Beware Of Police

[wayan]

Beware of Police

This story is about false accusation and threat

All fathers and mothers who has a child on a school read this

The facts

My son 14 year/ farang/ Dutch nationality/ looks like Thai because his roots are in Indonesia.

Thai language poor/ English excellent.

Study on a school in Khonkaen “ Boyschool Mahathai”

I ( father) lives about 100 km away

Good friends ( countryman) take care of his son

In the week stay’s in a dormitory at the school to improve his Thai language.

Story ( 3th of April 2008)

During the test for the new school-year a boy of 7 years accuse him of stealing 500 bath.

2 "friends" of the 7 years old boy have seen that.

The teacher told him to go police station, ( I told my son not to do this)

It turns out that the father of the boy is a police man.

It looks to me a not very important matter, my son not steel and not need the money , also my friend told me he was willing to go with my son the next morning to the school.

It turns out there was a meeting.

Principal of the school/teacher/my son/ parents of the boy/ the boy himself and his 2 friends/ my friend and his son who did the translation.

After a moment the boy of 7 was not aloud to stay at the meeting

Then ….some things changed, it was not anymore 500 bath, it was 40 bath

(a boy of 7 years can not have 500 bath of pocket money)

After some time the Police man insist that my son son say’s........ “ yes I have done it” also he insist .......to tell why.

My son refused to do that, “ I have not done it . it is a lie”.

The police man threat him, telling him that he will be send out of the country if he not tell the true.

To put more pressure a other officer arrived.

(In this time I was on my way to Khonkaen.)

The 2 friends of the boy (witness) tell different story’s, the teacher has seen nothing.

My friend becomes a bit angry about so many lies.

After more then 3 hours talking, the police man not wanted to lose his face and was threatening again saying

If you not confess I will go to court.

In this time I was also at the school.

To me it was clear my son can not stay on this school.

Everybody knows that if a farang have to go to court, he will lose his case.

In lunch time we ( my friends and son) where talking what to do, the situation was going out of hand, because of the behavior from the father “police man”, ( A shame for the force)

We decided that my son should say “ yes I have done it” :D

So he did.... under our pressure, because we not wanted to have this case for court.

The Police man ask him “ why you do” my son answered . “ I don’t know”

Police man again “ why you not tell that in the beginning?”

Answer ( we told him) Language problem and I am afraid.

My son like the school, has many friends, but for me it was impossible that he stay’s on this school,

So I told that Principal of the school, that I was taking my son back home and not was coming back to the school.

All this is only a part of the story, the meeting was over 5 hours, with many talk about nothing.

And all this because a boy of 7 years lie about everything and 40 bath !!!!!! a father who not wanted to lose his face.

I’m very disappointed and about the way some people go around with farang, very unpolited no since of reality.And to many lie’s

Well all we know, maybe it is time that all the farang going to Laos or Philippine, maybe that they will understand how much money we bring in to the country.

Please give you reactions, united we can do something this are things who not can happened, to nobody who loves his children.

I will try to send a picture ( we took some picture at the meeting)

NICE GREETINGS TO ALL OF YOU, I STILL CRY ABOUT UNBELIEVEBLE AND THAT THIS THINGS CAN HAPPENED

[thaiclan]

..so you encouraged your child to lie about his actions for fear of you being in court...... I'm sorry its unclear what you are asking ppl to unite about. That we should cower and show our kids that that is the way to get out of the situation??

[soundman]

Everybody knows that if a farang have to go to court, he will lose his case.

Whoever believes this also believes the moon is made from cheese.

[MrPaddy]

Yes mate, you suck as a father.

Go to court, call his bluff. All for 40 baht how ridiculious.

If it had been me, I would have called his bluff and walked out. But before walking out and with everyone around, I would have handed him 50baht and said here, if you really need the money. Accept it as my donation to the policemans ball.

Anyway, I think this post is just another from fantasy land.

Edited April 8, 2008 by MrPaddy

[Cuban]

The mistake is to allow "them" to play this game at the school, go to the police station call your lawyer get every one involved, make statements take pictures etc etc.

When to cop understands that you are happy to walk through the game in the court the claim will disappear - they are used to people backing down under the threat of action.

[PhilHarries]

Your son is in trouble at school over something he didn't do.

You turn up and instead of support you coerce him into admitting guilt for something he is innocent of and then you run away taking him with you.

