Thai Violence

[fr33space]

Hello, I havent posted much on this forum because I havent had much reason to do so. But, something has happened which I feel is a dilemma throughout Thailand, no doubt for a long time already since I have heard several cases of this from friends who have lived here for quite some time.

The topic is the ‘violent nature’ of many (by all means, not all) Thais. Since meditation techniques such as Vipassana and Anapanasati are taught by several well-respected masters of the techniques here, it still makes me wonder why so many Thais are easily angered - compared to counterparts I see in Asia and in the West. It is no doubt a cultural issue, but I just feel it is a bit hypocritical on the part of many Thais to claim their nation as ‘Buddhist’, yet, there is a very real problem of a ‘violent nature’ of many people here. I bring this topic up because I am a long-time meditator and Buddhist, and recently experienced violence – which seems peculiar to Thais – brought upon a dear friend of mine who was visiting from Japan. He has a very sincere heart - and I just have to let this known.

I wont go into details, but he didn’t deserve this abuse at all. I can say that the violence he endured would most likely not have been brought upon him in many other countries, under the circumstances that took place. The notion of ‘culture’ as a justifiable explanation to this violence just disheartens me very much. My friend is a very polite, caring person who did not deserve to be physically abused (he received a blow to the head). I am not asking for much sympathy, but , I would just like for Thais to recognize this type of violence which is prevalent in their culture, which most of the time goes unaddressed – and which humble meditation can most likely address.

I have acquaintances in the media here in Thailand, so I will do what I can to bring out this issue to somewhat of a fore. Sorry for my ranting. Cheers, and with Metta :

[RY12]

Well, very few Thais actually meditate, including most monks, so it's not exactly right to expect them to all be samadhi masters. Moreover, they do claim to be 'buddhists' but to 99% of Thais that means something very different from the puritanical Pali theravada that most westerners read about... in fact the majority of religious practices in thailand are spirit-worship practices traceable to pre-buddhist times. That's not to say that it hasn't effected the country somewhat, I think a lot of people agree that the jai-yen (cool heart) ideal among thais is traceable to the theravada. I don't know if I agree with that, it might be due more to their older tradition of 'face' (which mostly just means 'pride').

With regards to violence, that's probably due to a combination of being poor and frustrated and wanting to protect their face or pride. Beyond cultural explainations, it's also just a flat-out developing country, and the taboo of using violence hasn't really caught on like it has in the west, where we've been in dense, ordered and organized society for centuries.

Concern or respect for the stranger is a notion that is almost nil in SE Asia, and it's even worse in places like China or India. Again, this is due to the scarcity of resources and the need for self-preservation (and to the heirarchical nature of Asia societies, as opposed to say the Anglo-Saxon tribes, where there was no real division of labor and the chief was relatively equal with the rest of the tribe). This is how I explain the distrubing aspects of los, maybe i'm wrong?

Edited May 2, 2008 by RY12

[Brucenkhamen]

Hello, I havent posted much on this forum because I havent had much reason to do so. But, something has happened which I feel is a dilemma throughout Thailand, no doubt for a long time already since I have heard several cases of this from friends who have lived here for quite some time.

The topic is the ‘violent nature’ of many (by all means, not all) Thais. Since meditation techniques such as Vipassana and Anapanasati are taught by several well-respected masters of the techniques here, it still makes me wonder why so many Thais are easily angered - compared to counterparts I see in Asia and in the West. It is no doubt a cultural issue, but I just feel it is a bit hypocritical on the part of many Thais to claim their nation as ‘Buddhist’, yet, there is a very real problem of a ‘violent nature’ of many people here. I bring this topic up because I am a long-time meditator and Buddhist, and recently experienced violence – which seems peculiar to Thais – brought upon a dear friend of mine who was visiting from Japan. He has a very sincere heart - and I just have to let this known.

I wont go into details, but he didn’t deserve this abuse at all. I can say that the violence he endured would most likely not have been brought upon him in many other countries, under the circumstances that took place. The notion of ‘culture’ as a justifiable explanation to this violence just disheartens me very much. My friend is a very polite, caring person who did not deserve to be physically abused (he received a blow to the head). I am not asking for much sympathy, but , I would just like for Thais to recognize this type of violence which is prevalent in their culture, which most of the time goes unaddressed – and which humble meditation can most likely address.

I have acquaintances in the media here in Thailand, so I will do what I can to bring out this issue to somewhat of a fore. Sorry for my ranting. Cheers, and with Metta :

Do you think the perpetrator of the violence was a practitioner of Vipassana and Anapanasati? I don't think so.

What percentage of Thais do you think practice Vipassana and Anapanasati? 1%? 5%? 10%? There I think you have your answer.

To a lot of Thais Buddhism is something like a cross between Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny, it's the same in the West where the majority of people don't really appreciate our Christian roots.

