Stressed And Too Thin

[awakened]

Can anyone advise on how I can stop my weight from falling? I am 50, eat healthily and stretch regularly, although I do spend too long on the computer and now weigh 146lbs. My normal weight is about 161lbs. I eat a pumpkin/brown rice/veg plus a little meat, three times per day which I liquidize in a blender.

Recently I would sometimes experience terrible pain after eating and went to Bumrungrad for tests. A colonoscopy revealed inflammation and that that I had no villi on my duodenum or ileac. Completely Bald. I understand this can prevent absorption of nutrients. Bumrungrad thought it might be caused by a virus or celiac, After a couple of weeks of tests they eventually said they didn't know what it was. So I'm stumped.

I have taken fresh aloe vera daily for the last month which has helped with the inflammation but I am losing weight and my strength and energy are low. Maybe I am not getting the nutrition I need due to the lack of villi?

Stress is an issue causing adrenal exhaustion, joint pain, depression and some food sensitivity. Does anyone have any knowledge of this and what steps I can take to turn this particular ship around without selling the farm? Thanks.

[gobs]

Hi Awakened,

I'm not a doctor and furthemore not a specialist, but first, don't worry too much. It can happens we ingest a bad bacteria that makes us feeling bad... It happens to me 2 or 3 times since I'm settled in LOS... and nothing special occured then.

If I was in your case, I should try this: eating boiled potatoes or boiled western noodles (spaghetti, etc) or boiled/steamed white rice... No sauce, just maybe a little bit of butter (for the taste ). Bread can be good too... I should add some pieces of ham or BBQ chiken (not the skin) or BBQ pork (no fat)... I trully should avoid fresh vegetables or fruits or drinking from these ones during some days, and eat one or two real yoghurts per day... And for sure, no coffee, nor beer, nor wine, nor lao . Only Water...

So: soft food and soft drinking.

Let your "metabolism" curing itself during some days... When you feel better, then gently add progresivly some cooked fruits and vegetables (not too much at one time at the beginning). Later, OK, up to you...

Hope this can help you,

but one more time: I'm not a specialist. This is part of my own medication, specially when I have some stomach troubles... and it works for me!

Good luck,

Gobs

[katana]

...A colonoscopy revealed inflammation and that that I had no villi on my duodenum or ileac. Completely Bald. I understand this can prevent absorption of nutrients. Bumrungrad thought it might be caused by a virus or celiac, After a couple of weeks of tests they eventually said they didn't know what it was. So I'm stumped...

That can also be a symptom of Tropical Sprue. Although this is usually accompanied by chronic diarrhoea.

[Mobi]

I am sorry to hear of your condition - I may have something similar, so I know how you feel.

I am frankly surprised that after two weeks of tests that Bumrungrad has effectively given up. This sounds most specular; for one of the acknowledged top hospitals in the world.

May I ask what doctor you were seeing there, and have you checked to see if there is a better specialist who is able to diagnose your condition?

[zorro1]

woops . deleted

Edited May 3, 2008 by zorro1

[Sheryl]

The absence of villi will certainly cause malabsortpion which in turn causes nutritiopnal deficiencies. You need to be taking a potent vitamin and mineral supplement that includes iron, folic acid and all the B vitamins....and probably some extra folic acid on top of that as folate deficiency worsens the situation.

What is surprising is that you do not mention diarrhea. Possibly the fact that you blenderize your diet and also that your fat intake sounds quite low plays a role in that.

The most common causes of malabsortion are AIDs, celiac disease and tropical sprue. Weight loss and absence of villi are consistent with both of the last two. Celiac disease is a genetic intolerance to gluten (wheat protein). It would be unusual for it to first prersent at age 50 plus it doesn't sound like you consume much if any gluten. If by any chance your description of your diet was incomplete and you are consuming wheat or oats in any form, try eliminating it.

So that leaves Tropical Sprue as the most likely culprit, I suggest you specifically ask your doctor about that. There is no test for it other than an examination of the intestinal lining which you have already had. Tropical sprue is treated by vitamin/mineral supplementation and a long course of tetracycline.

Should also have an HIV test if you haven't already.

A much rarer possible cause is Whipple's Disease but uit is uncommon and usually accompanied by joint pain.

Good luck.

Here is a link to an article about Tropical Sprue; http://www.emedicine.com/med/TOPIC2162.HTM

[awakened]

The absence of villi will certainly cause malabsortpion which in turn causes nutritiopnal deficiencies. You need to be taking a potent vitamin and mineral supplement that includes iron, folic acid and all the B vitamins....and probably some extra folic acid on top of that as folate deficiency worsens the situation.

What is surprising is that you do not mention diarrhea. Possibly the fact that you blenderize your diet and also that your fat intake sounds quite low plays a role in that.

The most common causes of malabsortion are AIDs, celiac disease and tropical sprue. Weight loss and absence of villi are consistent with both of the last two. Celiac disease is a genetic intolerance to gluten (wheat protein). It would be unusual for it to first prersent at age 50 plus it doesn't sound like you consume much if any gluten. If by any chance your description of your diet was incomplete and you are consuming wheat or oats in any form, try eliminating it.

So that leaves Tropical Sprue as the most likely culprit, I suggest you specifically ask your doctor about that. There is no test for it other than an examination of the intestinal lining which you have already had. Tropical sprue is treated by vitamin/mineral supplementation and a long course of tetracycline.

Should also have an HIV test if you haven't already.

A much rarer possible cause is Whipple's Disease but uit is uncommon and usually accompanied by joint pain.

Good luck.

Here is a link to an article about Tropical Sprue; http://www.emedicine.com/med/TOPIC2162.HTM

Thank you Sheryl. Good find.