Then you post on TV looking for sympathy.

I'm sorry I can't find it in my heart to sympathise with anyone except your son who deserved better and more robust support than he got.

[GuestHouse]

At face value, there are two parents here: One is telling his son to accept responsibility for something he did not do. The other is telling his son he does not have to accept responsibility for something he has done.

Both parents will, in the fullness of time, reap the rewards for their failure to draw the line on personal responsibility.

[burman]

I can't believe you made your son confess like that. What lesson is that to teach him?

No one is taking anybody to court over 40 baht!

[Strap]

I do feel bad for your son ,

I hope he will learn not to give in to pressure in the future,if he learns now at an early age to just give up when faced with a tough situation how can he possibly learn to survive in this world?

You don't want him to learn that taking the easy way out is good do you?

Anyway why is he attending a ( if im reading this correctly ) a public Thai boys school? If it is an International school that you pay for surly you would have not had this situation, Going to a Thai local school and not being able to speak Thai is also a very difficult task for anyone.

I understand you did what you felt was right for the particular situation , get out and do what you must, having a local cop against you or your son isnt the best thing either so I do see your reasons, But remember your son learns from examples...

Good luck with the next school.

[popshirt]

Well none of us were present; it must be somewhat intimidating. And advice from a Thai friend would undoubtedly be "say what the guy wants you to say, pay something, and let's get out of here".

I agree it was wrong to tell the boy to lie.

[way2muchcoffee]

To be fair, probably every person he asked advice from at the time - his wife, the wife's family, friend's wife, friend, etc - probably told him to do exactly what he did. I work in schools and I have seen this kind of thing before many, many times with parents, students, teachers, and administrators. Innocent children are often made to kow tow and apologize, even when they did nothing wrong.

[jingjoe]

Maybe your son is a bully who stands-over kids half his age for their lunch money... he wouldn't be the first.

[mrtoad]

Everybody knows that if a farang have to go to court, he will lose his case.

Whoever believes this also believes the moon is made from cheese.

dam_n, I always believed that the moon was made of cheese. Next your going to tell me that Santa isn't real.

[mrtoad]

Your son is in trouble at school over something he didn't do.

You turn up and instead of support you coerce him into admitting guilt for something he is innocent of and then you run away taking him with you.

Then you post on TV looking for sympathy.

I'm sorry I can't find it in my heart to sympathise with anyone except your son who deserved better and more robust support than he got.

As a parent myself, I can fully agree with that statement.

[BigSnake]

[p_brownstone]

If you are not a Troll then at the very least you are a pathetic role model for your son.

Patrick

[elkangorito]

I'll never forget my first day at Primary School in Australia (year 3 - 1968 or thereabouts).

Suddenly, I was overshadowed by a huge figure. Who was it? It was the Headmaster. He was scowling at me. In the next second, he accused me of "dropping litter in the playground". Not only did I not carry anything to create "litter", I did not "drop" anything onto the playground.

I was told that I must write, 50 times, "I must not litter the playground". If I did not do this, I would be "caned".

When I got home that day, I told my parents. They told me to "make up my own mind". In other words, they were asking me to ask myself if I was lying or not. Of course I wasn't lying & so I made up my mind. I would not write out the 50 times punishment of "I must not litter the playground". Instead, I decided that I would face this HUGE man myself.

And so the day came.

I stood before him, terrified. He asked me for the written punishment. I didn't have it. He, like a good torturer, lingered around the possibility of "freedom" or "punishment", for what seemed like an eternity. I told him repeatedly that I did not litter the playground.

He finally asked me what I wanted.

I said, "Give me the cane". He blankly looked at me & then delivered it as promised...2 cuts. I never told my parents. Mind you, the headmaster never ever questioned my integrity again.

This incident has certainly helped me to form my opinion of some people in "authority". ie don't trust them unless they repeatedly "prove" themselves. They do not necessarily know the truth. Also, it helped me realise that the truth will set you free...even though some may think that perpetual lies will be easier. My mind has never been & will never be like a "steel trap". As an adult & in my working life, I've discovered that telling lies is better than the telling the truth. Most people (employers) in my experience, seem to promote this. If they don't promote this, then telling the truth is all about "trouble". How pathetic.

What did you teach your son? What will you teach your son? What did you show to these "nationalistic & culturally stupid" people?

