Ukraine ... Enlighten yourself

[lannarebirth]

My guess is that the cheap tuition will calm most prejudices.

[triffid]

P1P directed me to this thread when I opened another one without prior knowledge of this one. I'm glad he did because after reading his comments here and looing at the school's website I have become very interested in Wichai Wittaya as perhaps suitable for my purposes. Certainly I'm going to visit it to get more specifics.

In the meantime I'd be very interested for any first hand info on

a) the costs for a 6 year old

B ) do they have a school bus, and if so what is the range/distance it caters to?

c) would they accept a pupil of this age in september, ie not at the start of the academic year?

My children, both a bit older than 6, paid about 60K per year each for the last year. I do not have next year's costs, however I am sure they will not be dramatically different.

Yes, they have several school buses, which collect from considerable distances from the school. I know of two children coming from near Chom Tong, a distance of almost 50Kms from the school. I don't know of the costs, I'm afraid.

I strongly suggest you contact Mr. Murat Mendi, The Vice-Principal for Kindergarten and Primary levels. He is a charming and extremely helpful man, who would be only too happy to answer your questions.

PS

I too find the panic at the mere fact that a school has management with muslim/turkish names - without any evidence of undue muslim religiosity at the school - as appalling as it is unthinking. Other managements christian or buddhist names, so should one draw parallel conclusions of religiosity? It really is too silly.

Let me hasten to add that I too am "as secular as they come".

I simply find this evidential bigotry sad and lamentably symptomatic of this age, where the right-wing powers-that-be in countries like the US retain their positions by the expedient of promoting fear and xenophobia within their electorate. The "If you're not with me, you must be against me" mentality, a causative agent in so much that is wrong in our world today.

Thanks for the info and the referral to Mr Mendi. I'll follow that up for the next time I go to Chiang Mai.

(As to the prevalent post 9-11 islamophobia, we are obviously of a mind about this. The pity is that none of the islamophobes bothers to read up a bit to enlighten himself about muslims/islam - I mean read books by (western) scholars, not by ignorant bigots or self serving acolytes of Bush. Of course this suggestion is of no use vis a vis outright bigotry.

I wonder how anti muslim expatriates react to thai muslims - one sees them for example selling from the 'roti' stands all ove the place - many wearing the (horrors) headscarf). Are the anti muslim expatriates aware that the last army chief, Sonthi is a muslim? Their illustrious foreign minister, Surin (now head of Asean) is muslim. What does this say about the rather different thai/buddhist attitude to their muslim compatriots? I wonder too what percentage of the thai population is muslim. But I'll digress no further.)

[infernalman7]

I would say the real problem is the curriculum.

If to compare Varee with international schools in Chiang Mai, and not talking about anything else but the higher education, it will be tougher for your daughter to get into universities.

The problem is that Varee, and English programs in schools like Montfort, Prince Royal College, Sacred Hearts', all of them do not have a certified and solid program that is recognized by universities. Yes, including universities in Thailand.

Why? Children from these programs are usually not so good at English and not so good at Thai. From the papers it looks like they are well-rounded but they are actually not. The dean at Chulalongkorn Universities told one of my friend that the problem is because schools use their own programs and that is not good.

There is only one way to go to universities for these kids. They have to do the best in standardized tests such as SAT, ACT, IELTS, TOEFL, SAT IIs and etc. And this is the only thing that determines their performance. Whatever the school says doesn't really matter since their reputation and education records IN ENGLISH PROGRAM is QUESTIONABLE. These schools usually "help" their students do the paperwork or CV just so that the school would get some "credit" for having students in famous college.

While international schools in Chiang Mai do have at least some reputation and experience with this. The curriculum will be either American (APIS, CMIS, Grace), or British A-level (Lanna) or IB (Prem). Some students from these international schools can simply hand their grades in to university and just go in without any supplement tests. (Especially at Prem since they send ALL HOMEWORKS AND EXAMS to be graded at the IB Headquarter).

But this is ultimately your choice.

[infernalman7]

is this the one near carrefour???

No, that's Watchirawit (Matayom). The Pratom is along Changklan Road. Wichai is further along Changklan past Chiang Mai Land.