No. Virtually no fat in my diet. Do you know where I can get these supplements and Folic Acid from?

Mobi is correct. Bumrungrad was excellent and Dr Virasak did offer further tests but he looked doubtful that he would find anything. So I declined. I was also concerned by the number of drugs I was prescribed. Can you prescribe for a condition you haven't been able to diagnose?

The Bumrungrad examinations were conducted in 2006. Symptoms have persisted.

AIDS test was negative. I'm still a virgin (just kidding). Not a 'butterfly' either.

A stool sample showed Giardia (picked up on holiday in Vietnam) and was treated.

Food allergy tests - negative. Although these tests cannot detect sensitivities.

The Colonoscopy revealed Ileal mucosal atrophy, thin duodenal mucosa, 2 x polyps (removed), hiatus hernia.

The colon cleanse drink they give is vile. Where's the vanilla flavour when you need it I couldn't hold it down so attempted a salt water flush. Not thorough enough, so several enemas were needed prior to the op.

Anxiety is a problem for many these days and clearly years of tension have taken their toll on me. My understanding is that proper digestion cannot take place when the fight or flight response is kicking in. I have sat for up to 3 days with a belly full of undigested slurry wondering if it was ever going to digest. Now I give it a few hours. If it doesn't digest I heave it up to clear the contents. Do food sensitivities (itchy and sometimes runny nose and a sneeze or two) also prevent proper digestion?

I was getting mouth ulcers and heartburn often. If I eat popcorn, bread, sometimes ice cream. This suggests grain and dairy issues but could it be because they are acid-forming? I understand also that negative thoughts can lower your PH. Seem to be fine with unpolished rice.

I have been allergic to grasses (hayfever sufferer) since I was 5, although I have had no problems with pollen in Thailand. Certain herbs applied via oil massage previously caused very itchy skin. If my skin doesn't care for it, perhaps my stomach too? Aren't tomatoes related to the grass family?

Strategies like meditation are virtually impossible in an anxiety state, so I have concentrated on the physical aspects to reduce their effect on the mind. Psychiatric drugs like Seroxat were a disaster, deadening feeling but creating more anxiety and other (unadvertised) side effects. Never again.

Just to re-iterate, no processed foods, wheat or dairy. Virtually no fat. Freshly cooked soups and fresh Aloe Vera in the morning to help heal the lining and repopulate beneficial bacteria. A Thai farmer gave me six plants free. Great people. Not sure if this is the right strategy but the inflammmation has stopped, movements are regular and there has been a significant reduction in undigested slurry. I don't know if it's sticking to my one soup combination or the Aloe Vera. It's been 30 consecutive days and I'm giving it more time to work. How can I tell if there is sufficient beneficial bacteria or if my vilial atrophy is repairing? Another colonoscopy?

I thought of eating raw or cooked liver and beef to get more minerals but am not sure if this is wise or necessary. The odd chicken leg goes into the soup as do prawns and bean curd. I replaced table salt with sea salt and am drinking more water.

I also have low BP and blood sugar. Crave sweet things soon after eating. On one occasion recently I ate a sweet pudding and felt like I was going to keel over, this while sitting at the table Had to go and lie down. Have never had this before.

My immediate concern is to get some nutrients into my body and halt the weight loss. I eat very little fat, so maybe I need to. Which fat? Olive Oil or saturated fat?

Dietary advice is contradictory and confusing. How can athletes be in such superb physical states on vegetarian and vegan diets yet I wither away on both? I tried eliminating animal protein but this may have been a mistake. Maybe there is some truth to the eat right for your type diets?

My symptoms I believe are classic for stress. Getting over it though has been a struggle. It's hard to remain focussed with the accompanying 'brain fog'. It's not that I'm on the verge of ending it all, it's more that these recurrent concerns take the edge off life. If anyone has overcome it I'm interested in what methods you used.

I sometimes get back ache around the kidneys which led me to believe my adrenals were stressed. I read licorice root is good for the adrenals. Where do I get it in Thailand? Is there a Thai substitute or equivalent?

Does anyone know a good supplier of reputable supplements in Thailand? Going to the local Wat for some traditional remedies is out since I don't speak the language and most westernized thais have forgotten these ancient skills. They just ask 'why you not see doctor'?

I read somewhere that U.S. herbal suppliers are so fearful of 'healing crises' and being sued that they dilute their concentrations to the point where they are next to useless. There is also the issue of pharmaceutical companies entering the natural supplement field. Synthetic vitamins seem an unlikely substitute for nature. MLM companies claim wonders for their herbal cure-alls but they cost a fortune. Most of the price of the products goes in commissions.

A great difficulty in understanding is that so many things seem to cause the same symptoms. Mercury toxicity, poor nutrition, lack of magnesium, emotional trauma, electro-magnetic radiation, gluten intolerance, dehydration, oxygen starvation, acidosis, energy blocks.

It's a jungle out there

Thanks to all responders.

[kat]

Celiac disease is a genetic intolerance to gluten (wheat protein). It would be unusual for it to first prersent at age 50 ...

Just for the record, CD is vastly undiagnosed and its array of subtle symptoms may not be recognized until later in life. Medical professionals everywhere are now recognizing how common and how misdiagnosed it actually is, and revising their age and frequency expectation of this disease. It is also an autoimmune response to certain grains, such as wheat, rye, barley, and sometimes oats, and different than an intolerance. So, for a variety of reasons, it is not unusual to present at 50, especially if earlier symptoms have been largely ignored or dismissed. I have a thread on the subject with ample links:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=185922

I am not saying that CD is the case with this OP, only trying to clarify the expectation and definition of Celiac Disease.

http://www.aafp.org/afp/980301ap/pruessn.html

Detecting Celiac Disease in Your Patients

HAROLD T. PRUESSNER, M.D.,

University of Texas Medical School at Houston

http://healthlink.mcw.edu/article/956622658.html

How Common Is Celiac Disease?

