Western Or Thai Astrology?

[thai_narak]

Western Thai

Aries March 21 - April 20 April 13 - May 14

Taurus April 21 - May 21 May 15 - June 14

Gemini May 22 - June 21 June 15 - July 15

Cancer June 22 - July 22 July 16 - August 16

Leo July 23 -August 21 August 17 - September 16

Virgo August 22 - September 23 September 17 - October 16

Libra September 24 - October 23 October 17 - November 15

Scorpio October 24 - November 22 November 16 - December 15

Sagittarius November 23 - December 22 December 16 - January 14

Capricorn December 23 - January 20 January 15 - February 12

Aquarius January 21 - February 19 February 13 - March 14

Pisces February 20- March 20 March 15 - April 12

I just found out the Thai astrology (horoscope) has different dates with the western one (as quoted above). Now that wife is expecting next month, we have to decide a zodiac sign for our child to be engraved on a plaque with the his/her footprints and name, etc. but which zodiac to follow? I would prefer the western version (international) as the reference is the Sun and western astronomers are more likely correct when they have decided to use this cycle.

[Prakanong]

Not science - hocus pocus

[GuestHouse]

..and mumbo jumbo

[Prakanong]

..and mumbo jumbo

I also find a srong correlation between thouse that follow astrology, fortune tellers and the like are the ones who follow alternative therapies too.

[jumnien]

Lose your faith in science. What was scientific 1000 years ago or 50 years ago is not necessarily scientific today. What is considered scientifically correct today will be laughed at hilariously 50 or 1000 years from now.

[thai_narak]

i know it's hocus focus, mumbo jumbo and bunch of crap but i also want that my son have the correct engraved zodiac on his plaque not that he is virgo in thailand and then libra somewhere else...

[PhilHarries]

Personally I'd do whatever keeps your missus happy. As others have said it's all a load of bolleaux so what difference does it make?

[fxm88]

I thought Thai people only cared about the day of week and the time of day in regards to ones birth. And maybe the year (Chinese year, that is) if they're Thai-Chinese.

[lazeeboy]

Personally I'd do whatever keeps your missus happy. As others have said it's all a load of bolleaux so what difference does it make?

where will the kid be brught up ,here or in the west ? in the west use then use ours ,in the east use theres,simple....

[thai_narak]

Personally I'd do whatever keeps your missus happy. As others have said it's all a load of bolleaux so what difference does it make?

where will the kid be brught up ,here or in the west ? in the west use then use ours ,in the east use theres,simple....

will be growing up in thai soil of course. i know it's not important and it's just loads of crap but imagine when they grow up and see their birth plaque hanging on the wall which has wrong zodiac engraved...

[spot]

Personally I'd do whatever keeps your missus happy. As others have said it's all a load of bolleaux so what difference does it make?

where will the kid be brught up ,here or in the west ? in the west use then use ours ,in the east use theres,simple....

will be growing up in thai soil of course. i know it's not important and it's just loads of crap but imagine when they grow up and see their birth plaque hanging on the wall which has wrong zodiac engraved...

Then they will realise that it must be mumbo jumbo make believe after all...

[ThaidleHands]

Lose your faith in science. What was scientific 1000 years ago or 50 years ago is not necessarily scientific today. What is considered scientifically correct today will be laughed at hilariously 50 or 1000 years from now.

A comment such as this only demonstrates a thorough lack of knowledge of what science is and how science works.

Astrology is not scientific because it offers no falsifiable hypothesis. That is, while an astrologer may claim the positions of the stars or planets affect some aspects of earthly life and human conduct, he does not propose any method by which those factors act. Thus no test can be constructed to show that these interactions actually take place or to measure their strength or duration or frequency. By definition this places astrology outside the realm of science and into the realm of the mystical.

Furthermore, nothing as simple as a statistical correlation betweeen the position of heavenly bodies and events on Earth can be made. Such a correlation would at least all one to posit an unknown force or particle at work, but the correlation is no greater in any study that has ever been made than would be allowed by random chance.

In short, to say that astrology is bullshit is to do a great disservice to the economic and biological utility of bovine scat.

[Plus]

It's not Thai astrology per se, it's an old Hindu system. The difference lies in locating the borders of the signs. In the western system the first sign begins at 0'' longitude on Earth, in Eastern system the starting point is fixed in the sky. I don't think that these two points were ever exactly the same, they are about 20-25 degrees apart now.

I don't know what arguments are for the Western system (called tropical), but Eastern (called sidereal) makes more sense to me as we are talking about Sun entering into stars and constellations in the sky, not just passing some point in relation to Earth.

Scientifically astrology relies on a completely different set of underlying principles. If one to translate planets influences into moders language, one could talk about waves and wavelengths. Each planet's astrological color is actually the color of its waves as they pass through the prism.

There are unlimited combinations of the major planets waves coming at different angles and with different intensity. It's far beyond simple statistics.

Does this cosmic radiation influence one's life? We know that simple colors and sounds do.

