Bad Guts All The Time....

[kat]

This is a great thread that I'm reading with a lot of attention. I will try the recommendations listed. I am currently back in the West, trying to "fix" my stomach after living in LOS for 4 years. After a year back, it is still an ongoing battle. I haven't read the whole thread yet, so I'll briefly tell you what I'm currently doing.

I ate all the great food in LOS with abandon, as I am a foodie and not a snob, so I ate at roadside vendors to the top Thai restaurants, almost every day. I had many of the usual symptoms that most newcomers have in LOS, but in the beginning at times it was so painful, that I could understand how intestinal issues still kill in developing countries. A big and noticeable change occurred when I ate raw oysters at a roadside restaurant in Phuket. The next day, it literally was coming out of both ends simultaneously, like the great sea in my body was mass exiting, lol. Sounds funny, but it was incredibly frightening.

After several months of symptoms, I was finally diagnosed with a parasite - giardia (sp). Since this is notoriously difficult to get rid of, I was treated twice in LOS with albenzoile (sp), and twice in the US with flagyl, but because I didn't have health insurance here, I wasn't fully tested again.

I have felt that I still struggle with this, but I can't be sure because I also have a milk allergy. On some naturopathic websites, they say longterm parasites start to present allergy symptoms. My thinking is that if I contracted giardia, I probably had other parasites as well. My stomach has never been the same.

Right now, I am currently taking a naturopathic blend of cloves, black walnut oil, and wormwood. I also think longterm chili consumption may have damaged my stomach, or caused a sensitivity.

Still figuring it all out.

*oh yes, btw, the most significant improvement so far has not been my dumb doctor's diagnosis (irritable bowel syndrome, and lactose intolerance - on which he was wrong - but taking a daily probiotic acidolphilus/bifudus (spelling - sorry guys).

** and one other thing, I ate tons of Som Tam in LOS. I think it's great food, but the chilis killed my stomach after a while, and quite frankly many of them were found to have a lot of bad bacteria around by a study in Bangkok.

Edited November 3, 2007 by kat

[Sheryl]

3 points:

1) OP, please do not overlook the point I made about change in bowel patterns being a warning sign of cancer, especially if you are over 40.

2) For treatment of both giardia and amoeba. tinidazole (fasigyn) is a better alternative to flagyl and just as effective. Shorter course of treatment and less side effects, altho you will still have some if on the higher (amoebic) dose. If treating without a diagnosis from stool exam, then better go with the higher amoebic dose so as to eliminate both. The lower giardia dose will not eliminate amoeba. Ladies, don't take either if you may be pregnant.

3) For "bad guts" where protozoa have either been ruled out or were presumptively treated for, and -- in case of older people especially -- where cancer has been ruled out, a "detox/fast" program can work wonders. In Thailand I recommend the one at Health Oasis in Samui. Basically your GI tract gets a total rest following which live probiotics are given and eating resumed in a gradual fashion. Highly effective provided there is not a serious underlying cause such as cancer. 7-9 day program if possible but even a shorter one may help.

[Khutan]

Chronic giardia is also a possibility, as it is milder than the one with amoebas. You really need to get a stool check as an initial step.

Best advice - go and see a doctor.

Be very careful if you are taking Fasigyn do not have alcohol at any time during the treatment or for 3 days after you have stopped the treatment. Combining alcohol with FASIGYN (Tinidazole) can cause stomach cramps, nausea, vomiting, headaches, and flushing. When FASIGYN (Tinidazole) is combined with alcohol and the drug disulfiram (Antabuse), a severe mental disorder can occur.

[kat]

3 points:

1) OP, please do not overlook the point I made about change in bowel patterns being a warning sign of cancer, especially if you are over 40.

2) For treatment of both giardia and amoeba. tinidazole (fasigyn) is a better alternative to flagyl and just as effective. Shorter course of treatment and less side effects, altho you will still have some if on the higher (amoebic) dose. If treating without a diagnosis from stool exam, then better go with the higher amoebic dose so as to eliminate both. The lower giardia dose will not eliminate amoeba. Ladies, don't take either if you may be pregnant.

3) For "bad guts" where protozoa have either been ruled out or were presumptively treated for, and -- in case of older people especially -- where cancer has been ruled out, a "detox/fast" program can work wonders. In Thailand I recommend the one at Health Oasis in Samui. Basically your GI tract gets a total rest following which live probiotics are given and eating resumed in a gradual fashion. Highly effective provided there is not a serious underlying cause such as cancer. 7-9 day program if possible but even a shorter one may help.

Thanks Sheryl - very helpful. It is just not possible for me to get or find out quality medical information on this here in the states, at my current insurance level, so I'm pretty much on my own. Thanks.

Chronic giardia is also a possibility, as it is milder than the one with amoebas. You really need to get a stool check as an initial step.

Best advice - go and see a doctor.

Be very careful if you are taking Fasigyn do not have alcohol at any time during the treatment or for 3 days after you have stopped the treatment. Combining alcohol with FASIGYN (Tinidazole) can cause stomach cramps, nausea, vomiting, headaches, and flushing. When FASIGYN (Tinidazole) is combined with alcohol and the drug disulfiram (Antabuse), a severe mental disorder can occur.

Thank you for the very important caveat.

[niggle]

3 points:

1) OP, please do not overlook the point I made about change in bowel patterns being a warning sign of cancer, especially if you are over 40.

2) For treatment of both giardia and amoeba. tinidazole (fasigyn) is a better alternative to flagyl and just as effective. Shorter course of treatment and less side effects, altho you will still have some if on the higher (amoebic) dose. If treating without a diagnosis from stool exam, then better go with the higher amoebic dose so as to eliminate both. The lower giardia dose will not eliminate amoeba. Ladies, don't take either if you may be pregnant.

