Retirement Visa & Prison Record

[Phil_ne_uk]

Can anyone please advise me. I am planning to live in Thailand when I sell my UK house. A friend who lives there told me that a retirement visa is best as I’m 50 yrs old. The problem is that I understand I must have a copy of my police record. I have applied for this but think it will show that I was a bad lad when I was 20 yr old (young & daft lol) although it was 30 yrs ago I did serve 8 months in prison. Will this be a problem? If so then I will have to settle with a business visa I believe when I eventually start a company. I’m worried that if they know I was in prison that they might say I can NEVER come back to Thailand again! (panic!!!)

Any tips would be appreciated.

Cheers

Phil

[doctormann]

Re. prison record and O-A visa.

Surely, any convictions that you had 20 years ago will have 'expired' by now, in which case they shouldn't appear on your record. I guess that you'll have to wait and see what is on the disclosure document when you get it. Thai Embassy might give you some guidance on what is acceptable if anything shows up.

[paulfr]

If you have a UK passport, you are okay.

I do not believe they require a criminal history

report once you are here in LOS. You can get the

1 yr retirement extension without a problem.

Get the Non Imm O at the Thai Embassy in the UK

if you can rather than the 90 day Tourist visa.

It will save you time here with Bangkok Immigration.

And ...... how many times and for how long

should a man have to pay for his mistakes ???

[lamphun]

You shouldn't have a problem.

I understand that a criminal record is a requirement if you want a visa for Australia.

[Phil_ne_uk]

Thanks for your help everyone. However I understand that I do need to show details of my police record. See below what I found. No.’s 1.3 & 2.6 also the footnote. . I haven’t received the info back from police yet, so there’s a 1% chance it won’t show

Cheers, Phil

Procedure on the Issuance of Non-Immigrant Visa Category

“O-A” (Long Stay)

1. Qualification of an applicant

·1.1 A foreign national whose age is over 50 years or above

·1.2 Not being prohibited from entering the Kingdom under the Immigration Act B.E.2522 (A.D.1979)

·1.3 No criminal record of the Kingdom of Thailand, the country of national and country of permanent residence as well.

·1.4 Holding the nationality or permanent residence of the country of application

·1.5 No medical record of contagious disease.

·1.6 No permission of working in Thailand.

2. Required documents for visa application.

·2.1 Validity of passport at least 1 year

·2.2 Three (3) visa application forms and 3 passport size recent photographs

·2.3 Additional application form for Non-Immigrant “O-A” (Long Stay)

·2.4 Copy of bank statement having in possession of annually income equivalent to Thai currency at least 800,000 Baht or monthly income 65,000 Baht. (approximately GBP

14,000.00/annum)

·2.5 In case attached copy of bank statement as stated in 2.4, the original reference letter from the banking concerned is necessary.

·2.6 Criminal Record from own country or country of permanent residence of validity at least 3 months.

·2.7 Medical Record proving applicant has never been infected with contagious disease with validity at least 3 months (in accordance with Immigration Act B.E.2522)

·2.8 In case wishing to be accompanied by spouse, the marriage certificate will be attached. But spouse will be granted Non-Immigrant “O” in stead of “O-A”

(Long Stay)

Note: Documents as stated in 2.4 - 2.8 must be certified by Notary Public or from the competent authority concerned of the country of application.

[Pink Mist]

You shouldn't have a problem.

I understand that a criminal record is a requirement if you want a visa for Australia.

You soapdodgers are so out of touch, that requirement was dropped 200 years ago, get with the program.

[biggles45]

I made enquiries at the thai consul in brisbane, australia a couple of months ago about getting a retirement visa in oz. Was advised to get a Non immigrant O here and then apply for an extension with retirement status in thailand. was told that whereas I needed a police report if applied for in oz it was not required for an extension applied for in thailand. consul said much easier to process and less paperwork when you are already there. I will go with this approach.

