Show Money Needed--confirmed

[shellman]

Well dude, excuuuuuuse the dangerous US for not giving you and your situation special treatment cause you got a lot o dough. Get your wife citizenship in any of the visa exempt countries with all that cash. Money can buy you happiness. oh wait, you hate the US. money can then buy you sadness.

PS: Osama and company got cash. thank god they don't get special treatment

You seem to have a problem to understand my point. I did not request special treatment for anyone, I just said that the farangs should think about the visa regulations in their own countries before bitching about Thailands regulations which are rather liberal. I would expect a polite treatment for anyone who wishes to spend money in the US as a tourist, not a gestapo like interview from an most unfriendly person. What would we do if Thailand decides to enforce their own existing laws a bit stricter in return to the hassle for Thai nationals to enter the US, Canada, Australia or the UK? I am from Austria and Thais can get a tourist Visa for Austria fairly easy.

So, insted of telling me that I should buy a citizenship for my wife (do you even know what you are talking about?) - you could do something even better and tell me the difference between any Schengen Treaty Country and the countries mentioned above? I mean why do Thais qualify for an easy Visa to Germany, Italy. Sweden...but not for the US, Australia, Canada or UK? I am talking about a tourist Visa - tourists usually spent money in other countries and do not break the laws, just becuase there are exceptions, why do these countries discriminate all others as well? I wonder what the many farangs in Thailand would do if Thailand starts to enforce their Tourist Visa Regulations? there would be many many dissapointed people who have been exploiting the kindness of Thailand for many years and even whine about it when Thais start to try to get rid of the foreigners who can not support themselves here. It is easy enough to get a legal work permit, Visa, whatever, why bend the rules to the point where the Thais are fed up and make it harder for everyone, including the legitimate expats.

I do not hate the US at all, i merly find it more dangerous to live in ANY american or most european cities with more then 1 Million inhabitants then I find it in Bangkok. The Crime Statistics may even proove that feeling to be true.

And I myself don't have a load of money but the family of my wife, you might want to read the post before commenting it

cheers

[shellman]

  it must be EXTREMELY nice to be part of a family that makes 1.9 million baht per day!!!  related to Thaksin by chance? 

And it is not my family but my wifes.

It's sad and I'm sorry to hear that you don't feel that you are a part of your wife's family. I think that most good husbands would feel that they are.

well, the point is that even though i am the farang, i am not the rich one...

[Ajarn]

I am talking about a tourist Visa - tourists usually spent money in other countries and do not break the laws

Maybe for many, but not for Thais...US Embassy says most Thais (2/3) on tourist visas to America DO break the law. Hence, the reason for the policy of assuming first that the Thai won't return to Thailand unless they 'have' to...

And, if Thailand gets tough here, I could care less. No problem for me in any regard...

[lopburi3]

I am talking about a tourist Visa - tourists usually spent money in other countries and do not break the laws

Maybe for many, but not for Thais...US Embassy says most Thais (2/3) on tourist visas to America DO break the law. Hence, the reason for the policy of assuming first that the Thai won't return to Thailand unless they 'have' to...

And, if Thailand gets tough here, I could care less. No problem for me in any regard...

I question that 2/3 figure. If true the Consular Officers have a lot to answer for as it is their duty to prevent this from happening.

I seriously believe the figure would be less than 30% and probably under 20%. I have not seen the stats in some years but believe that what used to be posted on the Embassy web site was in that range.

[shellman]

I am talking about a tourist Visa - tourists usually spent money in other countries and do not break the laws

Maybe for many, but not for Thais...US Embassy says most Thais (2/3) on tourist visas to America DO break the law. Hence, the reason for the policy of assuming first that the Thai won't return to Thailand unless they 'have' to...

And, if Thailand gets tough here, I could care less. No problem for me in any regard...

well, fine that you are entirely legal, but if you have been in thailand for a while, you sure know that may are not. and i also have serious doubts that 2/3 of the Thai Tourists to teh US break the law. But if you can offer a official statistic on this, I am the first to admit it if I am wrong.

cheers

[Ajarn]

I am talking about a tourist Visa - tourists usually spent money in other countries and do not break the laws

Maybe for many, but not for Thais...US Embassy says most Thais (2/3) on tourist visas to America DO break the law. Hence, the reason for the policy of assuming first that the Thai won't return to Thailand unless they 'have' to...