Maybe one day, you can choose to realise that people who blindly follow cultural &/or religious rules, are nothing but puppets...and they will do ANYTHING to "save face" for their religion or culture (or egotistical position of power). Only strong people can stand up to this facade. If you do stand up to this, the facade will crumble.

By giving in to this travesty of justice, you have endorsed the nationalistic & cultural stupidity of this country & also the egos that are so similar to those in the western world.

Good luck.

PS. I do not apologise, in any way, for suggesting that this country (Thailand) is nationalistic, which can breed racism, & culturally retarded. Any person who tries to "freeze" time into a "perfect" picture is BEGGING for trouble.

"Culture" is nothing but a memory....only fools elect to force the life of those who lived 100 or 1 000 years ago, upon the current living people. Things have changed greatly since.

[dave111223]

You actually believed the policeman was going to take your 14 year old son to court for stealing 40baht off a 7year old at school?

Edited April 8, 2008 by dave111223

[mikethevigoman]

Beware of Police

This story is about false accusation and threat

All fathers and mothers who has a child on a school read this

The facts

My son 14 year/ farang/ Dutch nationality/ looks like Thai because his roots are in Indonesia.

Thai language poor/ English excellent.

Study on a school in Khonkaen " Boyschool Mahathai"

I ( father) lives about 100 km away

Good friends ( countryman) take care of his son

In the week stay's in a dormitory at the school to improve his Thai language.

Story ( 3th of April 2008)

During the test for the new school-year a boy of 7 years accuse him of stealing 500 bath.

2 "friends" of the 7 years old boy have seen that.

The teacher told him to go police station, ( I told my son not to do this)

It turns out that the father of the boy is a police man.

It looks to me a not very important matter, my son not steel and not need the money , also my friend told me he was willing to go with my son the next morning to the school.

It turns out there was a meeting.

Principal of the school/teacher/my son/ parents of the boy/ the boy himself and his 2 friends/ my friend and his son who did the translation.

After a moment the boy of 7 was not aloud to stay at the meeting

Then ….some things changed, it was not anymore 500 bath, it was 40 bath

(a boy of 7 years can not have 500 bath of pocket money)

After some time the Police man insist that my son son say's........ " yes I have done it" also he insist .......to tell why.

My son refused to do that, " I have not done it . it is a lie".

The police man threat him, telling him that he will be send out of the country if he not tell the true.

To put more pressure a other officer arrived.

(In this time I was on my way to Khonkaen.)

The 2 friends of the boy (witness) tell different story's, the teacher has seen nothing.

My friend becomes a bit angry about so many lies.

After more then 3 hours talking, the police man not wanted to lose his face and was threatening again saying

If you not confess I will go to court.

In this time I was also at the school.

To me it was clear my son can not stay on this school.

Everybody knows that if a farang have to go to court, he will lose his case.

In lunch time we ( my friends and son) where talking what to do, the situation was going out of hand, because of the behavior from the father "police man", ( A shame for the force)

We decided that my son should say " yes I have done it"

So he did.... under our pressure, because we not wanted to have this case for court.

The Police man ask him " why you do" my son answered . " I don't know"

Police man again " why you not tell that in the beginning?"

Answer ( we told him) Language problem and I am afraid.

My son like the school, has many friends, but for me it was impossible that he stay's on this school,

So I told that Principal of the school, that I was taking my son back home and not was coming back to the school.

All this is only a part of the story, the meeting was over 5 hours, with many talk about nothing.

And all this because a boy of 7 years lie about everything and 40 bath !!!!!! a father who not wanted to lose his face.

I'm very disappointed and about the way some people go around with farang, very unpolited no since of reality.And to many lie's

Well all we know, maybe it is time that all the farang going to Laos or Philippine, maybe that they will understand how much money we bring in to the country.

Please give you reactions, united we can do something this are things who not can happened, to nobody who loves his children.

I will try to send a picture ( we took some picture at the meeting)

NICE GREETINGS TO ALL OF YOU, I STILL CRY ABOUT UNBELIEVEBLE AND THAT THIS THINGS CAN HAPPENED

If this had been my son and i REALLY beleived he didnt do it i would have stood my ground and gone al the way,. you did EXACTLY what they wanted you to do, shame,.

[the highlander]

A lot of brave guys and girls on here!!

