Thai Communication Problem

[huggybear]

Straight communication is next to impossible here, because of little or no English skills or their incliniation to tell you what they think you want to hear or to tell you something that will not diminish their stature in a conversation, ie the so-called face-saving.

I hear what you're saying but have you considered that if you live in Thailand you are actually in a foreign country (if you happen to come from somewhere else). How pompous are some of us to think that communication is difficult because they don't speak English. I actually appreciate the fact that many Thais at least attempt to speak English. I'm sure the majority of Thais communicate quite well with each other and with the foreigners who went to the trouble to learn the Thai language.

Language skills are obviously a very important part of communication. I am asked often why I do not speak Thai after 11 years in the country. I have tried to learn, and will accumulate some more words over time, but I will NEVER speak good Thai. And why would I really? What would I talk about, and with whom? I live outside Pattaya, and goes to BKK now and then. Hardly ever to rural areas, and if so, my g/f is there to help.

Of course it would be a nice thing to understand and speak (and read and write), to show respect, and help me through some difficult situations. But in the situations I would need Thai language, and in the places I would find myself needing it, there is most of the time someone who can help.

And get this, my g/f sometimes even can't get the store/hotel/whatever staff to understand. And she is Thai. She has walked out of Homepro and similar stores in disgust a couple of times, due to the lack of understanding from the staff. Now how would I do in comparison?

Please feel free to flame me, I have thick skin!

"but I will NEVER speak good Thai"

English neither.............("but I will never speak Thai well")

[LooseCannon]

Why when 'cultural' norms include lieing and deceit.. You can dress it up as face as much as you like but they are still facts.

I think that you are correct in what you say concerning lieing & deceit as being a cultural norm, but I beleive it to be generally of a non-malicious nature. This sort of lieing & deceit is done to make another feel better or spare them from something considered to be unpleasant - this is the cultural 'norm'. When it becomes malicious I think this is due to character flaws in the person doing the lieing.

The big problem of having a cultural 'norm' that advocates lieing for 'good' is that there is this massive grey area in between the 'good' & the 'evil'.

So it becomes very easy for an otherwise morally upstanding person to slip into this grey area & the lie becomes not totally altruistic in nature but more self-serving.

Trying to analyze a multi-collection of ethnic groups becomes really hard because we will always be influenced by the behaviour of individuals we have come into contact with.

[Samuian]

Much has been written about this topic, all over southeastasia western educated people may have to get first a deep understanding of how the fabric of a certain society is woven!

The gap between rural, agricultural society and life in the 21st Century, has been mentioned!

And there is much to it!

Much can be put down to attitude, today if I find a bad negating attitude I keep on "walking", till I find the person with right attitude, usually based on being well educated.

Most people I have come across and having no problem communicating, even technical details, have been either educated overseas, been living there for some extended time or both.

taking the knowledge and abilities of rural folks, take 'em for what they are, sure will it turn out difficult talking about rocket engines and their fuel/speed ratio to hp... or stuff like it, but talk to them about their environment, about customs etc. and they will be a treasure chest of knowledge!

Have a look at bamboo basket making, using an ancient weaving technique to produce some wonderful silk cloth and garments, Niello Ware, Pottery, the incredible beauty of temples, of the boats form the royal fleet, carvings, look at some of the skills they have, don't demand that a farmer, his sons and daughters can give a comment about the theory of relativity, or bragg with them about algorithms... there are many things "simple" rural people are just great in doing, while we may perform very poorly trying to copy their skills.

And one thing is for certain, we western people have a strong tendency to be somewhat quickly stirred up, neurotic about "our Knowledge superiority", we too quickly want results and demand that the other will understand, we should put much more effort into making clear what we want, and ensure that we can be understood!

It's "US, not "the other", if we want some information, something done, we are responsible to get it right, or to choose the right person to do it for us, not "them"!

Speaking the language helps a lot, speaking it well, breaks down many, many "barriers"!

Cultural Arrogance is an obstacle which is very, very, difficult to overcome, but leave it behind opens (sometimes) doors we thought they never can be opened.

Edited April 27, 2008 by Samuian

[LooseCannon]

Quite a bold post, LivinLOS. Could we have a link to your information? It would fascinating to learn more.

One minute on google gave me this link..

