Shipping A Container To Thailand

[mouse]

On 9 June 2004, my friend received a fax from a Mr. Farang at the XX Shipping company in Bangkok. This fax consisted of an estimate to ship a container from Germany to their new home in Thailand. The estimate given was for a total cost of 22,000 Baht plus Customs cost and duties, which were estimated to be approximately 10,000 Baht additionally. Again this estimate was provided by Mr XX, who lead my friend and his wife to believe that the total billing would amount to no more than 32,000 Baht. In the meantime the shipment arrived in reasonable condition and the container was returned, as agreed.

Then on 16 August 2004, my friend received a fax for all services provided. This contained the total bill, which amounts to 46,000 Baht.

It is our understanding that Mr. XX is no longer being employed by the shipping firm and was never employed legally. What should my friend do?

The shipping company now states that they were forced to pay customs under the table (My God what has the world come to) and they want to collect on their bill. My friend insists that he will only pay for the estimate and the 10,000 Baht estimated customs costs, unless invoices for customs costs can be produced.

My friend will not rellease the name of the shipping company at this time nor the name of the farang that was working there.

Is my friend right? Or should he shut up and pay?

[BKK_banger]

First of all, this sounds remarkably cheap. 22,000 Baht to ship a 20' TEU container from Europe to Thailand including transport to and from the port?

The 10,000 Baht for Customs cost and duties however seems low if it includes customs clearance, handling charge, demurrage in Klong toey awaiting clearance etc. AND a preestimate of any duties and tea money.

The tea money issue is one which you cannot avoid but a shipping company will know how much to pay. I was a little suprised they could have got it so wrong but no-one will give a receipt for tea money.

Are you saying these people are dishonest or they made a mistake? If this was indeed the tea money paid and they are not cheating you then why are you not paying?

Anyone who has gone through Customs in the Port will tell you that it is better to pay up than argue.

[rcjoop]

Then on 16 August 2004, my friend received a fax for all services provided. This contained the total bill, which amounts to 46,000 Baht.

It is our understanding that Mr. XX is no longer being employed by the shipping firm and was never employed legally. What should my friend do?

The shipping company now states that they were forced to pay customs under the table (My God what has the world come to) and they want to collect on their bill. My friend insists that he will only pay for the estimate and the 10,000 Baht estimated customs costs, unless invoices for customs costs can be produced.

My friend will not rellease the name of the shipping company at this time nor the name of the farang that was working there.

Is my friend right? Or should he shut up and pay?

Just pay him,

I was quoted more than $4.500 for a container from the Netherlands to Chiang Mai, even if a lot of this would be the Bkk-CM part your bill still seems very low.

Joop

[DanishPosh]

Always make sure to sign a contract of transport. The total cost should be stated in the contract.

Doing business without written contracts is asking for trouble.

Basically, you have no case here, so you better just pay and take the lesson

Cheers

Kenneth

[Kringle]

1)You say that the shipment arrived and the container returned so you have the goods in hand, right? 2) Have you made the original requested payment already? 3)Has cutoms said anything about oweing any monies?

What I would do, but then this is just my thoughts on the matter.

3) If Thai customs didn't say you owe money to them and they should have supplied some kind of receipt of shipment being delievered, I wouldn't pay a baht more.

2) & 1) If you have already paid the first requested charges and received your goods in reasonable condition, then I wouldn't bother paying any more money.

Sounds like something that happened to a guy I know here that had his shipment delievered to him in Thailand (in bad condition, no insurance on shipment) and then the shipping company in Hawaii tells him he needs to pay tea money ($1000) to them before he can clear customs here in Thailand. Since the container was already here, he decided to go to customs to check on this. He was told to get these forms checked from one counter then the next, paid 600 baht and he was done, no other fees or whatever. This was nothing but a scam from the shipping company and not Thai customs. I know it does happen with Thai customs sometimes but it can be the other way around. You have to cover your own behind and check to make sure everyone is dealing straight up.

[BKK_banger]

I have processed shipments through teh Customs House and never again.

After the first full day of scurrying between counters I was physically exhausted and at breaking point.

The only "tea money" paid was for a large cake for the lovely old lady who took pity on my lady "I caaannnnt carryyyyy onnnnn, boooo hooooo" and fished a box of stamps out of her drawer and finsihed stamping her forms for her at 4:30 p.m. when the office shut.