[Sojourner]

Phil,

Just apply for a type O visa not a O-A in your home country, as a police clearance isn't required. Once in Thailand, assuming you meet the requirements for retirement status, immediately apply for a temporary one year visa. There are many threads here that explain what you will need to qualify for retirement status here in LOS. Hope this helps.

[ProThaiExpat]

Last post may be alluding to the following "canned" post. Getting an O visa before comming to Thailand isn't the easiest at your end vs. a tourist, but here it makes it a little quicker

Basic “retirement” classification questions answered!

Terminology is important in this area!!

Normally, entry into Thailand, from a foreign country is accomplished with a VISA, obtained from a Thai consulate or embassy abroad. This visa is called a non-immigrant O-A visa with a retirement classification. The same visa obtained in Thailand is termed a non-immigrant O visa with a retirement classification.

Entry into Thailand without a VISA, is permitted at the airport for thirty days, for aliens from visa waiver countries and is based on an ENTRY PERMIT.

As explained by immigration on their website, VISAS are primarily the province of Consulates and Embassies, entities attached to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. The MFA has given immigration the authority to change classifications of visas but not the authority to change an entry permit into a visa in Thailand, as far as I know.

Entry into Thailand without a visa, deportation from Thailand and regulation of the length of your stay, including entry and re-entry, are the province of the Department of Immigration, a police agency, staffed by police officers on assignment to the Immigration Department. The officer in charge of the Chiang Mai Immigration Department reminds us publicly, that immigration is a police agency, not a service agency and its function is to regulate, not to provide a service.

There is no such thing as a RETIREMENT VISA.

There is a long stay classification for aliens termed "RETIRMENT" and the requirement to qualify for this classification is essentially a verified Thai bank account of 800,000 Baht (alternatively a pension of 65K Baht) if applying in Thailand and an equivalent sum in an overseas account, or a pension, if applying overseas. Age requirement is being at least 50 years old.

The EASIEST way to get a long stay retirement classification is to do it in Thailand on the 3rd floor of the main immigration building in Bangkok. There has been some talk that it now can be accomplished at branch locations as well.

For some, the benefits of going through the additional hassle of obtaining the O-A in your home country is the comfort of having your immigration status finalized before you move to Thailand for retirement and the fact that you can move your household goods into Thailand without paying duty. (Make sure your shipping cost justify your shipment of goods easily replaced in Thailand at very reasonable prices)

The difficulty in obtaining this classification abroad is the differing requirements from Consulate to Consulate and Embassy to Embassy and the far more stringent requirements than in Bangkok. Sydney’s consulate told me in no uncertain terms that each Consul General had the right to interpret the regulations any way they want, and in Sydney, I needed a police clearance certificate from my home country, among many other things. Cambodia said forget it, don't even try.

Roger13 recounts this caveat regarding O-A visas obtained abroad’

“Can I suggest you add to your Wonderful Summary

a word of warning about the O-A not being familiar to

Immigration Officers at point of entry who might

not be aware they should give a one year stay?

And that anyone not being given one year should politely

ask for a Senior officer to be refered to.

And should this not be forthcoming

there is a Window near the entrance of Immigration HQ

in Soi Suan Phlu where "mistakes" at the Airport can be corrected”

The “long stay” retirement classification is based on a NON-IMMIGRANT O VISA (retirement) in Thailand (O-A abroad) and a change to this visa classification can be accomplished in Thailand, providing you have entered Thailand with a VISA, even a tourist visa, as was the case with me.

Here is an account of an expat doing this in Bangkok at the end of June, 2004

“I had a similiar experience this week at the main Immigration office.

I applied for the one year retirement extension. Apparently this

is not possible with a Tourist visa. So they had me getting in shape

with the stairs. From room 303 back down to the 2nd floor to

change my Tourist to a Non Imm O. Then to 1st floor to pay.