The difference is for the most part we are taught a sense of personal responsibility and for the most part our Police force's are not corrupt.

[IMA_FARANG]

Hello, I havent posted much on this forum because I havent had much reason to do so. But, something has happened which I feel is a dilemma throughout Thailand, no doubt for a long time already since I have heard several cases of this from friends who have lived here for quite some time.

The topic is the 'violent nature' of many (by all means, not all) Thais. Since meditation techniques such as Vipassana and Anapanasati are taught by several well-respected masters of the techniques here, it still makes me wonder why so many Thais are easily angered - compared to counterparts I see in Asia and in the West. It is no doubt a cultural issue, but I just feel it is a bit hypocritical on the part of many Thais to claim their nation as 'Buddhist', yet, there is a very real problem of a 'violent nature' of many people here. I bring this topic up because I am a long-time meditator and Buddhist, and recently experienced violence – which seems peculiar to Thais – brought upon a dear friend of mine who was visiting from Japan. He has a very sincere heart - and I just have to let this known.

I wont go into details, but he didn't deserve this abuse at all. I can say that the violence he endured would most likely not have been brought upon him in many other countries, under the circumstances that took place. The notion of 'culture' as a justifiable explanation to this violence just disheartens me very much. My friend is a very polite, caring person who did not deserve to be physically abused (he received a blow to the head). I am not asking for much sympathy, but , I would just like for Thais to recognize this type of violence which is prevalent in their culture, which most of the time goes unaddressed – and which humble meditation can most likely address.

I have acquaintances in the media here in Thailand, so I will do what I can to bring out this issue to somewhat of a fore. Sorry for my ranting. Cheers, and with Metta :

I have lived in Thailand, although I am forced by economics to work outside of Thailand and return every six months or so, for quite a few years. For many Thais now life, especially in Bangkok, is very difficult. They are always trying to get enough money to make a decent living. The pressure is great, and it takes it's toll in stress and in the daily pressure they feel.

Frankly, I don't feel that Thais are any more violent than any other nationality. I know first hand how hard it is to deal with the daily struggle in Bangkok.

For your information, a lot of Thais do feel that the pressure of life is warping traditional Thai society. Many of them blame it on the influence of matierialistic western society and the foriegn influence prevelant in Thailand today. Some of them. my Thai girlfriend included, are trying to get back to a more simple time and way of life.

For many Thais, finding enough time to keep themselves alive is the first priority. They don't think that they have the time to meditate. They are probably wrong in that, but the daily struggle takes their priority and warps their viewpoint.

If you don't understand what I mean, why don't you try living on 2500 baht a month. Maybe you will understand why many Thais feel frustrated and angry.

I know that isn't the answer, but you are trying to force a standard on Thais, that you probably could not keep yourself. No offense meant, but human beings react the same to pressure, no matter what nationality or culture they live in.

Remember, as a good Buddhist (I'm assuming you are), do not censure others, censure yourself first. Then do your best to bring others to a right livelyhood by your example. All else is secondary to that.

[fr33space]

Thanks for the replies, appreciate them - RY12, Brcunekhamen, IMA_FARANG.

'What percentage of Thais do you think practice Vipassana and Anapanasati? 1%? 5%? 10%? There I think you have your answer.'

Yes, and the national religion is quite well-publicized by the Thai government (TAT?).

'If you don't understand what I mean, why don't you try living on 2500 baht a month. Maybe you will understand why many Thais feel frustrated and angry.'

Concerning this perspective: I have close Thai friends who earn, and live on, very little; I am very familiar with this situation, and I spend quite a deal of time with them. I also have Thai friends who are, by any standard, quite well off - and I see this trait, almost a trigger response of violence, among quite a few of them, in certain situations. Indeed, the society does impose a large amount of stress on persons here - whether it be self-imposed or 'inflicted' upon them from the outside - no doubt the harshest of which I don't experience, although I do try to situate myself with locals. I suppose much of this analysis on my part is a hiccup from my Anthrpology studies...

'I know that isn't the answer, but you are trying to force a standard on Thais, that you probably could not keep yourself. No offense meant, but human beings react the same to pressure, no matter what nationality or culture they live in.'

None taken.

'Remember, as a good Buddhist (I'm assuming you are), do not censure others, censure yourself first. Then do your best to bring others to a right livelyhood by your example. All else is secondary to that.'

Thank you, I try to do so with friends here... maybe should work on befriending a few more. Appreciate your response.

[Yamantaka]

It is a sad fact that most Thais do not practice Buddhism any more than most Americans or Europeans practice Christianity. If they did, there would not have been the millions of dead from the hundreds of wars since Jesus lived.

Jesus and Buddha were both great teachers of compassion, humility and generosity yet those practices seem to be perpetuated only by a handful of social outcasts around the world.