Pre Nup Experience

[Oedipus]

I've heard that it is possible to do a Pre Nup so if the marriage does not work out, my future wife will not have any legal rights to assets accumulated before, during or after the marriage. Is this really the case? What pitfalls should I watch out for. It is my understanding that the Pre Nup has to be explained to the Lady by, in this case, a Thai lawyer, the Pre Nup written in the Thai language and she has to sign off on it that this was the case.

Without a prenup, I understand that Thai and US law looks as everything as community property. Does anyone know of a situation where a prenup was not recognized by a court. Is it just a matter of the lawyer preparing the pre nup correctly?

Thanks for the help.

[joskydive]

Yes, you can have a Pre Nup made here. It's normally prepared by a Thai Lawyer and he/she puts in your requirements. If you are a Foreigner you should also have a translation in your own language. You could go even further and have a second independent translation done, just for your own piece of mind. i.e. Sign nothing you don't understand!

Once the Pre Nup has been drawn up and both, you and your Lady agree, you both sign before witnesses, usually, in the Lawyers Office. Also, a suggestion only - take a copy to your Embassy.

Suggestion again - Make a last will and testament, so, if you wish to bequeath something to someone (family member) other than your future wife they will have a chance to recieve it. i.e. Condominium bought prior to marriage. This should also be held at the Embassy.

[Oedipus]

Yes, you can have a Pre Nup made here. It's normally prepared by a Thai Lawyer and he/she puts in your requirements. If you are a Foreigner you should also have a translation in your own language. You could go even further and have a second independent translation done, just for your own piece of mind. i.e. Sign nothing you don't understand!

Once the Pre Nup has been drawn up and both, you and your Lady agree, you both sign before witnesses, usually, in the Lawyers Office. Also, a suggestion only - take a copy to your Embassy.

Suggestion again - Make a last will and testament, so, if you wish to bequeath something to someone (family member) other than your future wife they will have a chance to recieve it. i.e. Condominium bought prior to marriage. This should also be held at the Embassy.

Thank you, great advice.

[retiredusn]

If there is no trust going into the marriage why get married and worry about the future as there will be none

[gregchambers]

Because love and trust are not the same thing. And women often undergo a charater transformation once legal and they have some kinda power. Hard to believe I know, but that is what often happens.

[mariner29]

Yes i have one, had it drawn up in two languages.

[LaoPo]

If there is no trust going into the marriage why get married and worry about the future as there will be none

A Prenup is drafted to protect both partners, not just the one with most assets at the time of marriage. It has nothing to do with love or trust.

Talk to a Notary and you'll learn.

I am VERY surprised that there are still (many stupid) people who hastily fall in love...hastily marry and end up in LOTS of problems once the marriage fails, WITHOUT a Prenup and Last Will.

It's in your own hands since NOBODY can buy a guarantee certificate at the Local Post Office or 7-11 that the marriage will stay rosy....forever "till Death Do Us Part"

LaoPo

[bread]

sorry to hijack this thread as such but i would like to know a similar thing if i can just put across the following scenario;

If you married you TGF and then in turn over a period of time you accumulate say a house in the UK in both your names and in turn brought a house in Thailand legally under her name

if then you in turn at some point got devoiced in the UK would your Wife take half the assets in the UK and all the assets in Thailand or does the courts in england include over sea's assets ?

if they don't can you get some thing to protect the equall sharing of assetts both in england and over seas or not ?

[PattayaParent]

bread, I understand from other threads that if you divorce in LOS you're entitled to a 50/50 split on anything accumulated after marriage so no need even for a pre-nup to protect existing assets prior to marriage.

[paully]

A Prenup is drafted to protect both partners, not just the one with most assets at the time of marriage. It has nothing to do with love or trust.

Talk to a Notary and you'll learn.

I am VERY surprised that there are still (many stupid) people who hastily fall in love...hastily marry and end up in LOTS of problems once the marriage fails, WITHOUT a Prenup and Last Will.