The students from this school are very famous from YouTube.

But of-course, famous because of sexual assaults in school's bathroom with school uniform on.

[Mapguy]

Some parts of some of the comments on this thread are helpful, but there is still a lack of substantive concrete knowledge shared of schools and what is and what is not important in terms of success educationally both in Thailand and in other countries where children may wish to go on in higher education.

Some parents give great stress to whether or not schools teach "acceptable" religious values. Fair enough. if that is what they think is a deciding factor, but I am not writing about that. I am writing about academic studies --- readin', writin', and 'rithmetic --- that prepare a child well for university education. And I have to qualify that goal by saying that there is great variation in the quality of universities in Thailand as well as universities abroad.

I read many posts which are of the "My-child-is very-happy-there-and-the staff-is-very-caring-and-helpful" ilk. Well, that is important, but is does not speak to the scholastic rigor of schools. Isn't that principally what the schools are for?

There are definitely fundamental differences in scholastic quality among schools in Chiang Mai. The conversation in this thread is obviously not focusing on government schools although Thailand should be applauded for the extent of its general education program compared to many, many countries. Chiang Mai does happen to have a couple of good government schools, which students must generally test into. But even those schools generally have huge student bodies with 50 - 60 students to a classroom. Such enormous classes are a feature of many "good" Thai schools, such as Yuparaj, Montfort College, Prince Royal's, and Dara.

The so-called "international schools" are not necessarily an improvement. These are generally "for-profit" schools. That doesn't mean that they all are focusing totally on the bottom line to the detriment of their students, but the bottom line counts most.

Among these schools, there is a local pecking order. They seem basically to sort by what you pay in tuition fees. That's not always the case, but probably a good rule of thumb.

Unfortunately, the best of schools in Chiang Mai, mind you, appear successful only relative to other schools in Chiang Mai in placing graduates in decent schools abroad, not compared with good preparatory schools generally. In other words, none of them seems to be particularly successful in placing students in universities of note abroad, and placement is also patchy even in Thai universities. There are some individual "stars" among graduates from time to time, but the higher education destinations of graduates published in the newspaper last year --- to give an example --- were not inspiring. But --- well --- here we are! We are generally not United Nations agency personnel working abroad on fabulous salaries whose children are basically subsidized in boarding schools "back home." Well, Prem could work for that crowd and Mitsubishi senior management!

For Prem to offer IB (International Baccalaureate) studies (not for all students, apparently), puts it comparatively in a very good marketing position as well as providing very sound academic preparation. The IB curriculum is really probably the best alternative for families who must move internationally while children are in school. For NIS, APIS, Lanna, and CMIS, there are ups and downs. Look at least for certification by internationally-recognized educational organizations if you have any wish to see your child advance to a decent school abroad upon graduation.

Then there are other schools, such as Varee and Witchai Witaya. The credentials of teachers at these schools are generally not of a high level. Just saying that they hire teachers "suitable for grade level" begs the question as to whether or not their teachers are properly educated, trained, and accredited. Where did they go to school? What degrees do they hold? Are they (in the case of farang ) accredited to teach in their "home" countries? And which countries? What previous teaching experience do they have, and where? And ask what the teachers are paid!! A salary schedule will do that notes how many teachers are at each level. No names necessary. Privacy protected! Oh, yes, ask about teacher --- not administrative and other staff --- salaries. Teacher salaries and benefits should constitute at least 75% of a school's operational budget.

Anyway, folks, don't be dazzled by fancy swimming pools!

Edited February 10, 2008 by Mapguy

[thaiwholesale]

Some parts of some of the comments on this thread are helpful, but there is still a lack of substantive concrete knowledge shared of schools and what is and what is not important in terms of success educationally both in Thailand and in other countries where children may wish to go on in higher education.

Some parents give great stress to whether or not schools teach "acceptable" religious values. Fair enough. if that is what they think is a deciding factor, but I am not writing about that. I am writing about academic studies --- readin', writin', and 'rithmetic --- that prepare a child well for university education. And I have to qualify that goal by saying that there is great variation in the quality of universities in Thailand as well as universities abroad.