3) For "bad guts" where protozoa have either been ruled out or were presumptively treated for, and -- in case of older people especially -- where cancer has been ruled out, a "detox/fast" program can work wonders. In Thailand I recommend the one at Health Oasis in Samui. Basically your GI tract gets a total rest following which live probiotics are given and eating resumed in a gradual fashion. Highly effective provided there is not a serious underlying cause such as cancer. 7-9 day program if possible but even a shorter one may help.

Thanks Sheryl - very helpful. It is just not possible for me to get or find out quality medical information on this here in the states, at my current insurance level, so I'm pretty much on my own. Thanks.

Chronic giardia is also a possibility, as it is milder than the one with amoebas. You really need to get a stool check as an initial step.

Best advice - go and see a doctor.

Be very careful if you are taking Fasigyn do not have alcohol at any time during the treatment or for 3 days after you have stopped the treatment. Combining alcohol with FASIGYN (Tinidazole) can cause stomach cramps, nausea, vomiting, headaches, and flushing. When FASIGYN (Tinidazole) is combined with alcohol and the drug disulfiram (Antabuse), a severe mental disorder can occur.

Thank you for the very important caveat.

Consider Gluten intolerance. Looks like you eat a lot of wheat based stuff. Try cutting out bread, pasta, thickened sauces etc for a while. See if ypu inprove.

Gastroscopy is really the only definate diagnostic tool

[Sheryl]

Gastroscopy only diagnoses problems in the upper GI tract (stomach), the symptoms you describe are suggestive of a problem in either small or large intestine. For that you would need a colonoscopy, and this only if the problem is not due to parasites.

If you are in the U.S. now you are not going to be able to buy either flagyl or tinidazole over the counter, you are going to have to see a doctor. Be sure to tell doc that you have recently been in a country which has a ,lot of giargiasis and amebiasis. S/he will probably insist on doing a stool test first. That's fine altho if negative needs to be repeated at least 3 times, and sample has to reach the lab fresh, preferrably a lab experienced in examining for tropical parasites.

If you do not have parasites (repeated stool samples negative, or self-treatment with flagyl/tinidazole doesn't help) then yes, colonoscopy will probably be necessary. Preceded by a manual rectal exam and test for occult blood in the stool.

[tuffy]

That doesn't sound like much fun!

[dee123]

...It sounds to me Sheryl knows what she is talking about! ...it never hurts anyone to go and get checked over!!.....

Edited November 7, 2007 by dee123

[tropo]

I have pretty much the same symptoms except for the feeling hungry right after I eat.

I travel back and forth from Thailand frequently and as soon as I leave LOS I seem to leave my problem there as well. Sometimes the same day and sometimes with in a few days my system is some what back to normal. Usually the same day I arrive back in LOS my guts are on red alert until i leave again (even if I stay away from spicy food). I have been to the doctor in the US and they can find nothing wrong with me including parasites. I have been thinking I would try a Thai doctor and see what they can come up with. My guess is IBS.

If you find something out sky123 please post what it is.

I'd guess your condition is caused by consuming coconut (cooked as in thai green curry).

If that's not it, try laying off chili for a while.

I had the same problem.

[dee123]

...Yes thats whats probably happened but to be honest why not go for a check!

[wpcoe]

I just had a paranoid thought while (literally) sitting on the toilet: Could use of a "bum spray" at the toilet lead to a parasite infestation?

e.g. My condo water supply is totally unflitered swamp water brought in by tanker trucks daily. Therefore I have a water filter at the kitchen sink and use it to wash dishes and brush my teeth. (I also use it to make coffee and tea, but only after having it boil in the microwave for three minutes.) But... am I putting myself at risk by spraying untreated water at my backside? Could intestinal parasites take advantage of the opportunity to wander up you-know-where?

And, yes, I'm serious.

[Somnambulist]

I had IBS a while ago, brought on by my insane relationship with my ex. In other words, it was stress. If you are lying awake at night thinking dark thoughts about someone you "love" it could be that. I went to the doctor and got a stool sample, which was nagative except for a bit of occult blood. He sent me to get a barium enema, which showed that my plumbing is in order. So I asked if it could be IBS and he concurred. I ate starchy foods. I went to a pharmacy and got lactobacillus tablets and bifudus tablets. And for the first little while I used a product with the charming name of Smecta, which contains clay, but once the diarrhea stops it's no longer necessary.

Oh, and I got out of that codependent relationship, stayed alone for a month, and now am happily seeing someone else.

All the best.

[FBN]

I just had a paranoid thought while (literally) sitting on the toilet: Could use of a "bum spray" at the toilet lead to a parasite infestation?

e.g. My condo water supply is totally unflitered swamp water brought in by tanker trucks daily. Therefore I have a water filter at the kitchen sink and use it to wash dishes and brush my teeth. (I also use it to make coffee and tea, but only after having it boil in the microwave for three minutes.) But... am I putting myself at risk by spraying untreated water at my backside? Could intestinal parasites take advantage of the opportunity to wander up you-know-where?

And, yes, I'm serious.

Short answer; No, no waterborne bug can cause an intestinal infection this way, but be sure that you have good hand washing habits after handling untreated water.

You are, however at risk of a multitude of waterborne infections in your area so be sure to have a very good water filtering and sanitation system in place..

Perhaps just another note: People taking anti-acids or any of the drugs to reduce gastric acid (Omeprasole, ranitidine etc), are at risk from these kind of infections as stomach acid is the best defense the body has to neutralise most infective organisms. (except those that are transmitted through ingestion of cysts like amebiasis).