Celiac disease is the most common genetic disease in Europe. In Italy about 1 in 250 people and in Ireland about 1 in 300 people have celiac disease. It is rarely diagnosed in African, Chinese, and Japanese people.

An estimated 1 in 4,700 Americans have been diagnosed with celiac disease. Some researchers question how celiac disease could be so uncommon in the United States since it is hereditary and many Americans descend from European ethnic groups in whom the disease is common. A recent study in which random blood samples from the Red Cross were tested for celiac disease suggests that as many as 1 in every 250 Americans may have it. Celiac disease could be underdiagnosed in the United States for a number of reasons:

* Celiac symptoms can be attributed to other problems.

* Many doctors are not knowledgeable about the disease.

* Only a handful of U.S. laboratories are experienced and skilled in testing for celiac disease.

[kat]

Can anyone advise on how I can stop my weight from falling? I am 50, eat healthily and stretch regularly, although I do spend too long on the computer and now weigh 146lbs. My normal weight is about 161lbs. I eat a pumpkin/brown rice/veg plus a little meat, three times per day which I liquidize in a blender.

Recently I would sometimes experience terrible pain after eating and went to Bumrungrad for tests. A colonoscopy revealed inflammation and that that I had no villi on my duodenum or ileac. Completely Bald. I understand this can prevent absorption of nutrients. Bumrungrad thought it might be caused by a virus or celiac, After a couple of weeks of tests they eventually said they didn't know what it was. So I'm stumped.

I have taken fresh aloe vera daily for the last month which has helped with the inflammation but I am losing weight and my strength and energy are low. Maybe I am not getting the nutrition I need due to the lack of villi?

Stress is an issue causing adrenal exhaustion, joint pain, depression and some food sensitivity. Does anyone have any knowledge of this and what steps I can take to turn this particular ship around without selling the farm? Thanks.

I think Sheryl is an excellent practitioner with excellent advice and has helped me in the past as well. In your case, it could very well be Tropical Sprue, especially with a giardia background (my theory).

I am not a health practitioner, but I have been having chronic health problems with very strong indicators for Celiac Disease and/or wheat and grain intolerances. Your condition could very well be something else, but this is my lens at the moment. I also had a bout with giardia in Thailand. In addition, I have highly probable genetic links for CD, and a lot of my past and mysterious symptoms that I had growing up are also widely shared by others with CD who were not diagnosed until later in life. I have done a bit of research, and have been on forums talking to other people with diagnosed CD and intolerances. The average gap between overt symptoms and correct diagnosis is 7 to 10 years.

Intolerances and especially CD are often tested for false positives, until a biopsy is done from the lining of your intestines. You mention that a barrage of tests were done at Bumrungrad and they didn't find anything, but that doesn't tell us much about the tests or how they could've interpreted them. You also mention your diet as it is now, but mention other things from the past such as ice cream, corn, etc.

Did you change your diet by the time you had extensive tests? If so, that may be one of the reasons why there was no diagnosis for intolerances.

Did you ask Bumrungrad for more specific explanations and results of your tests, even if they were negative or inconclusive?

Last year I was also seen by a doctor, and after getting a blood test he confirmed my milk allergy, but didn't put other possibilities together. Some of those possibilities were that I also presented for anemia, high white blood cell count, candida, and an itchy rash with a mirror effect in addition to immune responses such as sneezing, bronchitis, etc., which are classic indicators of CD.

At any rate, you should do a lot of research yourself, and gather all of the results that you have, even if they are inconclusive, because it could really mean that the attending medical staff were inconclusive rather than your results.

Good luck. Malabsorption and undiagnosed CD have serious consequences if not understood and cared for properly. I have recently bought gluten free vitamins and B-12 tablets made by Pioneer, which are making a difference for me. One day at a time.

Edited May 3, 2008 by kat

[awakened]

I searched Wikipedia for 'malabsorption'. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malabsorption

A number of possible causes although I did not see emotional or psychological factors. Since a difficult and stressful divorce was the original trigger for my subsequent depression and anxiety, I wonder why?

Could it be that the emotional trauma upset homeostasis causing physical imbalances to occur such as nutritional deficiencies that trigger more anxiety and other physical symptoms which cause even more anxiety which creates a self-sustaining mental/physical anxiety state? Phew! For example we tend to breathe more shallowly when we are tense. This can reduce oxygen intake affecting cellular respiration, toxin elimination and starve the brain of oxygen. So maybe I should just be breathing correctly or standing on my head?

And why should there still be an emotional/psychological factor after 20 years? Surely enough time has elapsed to heal that particular wound?

Would taking a vitamin supplement address the underlying cause? Doesn't the body manufacture its own vitamins? Maybe its trace minerals I need? How about taking digestive enzymes and HCL to assist digestion. Where do I find them in Thailand?

This is where it gets terribly confusing. Is it the body or is it the mind? Is gluten intolerance a cause or a symptom? Is our medical system too focussed on diagnoses and treating symptoms and not on the whole person? Should the doc have hugged me rather than top me up with pills?

My approach after the Bumrungrad experience has been to detox and to amend my diet. Coming to Thailand for the food, massage, sunshine and escaping the rat race was also a part of that. Due to joint pain I do not do aggressive exercise and a degree of self-sabotage can interfere with progress. Maybe at some level I don't WANT to improve. Why would that be? I KNOW I should exercise more but find motivation difficult when I tire easily. I seem to be constantly managing the problem without going beyond it. Where are the success stories to provide guidance?