I read many posts which are of the "My-child-is very-happy-there-and-the staff-is-very-caring-and-helpful" ilk. Well, that is important, but is does not speak to the scholastic rigor of schools. Isn't that principally what the schools are for?

There are definitely fundamental differences in scholastic quality among schools in Chiang Mai. The conversation in this thread is obviously not focusing on government schools although Thailand should be applauded for the extent of its general education program compared to many, many countries. Chiang Mai does happen to have a couple of good government schools, which students must generally test into. But even those schools generally have huge student bodies with 50 - 60 students to a classroom. Such enormous classes are a feature of many "good" Thai schools, such as Yuparaj, Montfort College, Prince Royal's, and Dara.

The so-called "international schools" are not necessarily an improvement. These are generally "for-profit" schools. That doesn't mean that they all are focusing totally on the bottom line to the detriment of their students, but the bottom line counts most.

Among these schools, there is a local pecking order. They seem basically to sort by what you pay in tuition fees. That's not always the case, but probably a good rule of thumb.

Unfortunately, the best of schools in Chiang Mai, mind you, appear successful only relative to other schools in Chiang Mai in placing graduates in decent schools abroad, not compared with good preparatory schools generally. In other words, none of them seems to be particularly successful in placing students in universities of note abroad, and placement is also patchy even in Thai universities. There are some individual "stars" among graduates from time to time, but the higher education destinations of graduates published in the newspaper last year --- to give an example --- were not inspiring. But --- well --- here we are! We are generally not United Nations agency personnel working abroad on fabulous salaries whose children are basically subsidized in boarding schools "back home." Well, Prem could work for that crowd and Mitsubishi senior management!

For Prem to offer IB (International Baccalaureate) studies (not for all students, apparently), puts it comparatively in a very good marketing position as well as providing very sound academic preparation. The IB curriculum is really probably the best alternative for families who must move internationally while children are in school. For NIS, APIS, Lanna, and CMIS, there are ups and downs. Look at least for certification by internationally-recognized educational organizations if you have any wish to see your child advance to a decent school abroad upon graduation.

Then there are other schools, such as Varee and Witchai Witaya. The credentials of teachers at these schools are generally not of a high level. Just saying that they hire teachers "suitable for grade level" begs the question as to whether or not their teachers are properly educated, trained, and accredited. Where did they go to school? What degrees do they hold? Are they (in the case of farang ) accredited to teach in their "home" countries? And which countries? What previous teaching experience do they have, and where? And ask what the teachers are paid!! A salary schedule will do that notes how many teachers are at each level. No names necessary. Privacy protected! Oh, yes, ask about teacher --- not administrative and other staff --- salaries. Teacher salaries and benefits should constitute at least 75% of a school's operational budget.

Anyway, folks, don't be dazzled by fancy swimming pools!

Hi Mapguy if you have to send your daughter to Yuparaj, Montfort College, Prince Royal's, Dara, Varee or Witchai Witaya where will you send her and why?

[infernalman7]

Some parts of some of the comments on this thread are helpful, but there is still a lack of substantive concrete knowledge shared of schools and what is and what is not important in terms of success educationally both in Thailand and in other countries where children may wish to go on in higher education.

Some parents give great stress to whether or not schools teach "acceptable" religious values. Fair enough. if that is what they think is a deciding factor, but I am not writing about that. I am writing about academic studies --- readin', writin', and 'rithmetic --- that prepare a child well for university education. And I have to qualify that goal by saying that there is great variation in the quality of universities in Thailand as well as universities abroad.

I read many posts which are of the "My-child-is very-happy-there-and-the staff-is-very-caring-and-helpful" ilk. Well, that is important, but is does not speak to the scholastic rigor of schools. Isn't that principally what the schools are for?

There are definitely fundamental differences in scholastic quality among schools in Chiang Mai. The conversation in this thread is obviously not focusing on government schools although Thailand should be applauded for the extent of its general education program compared to many, many countries. Chiang Mai does happen to have a couple of good government schools, which students must generally test into. But even those schools generally have huge student bodies with 50 - 60 students to a classroom. Such enormous classes are a feature of many "good" Thai schools, such as Yuparaj, Montfort College, Prince Royal's, and Dara.