The next day on picking up the goods an attempt at extortion was made. Unfortunately my lady was making the pick up so he lost face when she screamed abuse at him, threw the shipment in her SUV and drove off.

Not all stories are so nice and often your container will be delayed in the port, attracting hefty demurrage charges, whilst they extort the tea money. If they have some heavy expenses that week the demands can be quite high I understand but never anything like US$1,000 for a container, a few thousand baht max.

[Kringle]

As I said, this figure did not come fromn Thai Customs but from the shipping company out of Hawaii. Always be on your toes.

[simon43]

Seems some people are being quoted silly prices for shipping containers from Europe to Thailand.

The situation in reality is that the vast majority of these containers are either in Europe or America, because most shipments are from Asia to the West.

So the shippers that I spoke to seemed quite happy to ship a 20 foot container from UK to Thailand (port-to-port), for about 7,000 baht.

Of course, the customs duty payable on the goods in your container will vary according to the goods themselves. And if you need to ship door-to-door and not port-to-port then there will be extra charges.

[apetley]

Seems some people are being quoted silly prices for shipping containers from Europe to Thailand.

The situation in reality is that the vast majority of these containers are either in Europe or America, because most shipments are from Asia to the West.

So the shippers that I spoke to seemed quite happy to ship a 20 foot container from UK to Thailand (port-to-port), for about 7,000 baht.

Of course, the customs duty payable on the goods in your container will vary according to the goods themselves. And if you need to ship door-to-door and not port-to-port then there will be extra charges.

Hi, 7000 Bht seems amazingly cheap to me. Would that be from an agent in BKK who would arrange UK to Thailand? Any contacts in BKK you can give me please? Thanks Andy.

[simon43]

This was from a shipping agent in Manchester, for shipping from Harwich to Laem Chabang. They told me that most docks in Asia were desperate to get the containers back, so they would not charge me anything for shipping the container, only for the paperwork etc. (This agent also suffered from shipping delays from Asia to the UK because there were no containers available to put the goods in!!)

[Phil Conners]

7000? Wow! I'd be happy to pay that and double that in tea money to get a container with my stuff shipped out here from Europe. The best offer I've had so far was over 100,000 bath all incl. Someone give me a contact here, please!!

[SoCal]

Mouse,

Highly doubtful that a shipping company will release a container of personal goods without payment.

That assumed, your friend should be aware that he only has a certain amount of time before said container starts to accumulate detention charges. Here in Long Beach you have 5 days. These charges can be quite hefty, over a period of time.

My advice is to try to negotiate with them in person in their office. If that doesn't work, then pay and be done with it.

[nautilus]

As I said, this figure did not come fromn Thai Customs but from the shipping company out of Hawaii. Always be on your toes.

The shipping company in Hawaii is a corrupt monopoly.

[Kringle]

Only really two shipping companies in Hawaii (Young Brothers and Matson) and they control shipping in the Islands. I remeber one year when they went on strike and were asked how they could do this, they said "If anyone else wants to compete with us, just get your own ships". Can't get a job with these guys unless you're "part of the family".

[mouse]

Actually everything was delivered prior to billing without a problem!!!! then after negotiating with them, they backed down to 35,000 Baht. I think that my friend got an excellent deal. I am sure they learned what the word estimate means.

[Axel]

Congratulations to your friend, mouse, that the company finally accepted the quotation given by an employee (or non-employed).

But the figures sound too low, perhaps the container mentioned was not a 20' container but just a wooden box?

As for bringing back empty containers, yes, it is true, the trade is umbalanced and the shipping lines do carry empties back to Asia resp. give discount. The present tariffs, Aug 2004 are around US$ 18-1900 per 20' + fuel surcharge and curreny adjustment to ship from BKK to Europe. The rate from Europe to BKK is around US$ 1000/20'.

Baht 7000??? Most ships do call Singapore and tranship there on feeder vessels, the port charges in Singapore are already higher than Baht 7000.

Thai customs: Yes, there are ways to 'speed up' the clearance. If you have no right to import your used household goods free of duty and taxes, you can use such way. To get it in free you must have a WP or an extented 'O' for retirement or a Thai-wife who stayed outside of LoS for over one year.

Should you perhaps have some items in the container that are not duty-free, you better talk to the customs about ways not to inspect. Mind you, an inspection takes time and perhaps all cartons are torn....How does a Thai - wife explain men's items in the contaienr?