Sorry to go on about this. I'm not expecting answers, perhaps just expressing my frustration, not least with myself.

[kat]

"This is where it gets terribly confusing. Is it the body or is it the mind? Is gluten intolerance a cause or a symptom? Is our medical system too focussed on diagnoses and treating symptoms and not on the whole person? Should the doc have hugged me rather than top me up with pills? huh.gif"

I think hugs are nice, but ultimately many health professionals are not accustomed to looking at multi-organ symptoms and diseases. This discussion and approach is now starting to change among some. Health professionals in Italy, Sweden, Ireland and now some in the United States are also starting to explore the connection between brain, nerves and gut.

[bina]

first of all, i lose weight also on a vegetarian/vegan diet.

i am now a carnivore, and barely maintain my weight. i eat mostly rice and have all but stopped eating wheat products just by chance and i dont eat milk products (lactose intolerant). i am an older woman btw, not a male.

it sounds like u really worry too much about worrying. yes, stress can make u lose weight. i am a good example. when i work hard, and am super worrying (visa for husband, divorce etc) then i lose weight. i am naturally underweight anyway so am always on the edge. i keep munchies around for nibbling at while doing computer stuff, on the buss, etc... i try for nutritious, or at least, not too sweet, munchies. lost of small meals is better then three a day, u might feel more energetic that way. dont eat puddings and things; if u want sweet, try for some jam or fruit butter on plain crackers or something like that.

i dont understand why u are eating such a disgusting sounding meal three times a day. and yes, u need oil/fat in your diet. u could get some from meat that u eat but if u dont, there is linseed oil (the yemens make hilba which is a mash made from linseeds and eaten with food, its supposed to be good for the gut but i think its vile)... olive oil cannola oil, etc.

why dont u just eat plain cooked food a few times a day like six times a day, a fruit or two a day, some cooked veggies, and some extra curricular activities to take your mind off yourself.

taking vitamins is a good idea; and an appointment with a good medical dietitian also, for advice...

bina

[awakened]

I wonder how many times I have heard 'stop worrying and pull yourself together'. Actually, the kick up the behind approach isn't such a bad idea. Having a Mr Motivator alongside would be a great help. Doing a two week marine training course would also do far more for me than a host of quacks and snake-oil salesmen. I know this since I have done it before. It's just a bit harder when you are 50 and the sun is melting the tarmac, to do squat thrusts and star jumps. I also wonder if it is wise to stress an already undernourished body?

Many moons ago I did weight training and had to eat so much food to gain weight that I was a social hand-grenade. The mix of foods was gas-forming. What was funny about that experience was that I was away from home at the time and wanted to impress my girlfriend. After 6 months I returned wearing a tight white T-shirt. With chest manfully puffed up I asked her if she noticed anything different? 'You've 'ad yer aircut' she said.

Hard work but I did feel strong and full of vitality.

Despite the impression given I am not consumed by all of this to the exclusion of everything else. In the absence of a Mr Motivator my state of health determines my level of motivation. With the recent weight loss it's a little more pressing.

The problem as I have clumsily tried to explain is that there are no end of 'experts' and hundreds of theories and approaches. I am a slim, analytical type anyway and I'm told, prone to nervous disorders. Now someone tells me I have no villi and I have to question whether I am still 'normal' for my type and go off on a 'scientific' hunt to track down the cause or correct the problem. Am I really an ectomorph or is there a fat man waiting to emerge?!

If I were to ask 20 psychiatrists why I am the way I know they will come up with 20 different theories. That's the problem with specialists. Within their narrow scope they are incredibly knowledgeable (and charge accordingly). Yet, I don't see animals laying on the couch for hours discussing their Oedipus complex. They stuff a bunch of leaves down their throat, lick some clay or salt deposit and they are fine. I shouldn't have to micro-manage every aspect of my physiology when it's a dam_n site easier to go for a brisk walk. This is the rub.

Lol. Sorry. My GF is an excellent cook and my 'disgusting' concoction tastes great. I am checking to see if it contains the right mix of protein and carbs and whether I just need to eat less more often.

I guess my plea was 'Where is the simple answer?' Someone was smart enough to see that and has PM'd me a suggestion and a site explaining how us naturally skinny types can gain weight. Many thanks to him.

I would be grateful for an answer to where is a good source of quality supplements. Other than that I have talked enough.

[Sheryl]

First of all, you can get the supplements at any pharmacy or drug store like Boots and Watsons and do not delay. The mouth ulcers are an indication of vitamin deficiency and many of your other symptoms are probably too. The reason malabsorption syndromes, be they due to Tropical Sprue Celiac Disease or anything else, cause such a wide list of symptoms is because of the nutritional deficiencies that result.

Secondly, while stress can affect the body in many ways it cannot strip the small intestine of its villi. If it could, a very large percentage of the population would be suffering from severe malabsorption. As said before, Tropical Sprue is the most likely explanation in your case given your age and that you are not consuming wheat or dairy. The question is whether or not you still have it, since the colonoscopy was done some time ago. You have several options:

- you can return to the doctor and get a repeat exam (which will involve endoscopy), if it still shows absence or atrophy of villi specifically ask about Tropical Sprue.

- you can presumptively treat for Tropical Sprue, but this means at least 3 months of tetracyline.

- you can ease back into a normal diet, i.e. solid food not slurrries and some fat (olive oil or canola being the best), introduce the fat a little bit at a time and see what happens. Start stir frying or sauting the vegies and fish/meat and having that along with solid rice (brown is better) or potatoes. Also, start eating some fruit. For the time being hold off on dairy and wheat as that would just confuse the picture. If you still have malabsorption and start consumung more fat your body will pass it straight out and you'll have very bulky smelly stool that floats (apologies to anyone reading this while eating!).