The so-called "international schools" are not necessarily an improvement. These are generally "for-profit" schools. That doesn't mean that they all are focusing totally on the bottom line to the detriment of their students, but the bottom line counts most.

Among these schools, there is a local pecking order. They seem basically to sort by what you pay in tuition fees. That's not always the case, but probably a good rule of thumb.

Unfortunately, the best of schools in Chiang Mai, mind you, appear successful only relative to other schools in Chiang Mai in placing graduates in decent schools abroad, not compared with good preparatory schools generally. In other words, none of them seems to be particularly successful in placing students in universities of note abroad, and placement is also patchy even in Thai universities. There are some individual "stars" among graduates from time to time, but the higher education destinations of graduates published in the newspaper last year --- to give an example --- were not inspiring. But --- well --- here we are! We are generally not United Nations agency personnel working abroad on fabulous salaries whose children are basically subsidized in boarding schools "back home." Well, Prem could work for that crowd and Mitsubishi senior management!

For Prem to offer IB (International Baccalaureate) studies (not for all students, apparently), puts it comparatively in a very good marketing position as well as providing very sound academic preparation. The IB curriculum is really probably the best alternative for families who must move internationally while children are in school. For NIS, APIS, Lanna, and CMIS, there are ups and downs. Look at least for certification by internationally-recognized educational organizations if you have any wish to see your child advance to a decent school abroad upon graduation.

Then there are other schools, such as Varee and Witchai Witaya. The credentials of teachers at these schools are generally not of a high level. Just saying that they hire teachers "suitable for grade level" begs the question as to whether or not their teachers are properly educated, trained, and accredited. Where did they go to school? What degrees do they hold? Are they (in the case of farang ) accredited to teach in their "home" countries? And which countries? What previous teaching experience do they have, and where? And ask what the teachers are paid!! A salary schedule will do that notes how many teachers are at each level. No names necessary. Privacy protected! Oh, yes, ask about teacher --- not administrative and other staff --- salaries. Teacher salaries and benefits should constitute at least 75% of a school's operational budget.

Anyway, folks, don't be dazzled by fancy swimming pools!

Hi Mapguy if you have to send your daughter to Yuparaj, Montfort College, Prince Royal's, Dara, Varee or Witchai Witaya where will you send her and why?

Mapguy has said almost everything.

You're not asking me but if the choice you have there I would send my daughter to Prince Royal's.

Montfort College is a boys only school unless your daughter is already in the high school. Yuparaj is not so good at English based on the Thai National Test score. Prince Royal's was a boys only school but now it's gotten better.

[swain]

Does Varee have a website.. I saw this link.. http://www.varee.ac.th/thai/ but its a dead link... if someone has a different url please pass it along.

[Loaded]

a few comments:

Wichai employs a very religious christian British teacher. He has no problem working in a muslim school.

Official English Programmes (EP) are accredited and controlled by the Thai MoE. In Chiang Mai Varee, Montfort, Wattanothaipayap run EPs. Not sure if Wichai's is an 'official' EP. Other schools that offer MEPs, and bilingual Programmes are flying under the radar of Government regulation and therefore can be more flexible with their programmes.

International Schools pay relatively high salaries and all teachers are PGCE/BEd/Teacher Licenced or equivalent. Other schools, including Varee and Wichai, pay foreign teachers less than half International School salaries. If you are qualified to teach in your home country, guess where you work.

[Mapguy]

Hi Mapguy if you have to send your daughter to Yuparaj, Montfort College, Prince Royal's, Dara, Varee or Witchai Witaya where will you send her and why?

You've left out the international schools, I imagine because of the cost. I believe you have a daughter who is of primary school age. Based upon discussions with Thai friends, some of whom have backgrounds in education and some of whom just have small children and are eager to get them into a good school, Prince Royal's and Dara appear to be the most popular options. A bright student, with tutoring, would probably shine in any of the schools you mentioned. One Thai source I admire quite a bit, who has been a free-lance tutor for several years, attended the demonstration school of Chiang Mai University and Yuparaj, graduating from one or the other (I can't recall which). Her recommendation was to send a child to an international school if you can afford it.