I'm sure that all of you would actually tell the bib to take a hike in this situation!

I am sure that you would not be worried that your child had been grilled at a police station in a language that he did not understand for several hours probably scared and upset and think it would be a great idea to prolong the event indefinitely.

Reminds me of a guy that I once knew! He stepped of the kerb at a zebra crossing and got hit by a car!!

He was in the right though as he had stuck by his principles of not letting drivers bully him into waiting !!

The coroner said as much in his statement!!

I am sure the OP has plenty opportunity to teach his son about right and wrong (and the way things really are)!

Edited April 8, 2008 by the highlander

[highlander76]

Lets all wait a minute here nobody was in this mans shoes here this is why I will not consider living in Thailand the way we can be treated by the police and any thai will any sort power in wherever you choose to live yes you should had some back bone at school and taken the c"nt to court if you could afford it f"ck face I would never allowed anyone to do that but I can say that my girlfriend knows a very high ranking policeman and has his moblie number all you have done is let anything where you live know you are a soft touch I would have not gone to any meeting with out a lawyer commensense man

[Dustoff]

As in most such cases, it comes down to a father who doesn't believe his child would steal and a father who does not believe his child would lie. Either could be wrong.

My wife would never have believed that her son was capable of any kind of dishonesty until security at Tesco Lotus caught him going out the door with his jacket stuffed with toys and batteries.

Relax folks - only the boys know the truth...

[Scott]

The truth is that most kids will steal (at sometime) and most kids will lie. It's normal to at least try it.

In this case the school missed a very good chance to use a relatively small situation to begin to instill moral learning in the case. Decent and compassionate questioning could have probably uncovered whether anyone actually "saw" someone steal the money, when and where it was stolen. A quick search of the alledged 'perpetrator' could have turned up the evidence or lack of evidence.

These things are best left to a much more 'local' level and can be used to help people understand the risks of being caught, the need for taking care of your things etc.

We go through it all the time at our school and generally somebody squeals--provided the stakes are raised too high. I mean, for God's Sake, it went from 500 baht to 40 baht. Sounds like there's more than one villian in the story.

Support from family and assistance in 'processing' the events is essential to understanding and comprehending. Most all of us have been wrongfully accussed of things and made to pay the consequences. As long as the consequences aren't too severe and the environment in which they are given are supportive we learn from these things.

[JetsetBkk]

I think most posters are being very hard on Wayan. After a meeting lasting 5 hours and with no proof of anything being available, Wayan had made up his mind to take his son out of the school. So I don't blame him for admitting the theft just to get out of the situation. I'm sure his son is old enough to understand why.

How many posters have paid off the cops to get out of a situation that had been fabricated by them? I know I have.

[hansnl]

Yes mate, you suck as a father.

Go to court, call his bluff. All for 40 baht how ridiculious.

If it had been me, I would have called his bluff and walked out. But before walking out and with everyone around, I would have handed him 50baht and said here, if you really need the money. Accept it as my donation to the policemans ball.

Anyway, I think this post is just another from fantasy land.

Definitely, this is not fantasy land.

I am afraid you think that you can bully yourself out of situations, just like the policeman.

The policeman can do that, you can not.

Remember T.I.T.

First, you were not there

Second, indeed go to court, and see what happens to you.

Third, hand the policeman some money with about 10 people around, including farang, and then look what will happen.

Yes indeed, all for 40 baht.

People have been condemned in Thailand for very much less money.

Besides that, local police can talk to immigration police, savvy?

I was there, listened in, talked to someone in the justice department, and he agreed this could be the best and fastest way to try to minimise damage, because it all boiled down to loosing face!

The policeman overstepped his authority by doing the questioning, because his underage son was the victim, so by law HE was the victim.

The policeman could threaten to bring the boy to court, obviously he does not have that power, because the public prosecutor decides that.

He threatened to refuse the boy to stay in Thailand, that is the prerogative of the immigration police.

That said, like I said before, the policeman could influence his friends in the immigration department.

End result ?

The school was most at fault to surrender the proceedings to the policeman!!!!!!

But they did not dare to withstand the man, being afraid to loose an influential (?) parent.

At a certain point of the proceedings a higher officer was brought in, he listened for about 10 minutes, and went away.

So, I think even you will understand that the lieutenant had covered his tracks.

So please, use your brains.