And, if Thailand gets tough here, I could care less. No problem for me in any regard...

well, fine that you are entirely legal, but if you have been in thailand for a while, you sure know that may are not. and i also have serious doubts that 2/3 of the Thai Tourists to teh US break the law. But if you can offer a official statistic on this, I am the first to admit it if I am wrong.

cheers

Call and ask for yourself. That's what I did.

[Ajarn]

I am talking about a tourist Visa - tourists usually spent money in other countries and do not break the laws

Maybe for many, but not for Thais...US Embassy says most Thais (2/3) on tourist visas to America DO break the law. Hence, the reason for the policy of assuming first that the Thai won't return to Thailand unless they 'have' to...

And, if Thailand gets tough here, I could care less. No problem for me in any regard...

I question that 2/3 figure. If true the Consular Officers have a lot to answer for as it is their duty to prevent this from happening.

I seriously believe the figure would be less than 30% and probably under 20%. I have not seen the stats in some years but believe that what used to be posted on the Embassy web site was in that range.

So, Lop, why do you think the US is so tough on first time tourist visa applications for Thais?. Why is their stated policy to assume the applicant won't come back?

Anyway, as I said, call them yourself and ask. That's what I did.

[shellman]

Well, a phone call is no official statistic i would say and i have my doubts that I can just call the US Embassy and ask them about the crime statistics of Thai Tourists? I hardly can believe that they are authorized to make such statements over the phone. So if you do not have any more evidence then a phone call that may or may not have happened, I prefer to stick to my first impression that this figure is way to high to be true.

cheers

[Ajarn]

Well, a phone call is no official statistic i would say  and i have my doubts that I can just call the US Embassy and ask them about the crime statistics of Thai Tourists? I hardly can believe that they are authorized to make such statements over the phone. So if you do not have any more evidence then a phone call that may or may not have happened, I prefer to stick to my first impression that this figure is way to high to be true.

cheers

Live in your own chosen clueless world, sir.

[shellman]

Well, a phone call is no official statistic i would say  and i have my doubts that I can just call the US Embassy and ask them about the crime statistics of Thai Tourists? I hardly can believe that they are authorized to make such statements over the phone. So if you do not have any more evidence then a phone call that may or may not have happened, I prefer to stick to my first impression that this figure is way to high to be true.

cheers

Live in your own chosen clueless world, sir.

Hmmm - so I am clueless because I doubt your word? I would say I am highly intelligent because I do not believe everything that somebody says on an internet forum You don't expect anyone to believe that any Embassy official will tell you on the phone that 66.6% of thai tourists to the US are criminals in some way?

cheers

[Ajarn]

Well, a phone call is no official statistic i would say  and i have my doubts that I can just call the US Embassy and ask them about the crime statistics of Thai Tourists? I hardly can believe that they are authorized to make such statements over the phone. So if you do not have any more evidence then a phone call that may or may not have happened, I prefer to stick to my first impression that this figure is way to high to be true.

cheers

Live in your own chosen clueless world, sir.

Hmmm - so I am clueless because I doubt your word? I would say I am highly intelligent because I do not believe everything that somebody says on an internet forum You don't expect anyone to believe that any Embassy official will tell you on the phone that 66.6% of thai tourists to the US are criminals in some way?

cheers

Instead of even trying to learn/confirm the truth, you choose to shoot the messenger- and call me a LIAR , and also continue to stay ignorant in the process, assuming your own fantasy figure... Doesn't seem to reflect much of your 'high intelligence'. You're sounding more like a troll now, I think

[shellman]

Call me stupid, call me a troll, but I still don't believe it. Up to me I'd say.

[Ajarn]

Call me stupid, call me a troll, but I still don't believe it. Up to me I'd say.

Troll

[shellman]

Call me stupid, call me a troll, but I still don't believe it. Up to me I'd say.

Troll

you are obviously out of arguments khun ajarn

[Ajarn]

Call me stupid, call me a troll, but I still don't believe it. Up to me I'd say.