[Puwa]

Schools, burgers, haze, bikes, bars, bistros--why does nearly topic on this forum disintegrate into personal argument? Civility, civility!

[p1p]

WARNING: Any further bickering will receive its just deserts.

Perhaps I should try to make some points a bit clearer:

1. Some people seem unable to understand or accept that Wichai Wittaya IS NOT A MUSLIM SCHOOL. it is entirely secular.

2. To the best of my knowledge and assurances I have received, all teachers at Wichai Wittaya have teaching qualifications and experience from their home countries. They are employed in posts appropriate to their experience and qualifications.

3. There are several Christian teachers at Wichai Wittaya, not just one.

[Crow Boy]

I have deleted two posts that did not add any value to the discussion. Please keep the discussion civil and on thread.

Crow Boy

Moderator Team

Thai Visa

[infernalman7]

You've left out the international schools, I imagine because of the cost. I believe you have a daughter who is of primary school age. Based upon discussions with Thai friends, some of whom have backgrounds in education and some of whom just have small children and are eager to get them into a good school, Prince Royal's and Dara appear to be the most popular options. A bright student, with tutoring, would probably shine in any of the schools you mentioned. One Thai source I admire quite a bit, who has been a free-lance tutor for several years, attended the demonstration school of Chiang Mai University and Yuparaj, graduating from one or the other (I can't recall which). Her recommendation was to send a child to an international school if you can afford it.

Oh yes, I totally forgot about the Chiang Mai University Demonstration School. It's ranked in the top 10 of the Thai High School Ranking (Nationwide).

But the problem is that it is a high school, no primary section. And the other thing is admission there is one of the toughest in the nation again, having guaranteed that all their students can just simply walk-in to Chiang Mai University. Their staff is good, having some professors from Chiang Mai University teaching in a high school. Students there can use all the facilities of the CMU.

The other thing is it is the one and only top 10 school in Thailand that has students can just go out and in the school at anytime. (No gates, fences or walls)

[tigerbeer]

You've left out the international schools, I imagine because of the cost. I believe you have a daughter who is of primary school age. Based upon discussions with Thai friends, some of whom have backgrounds in education and some of whom just have small children and are eager to get them into a good school, Prince Royal's and Dara appear to be the most popular options. A bright student, with tutoring, would probably shine in any of the schools you mentioned. One Thai source I admire quite a bit, who has been a free-lance tutor for several years, attended the demonstration school of Chiang Mai University and Yuparaj, graduating from one or the other (I can't recall which). Her recommendation was to send a child to an international school if you can afford it.

Oh yes, I totally forgot about the Chiang Mai University Demonstration School. It's ranked in the top 10 of the Thai High School Ranking (Nationwide).

But the problem is that it is a high school, no primary section. And the other thing is admission there is one of the toughest in the nation again, having guaranteed that all their students can just simply walk-in to Chiang Mai University. Their staff is good, having some professors from Chiang Mai University teaching in a high school. Students there can use all the facilities of the CMU.

The other thing is it is the one and only top 10 school in Thailand that has students can just go out and in the school at anytime. (No gates, fences or walls)

thanks for this information. amazing how everyone focuses on the private and international schools including myself.

[PeaceBlondie]

Speaking of demonstration schools in the Chiang Mai area, Rajabat has one on Chotana Road, for primary (prathom) students. Excellent facility if you can stand fans, great student body (well behaved), etc.

[thaiwholesale]

I like to thanks all for their information this have really been helpful. Please come with more.

When I start this thread I was thing of Varee but is now thinking that is not going to be my choice.

I really wonder why there is not one parent form Varee there will recommend the school. Is it because Varee is not anything special but just a place you put your children because you think it is better than a normal school? Just wonder?

[infernalman7]

I like to thanks all for their information this have really been helpful. Please come with more.

When I start this thread I was thing of Varee but is now thinking that is not going to be my choice.