You know the saying, please switch on your brain before you do something?

[dave111223]

So please, use your brains.

You know the saying, please switch on your brain before you do something?

Got it.

Step 1) Turn on Brain

Step 2) Extract Spine

Step 3) Instruct son to do the same

Step 4) Use brain from step 1 to justify step 2 and 3.

[Dakhar]

I'll never forget my first day at Primary School in Australia (year 3 - 1968 or thereabouts).

Suddenly, I was overshadowed by a huge figure. Who was it? It was the Headmaster. He was scowling at me. In the next second, he accused me of "dropping litter in the playground". Not only did I not carry anything to create "litter", I did not "drop" anything onto the playground.

I was told that I must write, 50 times, "I must not litter the playground". If I did not do this, I would be "caned".

When I got home that day, I told my parents. They told me to "make up my own mind". In other words, they were asking me to ask myself if I was lying or not. Of course I wasn't lying & so I made up my mind. I would not write out the 50 times punishment of "I must not litter the playground". Instead, I decided that I would face this HUGE man myself.

And so the day came.

I stood before him, terrified. He asked me for the written punishment. I didn't have it. He, like a good torturer, lingered around the possibility of "freedom" or "punishment", for what seemed like an eternity. I told him repeatedly that I did not litter the playground.

He finally asked me what I wanted.

I said, "Give me the cane". He blankly looked at me & then delivered it as promised...2 cuts. I never told my parents. Mind you, the headmaster never ever questioned my integrity again.

This incident has certainly helped me to form my opinion of some people in "authority". ie don't trust them unless they repeatedly "prove" themselves. They do not necessarily know the truth. Also, it helped me realise that the truth will set you free...even though some may think that perpetual lies will be easier. My mind has never been & will never be like a "steel trap". As an adult & in my working life, I've discovered that telling lies is better than the telling the truth. Most people (employers) in my experience, seem to promote this. If they don't promote this, then telling the truth is all about "trouble". How pathetic.

What did you teach your son? What will you teach your son? What did you show to these "nationalistic & culturally stupid" people?

Maybe one day, you can choose to realise that people who blindly follow cultural &/or religious rules, are nothing but puppets...and they will do ANYTHING to "save face" for their religion or culture (or egotistical position of power). Only strong people can stand up to this facade. If you do stand up to this, the facade will crumble.

By giving in to this travesty of justice, you have endorsed the nationalistic & cultural stupidity of this country & also the egos that are so similar to those in the western world.

Good luck.

PS. I do not apologise, in any way, for suggesting that this country (Thailand) is nationalistic, which can breed racism, & culturally retarded. Any person who tries to "freeze" time into a "perfect" picture is BEGGING for trouble.

"Culture" is nothing but a memory....only fools elect to force the life of those who lived 100 or 1 000 years ago, upon the current living people. Things have changed greatly since.

I had a similar situation 3 "swats" or "licks" rather than cuts is what they called them. It was either write a tremendous pile of doo doo or take the swats when the paper was due.

I put on about 8 pairs of underwear.... took the swats with a smile. Lesson learned.... let "the man" think he won, but always be the real winner.

[wayan]

Thanks for your sympathy

Indeed you have to be there to know what was happened

See also poster Hansnl

It was the best solution to get out of this matter

I want to thank all posters for the reaction, only some of them not understand the story, they not live long enough in Thailand, or have a opinion who are just a cheap answer. without thinking

In T.I.T is everything possible, good things but also many things you never have seen/hear in your own country.

I give you a other example, In ampur Khonkaen they refuse to put my son in the yellow book

So he is still not in it, we will try again.

Please not come with ehhhh / not possible... it is yes it happened!!!

When you are married and live here ( retired) you like to stay in this country with many nice way of living, but all this what is happening gives me thinking, there are many other country's who are happy to receive farang

mmmmm what you will do?????

Greetings to you all

[wayan]

Poor posters with a statement like this you understand nothing but just give a opinion

look poster Hansnl

[MrPaddy]

You know what, if you do not have the back bone to stand up to someone over an absolute pathetic situation as this one, then you will be walked over all your life.

If you are gullible enough to think you would be dragged kicking and screaming to court over 40 baht, especially when one party has already been caught lying over the 500baht/40baht difference, then you deserve to run away with your tail between your legs.

Take your child out of school, move house, get into a witness protection program even.