I read the same text in a different format in the past.. Originally in the Nation so it says.

http://www.thailandlife.com/thaiyouth_64.html

The survey also found that 8.5 per cent of the children it tested were mentally retarded. Most of them were in the North, where 16.4 per cent of the children surveyed were classified as mentally retarded. Only 2.5 per cent of those tested in Bangkok were mentally retarded.

I had read Thailand was an average IQ of high 80's.. (87 or 89 from memory) but wikipedia is saying 91 now.. I am trying to remember where I read the 80's score and from what research.

EDIT :: I was going to go back and edit the previous post where I said it was an 80's score on average IQ but cant edit the post any longer.. As I cant find the link I am sure I had read please disregard that data.. However even a 91 score when looked at next to a Chinese 105 explains much about how the country is run !!

'IQ and the Wealth of Nations'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IQ_and_the_Wealth_of_Nations

Thailand at a very respectable #39 if you look at the countries +/- a few points.

I always thought that the IQ test was culturally biased - but take a look at the top 4.

If you removed the North & Isaan (being the poorest areas) I wonder how the ethnic 'Thai' would rate?

As regarding IQ & the ability to communicate I don't think it has much bearing on Thai/Falang interactions, unless one or both parties have exceptionally high or exceptionally low IQ's.

[LivinLOS]

..... In fact I caught myself in the head wobble game many times.

I spent a lot of time in India during the late 70's & 80's & found the Indians to be probably the most helpful & friendly people in the world - unfortunately a good percentage had no idea what they were talking about. I lost count of the number of times that on asking directions to a particular place & receiving an incredibly detailed description on how to reach the place, only to find out that it was totally wrong, & more often than not in completely the wrong direction. Language was certainly not a problem as a lot of Indians speak excellent English (in fact a really beautifully spoken & written version of English that seems to have been caught in a time warp, sometime around the early 1900's) so it must a cultural trait - a strong desire not to disappoint maybe.

From a previous post, someone mentioned the frustration of going into a shop & asking for directions to a particular item, only to find the directions to be completely wrong. Maybe this is similar to the Indian experience. Maybe the Thai thinks - I work here, this is my job, I should know where the item is, but I am not sure so I will say this.......

This satisfies the 'face saving' aspect (yes I know my job) as well as the desire not to disappoint (in a lot ways Thai's & Indians are very similar, & I have always found Thai people to be very helpful).

After spending any length of time in India the head wobble just seemed to happen subconsciously, it was like I had no control over it.

I must say I have witnessed some truly classic examples of the wobble - it is almost hypnotic.

Yes I think there is a very strong desire in the indian character not to dissappoint.. and I also found them amazingly open / friendly, that great big smile and the reactions we got to doing a mad silly event charity wise were just superb. I did get a bit over india'd in Mumbai at the end of my time, stress and city life dont mix well and my mood was probably to blame as much as anything. However my experiences moving slowly across the country were all in all superb. ask for directions and they are as likely to go and take you, stopping along the way to offer to feed you or meet thier family..

As to the giving false directions.. We once stopped in the car while travelling upcountry and wifey asked someone, who proceeded to talk away for 10 mins, giving detailed instructions when we pulled away she said we had to ask someone else as he was clearly just lieing (yet she nodded and listened and went along with the game for ages too) when I expressed shock she just said simply "we in a car and he from the country, he cannot say he doesnt know the place as it make him look stupid" so he just made it up, however a Thai picked up on whatever clues that it was a made up version.

[LivinLOS]

Why when 'cultural' norms include lieing and deceit.. You can dress it up as face as much as you like but they are still facts.

I think that you are correct in what you say concerning lieing & deceit as being a cultural norm, but I beleive it to be generally of a non-malicious nature. This sort of lieing & deceit is done to make another feel better or spare them from something considered to be unpleasant - this is the cultural 'norm'. When it becomes malicious I think this is due to character flaws in the person doing the lieing.

The big problem of having a cultural 'norm' that advocates lieing for 'good' is that there is this massive grey area in between the 'good' & the 'evil'.

So it becomes very easy for an otherwise morally upstanding person to slip into this grey area & the lie becomes not totally altruistic in nature but more self-serving.

Trying to analyze a multi-collection of ethnic groups becomes really hard because we will always be influenced by the behaviour of individuals we have come into contact with.