If it were me I think I'd try #3 first. In any case it does not sound like you are consuming enough calories which may be part if not all of the cause of your weight loss.

If a trial of normal solid diet with gradually introduced fats yeileds results that indicate significant malabsorption then go to either #2 or #1 depending on how comfortable you are with self-medication and also your ability to pay for another colonoscopy. If the trial diet change goes OK, continue it. With more fat in your diet you are sure to put ion weight as long as the fat is being absorbed.

If you do decide to self-medicate with tetracycline read up on it first opaying particular nor\te to drug and food interactions.

[Robroy]

It could be a reaction to certain foods - e.g. rice. Anything eaten for a long time has the potential to build up an ellergic or other reaction.

The way to find out is to remove one food from the diet at a time, and note symtom changes.

We are not a grain-eating species, so for preference remove grains & replace with foods that are non-grains & non-dairy.

(See my post on today's celiac thread: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=185922 )

[docall18]

Hi there,

Sounds exactly like what i have, adrenal fatigue. My major symptoms were thin, anxious/panicy, stomach/shoulder pain, hairloss etc. Also your blood pressure is usually low due to low cortisol, mine sometimes was high due to excess adrenaline, which the adrenals produce to compensate for the low cortisol.

My symptoms are now almost all gone after starting the proper adrenal support. What you shoud try is vitamin B5 (500mg+, very important), a high potency vitamin B complex, vitamin C (3000mg+), seasalt. For worse cases hydrocortisone and DHEA are sometimes taken.

You would be surprised the amount of mental and physical symptoms which will disappear once your adrenals begin to recover.

hope this helps...

[docall18]

Oh ya, and cortisol is a major antihistamine. When my cortisol was low i had allergies which have now all dissapeared, so i wouldnt listen to all this allergy nonsense

[awakened]

Hi Sheryl

Ok. Adequate nutrition is the priority.

Looks like:

1. I'm not taking in enough fat.

2. I'm not eating enough overall to compensate for the degree of malabsorption.

3. Due to limited meat intake I'm not getting sufficient protein from either meat or vegetable sources.

4. I need to supplement

All the above are easily addressable so I'll do that. As mentioned, not sure about the quality or effectiveness of synthetic vitamins or supplements hence the nagging about sourcing.

Your option 3 I can do in 3 months next time I'm in Bangkok. This will allow time for food changes to have some impact. I can then compare to the previous test.

Blending the food is to fit more in and to make it more assimilable. I know absorption begins in the mouth hence the need to chew but still feel the stomach needs every assistance right now. No good?

I'm certain the ulcers are a reaction to particular food rather than overall deficiency which is why I mentioned wheat, corn, and some dairy. http://www.21stcenturydental.com/smith/education/ulcers.htm. Supplementing certainly can't do any harm.

I will add Extra V Olive Oil, attempt to eat more throughout the day and up my protein intake.

Will monitor the thread and post if there is progress or if anyone has anything else to add. If not it's because I've slipped through a crack in the pavement.

Thank you all.

[kat]

Oh ya, and cortisol is a major antihistamine. When my cortisol was low i had allergies which have now all dissapeared, so i wouldnt listen to all this allergy nonsense

Well, I'm glad you recovered, but for people with real allergy, intolerances and certain autoimmune diseases, they could very well die or become terminally ill if they believed that it was all "nonsense".

*added: but hey, you and others must know more than the people suffering from "nonsense", and the medical doctors and researchers at reputable institutions worldwide that are doing groundbreaking work to uncover the connections between grains and conditions such as Autism, MS, Lupus, Manic Depression, intestinal lymphomas, and other auto immune diseases.

I guess you will catch up to us in a decade or so.

Edited May 4, 2008 by kat

[bina]

kat, actually, the adrenal thingy is real: it actually happens in dogs so that dogs with a adrenal secretion problem do have less allergies and less arthritic pain, when everything is balanced out again, suddenly they again have arthritic pain (its called Cushing's Disease (Hyperadrenocorticism)); i had to find out about it since we had a doggy patient with this syndrome.... people get it also....

second, to the OP, what i wrote was reiterated by sheryl: again, my experience clinically from canines and felines and caprines (ruminants in general) but the ideas are the same...unless u were specifically told by a doctor to eat pureed food or u have no teeth, u should be eating solid food, not pureed food. u can boil it, or nuke it (microwave) and mash it a bit, but the salive in your mouth is what digests the stuff, not the mushing it. in some cultures, mothers chew and then feed their babies with the chewed food as a way of pre digesting it. and dogs regurgitate for their pups. but u dont need that. just chew your portions properly. also, mastication is neccesary for the muscles etc in the face, and i think also promotes proper digestive reactions. that is, the chewing prepares the body for digesting by letting it know that food is on the way down.

just out of curiousity, do u have an appetite?

i am also chronically skinny (the type that doctors are always testing me for thyroid etc problems)... but yes, mostly energetic, mind in motion, high metabolism, low blood pressure, low blood sugar type person. so my suggestions were based on experience.

btw, there is ensure, that nasty drink for people with absorbtion problems. but in my eyes a last resort.

bina

[awakened]

Sorry folks, trying not to over post but this is too important for me to be shy.

Hi Bina

Did you cure the dog of Cushing's Disease? If so, then there is hope for us.

Your post about dogs reminded me of the 'Pottinger's Cats' study. Isn't it since dogs started eating processed, canned food that they are now getting the same disorders as humans? I also read dog food contains grains and appetite stimulants. With cows eating other dead cows and chicken feces and dogs eating food meant for herbivores, the food scientists really have lost it. Machievellian plot to make pets and humans sick and enrich the drug companies? Environmentally-friendly recycling? Or barking mad?