Back to 3rd floor room 303. They scrutinized my docs, asked my

Thai lady questions in Thai and then seemingly approved all my

papers (bank letter (200B), health certificate (380 B at Bumrungrad))

and told me to come back next month when my new 30 day

Non Imm O expires.

It was quite a runaround, but looks like I will have my 1 year

extension later this month.”

Thai immigration’s document “requirements list” is as follows” (obtained from their website)

Application for further stay to spend the remainder of life

in the Kingdom of Thailand

1. Immigration form 7 (Tor Mor 7)

2. Copy of passport

3. 4 cm. x 6 cm. photograph

4. 1,900 bath application fee

5. Financial Evidence:

- Bank account pass-book, bank statement

- Evidence showing reception of pension accompanied with Thai translation certified by the embassy or consulate of the country paying the pension

- Evidence presenting other sources of income or evidence of money transferred from overseas

6. In cases of having dependents (husband/wife, children), the applicant must provide evidence indication their relationship. Evidence must be translated into Thai and be certified by the embassy or consulate of the aliens.

7. Health Certificate for those who apply for further stay after Nov. 14, 2002.

8. The officials reserve the rights to examine or ask for additional documents, if necessary.

Name Webmaster (203.156.96.*) [ Saturday 15 May 2004 เวลา 16:16 น ] Comment No: 1

To obtain your change of visa classification on the 3rd floor of the main immigration building, you need to take with you a bank letter stating you have the required minimum 800k Baht for the retirement classification in a bank account (anything other than a fixed rate account). The letter should include the date of the transfer of the funds into your account, the source institution of the funds and the country from which the funds came.

The STANDARD BANK LETTER, one that merely states the amount on deposit on any given day is INSUFFICIENT for the change of status process, while it is fine for any annual extension thereafter. This was the case with me, others may have got by with the standard letter.

There is an option to qualify for retirement financial status through pension verification, but that is a very difficult approach, requiring an Embassy verification of the pension. (You need strong pension entitlement or promises to pay letters for the Embassy to get their verification) The difficulty is the individual immigration officer involved may choose to explore the stability of the source of your pension. Conceivably, the pension could be terminated or suspended for a number of reasons during the year and you would then be left penniless, if no other funds were available. Thus a savings account in Thailand in addition to qualifying with a pension is a better approach if you can manage that. A combination of the two also qualify to meet the minimum requirement.

The health certificate that is required is obtainable from any emergency room of any hospital (preferred) or clinic. Exam may not even occur. 50 Baht or more is charged.

Your signature on all photocopies of all documents, including every page of your passport, is required.

4cm x 6cm colored photograph (suggest you take more than one).

No Embassy letter is required unless you are trying to qualify financial responsibility through a pension.

No police or criminal clearance document is required.

Dress very well, be extremely polite, try to keep your head at or below that of the officers involved, don't stand over them when they are seated as that is seen as very intimidating or threatening.

Most importantly, have a mental frame of mind that you will do ANYTHING required of you, including numerous trivial and unnecessary tasks when requested. Your mind set is that you are not going away, you are there to stay the course until the document sought is obtained.

Your first extension under your non-immigrant 0 (retirement) status will probably be for only 90 days. I was given two 90 day extensions and then an extension for the balance of the first year, dated from when I entered the country.

Expect 30 days between the application and the approval, ie. two trips to immigration to allow for processing. After that, extensions can be obtained from any immigration office.

If you anticipate leaving Thailand on occasion in the forthcoming year, it is suggested that you obtain, at the time you apply for your retirement classification, a single or multiple re-entry permit. Once you have your retirement classification and leave the Kingdom, you lose your visa classification and must obtain another visa unless you have a re-entry permit. There is some information to suggest that for a retiree a single re-entry permit is the only one to get, as you lose the multiple re-entry permit after the first exit. I have no personal experience in this regard, as I have always just obtained singles.

I will be happy to answer any specific questions you may still have regarding retirement classifications if you want to PM me or post it.