Well perhaps being in the tourist zone shows me worse Thais.. But I see lieing and outright deceit (Thai on Thai also) within all forms of land deals, thefts, scamming and shoddy poor business practices non stop. Those are not little white lies they are flat out lies and deception.

For a very minor example right now, we have a handyman who has sort of broken something.. I told him not to do it one way as it would break something valuable.. He swore blind he knew what he was doing and assured me he was aware of the problem. Then as I predicted he ballsed it up and promised to be back to fix it.. Now he doesnt answer his phone. This is a handyman who I have maybe 3 years worth of ongoing regular work with (and I wont let him really go out of pocket, I know the way the world is I have money and he doesnt).. Is that lieing (I will be back tomorrow) ?? is that deceit ?? Is that an inability to accept responsibility ?? Is it a character that feels its easier to hide and run away from a problem than own up and solve it ?? Call it what you will, but its par for the course in Thailand.

[egg6447]

2) If I ask too many questions, Thai other half complains he has a headache. It's my queue to shut up.

Peter

thats very interesting, all, all my friends with thia partners claim the headache thing. interesting that it also aplies to male partners. the best line ive heard from a humerous piont of veiw is, how far to X , reply, long way little bit, cracks me up every time . i accept this particular reply is down to lack of understanding english which makes it all the more endearing. blessem.. i,m currently trying to get my wife to pay taxes, she doesnt see the need, and certainly doesn,t understand the paper work, as many/most falang dont but at least she is takeing it on board now. hope to get her registered this week.lol.

[LooseCannon]

Why when 'cultural' norms include lieing and deceit.. You can dress it up as face as much as you like but they are still facts.

I think that you are correct in what you say concerning lieing & deceit as being a cultural norm, but I beleive it to be generally of a non-malicious nature. This sort of lieing & deceit is done to make another feel better or spare them from something considered to be unpleasant - this is the cultural 'norm'. When it becomes malicious I think this is due to character flaws in the person doing the lieing.

The big problem of having a cultural 'norm' that advocates lieing for 'good' is that there is this massive grey area in between the 'good' & the 'evil'.

So it becomes very easy for an otherwise morally upstanding person to slip into this grey area & the lie becomes not totally altruistic in nature but more self-serving.

Trying to analyze a multi-collection of ethnic groups becomes really hard because we will always be influenced by the behaviour of individuals we have come into contact with.

Well perhaps being in the tourist zone shows me worse Thais.. But I see lieing and outright deceit (Thai on Thai also) within all forms of land deals, thefts, scamming and shoddy poor business practices non stop. Those are not little white lies they are flat out lies and deception.

For a very minor example right now, we have a handyman who has sort of broken something.. I told him not to do it one way as it would break something valuable.. He swore blind he knew what he was doing and assured me he was aware of the problem. Then as I predicted he ballsed it up and promised to be back to fix it.. Now he doesnt answer his phone. This is a handyman who I have maybe 3 years worth of ongoing regular work with (and I wont let him really go out of pocket, I know the way the world is I have money and he doesnt).. Is that lieing (I will be back tomorrow) ?? is that deceit ?? Is that an inability to accept responsibility ?? Is it a character that feels its easier to hide and run away from a problem than own up and solve it ?? Call it what you will, but its par for the course in Thailand.

The question is, does he treat you differently because you are a falang?

Does he treat his Thai customers the same way?

My experience with 'small businessmen' is very limited, but I would suspect that it has a lot to do with your location & the fact that you are falang.

I can only relate my own situation & experiences, & don't doubt for a minute that your experiences are genuine & conclusions are legitimate.

My wife owns a number of properties all within a fairly small geographic area - on the outskirts of a relatively small provincial town - sisters, brothers & extended family all own houses & land within this same area. The family is very well known in the area & at one time my wife's father & his brothers owned a huge tract of land in the district, the community is close knit, most people know each other or at least know of more or less everybody in the immediate vicinity, fairly typical for rural & semi rural areas.

It is in this context that reputation is everything, if you have performed shoddy work or offered substandard service everybody knows about it. Everything is word of mouth, recommendations are sought from relatives, from people who have dealt previousely with these people & a bad reputation will result in very little work.

I think the problem you have stems from the fact that your community has very little 'connection', being in a tourist area, it is a collection of people with no or relatively few ties to each other. This makes it very easy for shonky businesses to survive because there are too few connected people with a common bad experience. This coupled with the weak or non-existant consumer protection/accountability prevalent in Thailand serves to compound the problem.