I really wonder why there is not one parent form Varee there will recommend the school. Is it because Varee is not anything special but just a place you put your children because you think it is better than a normal school? Just wonder?

Well, I don't know. But the facility is of-course better than a normal thai schools. Just because they have fancy swimming pool and A/C in class rooms.

Apart from that, nothing special. And the "quality of students and staff" is no match to some top Thai schools in Chiang Mai which may in some cases, teach better English than Varee's EP. (CMUDS, Yuparaj, Montfort, Regina's, PRCs, Sacred Hearts, Dara)

[haybilly]

I like to thanks all for their information this have really been helpful. Please come with more.

When I start this thread I was thing of Varee but is now thinking that is not going to be my choice.

I really wonder why there is not one parent form Varee there will recommend the school. Is it because Varee is not anything special but just a place you put your children because you think it is better than a normal school? Just wonder?

Well, I don't know. But the facility is of-course better than a normal thai schools. Just because they have fancy swimming pool and A/C in class rooms.

Apart from that, nothing special. And the "quality of students and staff" is no match to some top Thai schools in Chiang Mai which may in some cases, teach better English than Varee's EP. (CMUDS, Yuparaj, Montfort, Regina's, PRCs, Sacred Hearts, Dara)

Well, well, this has been a fascinating read--I am one of the parents who has decided to send my daughter to Varee--I did some research, asked several parents with kids there, visited the school on several occasions and thought that it looked like the right choice for my 6 year old, and very high-spirited not too mention rather naughty little daughter--I am now totally confused but time alone will tell; God wiiling [ and by that I mean any God you care to worship--or not, as in my case] my daughter will thrive in Varee and failing that I always have the option to remove her and start all over again--AAAARRGGGHHH!

May I thank all the contributors who expressed valid and interesting points of view--without the need for bigotry.

[Hugh Jarse]

A most helpful thread, indeed. I too have a 6 year old with virtually no Thai. Will be checking out the schools mentioned as wel as Sarasas (nr the railway station). Also plan to re visit Wichai Wittaya and Varee and revert.

[Gravelrash]

As my previous post said I don't like extremists of any persuasion. My child was in Varee and I wasn't picking up that he was learning as much as I felt he should. In fact he was learning very little. As I also said I had a friend who was very happy with Wichai, he returned home and his kids slotted straight back into their western school without any apparent holes in their years of education at Wichai.

Also reading the constructive comments about Wichai, between the ignorant personal attacks, I decided to have another look at it. I liked what I saw and changed my child over to Wichai and am deligted I did so. He is now actually learning, in fact he went through a long catch up period, and I am now happy with his progress. This is of course only in comparison to Varee, and I cannot attest to other schools. I may or may not change to an International School at high school age.

It is difficult to know which school as how do you benchmark them? Trial and error isn't the best way to find out, but it is better than perservering with an inadequate education.

Finally an interesting side effect, apparently the school also teaches morals, work ethic etc. Lately we have had some unexpected and unasked for help around the house.

[Mapguy]

There's no easy answer to where to put your child in school. And just remember, the family is most important in education. In short, don't just fob your child off onto a school for his or her future development. And it isn't just "Okay, primary schools don't mean squat --- the kid is just a kid; but what about Chemistry and Calculus?!" I am a firm believer in the importance of early education. And it is clear to me that several of the TV posters are focused the same way.

Different kids do well in different schools. Fair enough. LOTS of variables. But to get down to the nitty gritty, I think that it is safe to say that you usually get what you pay for. Not always, but generally. Do what you can afford to do after careful attention.

Do you want a small classroom with accredited teachers? You'll pay for it! Usually!! Otherwise, friends, no specific recommendations (even for the schools my wife and I have chosen). Why?

Kids do well in a variety of schools. Much depends on the child and the school. Most on you, actually! Otherwise, on this site under various topic headings there are schools referred to with teachers who try hard, some of whom are very effective. Some unfortunately haven't had the training one would wish. That's not to "bad mouth" them. I know of one relatively new nursery school in which the effective teachers are not trained appropriately but who are, in my opinion, very effective despite being here on "magic" tourist visas. Nonetheless, who do you want flying your airplane?!