CAVEAT: Individual discretion is always a factor with immigration police officers, so don’t be shocked if you are required to do other things or produce other documents. Remember, your there to do whatever is required by the individual officer to get your long stay classification. Humility goes a long way and feigning ignorance, even stupidity, will engender sympathy and a helpful attitude on the part of the immigration officer, to the point that he will actually help you to take care of the “problem”.

After sending me back to my bank for more detailed information in my bank letter, the immigration officer still wanted more and “volunteered” to obtain it by fax from the bank. Why he didn’t offer that at first, suggests that he was impressed with my attitude and willingness to do whatever was required and once seeing that, “volunteered” to help.

The foregoing “summary” has imput from Dr. Pat and lopbury3 among others and to them must go our thanks.

[simple1]

Surely, any convictions that you had 20 years ago will have 'expired' by now, in which case they shouldn't appear on your record.

Under U.K. law their is not any statue of limitations for criminal offences. Any criminal convictions stay on record for life. However, many counties only take into account criminal convictions for visa applications, if the jail time is more than one year e.g. Australia. Maybe you should contact the Thai embassy to clarify the Thai law regarding this matter. Otherwise, I suggest you obtain your "O" visa and apply for the retirement extension 60 days after your arrival in Thailand.

[astral]

Thanks for your help everyone. However I understand that I do need to show details of my police record. See below what I found. No.’s 1.3 & 2.6 also the footnote. . I haven’t received the info back from police yet, so there’s a 1% chance it won’t show

Cheers, Phil

Procedure on the Issuance of Non-Immigrant Visa Category

“O-A” (Long Stay)

1. Qualification of an applicant

·1.1 A foreign national whose age is over 50 years or above

·1.2 Not being prohibited from entering the Kingdom under the Immigration Act B.E.2522 (A.D.1979)

·1.3 No criminal record of the Kingdom of Thailand, the country of national and country of permanent residence as well.

etc

That is if you apply for the visa in the UK.

Get the Non-Imm O for three months and then extend it once you arrive.

The checks inside the country are different.

Don't ask me why.

It is also cheaper here as you do not need to get all the documents notorised.

Medical is only 150 baht (2 pounds).

[ProThaiExpat]

Astral: You must be in BKK. Rama I hospital in Chiang Mai charges 50 Baht for the med certificate, and this year they actually examined me, although somewhat prefuctorily.

[royar2002]

you will get a retirement visa (non immigrant o ) easy without any police paper, but if you apply for recidense you will have problem. If the embassey require policepaper, just go to thailand on a touristvisa. Bring all your papers, open a bankaccount, transfer the money, go to laos and apply for non immigrant o visa (single entry) based on retirement. If you have all your paper, you will get your visa next day. After 3 months you go to immigrationoffice and apply for 1 year extension.

[djinn]

They NEVER asked me anything about a police statement from my hme country....

and I have had my OA visa without problem (only 600 bahts of tea money )

[boris]

Can anyone please advise me. I am planning to live in Thailand when I sell my UK house. A friend who lives there told me that a retirement visa is best as I’m 50 yrs old. The problem is that I understand I must have a copy of my police record. I have applied for this but think it will show that I was a bad lad when I was 20 yr old (young & daft lol) although it was 30 yrs ago I did serve 8 months in prison. Will this be a problem? If so then I will have to settle with a business visa I believe when I eventually start a company. I’m worried that if they know I was in prison that they might say I can NEVER come back to Thailand again! (panic!!!)

Any tips would be appreciated.

Cheers

Phil

Why should anyone give you tips when you have given no indication of what crime you went to prison for? If it involved for example violence of any kind, I do think there is a question of whether you should be thinking of emigrating at all.It doesn't matter whether it was 30 years ago in this event.Our past actions have consequences which cannot be shrugged off.If the offence was a lesser matter such as failing to pay debts, that is another matter.