As to fact that this gentlemen has had 3 years work from you & the prospect of more, & treats you in this way, I cannot begin to guess or understand his reasoning, & I am sure if you were to ask him, his answer would be total nonsense.

[koto]

When one asks a Thai a simple question which only requires a (yes) or a (no) answer the reply one gets is "no problem" or silence as if the question is not understood.

What does "no problem " mean?

So far in Thailand, I have had a wife, two live-ins and three want to be, And to me, no problem means, ( Don't understand 100% and that's OK ) ( Just pass the beer and shut up ) ( As long as you keep helping us, we don't care, no problem ) ( Nobody die, no problem ) ( Or last but not least, Your no problem so far, watch your mouth farang )

hahahaha and cha,cha,cha. MAY HEALTH AND HAPPINSS BE WITH US ALL, NO PROBLEM

[PeaceBlondie]

Lack of precision in telling time: due in large part to traditionally not being able to control time. Only in this generation have average Thais had reliable wall clocks or wrist watches. They were not taught punctuality.

Directions: in village life, without motorized transport, every place was hours away, and you seldom went there. They were not taught to give accurate directions, and local people knew where everything was, and seldom encountered strangers.

Truth telling: you cannot tell the truth to anybody higher up on the social ladder, if the truth is inconvenient, damaging, or beyond their control. They were not taught to tell inconvenient truths.

Politicians tell bald-faced lies, and the Thais know not to believe it. That they are taught.

Blame the traditional educational methods. Blame whomever you wish, but don't blame the Thais, because you are not supposed to. But you can blame farang, because we can accept blame!

[Andrew Hicks]

Straight communication is next to impossible here, because of little or no English skills or their incliniation to tell you what they think you want to hear or to tell you something that will not diminish their stature in a conversation, ie the so-called face-saving.

Language complicates the problem but there's more to it than that.

The cultural disinclination to say no is well known. I've also noticed Thais getting hopelessly confused when making arrangements with each otehr, social or otherwise. Is there a reluctance to commit themselves to anything? Is this why they're slow to say yes? Or because saying yes does not establish a commitment anyway and so is not significant.

While there are of course ways of saying it, the Thai language has no one word for yes and no. There are plenty of words though for perhaps and maybe.

Andrew Hicks

PS I thoroughly enjoyed Mont Redmond's "Wondering Through Thai Culture" but it is so discursive that while it makes you think, it doesn't give you many clear answers. Then again there aren't any! My own recent book on which there is a current thread on this forum tries to inform in a different way... by relating my own experiences of life in Isaan from which a reader might draw some wry conclusions.

[freitag1]

A partial explanation for some of the idiosyncrasies that the Thai exhibit can be attributed to the fact that Thailand is still, & will be, for a quite a number of future generations, an agrarian society. By far the huge majority of Thais are less than a generation away from a village/rural life & have a mindset that is firmly rooted in the 'country'. If you think about the divide that exists between 'city' & the 'country' in western countries, it might help us to understand what is happening in Thailand. When I go back to my mothers village in north east England, it's not remote by distance, but more remote by time. It is almost like going back in time 100 years except everybody has a microwave. Country people think differently from city people & I am not making a judgement of which is better, but there is just a different way of doing things.

Thailand is exactly the same in this respect. When we come here we see the locals driving around in BMW's or late model sedans & utes, they have DVD's, computers, mobile phones etc. They go to work in ultra modern multi storey buildings, air-conditioned 7-11's & shopping malls. But what happens when they go home everyday? Essentially it is village life transported to the city. When you go to the smaller provincial towns & rural areas everything is exactly the same (except for the BMW's). In the west the transition from agrarian society to industrialized society has taken place over 150 years or more, in Thailand this hasn't happened yet, but all the trappings we associate with an advanced industrial society can be found here, thus giving the illusion of being a 'sophisticated' society ( I am not sure if this is correct word to use in this context, to illustrate what I am getting at - you go into a shiny, new, modern department store in London/New York & you have certain 'expectations' of how your interaction with the people found therein will transpire. You see someone in a 'setting' & it is natural to assume that that person has certain 'qualities' 'abilities').