Troll

you are obviously out of arguments khun ajarn

Argue with a Troll? Pointless, obviously

[shellman]

I rest my case and go to have a beer at Soi 33

cheers

[Darth Bangkok]

I question that 2/3 figure. If true the Consular Officers have a lot to answer for as it is their duty to prevent this from happening.

I seriously believe the figure would be less than 30% and probably under 20%. I have not seen the stats in some years but believe that what used to be posted on the Embassy web site was in that range.

at least 80% of the 10 or 15 thai's i know in NY are illegal. I also know of a number who got married to friends of friends or even in one case, the daughter of the thai restaurant owner (who are among the few legal thais I know), just to stay in the US

[chuchok]

If I was a betting man, i would be putting a stack of cash on what Ajarn says is true.

I have been told similar information from a NZ Immigration official first hand.He said that Thais were in the Top percentile when it came to overstaying.Thats the reason why a lot of countries put them through the third degree before giving them visas.

[Ajarn]

If I was a betting man, i would be putting a stack of cash on what Ajarn says is true.

I have been told similar  information from a NZ Immigration official first hand.He said that Thais were in the Top percentile when it came to overstaying.Thats the reason why a lot of countries put them through the third degree before giving them visas.

Just to clarify what was told to me, they said 2/3 violated the law, but not just with overstays. He said the most common violation they see is someone working in America on a tourist visa...

And the reason why it was over the phone was because my wife was turned down initially after her interview, and I called and talked to the official who interviewed her in Chiang Mai. It took another interview the next week, with me there, before we got the visa....Too late, unfortunately.

That sad story is documented here. http://asiarecipe.com/letter.html

[chuchok]

working...in the oldest profession, me thinks.

[Felt 35]

We can in a way say that Thailand have a liberal immigration policy regarding tourists where which they gain something from in the form of more money, but on the other hand a very inhuman policy regarding people with a family related reason to be here.

That policy remind me about the story about the friend who smile and do everything for you as long as he gain something, but as soon as he not gain something he turn you the back.

(Recognized as a very bad habit Internationally.)

What the government haven’t considered is that with an open door to anyone even if they get more cash in, is that they also open the country for all levels of the society. Which again over time can make their country as a hub for what they call “bad foreigners”, criminals and alike.

They have now suddenly got this point and because they didn’t think about this earlier do they no call most foreigners bad and have to set some extremely rules, which again make it necessary for not only “the bad foreigner”, but also for tourists, and people with family in Thailand to run around with at least a months average Thai salary in their wallet every time they dear to leave Thailand and return.

In comparison to some of the countries mention earlier on this tread you don’t only need to qualify for a visa once, but you need to qualify every year, even for foreigners with a family relation to Thailand. (Married with a Thai National and/or children with Thai/foreign parents.)

This policy is very unlikely in most western countries as long as the foreign part not is a criminal and a burden to the actual country.

Personally I’m surprised that a country, which depend so much on foreign recourses take the twist, they no do, and I look at the reason two ways. Either have they totally lost foothold or it’s a panic related way to try to clean up in a self made mess.

BTW, I don’t agree in that its only USA, UK, Australia and Canada, which have straight rules for tourist visas for Thais.

Before we got married my wife had to prove documentation from here work, a reason to return, money in bank, insurance which cover all the Shcengen countries, plus a guaranty and invitation from me and a interview at the embassy, and a symbolic fee for here visa for getting the possibility to have a two weeks tourist visa to my home country.

But now when she is married come the great difference: No fee, no documents, “no money show”, no visit to immigration every 90 day and last but not to forget she is accepted, even if she have dark skin and not personally is wealthy.

The Thai immigration has a very long way to go…

[PeaceBlondie]

......Just to clarify what was told to me, they said 2/3 violated the law, but not just with overstays. He said the most common violation they see is someone working in America on a tourist visa...

And the reason why it was over the phone was because my wife was turned down initially after her interview, and I called and talked to the official who interviewed her in Chiang Mai. It took another interview the next week, with me there, before we got the visa....Too late, unfortunately.