I have been looking again at Adrenal Exhaustion/Burnout. I understand Doctors are aware of Addinson's Disease but haven't pulled all the factors together to make the problem with the adrenals a 'syndrome'. A new book by James Wilson 'Adrenal Fatigue - The 21st Century Stress Syndrome' does this.

More on adrenal burnout/exhaustion

http://educate-yourself.org/lte/adrenalfatigue14apr07.shtml

One other search on improving absorption and assimilation was for digestive enzymes. This site had some interesting comments on this, as well as Pottinger's Cats and I wonder if any there are any nutritionists reading this who can comment on the debate about cooked vs raw foods and the need to supplement digestive enzymes. Personally I don't thrive on raw food. Warm, nourishing soups are more comforting and help raise the body temperature, while raw foods do the opposite.

http://www.thehealthnuts.net/script.html

Guess I was wrong about blending. I reasoned it would help after after checking my stool and noticing the solids were only partly being broken down.

Will chew more thoroughly.

[kat]

The reason malabsorption syndromes, be they due to Tropical Sprue Celiac Disease or anything else, cause such a wide list of symptoms is because of the nutritional deficiencies that result.

I think that's probably true for Tropical Sprue, but an oversimplification for CD. There are people who suffer from CD that don't have the GI distress, but more of the brain and nerve symptoms. Whereas Tropical Sprue is largely malabsorption, that is but one of the issues for CD because it is an autoimmune disease involving the brain, nerves and gut. Over the last few years there have been some breakthroughs, and a lot of this connection is still being explored by the medical community.

kat, actually, the adrenal thingy is real: it actually happens in dogs so that dogs with a adrenal secretion problem do have less allergies and less arthritic pain, when everything is balanced out again, suddenly they again have arthritic pain (its called Cushing's Disease (Hyperadrenocorticism)); i had to find out about it since we had a doggy patient with this syndrome.... people get it also....

bina

I never said that the adrenal thingy was not real, only that the food allergy thingy was, regardless.

[moldy]

Can anyone advise on how I can stop my weight from falling? I am 50, eat healthily and stretch regularly, although I do spend too long on the computer and now weigh 146lbs. My normal weight is about 161lbs. I eat a pumpkin/brown rice/veg plus a little meat, three times per day which I liquidize in a blender.

Recently I would sometimes experience terrible pain after eating and went to Bumrungrad for tests. A colonoscopy revealed inflammation and that that I had no villi on my duodenum or ileac. Completely Bald. I understand this can prevent absorption of nutrients. Bumrungrad thought it might be caused by a virus or celiac, After a couple of weeks of tests they eventually said they didn't know what it was. So I'm stumped.

I have taken fresh aloe vera daily for the last month which has helped with the inflammation but I am losing weight and my strength and energy are low. Maybe I am not getting the nutrition I need due to the lack of villi?

Stress is an issue causing adrenal exhaustion, joint pain, depression and some food sensitivity. Does anyone have any knowledge of this and what steps I can take to turn this particular ship around without selling the farm? Thanks.

Well getting back to basics really!!! Isn't it best to just go back to a normal healthy diet including animal fats, stodge and all. Stomach problems cause fear and anxiety, which in turn cause stomach problems. You may need to get a grip. Being around big eating friends helps. You might even want to consider anti-depressants, or relax with a few beers (or fem alternatives) in the evening. I jest you not.

[awakened]

Well getting back to basics really!!! Isn't it best to just go back to a normal healthy diet including animal fats, stodge and all. Stomach problems cause fear and anxiety, which in turn cause stomach problems. You may need to get a grip. Being around big eating friends helps. You might even want to consider anti-depressants, or relax with a few beers (or fem alternatives) in the evening. I jest you not.

Now why didn't I think of that?

I can only think it's a matter of time before you are off to the doc on that advice my friend. Every one of my neighbours is sick or overweight on a normal 'healthy' diet.

As I already explained I can't eat grains or dairy so what does that do to a 'normal' diet?

Are you really sure that the normal 'food' in supermarkets is actually food because it doesn't look like it to me. Just irradiated, pesticide and preservative-laced, de-mineralised, coloured, flavoured, synthesised, genetically-modified, anti-biotic and growth hormone filled, artificially-ripened, out of season tasteless crap, grown on lifeless soil that they stick in colourful packaging and call 'food'. Just like the fluoride poison they stick in the water, it ain't natural, it ain't normal and it has sod all to do with nutrition just as it has bugger all to do with your teeth.

In my opinion the food giants are deliberately poisoning millions of us then handing us on to the drug companies to subject us to even more exploitation. It's a fantastic business model that coins them billions. The owners of both industries are ONE evil family who a hundred years previously sold arsenic laced and oil based 'tonics' to the unwary and killed quite a few doing it. That's where the term snake-oil salesmen came from. They don't give a dam_n about nutrition and haven't changed their modus operandi one bit, they have just become immensely more powerful and sophisticated.

The sooner people wake up the healthier we all will be.

You are right, worry is a problem and a major factor in how I feel. I would love to nip down to the 3 Ferrets for a pie and a pint but these days one pint has my head spinning and I've got no tolerance for divorced bar flies whose sole topic of conversation is how 'that bitch took it all' rather than look at their own obvious failings. I don't smoke and have heard all the bawdy jokes a hundred times over. Bar flies aren't relaxed company in my opinion, they are life's losers, finding drunken solace in each others company and in Thailand bedding every whore they can find and thinking they are gods when the reality is that they are so corrupted no decent woman would go near them.