LaoPo

Remember that a Prenup does not necessarily cover every eventuality. If there are children of the marriage who have not adequately been provided for under the Prenup, then, certainly in the UK, the court is likely to step in and amend it to make sure the children are properly provided for. If the wife has custody of the children, then the husband will lose out despite what the Prenup says.

[bread]

indeed that in the UK the devoice courts will take in to account children and in turn amend the settlement to cater for this but on the basis of a Thai court going to 50/50 split every thing does that still mean you would have to get devoiced twice in all, once in the UK to take care of the UK assets and then again in turn in Thailand to take care of the Thai assets.

(also I read that by buying property other than a condo in Thailand you had to place it in your wifes name and relinquish all rights to it ?) so does this mean that it then would not be included in and devoice, as I know in england it would not matter who's name the property was in all assets are taken into account ?

[jumnien]

Sounds like you should continue to rent instead of buy!

[pluto_manibo]

Tilleke&Gibbins law firm have an interesting article regarding family law, which includes marriage, divorce etc....

What is acquired before marriage is separate property, what is acquired after marriage is considered communal property(50/50) exceptions are inheritance, gifts or donations, personal tools(they are considered private property even after marriage)

[bread]

Still does not answer the point as such

If you were devoiced in the UK would overseas assets be taken in to account ?

If the house that you had in Thailand been placed in your wifes name, and as per Thai Law you had signed to say that it was her's brought with her money would this in turn then not be split 50/50 under Thai devoice law ?

And also going back to the original point can you get a pre nup that even says that assets accumulated DURING marriage are only one persons?

Edited April 29, 2008 by bread

[Alberthall]

All assets, value and wealth generated within the marriage is deemed as marriage wealth and would be included in the marriage pot to be divided appropriatly based on length of marriage and or if any children involved. Gifted items such as an expensive watch or ring or a car would not normally be included. A property asset in whom evers name would be.

If the couple can't come to an agreement as to what the marital wealth a judge can grant a court order to sell everything and divided it up as he thinks fit.

Albert

[hanibal7]

The idea of a prenup is to look at all assetts and agree with both parties as to who gets what.it may not be 50/50 but 70/30 in the non thai side as long as both parties sign there should not be a problem.

AM i right to say how important a will is as if the thai wife has the house under her name,if she dies first then the property might be given to her parents,as next of kin.

[bread]

Interesting to hear about the will and the property being passed to HER relations I wonder if someone could clarify this?

Also going back again how do the UK courts see over seas assets are they taken into account?

[pluto_manibo]

Just remember that pre-nups are recognised in Thailand, they are not enforceable,. This is what I was told by a reputable lawyer in Thailand. Other lawyers will tell you otherwise and charge you a large sum for them. If you do choose to go this way, remember she needs legal representation(a lawyer of her own) and needs full certified translations of the documents. A list of all your assets with specific detail must be done and included in the document, both within Thailand and abroad. The pre-nup can always be contested by the courts if deemed unfair....this especially happens abroad in farangland.

If you do choose to do a pre-nup, do not be cheap about it, go to the best Law firm which understands international marriage law and the laws of your country of origin, as pre-nups entail different meanings in different countries.

[LaoPo]

Just remember that pre-nups are recognised in Thailand, they are not enforceable,. This is what I was told by a reputable lawyer in Thailand. Other lawyers will tell you otherwise and charge you a large sum for them. If you do choose to go this way, remember she needs legal representation(a lawyer of her own) and needs full certified translations of the documents. A list of all your assets with specific detail must be done and included in the document, both within Thailand and abroad. The pre-nup can always be contested by the courts if deemed unfair....this especially happens abroad in farangland.

If you do choose to do a pre-nup, do not be cheap about it, go to the best Law firm which understands international marriage law and the laws of your country of origin, as pre-nups entail different meanings in different countries.

I would (and I did...) only draft a Prenup in the own home country. The disadvantage is that the future spouse has to be present to sign and the Prenup has to be translated in a language she/he can read/understand.

LaoPo

[think_too_mut]

The Economist had a short article in the wake of Paul McCartney's last divorce. There they said that prenuptial agreement bears no value (void) in the UK.

Is anyone sure it's worth anything in Thailand?