[Phil_ne_uk]

Boris,

If you want to know, after a relationship ended which effected me big time, I got involved with an old school mate and 2 older crooks that he knew. I got involved with them in a robbery and I was the one that used a starting pistol to hold up a jewelers. (yep daft I know) This was my first and ONLY offence, however it was classed as armed robbery.

Phil

[BKK_banger]

If you read the Pattaya Mail you will be aware of people, living quite happily for many years in Thailand, who are arrested and deported to answer charges in their home country but have valid immigration status Non Imm etc. despite a lengthy criminal past.

And not just groups like the ex-Spetsnatz commandos who killed a police officer in a bank raid in Pattaya a few years ago but underworld figures who have made Thailand their home.

This thread has answered my musings as to how Thailand can let crims in and not be aware of their nature. The answer appears to be that there are loopholes which can be exploited by those the Thais do not really want.

A man's past is his past but Thais are rightly worried about the present and the future conduct of ex cons. Add to this Toxin's belief that Thailand needs "quality" tourists and long-term tourists and you may get a negative attitude to your past.

[biggles45]

Jesus, Boris your a bit harsh arn't you? I would hate to think that someone was holding the stupid things I did 30 years ago against me still. Even our ex-wives can forgive us eventually. we all change over the years (perhaps not in your case, maybe you have always been judgemental?). the man wanted advice, he didn't want to be preached to.

[Up2U]

To take up one point in the original poster's message - you CANNOT get a work permit with a retirement extension. The permit-to-stay is for retirement. If you want to carry on a business, look at alternatives.

[boris]

Jesus, Boris your a bit harsh arn't you? I would hate to think that someone was holding the stupid things I did 30 years ago against me still. Even our ex-wives can forgive us eventually. we all change over the years (perhaps not in your case, maybe you have always been judgemental?). the man wanted advice, he didn't want to be preached to.

It's difficult to know where to begin with a shrill and half baked response like this -but anyway will attempt to tackle it.I enquired, since we had been given no information, what crime had been committed to earn an 8 month jail sentence.I drew a legitimate distiction between acts involving violence and lesser crimes such as failing to pay a debt.Very few countries would agree to accept an immigrant with a criminal record including armed robbery.There seems to be a view however among some, and not only the Pattaya riff raff, that the normal rules should be suspended in the case of Thailand.I make no judgement on morality at all nor am I interested in preaching, merely making the valid point that all actions have consequences.Armed robbery albeit with a starting pistol cannot just be overlooked.The one amusing aspect of this depressing saga is that the crime was attributed by the perpetrator as the consequence of a relationship break up, comically typical of the self pity and post facto justification found in many of the criminal classes.

In this particular case my sympathy is with Phil particularly as the incident was a one off which is why I did not respond further to his explanation.My only purpose in intervening was to stress that our past is always with us, and we live with the consequences of past actions.I certainly do.

[bucatini70]

So! now i am really confused is it yes there is a criminal check to get a visa? or no there is not? and if yes? does it apply to every country or just specific ones? or this a gray area?

[ProThaiExpat]

bucatin70:

The difficulty in obtaining this classification abroad is the differing requirements from Consulate to Consulate and Embassy to Embassy and the far more stringent requirements than in Bangkok. Sydney’s consulate told me in no uncertain terms that each Consul General had the right to interpret the regulations any way they want, and in Sydney, I needed a police clearance certificate from my home country, among many other things. Cambodia said forget it, don't even try.

The foregoing is from my first "canned" posting in this thread.

To answer your question directly, the Miinistry of Foreign Affairs requires a police check in their regulations and it is my understanding that all Embassies and Counsulates require a police check.

The foregoing is one of the main reasons it is easier to get the non-immigrant 0 (retirement) visa in Thailand. You may be able to get a non-immigrant 0 visa with multiple entry on another ground other than retirement without a police clearance abroad, but I don't know that.

Dr. Pat or lopburi3 will know this.