Westerners like to be precise which is the result of living in a modern city - exact times, places & distances. The Thais are vague because in a rural setting it is appropriate.

A few thoughts on 'face' & the 'saving of' - I think westerners are too preoccupied with getting an admission of guilt or acknowledgement of being wrong out of the person that they are interacting with. I am not talking about the more extreme situations, but just the everyday interactions, where in the west there would be just a 'casual' acknowledgement, a sort of "oh, yea you're right" response, the Thais response is more in body language, I know you are wrong, you know you are wrong, we just don't have to say it, why rub salt into the wound. In a lot of situations this then leads to the the person repeating the 'incorrect' statement, and this where you move on & the whole thing is brushed aside.

The thing is if you want to live a relatively stress free existence in Thailand you have to be prepared to adapt, to bend & be flexible in your thinking. If you insistence on being rigid & uncompromising in your thinking, & expect Thais to react & behave as a westerner would you will go insane. This has got nothing to do with liking it, it is all to do with adapting to it.

How can you live in Thailand, be surrounded by Thais & not become 'Thai' to some extent? Impossible.

Very good points!

[kat]

Very good responses on this thread that explain that Thai communication is a combination of culture and issues of face, status and saying no, lack of value for precise answers and commitments, and the language itself, although this is not necessarily English to Thai, but also Thai to Thai. In addition, someone mentioned the differences from province to province that Thais have amongst themselves.

In the frustrating case of questions, this is not only Thai but also a SEA thing, and someone else mentioned that it is Asian. There are definite similar Asian cultural values about face and direct speak.

[iko]

Quite a bold post, LivinLOS. Could we have a link to your information? It would fascinating to learn more.

One minute on google gave me this link..

I read the same text in a different format in the past.. Originally in the Nation so it says.

http://www.thailandlife.com/thaiyouth_64.html

The survey also found that 8.5 per cent of the children it tested were mentally retarded. Most of them were in the North, where 16.4 per cent of the children surveyed were classified as mentally retarded. Only 2.5 per cent of those tested in Bangkok were mentally retarded.

I had read Thailand was an average IQ of high 80's.. (87 or 89 from memory) but wikipedia is saying 91 now.. I am trying to remember where I read the 80's score and from what research.

EDIT :: I was going to go back and edit the previous post where I said it was an 80's score on average IQ but cant edit the post any longer.. As I cant find the link I am sure I had read please disregard that data.. However even a 91 score when looked at next to a Chinese 105 explains much about how the country is run !!

'IQ and the Wealth of Nations'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IQ_and_the_Wealth_of_Nations

Thailand at a very respectable #39 if you look at the countries +/- a few points.

I always thought that the IQ test was culturally biased - but take a look at the top 4.

If you removed the North & Isaan (being the poorest areas) I wonder how the ethnic 'Thai' would rate?

As regarding IQ & the ability to communicate I don't think it has much bearing on Thai/Falang interactions, unless one or both parties have exceptionally high or exceptionally low IQ's.

I'm sure of 2 things

1) who invented the IQ test rated the cleverer guy in the world

2) who invented the IQ test was not the cleverer guy in the world

There are many types of intelligence; Bobby Fischer (maybe the best chessplayer ever, and with no doubt one of the best) rated a genius IQ number, but, as his chaffeur once said: "Mr Fischer, you can be a genius at chess, but for sure you're an idiot at all the rest".

That said, Feyerabend said a lot of very interesting things about this supposed western cultural superiority (come on..) and I'd stress that if somebody lives somwhere and does not speak fluently the hosting country language, or he's a retard or he thinks he doesn't need to learn that language, which is just the same (with all due respect )

IKO

Edited April 27, 2008 by iko

[IMA_FARANG]

When one asks a Thai a simple question which only requires a (yes) or a (no) answer the reply one gets is "no problem" or silence as if the question is not understood.

What does "no problem " mean?

1. Is this a rhetorical question?

2. "No problem" can mean different things. Did your mate/wife/spouse say it? "No problem" can mean anything from "O.K. I agree" to "No way, you'd better NOT do that". If you ask your wife, "I'm going out with my male friends for a few drinks Friday night, is that o.k.?", then "no problem" means "No way, if you do it's going to start a big fight."