I would love to go back to the good old days of pissing it up the wall, eating curry and chips and bedding every wench that I set my mind to but it tarnished my soul then and it holds no appeal now I've got it out of my system.

Anti-depressants turn you into a zombie and only prolong anxiety.

My joys (and I do have them) come from my immediate loved ones and a wonderful 7 year old who's smile lights up the eastern hemisphere.

Reminds me of a fat Indian I met once in Kerala who was an amazing glutton. 'Come on' he said 'Eat up, you can be fit and strong like me!' With food, it's Rubbish in. Rubbish out. Are you sure you are so healthy?

Sorry to sound off but 'get a grip' doesn't do it for me.

I KNOW how to gain weight the easy way. Spend 30 days in MacDonalds.

[kat]

The reason malabsorption syndromes, be they due to Tropical Sprue Celiac Disease or anything else, cause such a wide list of symptoms is because of the nutritional deficiencies that result.

I think that's probably true for Tropical Sprue, but an oversimplification for CD.

And I need to clarify as well: I was wrong earlier when I said that Tropical Sprue and Celiac Sprue were the same. They are not. The formal name for CD is Celiac Non-tropical Sprue, because it became distinguishable after WW II, when Tropical Sprue patients in the U.S. mysteriously recovered during the war when there were no grains, and then got sick again after the war's end.

[moldy]

Well getting back to basics really!!! Isn't it best to just go back to a normal healthy diet including animal fats, stodge and all. Stomach problems cause fear and anxiety, which in turn cause stomach problems. You may need to get a grip. Being around big eating friends helps. You might even want to consider anti-depressants, or relax with a few beers (or fem alternatives) in the evening. I jest you not.

Now why didn't I think of that?

I can only think it's a matter of time before you are off to the doc on that advice my friend. Every one of my neighbours is sick or overweight on a normal 'healthy' diet.

As I already explained I can't eat grains or dairy so what does that do to a 'normal' diet?

Are you really sure that the normal 'food' in supermarkets is actually food because it doesn't look like it to me. Just irradiated, pesticide and preservative-laced, de-mineralised, coloured, flavoured, synthesised, genetically-modified, anti-biotic and growth hormone filled, artificially-ripened, out of season tasteless crap, grown on lifeless soil that they stick in colourful packaging and call 'food'. Just like the fluoride poison they stick in the water, it ain't natural, it ain't normal and it has sod all to do with nutrition just as it has bugger all to do with your teeth.

In my opinion the food giants are deliberately poisoning millions of us then handing us on to the drug companies to subject us to even more exploitation. It's a fantastic business model that coins them billions. The owners of both industries are ONE evil family who a hundred years previously sold arsenic laced and oil based 'tonics' to the unwary and killed quite a few doing it. That's where the term snake-oil salesmen came from. They don't give a dam_n about nutrition and haven't changed their modus operandi one bit, they have just become immensely more powerful and sophisticated.

The sooner people wake up the healthier we all will be.

You are right, worry is a problem and a major factor in how I feel. I would love to nip down to the 3 Ferrets for a pie and a pint but these days one pint has my head spinning and I've got no tolerance for divorced bar flies whose sole topic of conversation is how 'that bitch took it all' rather than look at their own obvious failings. I don't smoke and have heard all the bawdy jokes a hundred times over. Bar flies aren't relaxed company in my opinion, they are life's losers, finding drunken solace in each others company and in Thailand bedding every whore they can find and thinking they are gods when the reality is that they are so corrupted no decent woman would go near them.

I would love to go back to the good old days of pissing it up the wall, eating curry and chips and bedding every wench that I set my mind to but it tarnished my soul then and it holds no appeal now I've got it out of my system.

Anti-depressants turn you into a zombie and only prolong anxiety.

My joys (and I do have them) come from my immediate loved ones and a wonderful 7 year old who's smile lights up the eastern hemisphere.

Reminds me of a fat Indian I met once in Kerala who was an amazing glutton. 'Come on' he said 'Eat up, you can be fit and strong like me!' With food, it's Rubbish in. Rubbish out. Are you sure you are so healthy?

Sorry to sound off but 'get a grip' doesn't do it for me.

I KNOW how to gain weight the easy way. Spend 30 days in MacDonalds.

And yet people on main stream diets seem to do best it seems to me and life expectancy is on the up and up in the west, although of course you should avoid food you are allergic too. I've not met anyone on a health food kick who doesn't look anaemic, tense, warty, etc, it's just not natural. But you are missing the point, whatever you've been doing may not be right either. Sounds like you are over doing the self denial bit. One thing is for sure, you are too thin at the moment. You sound pretty bitter yourself too- of course because you are ill.

So yes, why not run with the idea of a bit more 'bad' food, strikes me you are overdoing it the other way.

Meat, potatoes(or similar), the odd fry up, plenty of green veg, lots of soups, bananas, apples, plenty of choccy biccies, jugs of tea. Fasting a few hours now and then. Then lots of sleep and mild to moderate exercise. If smoking wasn't so addictive because it's so pleasurable I'd rec. a few of these every day too. Sadly I had to give them up because they hurt my nose too much.

I'd say my Dad and Uncle have existed for 77 and 80 years on the above (Mum too), and they were (are) both heavy smokers and drinkers too. Sadly, they are nearing the end and I dare say an even healthier diet would have been better.

I dare say you are right about my own diet too. As well as all the above I used to eat full English, and had a bacon sandwich just about every day for 30 years or more. I'm also a coffee addict in remission. I go to the doctors quite often because of nasal problems and have 5 or 6 bad stomach upsets (and I mean bad stomach upsets) a year.

Yet intriguingly, my BP is 115/60, on a pulse of 55, and like you I'm on the skinny side.