That sad story is documented here. http://asiarecipe.com/letter.html

Ajarn, that's a tragic story. But is Thailand much different than other countries in this regard? Didn't the US Congress pass laws that ASSUME before the fact that all non-citizens wishing to 'visit' American will probably stay in the US? Thus, don't all non-citizens have to overcome the assumption with clear, convincing evidence to the contrary?

And aren't there other countries besides Thailand that have an even worse record of overstaying their tourist visas or working on a tourist visa?

Yes, it's tragic. Unfortunately, the US Congress assumes that non-citizens will break the law, so they keep them from even visiting.

[abdulrahman]

Felt 35,I think you make the point.

[abdulrahman]

Felt 35,I think you make the point.

[Ajarn]

Ajarn, that's a tragic story.  But is Thailand much different than other countries in this regard?  Didn't the US Congress pass laws that ASSUME before the fact that all non-citizens wishing to 'visit' American will probably stay in the US?  Thus, don't all non-citizens have to overcome the assumption with clear, convincing evidence to the contrary?

And aren't there other countries besides Thailand that have an even worse record of overstaying their tourist visas or working on a tourist visa?

Yes, it's tragic.  Unfortunately, the US Congress assumes that non-citizens will break the law, so they keep them from even visiting.

You know, I support the law. But, as long as it's so objective, with interviewers having no accountability for their decisions except a 'feeling' there are bound to be plenty of stories like mine. Even I've noticed how burnt out these workers seem...Yes, I was naive to think it would be no sweat for my wife to get a visa, under the circumstances. If I had gone there with her, it's likely her visa wouldn't have been a problem, and I could get home in time to see my mom....Yes, that's my cross to bear.

It's obvious why America needs to be strict. I truly believe it is the land of oppurtunity, and I'm sure many want to live there, but there must be some controls. I don't have an answer as to how to makes things better or fairer or faster or cheaper or....Frankly, I'd rather think about happier things that pertain more to my life now. Bush?

Bush who?

[Axel]

Ajarn, sorry to hear about this and I mean it.

Now, you are right, you hear these stories all the time, read it in the newspapers

and get a bad feeling. Do these guys have no compassion?

Sure, they have to proceed so and so many visa-applications every day, but still, one would expect a bit more humanity.

I am not putting my finger on the US-embassy, others are similar, only a question of numbers and the US has to proceed more than other countries' embassies.

Basically, I am for reciprocal treatment. If a citizen of one country can enter Thailand for 30 days without visa, the same should be granted to a Thai visiting that country.

Brazil did it the other day, as every Brazilian must be finger printed when entereing the US, they requested every US-citizen to be treated same when entering Brazil. IMHO FAIR. (Never mind the different equipment).

As for your exchange with shellman, what happened? He got some points and your replies were a bit outside of your usual style.

Back to emergency flights. 3 years ago, a Saturday night in BKK, I called my father in the hospital back home and learned that he just passed away. Fastest I could do, arrived Wednesday morning back home. Was singled out for customs inspection.

Sure, wife got black hair. "Where you come from?" "Bangkok!"

"Holiday?" "No, we live there and just come back because my father died last Saturday."

Reply: "This does not matter for customs, open the bags".

OK, they were right, but before I did it, I asked for a superior, lodged an official complaint, repeated this in writing and finally got an apology, bla bla bla.

You know, I was down, even I expected my father to go soon. He would have been proud, for my complaint...

A little bit of understanding, customs in my case, embassy in yours, really would not be too much to ask for.

[Ajarn]

Axel, some good points made. Thanks for your thoughts and experiences.

As for your exchange with shellman, what happened? He got some points and your replies were a

bit outside of your usual style. 

Never appreciated being called a liar. Sure you don't either. I react quite aggressively to such accusations regarding my honesty and my integrity, especially when someone has no valid reason to do that, in my view. Always have, always will react that way

Doubt the figures as loburi did, but don't doubt my word unless you can back it up!

[LivinLOS]

Well dude, excuuuuuuse the dangerous US for not giving you and your situation special treatment cause you got a lot o dough.