3. As a farang in Thailand you (like me) carry a baggage of learned responses from whatever country you grew up in. For me, they are American assumptions caused by my upbringing in a small town 1950's rural America enviroment. For a Thai, it could be the memory of their Thai upbringing, say in an upcountry Issan village. Obviously what you asume is "normal" may be different from what that Thai learned as "normal". Egro- what you assume is a simple question may not be a simple question to the person you asked.

4.

[xsplat]

Here in Indonesia I also see the habit of deliberate vagueness. People point with the the back of their swinging hand. Or if a finger is used, it is cocked to the left. Never direct.

How telling is it that nothing is ever to be directly aimed at? It is considered blunt to precisely point. At objects.

Conversation western style is a total impossibility.

[xsplat]

This thread seems to have disappeared from the list of General posts. Moderated into a black hole or some forum glitch?

[xsplat]

As for why Asians and moreso Thais obfuscate directness, I think rice fields has nothing to do with it. I know of no western country in which the rural folk are shy to take a personal stand.

It's about ego development. Asians not only don't value individuality, they find it a burden. Never the twain shall meet.

Differences don't boil down to sameness. It's different. Value it as you will. You are not racist to have personal values.

[kat]

Excellent observation.

[kowneeoh]

But seriously; can you really not let another have their opinion?

Welcome to Thai Visa !

[Doza]

I know of no western country in which the rural folk are shy to take a personal stand.

Maybe shy to personally take a stand but they love a collective stand. Are they always lobbying or protesting at government house for their debts to be wiped, food prices to be lowered, rain to be made.............??? The Caravan For the Poor and other Isaan farmers groups seem quite political to me.

[PadThaiGuy]

I think many Thais have hearing loss due to the excessive noise, therefore, a communication problem.

[PeaceBlondie]

I think many Thais have hearing loss due to the excessive noise, therefore, a communication problem.

I never thought of that! We logically debate IQ deficiencies, but never consider hearing loss. I really doubt that is true, though. More likely, I expect this culture does not teach good listening skills. Often, Thais do not give us an expected answer because the question never made it all the way into their brain to be properly processed.

Conversation may not be an important mode of communication, to the extent we learned it in the West. Maybe they communicate by body language, actions, their entire life. We talk too much, and say little of importance. At least, Thais may tune out speech they do not wish to acknowledge or confront.

[NowImEasy]

This string should be required reading for all falang in los. I've learned much about the Thai psychie by following this discussion. So after lurking for a while, I had to register and make this my first post just to say 'Thank You'

[xsplat]

I know of no western country in which the rural folk are shy to take a personal stand.

Maybe shy to personally take a stand but they love a collective stand. Are they always lobbying or protesting at government house for their debts to be wiped, food prices to be lowered, rain to be made.............??? The Caravan For the Poor and other Isaan farmers groups seem quite political to me.

Seems you are making my case.

[Pakboong]

..... In fact I caught myself in the head wobble game many times.

I spent a lot of time in India during the late 70's & 80's & found the Indians to be probably the most helpful & friendly people in the world - unfortunately a good percentage had no idea what they were talking about. I lost count of the number of times that on asking directions to a particular place & receiving an incredibly detailed description on how to reach the place, only to find out that it was totally wrong, & more often than not in completely the wrong direction. Language was certainly not a problem as a lot of Indians speak excellent English (in fact a really beautifully spoken & written version of English that seems to have been caught in a time warp, sometime around the early 1900's) so it must a cultural trait - a strong desire not to disappoint maybe.

From a previous post, someone mentioned the frustration of going into a shop & asking for directions to a particular item, only to find the directions to be completely wrong. Maybe this is similar to the Indian experience. Maybe the Thai thinks - I work here, this is my job, I should know where the item is, but I am not sure so I will say this.......

This satisfies the 'face saving' aspect (yes I know my job) as well as the desire not to disappoint (in a lot ways Thai's & Indians are very similar, & I have always found Thai people to be very helpful).

After spending any length of time in India the head wobble just seemed to happen subconsciously, it was like I had no control over it.

I must say I have witnessed some truly classic examples of the wobble - it is almost hypnotic.

Yes I think there is a very strong desire in the indian character not to dissappoint.. and I also found them amazingly open / friendly, that great big smile and the reactions we got to doing a mad silly event charity wise were just superb. I did get a bit over india'd in Mumbai at the end of my time, stress and city life dont mix well and my mood was probably to blame as much as anything. However my experiences moving slowly across the country were all in all superb. ask for directions and they are as likely to go and take you, stopping along the way to offer to feed you or meet thier family..