So my point is it's a balance and a trade off, although I agree I haven't got it

It's just my kick, but I can't emphasise the need for light/moderate exercise such as a jogging machine, or 15 mins in the swimming pool..

Always good to remember life is a total bitch too.!, ie, whatever you do life just is painful and disappointing with many regrets, and constant deprivation in a sense. So easy to torture yourself with the notion that it was ever meant to be any other way.

[kat]

"As I already explained I can't eat grains or dairy so what does that do to a 'normal' diet?"

And yet people on main stream diets seem to do best it seems to me and life expectancy is on the up and up in the west, although of course you should avoid food you are allergic too. I've not met anyone on a health food kick who doesn't look anaemic, tense, warty, etc, it's just not natural. But you are missing the point, whatever you've been doing may not be right either. Sounds like you are over doing the self denial bit. One thing is for sure, you are too thin at the moment. You sound pretty bitter yourself too- of course because you are ill.

So yes, why not run with the idea of a bit more 'bad' food, strikes me you are overdoing it the other way.

Meat, potatoes(or similar), the odd fry up, plenty of green veg, lots of soups, bananas, apples, plenty of choccy biccies, jugs of tea.

Awakened has already mentioned that he "can't do grains or dairy" and has a "bald duoedenum". Now, whether he is ignoring the information on Celiac Disease and intolerances for some other reason is a different story and up to him, but as you say yourself a "mainstream" diet is not a once-size-fits-all for people with CD and/or food intolerances or other illnesses. If anything, he will definitely become more ill, anemic, and destined for serious disease much more rapidly. I think you mean well, but there are other signs besides his diet. That is also the case if he has other problems related to his adrenals, such as Addison's Disease, or a tumor in the pituitary such as Cushing's Disease or Cushing's Syndrome.

I think there have been plenty of conscientious people on this thread who have given valuable feedback to Awakened. If he is serious about this thread and his health, he should be on his way to researching some of the advice for himself and taking it from there with scheduled visits to medical professionals.

Of course, if he is serious. Otherwise, this thread is child's play.

*added: I'm not sure why I bother, but: you should also know that Celiacs are mostly known to have problems with gaining and keeping on weight, but also more recently recognized problems with losing weight, and the disease is associated with autoimmune thyroid disease.

Good luck.

Edited May 6, 2008 by kat

[moldy]

Well I certainly wouldn't want to make OP any more frail, and I certainly understand that there are dangers in the modern diet.

And yet when I read what OP has written this is what shouts out at me. Still intuition can be a very 'wrong' thing too.

It is true I think that people very often in an attempt to become more healthy, go green, or organic tend to somehow bring ill health upon themselves, whilst those who eat and do all the 'wrong things' look as happy as pigs in the proverbial. Often the poison is also a cure. Or to choose an old Dorset phrase- a peck of dust afore you die. Perhaps too general.

I think my views need to be worked in to the equation in some proportion in the longer term - so called healthy diets often aren't.

Would be nice if OP could get some short term relief. How about going back to the basics in another sense, ie, lots of mashed pots, white meat, bananas etc.

What's your daily diet OP? Could it be too healthy?

[kat]

It is true I think that people very often in an attempt to become more healthy, go green, or organic tend to somehow bring ill health upon themselves, whilst those who eat and do all the 'wrong things' look as happy as pigs in the proverbial. Often the poison is also a cure. Or to choose an old Dorset phrase- a peck of dust afore you die. Perhaps too general.

Yes, I agree with this on some level. However, it can be a bit more complicated when dealing with genetics and/or autoimmune conditions, because we really don't have the choice. In my case, I ate whatever I wanted but had subtle symptoms that I could live with quietly all along, until stress, a giardia infection AND a viral infection triggered more overt conditions.

Here are other links on the thyroid connection:

http://thyroid.about.com/cs/latestresearch/a/celiac.htm#ref

http://www.csaceliacs.org/library/whythyroid.php

Thyroid Disease: Why Do Celiacs Have It?

Patricia Daly, M.D., Endocrinologist, Harvard Medical School

CSA Annual Conference, October 1998, Warwick, RI

Edited May 6, 2008 by kat

[moldy]

It is true I think that people very often in an attempt to become more healthy, go green, or organic tend to somehow bring ill health upon themselves, whilst those who eat and do all the 'wrong things' look as happy as pigs in the proverbial. Often the poison is also a cure. Or to choose an old Dorset phrase- a peck of dust afore you die. Perhaps too general.

Yes, I agree with this on some level. However, it can be a bit more complicated when dealing with genetics and/or autoimmune conditions, because we really don't have the choice. In my case, I ate whatever I wanted but had subtle symptoms that I could live with quietly all along, until stress, a giardia infection AND a viral infection triggered more overt conditions.

Here are other links on the thyroid connection:

http://thyroid.about.com/cs/latestresearch/a/celiac.htm#ref

http://www.csaceliacs.org/library/whythyroid.php

Thyroid Disease: Why Do Celiacs Have It?

Patricia Daly, M.D., Endocrinologist, Harvard Medical School

CSA Annual Conference, October 1998, Warwick, RI

Yes I understand Kat, when something strikes, well it can just be like the bullet out of a gun, there's no arguing with it, so all rationale about this, that or the other is futile, and blaming too in some cases. And certainly, auto immune deficiencies seem to abound and are not wholly understandable (there's never been a definitive conventional isolation of the HIV virus in my opinion for God's sake).

Personally, I can't help but point the finger at the general toxic lifestyles we lead and OP I do actually agree with your sentiments and politics- crap everywhere, everybody seems ill, I mean, who isn't?

I do have genuine sympathy for your plight OP, and mean well. It's a situation that needs to mollified.