[naka]

i know it's hocus focus, mumbo jumbo and bunch of crap but i also want that my son have the correct engraved zodiac on his plaque not that he is virgo in thailand and then libra somewhere else...

Dear oh dear !

Naka.

[Eff1n2ret]

To quote an old buffer called Patrick Moore, well-known to British TV viewers for his programmes on astronomy:-

"Astrology proves just one thing - there's one born every minute."

[Plus]

To the OP.

I don't know what you need the plaque for, but everywhere outside of Thailand, and that includes daily horoscopes and other popular magazine nonsense, he will be Libra.

Actually there's another important difference between tropical and sidereal astrology. In the West a person is Libra because the Sun was in Libra at his birth. In the East Sun's position is not as important as the sign rising above the horison.

Thus there's no tendency to label a person a Libra or Leo just by the date of his birth, one must look into all the major influences and see if one particular sign or planet really dominates, if you want to put a label at all.

[thai_narak]

To the OP.

I don't know what you need the plaque for, but everywhere outside of Thailand, and that includes daily horoscopes and other popular magazine nonsense, he will be Libra.

Actually there's another important difference between tropical and sidereal astrology. In the West a person is Libra because the Sun was in Libra at his birth. In the East Sun's position is not as important as the sign rising above the horison.

Thus there's no tendency to label a person a Libra or Leo just by the date of his birth, one must look into all the major influences and see if one particular sign or planet really dominates, if you want to put a label at all.

sorry, didn't made it clear. a birth plaque (don't know if they really call as such) is usually one option from the hospital in thailand where they will engrave the baby's name and lastname, time and date of birth, weight, footprints, attending physician and the zodiac sign of the baby. it's just something that you can give to your son or daughter as a remebrance when they were delivered.

[Pepe']

Ancient Pali texts has it the 12 animals of the Chinese Zodiac were chosen by Buddha. When Buddha was near death he invited all the animals to visit him. Only 12 came: the rat, ox, tiger, rabbit, dragon, snake, horse, goat, monkey, rooster, dog and pig. For visiting him, Buddha honored each by using them to represent the 12 phases of the Zodiac.

Our bodies are over 70% water. If the moon can effect the tides do we believe that it has no effect on us.

It is well documented that ER admissions and violent crimes increase dramatically with the comming of the full moon...

[thai_narak]

Ancient Pali texts has it the 12 animals of the Chinese Zodiac were chosen by Buddha. When Buddha was near death he invited all the animals to visit him. Only 12 came: the rat, ox, tiger, rabbit, dragon, snake, horse, goat, monkey, rooster, dog and pig. For visiting him, Buddha honored each by using them to represent the 12 phases of the Zodiac.

Our bodies are over 70% water. If the moon can effect the tides do we believe that it has no effect on us.

It is well documented that ER admissions and violent crimes increase dramatically with the comming of the full moon...

must have been scary when the dragon came...

one thing i know, the moon affects the tide. diving is good when it's high tide...

[Pepe']

Ancient Pali texts has it the 12 animals of the Chinese Zodiac were chosen by Buddha. When Buddha was near death he invited all the animals to visit him. Only 12 came: the rat, ox, tiger, rabbit, dragon, snake, horse, goat, monkey, rooster, dog and pig. For visiting him, Buddha honored each by using them to represent the 12 phases of the Zodiac.

Our bodies are over 70% water. If the moon can effect the tides do we believe that it has no effect on us.

It is well documented that ER admissions and violent crimes increase dramatically with the comming of the full moon...

[Pepe']

Sorrry about the double post. I believe Buddha and the dragon got on just fine. Ahimsa you know...

[sleepyjohn]

Ancient Pali texts has it the 12 animals of the Chinese Zodiac were chosen by Buddha. When Buddha was near death he invited all the animals to visit him. Only 12 came: the rat, ox, tiger, rabbit, dragon, snake, horse, goat, monkey, rooster, dog and pig. For visiting him, Buddha honored each by using them to represent the 12 phases of the Zodiac.

Our bodies are over 70% water. If the moon can effect the tides do we believe that it has no effect on us.

It is well documented that ER admissions and violent crimes increase dramatically with the comming of the full moon...

1. Thanx always enjoy a fairy story

2. Well do you believe the moon has an effect? If so please demonstrate

3. That's not true

[Pepe']

Ancient Pali texts has it the 12 animals of the Chinese Zodiac were chosen by Buddha. When Buddha was near death he invited all the animals to visit him. Only 12 came: the rat, ox, tiger, rabbit, dragon, snake, horse, goat, monkey, rooster, dog and pig. For visiting him, Buddha honored each by using them to represent the 12 phases of the Zodiac.

Our bodies are over 70% water. If the moon can effect the tides do we believe that it has no effect on us.

It is well documented that ER admissions and violent crimes increase dramatically with the comming of the full moon...