How to explain more than one electr. item?

[Phil Conners]

We have ca. 20 m3 (max) househouse items stored in Brussels that we would like to ship over here. Having it moved to a shipping container and deliver it in Laem Chabang would be optimal. Can anyone recommend a company who can do this without it costing an arm and a leg?

Edit: I've searched the internet now for 3 hours straight for shippers who could do this, but every site I find turns out to deal with shipping from or to USA only.

[tuktukmike]

Hope This Might Help.

I always use APC Thailand who are based in Bangkok and have never had any problems also they can contact your storage company in EU and arrange everything.

If you ask for Saowapark she is really tuned in and very very helpfull.

Tel no, 027141491 good luck.

Mike.

[chuchok]

Free empty container returns, or low cost on a particular trade lane can sometime happen. There has been some trade lanes in the past that actually have run at -ve freight!!

My advise is to ring around and get a firm quotation. Some personal effects specialists charge like wounded bulls compared to a commercial freight forwarder or shipping company...so be carefull. It is normally quite a competitive business, so if you mention to one company that you are also asking for competitive rates, then most of the time they sharpen their pencils.It also pays to bs a little.by that I mean say things like.."i will be also shipping 5 more containers later this year for the rest of my staff etc.."

Very important that you get ALL charges in writing, not just the freight , but all the add-ons that come with it.

[Phil Conners]

Thank you both!

Mike, I'll call Saowapark Monday. Any idea of what this would cost, all incl?

[chuchok]

forgot to add, that 90% of the time you get a better rate from the departure city end.

[Axel]

We have ca. 20 m3 (max) househouse items stored in Brussels that we would like to ship over here. Having it moved to a shipping container and deliver it in Laem Chabang would be optimal.  Can anyone recommend a company who can do this without it costing an arm and a leg?

Edit: I've searched the internet now for 3 hours straight for shippers who could do this, but every site I find turns out to deal with shipping from or to USA only.

A few questions

a) Is everything already packed in Brussles. Means you need a container and can stuff all in without worrying about damage? Is the packing seaworthy?

Standard procedures in this case, a quote to deliver an empty container to you in Bruxelles where somebody loads it and back to Antwerp.

c) A price in Antwerp to bring it on a ship

d) ocean freight "Antwerp to Laem Cha Bang

e) Here starts the problem. Are you exempted from import duty and taxes? E.g. Thai wife or non-imm extented for 1 yr plus WP?

I mentioned previously above, the problems in Customs, which usually do cost money.

f) Don't forget to cover insurance.

Suggest, give me a PM and we can meet, if you are in BKK, and/or I do two things

1) give you a quotation for 1x20'-container which I recommend for 20 cbm.

2) give you some links to my competitors. In this kind of business governments ask, for example, for 3 quotations from three different companies.

Whatever you do, consider a) to f) above and ask for quotations based on this.

chuchok: 5 more containers is a nice idea but

compare it with a bar, 'If you give me cheaper drinks I come next week with 5 friends. Btw, a ship from Europe to Asia has space for about 7000x20'-containers and that is sailing 4-5 times a week, just to give you an idea.

[tuktukmike]

Hi

Sorry not a clue from Brussells

I wish i could get a nearly free container from uk to bkk. I am paying around £2000 for part container, but this includes the company packing all my household goods from my home to delivery in Hua Hin. also includes insurance.

But just will have to wait for the usual problems when it all arrives in bkk and customs want some money for the next card game.

Mike.

[chuchok]

Hi Axel,

Volume discounts do work in shipping as opposed to a bar (tho i do wish the bar discount would work!!!) Freight forwarding and shipping is a competitive business as you know.

Even if you have a 7000TEU vessel sailing from Europe every couple of days, the vessels may not be full to Asia.there are many freight forwarders out there that have to make up volume contracts with the shipping lines.Every container counts and the shipping lines sometimes fight tooth and nail for every little bit.

Joe Blow who walks into a freight company with one container etc, is sometimes asking to get ripped off.I know of many instances where people with personal effects are charged much more than their commercial counterparts.

Also, if you know what you are talking about, you are most likley to get a much better deal. I have done this myself and the rates change dramaticly.Again , the best thing is to shop around, although I'm sure your company would do a good deal.

cheers