Not the case of my own personal experience... When I was in my mid 20's I wanted to do a year touring the USA.. Went for the interview.. Wore a nice tailored suit.. Had on a Platinum Rolex.. When asked to show proof of funds to allow my stay showed them a couple of 7 figure bank accounts (not Lira or Baht ).. Within 1/2 hour was told my visa would be granted and was issued a 10 year multiple entry visa.

I was not allowed to work on that visa (I had absolutely no intention of doing so) though was told by non visa staff that after a few years I could apply for naturalization and green card if I choose to.

The ###### visa actually caused me lots of hassle as no one in American immigration offices had ever seen a 10 year multiple entry visa.. They used to take the passport away and check it with superiors and make me wait.. I only wanted the year..

This visa was issued in London and it sure seemed to me that money talks and it must have been the Thai issue that made it harder... Why not go to a Schengen country, usually piece of cake, my Thai lady came and lived with me in Holland and traveled freely around all of the Schengen states plus was allowed a social security number to work if she wished (she did not) own land and property, etc etc etc. Then apply for your US admission from a Schengen country. For a family earning a mil US a year a holiday to Europe is hardly an issue..

For those that say Thailand is open and easy to stay in, and compare it favourably to Europe I dissagree.. It may be easier for poor farangs to travel to Thailand than it is for poor Thais to travel to other countries (dont you think they would abuse the system and try to work or stay ?? Are they purely spedning money and benefiting the ecomomy as farangs do here ?? How many farangs are stealing Thai jobs for 10k baht a month ??) but my experiences (and those of my little brother) have been that when treated correctly visa's for Thai's have been a trivial process (for the record in the last 5 years myself and my brother have taken multiple Thai ladies to NZ, Holland, Belgium, Germany, Spain, The UK and Ireland) none of which were ever refused. These were all pennyless girls with a checkered past mere using us as guarantors.

[shellman]

Axel, some good points made. Thanks for your thoughts and experiences.

As for your exchange with shellman, what happened? He got some points and your replies were a

bit outside of your usual style. 

Never appreciated being called a liar. Sure you don't either. I react quite aggressively to such accusations regarding my honesty and my integrity, especially when someone has no valid reason to do that, in my view. Always have, always will react that way

Doubt the figures as loburi did, but don't doubt my word unless you can back it up!

Ajarn,

I personally still do not believe that this was said by anyone who was authorized to do so, i rather think he wanted to calm somebody down who maybe was a bit angry? I wrote an Email to the Embassy to ask for their input, let's see if they will reply with a current statistic. And I might add that it does not look good for the Consular Officers competence if after these screenings they still can not manage to keep the undesireable individuals out?

And i doubt whatever I want to doubt, sorry if I hurt your feelings but since I do not know you personally I can't tell if your stories are usually true or not. I just did read in a Thai Paper that the percentage of crimes committed by thais on tourist visas in the us is below 20. That was written in the "Daily News" about 6 month back when a discussion occured about the harsh treatment that some thai business men had to face from the Embassy.

If the US Embassy makes such statements, I would think you could read it in the Thai Papers very fast. But we will soon see, if they reply to such questions per Email that is. I have no problem admitting if I am wrong.

Recently arrested US citizen for smuggeling of marijuhana and running a Stock trading scam in Hua Hin is only one example that the rules could be applied on both sides then, we all know that there is more then only this example. How would US Tourists like it to have to go to an interview before getting a tourist visa for thailand, having their fingerprints and photo taken and being questioned like criminals? I remember that they did not like that at all when Brazil decided that they would have to treat them just like they treat Brazilians.

We are talking about people who do not need to stay in the US illegally as they have more then enough assets and family ties in Thailand to make sure they will come back. Not about the Bar Girls from Pattaya who want to make a quick buck somewhere in the US. There are enough well off thais who can afford to make trips to the US for tourism with no bad intention.

Anyway, Thailand hopefully will one day treat the individuals of countries accordingly to how Thais are treated when (or better before) travelling in these individuals country. Would be a very good idea.

cheers

cyber

[sriracha john]

And I myself don't have a load of money but the family of my wife, you might want to read the post before commenting it

actually you may want to read my post more clearly as I never said it was your money, I simply stated that you were a part of your wife's family.... obviously they wouldn't want to entrust their money to someone who reads as carelessly as you do.