1. Thanx always enjoy a fairy story

2. Well do you believe the moon has an effect? If so please demonstrate

3. That's not true

--------------------

One well-recorded research is that of a team of psychologists, led by Arnold Lieber in the late 1970's. They researched 1,887 murders over 15 years in Dade County, Miami. They found the rise in incidence of murders matched the occurrence of the full moon AND new moon. To further verify the findings, they repeated the research in Ohio with the same amazing results!

In 1998, a study in England reported that the 1,200 inmates of Leeds' Armley Jail displayed violent behaviour during the days either side of a full moon.

On Sunday, August 25, 2002, the "Blade", Toledo published an article on the phenomenon of a link between crime and the full moon. It stated:

"A Blade computer analysis of Toledo police reports over the last three years adds credence to an age-old adage. From 1999 through 2001, the crime rate rose 5 percent on the nights with full moons."

[englishoak]

Hmmm may be thats what happend to my ex on a monthly basis, I always thought it was her PMT making her so intolerable.

[ronw]

Scientifically astrology relies on a completely different set of underlying principles. If one to translate planets influences into moders language, one could talk about waves and wavelengths. Each planet's astrological color is actually the color of its waves as they pass through the prism.

There are unlimited combinations of the major planets waves coming at different angles and with different intensity. It's far beyond simple statistics.

Does this cosmic radiation influence one's life? We know that simple colors and sounds do.

Can you put this into plain English, please?

can you explain exactly which type of wave is transmitted by the planets?It is known that they REFLECT the light from the Sun....but precisely what do they transmit?

And where is this prism located?

[Plus]

I didn't say they transmit anything, if you want to be so picky.

By prism I meant spectroscope - a device that catches and measures wavelengths of radiation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spectroscopy

In science we look at the light and try to find reasons that cause it to be blue or yellow.

Astrology goes in the opposite direction and talks about what effect blue or yellow light will produce on you.

Like you go somewhere and you talk about the "vibe" in that place. You can also find sources of this "vibe", what makes you feel happy or miserable. In astrology the process is reversed - it's the planetary vibe that creates miserable conditions, which you can feel later.

I see no reason to flatly deny that prolonged exposure to a particular kind of radiation can have an effect on living organisms. There are plenty of studies about effects of visible light already.

[ronw]

I didn't say they transmit anything, if you want to be so picky.

True, you did not say they transmit.but NONE OF THE PLANETS ARE LUMINOUS, and we can only see them by sunlight reflected from the planets to earth!

By prism I meant spectroscope - a device that catches and measures wavelengths of radiation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spectroscopy

In science we look at the light and try to find reasons that cause it to be blue or yellow.

In science , it is KNOWN why a light is of a certain colour. so no guessing needed!

Astrology goes in the opposite direction and talks about what effect blue or yellow light will produce on you.

Like you go somewhere and you talk about the "vibe" in that place. You can also find sources of this "vibe", what makes you feel happy or miserable. In astrology the process is reversed - it's the planetary vibe that creates miserable conditions, which you can feel later.

I see no reason to flatly deny that prolonged exposure to a particular kind of radiation can have an effect on living organisms. There are plenty of studies about effects of visible light already.

What you seem to forget is the law of inverse proportion....and because of this, any light from a planet is totally overwhelmed by the ambient light level existing on Earth....and is so small , in fact, that it can have almost no effect whatsoever, on anything!

but I feel i am shouting to the wind...you are a believer....and as such are usually impervious to a reasoned argument.

[Plus]

I'm not saying that science has found explanations for astrology and can now prove that Sun positioned in Leo at birth would make one a fiery personality. I mentioned radiation only as a possible link.

Underlying principles are totally different. Consider this, for example.

Traditionally astrologists would say that everything is composed of five elements - earth, water, air, fire, and ether. Scientifically it's a joke. Yet the terms water or earth have entirely different meanings. Take an atom, it has a nucleus - earth, it has electrons running around it - air, it has gravitational force that keeps these electrons in orbit - water, and it has collossal amounts of energy - fire. The whole thing occupies some space - ether.

In that sense you can't say that atoms do not consist of water, air, fire etc.

Maybe you can say with total confidence what energy is, or what is gravitational force, or what a quantum is. Maybe you can say with total confidence that this is the one and only possible classification system. And those were only gross elements. There are also about twenty subtle elements. What is a mind? What are the senses? What is ego? What is life?

[Pepe']

..and mumbo jumbo

I also find a srong correlation between thouse that follow astrology, fortune tellers and the like are the ones who follow alternative therapies too.

--------------------------

What do you mean by alternative therapies?

[LinkPopularity]

the horoscopes in the newspapers etc are BS of course

but don't underestimate the influence of the stars on your brain !

let's turn it around ... planets turn around influenced by other planets, the sea moves according the moon, G-force and so many other examples

now ... the brain is for a great part electric ...

so anybody here who wants to claim that the forces of nature, which seem to influence the entire universe, have no effect what so ever on the electrons in your tiny brain ?

think again !

(check the chines astrology !)

(note that I use 'influence' and not 'determine'

Edited September 19, 2007 by LinkPopularity