Our child is an eager learner (perhaps the most important quality). I humbly claim that part of that eagerness comes from her mother and me, but her uncertified teachers in K1 - K3 have also been quite effective, and we do appreciate very much what they have done. Would they get a job in New Zealand, Australia, North America (less Mexico), or Europe? Nope! Never in any decent school. They know it; they admit it!

I have not spoken the unspoken. I suspect that there are a lot of caring TV posters who are from abroad and have Thai wives and are frustrated about what to do: what they can afford and so on?! This forum is, after all, basically the land of expats, some of whom do actually worry about more than if water is free or not in a pub or restaurant! For those who have not tasted the local water, Chiang Mai is a superb choice in which to live liveably (if you don't have asthma!) when it comes to the selection of schools, including some Thai government schools.

For anyone, I can suggest that checking the budget, doing research personally regarding education as well as remembering your own personal experience and listening to "sales pitches" at the various schools. Most schools have very, very pleasant marketing (and other) staff, but you need to know what you are looking at. One minor rule of thumb: FORGET THE SWIMMING POOL !!!!

Now, in Chiang Mai, you are in a buyers market. Understand that in tough economic times, the schools are already beginning to lose enrollment, sometimes peculiar to the ethnic mix of the expat community in Chiang Mai. Funny, isn't it, that a very sizable number of expats don't post on this parochial, language-sensitive web site. Imagine that!!!! You mean some folks don't speaka rite da Inglishe well?

It is late. Sorry for any lapses in my train of thought!

Edited December 22, 2008 by Mapguy

[PeaceBlondie]

Mapguy, excellent post, as usual.

Thanks for mentioning the unmentionable, about having a Thai partner who wants her leuk krueng baby to have an education in Thailand that resembles the education she had, many years ago. Students need to know about sam tom in Lamphun, not greengrocers in Kent.

[whopper]

My 11 year old son goes to Varee and is very happy. I teach him english, so that really isn't an issue. The costs are just a little more expensive than some of the middle range thai schools and I believe it is worth it to spend a little extra if it just goes for smaller class sizes.The faculty seems organized and they stay in touch with the parents with regard to completion of assignments and homework. I used to teach in Chiang mai in various english programs and in all types of schools. At wachiwarat school they gave me a loud speaker and the class/chaos had maybe 60 kids in the room, needless to say that is a waste of time.My expectations are not too high with anything outside international schools. He loves it, that is what is important.

[NaiGreg]

My daughter goes to anubaan (age 4) at Varee. So far, so good, but I will explore all options as she develops. Her younger brother will start next term.

btw ... Varee is a Thai-Christian school but observes both Christian and Buddhist holidays.

** I'm now thinking of sending my kids off to a second-rate, secular-cum-Muslim school in Indonesia. Apparently this did wonders for the Harvard-educated wonder-boy President-elect Barrack Obama.

[busylife]

I think Wichai is the best of all in education, they have Key Stage Curriculum and good maths, and science. But facilities are not as good as others. Last year Wichai was the top school in Thailand in NT test English part.

[brennanstimpy]

It is obviously dependent upon what kind of school you are interested in. I have personally taught at Varee in the English program and would not recommend it to anyone. I know Varee and believe that she has a great heart but the success of her school has gotten to her and she is definitely in it for the money. It claims to be a Christian Thai school, but it it essentially a Buddhist school that honors Christian concepts. It is completely steeped in it and the traditions/rituals that go along with it. I read another comment that talked about the classrooms being orderly, but when I was there the 2006-2007 year, it was anything but orderly in the English program. If your child is Thai and you do not disapprove with the Thai education system, Varee is a decent school. I don't know if anyone has mentioned it, but it is also a school for the upper end class of people, who show blatant disregard for those they believe are "below" them in class. I do also know that the teachers in the English program are not required to have a teaching certificate. I know it is a very expensive school and I would say if you are willing to pay for expensive schools any of the international schools will give your child a better education because the have to follow a standard outside of Thailand, which I have found is much more strict.