As to the giving false directions.. We once stopped in the car while travelling upcountry and wifey asked someone, who proceeded to talk away for 10 mins, giving detailed instructions when we pulled away she said we had to ask someone else as he was clearly just lieing (yet she nodded and listened and went along with the game for ages too) when I expressed shock she just said simply "we in a car and he from the country, he cannot say he doesnt know the place as it make him look stupid" so he just made it up, however a Thai picked up on whatever clues that it was a made up version.

My GF claims that the reason Thais give such poor directions is that they are never lost!!!

[tim armstrong]

"Yes" means I heard you. "No" is the same in any language. You can change "no" to "yes" by asking the question again. You can be guaranteed a "yes" by raising you voice to ask the question. "No problem" is the same as "yes" but with more emphasis. Now getting anything done, like getting some butter at a restaurant, is a subject for a whole other forum.

I hope this clears up you dilemma.

Some years ago there was serious research done on the most widely understood words in the world - in any language. No.1 was - OK. Unfortunately No.2 was COKE. So I suggest you try OK, or NOT OK (with appropriate gestures). Tim

[freeurmind2]

.....

one of the most frustrating experiences is how the phone is used here

often they don't identify themselves

often they don't say good bye before hanging up

.....

(not limited to Thais)

etc...

Agreed. No truer words were spoken. I can let it slide if I'm calling a residence. But it really bugs me when I'm calling an office. Often the lack of training is really really frustrating. I get passed from person to person, having to repeat what I'd just said. WHY is it they do not have the courtesy to tell me 1) I don't have the info 2) Will pass you on to someone [sometimes the line just goes dead and I have to guess if I've been cut off or what]. Why don't they ever tell the next person about me first? Argh.

Am not just talking about the country, this is a general Asian thing. A tad off topic, apologies.

[noise]

This string should be required reading for all falang in los. I've learned much about the Thai psychie by following this discussion. So after lurking for a while, I had to register and make this my first post just to say 'Thank You'

NowImEasy,

RE COMMUNICATION PROBLEMS. Yes, this string can help you to be sensitive to how you ask questions and how the answers are phrased, but......

I wasn't going to reply but I read so many comments that make it sound as if no one talks to another person, just talks around a subject. No one would ever get anything done if communications problems were as "black and white" bad as stated here.

To really understand the problems related in context, I think each commentor should say if they speak Thai or not. I do not have these problems, but I speak Thai. I never use English except with my wife in front of my mother-in-law. My personal and business interactions are, to me, straight forward and clear.

RE IQ COMMENTS IN SEVERAL COMMENTS: IQ test results are extremely sensitive to/dependent upon reading ability and vocabulary. Example, I once gave a sample test to a teenager who didn't understand a question about frankfurters but could answer the question once i explained it was a hotdog.

The rural background of many Thais was an appropriate comment on a way of thinking. Give the same IQ test to a college graduate and the cashier at 7-11 and quess what kind of results you would see ragardless of capabilities. So the country IQ ranking quoted in one reply may be more of a reflection on the educational system (e.g., availability of affordable schools) rather than the actual intellectual capabilities of a people as a nation.

[deejah]

.....

one of the most frustrating experiences is how the phone is used here

often they don't identify themselves

often they don't say good bye before hanging up

.....

(not limited to Thais)

etc...

Agreed. No truer words were spoken. I can let it slide if I'm calling a residence. But it really bugs me when I'm calling an office. Often the lack of training is really really frustrating. I get passed from person to person, having to repeat what I'd just said. WHY is it they do not have the courtesy to tell me 1) I don't have the info 2) Will pass you on to someone [sometimes the line just goes dead and I have to guess if I've been cut off or what]. Why don't they ever tell the next person about me first? Argh.

Am not just talking about the country, this is a general Asian thing. A tad off topic, apologies.

...or they call from a firends phone

you dont have the number stored in your phone

you dont know who they are

they dont say who they are

but they say

'you member me?'

or you ask who they are (in thai) and they tell you the name of the person whose phone they are using and you have no clue

oh well

sigh

i just like to vent every now and then

all in all its all well worth it

though it may sound like complaining, i have nothing to complain about