Do Expats Look Down On Tourists?

[rixalex]

Many expats i see, seem to go to great lengths to constantly show themselves as being more than just a tourist.

Some use Thai language in situations where it's not necessary. For example, i've seen expats in banks trying to explain something in Thai (and failing), when it seems that the bank teller's command of English is somewhat better than theirs in Thai.

Another instance of trying to prove one has settled in Thailand is in the ordering of the spiciest food. Not that i question that the expat in question doesn't enjoy hot food, but there seems to be an element of pride in being able to stomach what the locals do.

It sometimes even seems like the tourists themselves are doing anything to avoid the tag. Some frequent travellers to Thailand are a bit like wannabe expats, and try to convince you they really are the genuine article.

Meeting with other expats i find there can be an underlying current of competition as to who speaks the most Thai, eats the spiciest food, knows the most about Thai people, and so on...

So just why is it expats are so keen to distance themselves from being a tourist. And why the need to prove it every time they step outside the front door? Or have i got it round the wrong way? Perhaps it's not so much a case of not wanting to be a tourist, but more like just trying to fit in. What do you think?

[funfun]

"Meeting with other expats i find there can be an underlying current of competition as to who speaks the most Thai, eats the spiciest food, knows the most about Thai people, and so on..."

ill take that as you cant read or write Thai, in fact ill bet your one of those that cant even speak Thai!!!!

[thaimate]

i think we try to distance ourselves from the tatoo and pigtale brigade ,walking around in a singlet shorts ,black socks and sandels with their arms round the waist of a young bar girl ,wearing a skirt no bigger than a belt.

as for trying to speak thai ,dont you want to practice so as you get it right if your going to live here?

as for the somtam ,not for me .

oh i also want a dvd that actually works and doesnt cost 150 bhat

[seagull]

Many expats i see, seem to go to great lengths to constantly show themselves as being more than just a tourist.

Some use Thai language in situations where it's not necessary. For example, i've seen expats in banks trying to explain something in Thai (and failing), when it seems that the bank teller's command of English is somewhat better than theirs in Thai.

Another instance of trying to prove one has settled in Thailand is in the ordering of the spiciest food. Not that i question that the expat in question doesn't enjoy hot food, but there seems to be an element of pride in being able to stomach what the locals do.

It sometimes even seems like the tourists themselves are doing anything to avoid the tag. Some frequent travellers to Thailand are a bit like wannabe expats, and try to convince you they really are the genuine article.

Meeting with other expats i find there can be an underlying current of competition as to who speaks the most Thai, eats the spiciest food, knows the most about Thai people, and so on...

So just why is it expats are so keen to distance themselves from being a tourist. And why the need to prove it every time they step outside the front door? Or have i got it round the wrong way? Perhaps it's not so much a case of not wanting to be a tourist, but more like just trying to fit in. What do you think?

Uuuummmmnnn, expats are NOT tourists ?

[Fantasteak]

The thing is when you've been in Thailand for a long a time you can see how you were when you first came. It can be really emabarassing to see some one in a Chiang vest and fishermans pants squatting whilst stroking a soi dog. Now I never did anything like that!!!! Well I never stroked a Soi dog. I also never wore very tight, short Adidas shorts displaying my skinny milk white legs and often flashing some spiders when sitting down.

So taking the pee and mocking the tourists and new -bees is a way of forgetting (reminding) how not to behave.

[Seizhin]

I dont think so.

I for one is eager to meet up with tourists and get to know them better, especially about where they come from.

Of course, the same for everything else, there are different types of people and if you fall into the 'unsincere' one, that's where you're supposed to be treated badly.

[soundman]

I don't feel the need to prove my status in front of tourists - I rarely see any!

Just to be pedantic - I eat very spicy food and attempt to speak Thai on most of the time.

however:

Whenever going to a tourist area - I actually pretend to be a tourist who doesn't speak any Thai. Get my fair share of laughs listening to the "how much are we going to charge this one" banter going on around me.

Soundman.

[zorro1]

i think we try to distance ourselves from the tatoo and pigtale brigade ,walking around in a singlet shorts ,black socks and sandels with their arms round the waist of a young bar girl ,wearing a skirt no bigger than a belt.

as for trying to speak thai ,dont you want to practice so as you get it right if your going to live here?

as for the somtam ,not for me .

oh i also want a dvd that actually works and doesnt cost 150 bhat

And the shirtless brigade. Just this minute got home after walking down Sukhumvit and 3 older guys were sitting outside in a bar with NO shirts , beer bellies and covered in tats.

Re Your DVD situation your being ripped off. I buy DVDs that don't work for only 80 bht

[burman]

The backpackers hate the package tourists, the package tourists hate the sex pats, the long term expats hate the short term expats, the non teachers hate the teachers, the teachers hate the backpackers etc.

Ok, quite a generalisation, and of course not everyone is like that, but overall I think we can safely say a lot of farang hate other farang here for the stupidest reasons.

Even on this forum you can be ridiculed for meeting your wife in a bar, or living in too small an apartment, teaching English, your choice of holiday destination (think Phangan/Pattaya), choosing to eat farang food daily instead of Thai food etc.

The farang that are generally most negative towards other farang usually do so out of some need to compete against them and/or to try to win brownie points from the Thais.

[rixalex]

"Meeting with other expats i find there can be an underlying current of competition as to who speaks the most Thai, eats the spiciest food, knows the most about Thai people, and so on..."

ill take that as you cant read or write Thai, in fact ill bet your one of those that cant even speak Thai!!!!

This attitude exactly proves the point i was making about those who shout about how good their Thai is, and admonish others - even those they have never met. Very sad.

For the record i both speak Thai and eat spicy food, but don't feel this is something i have the need to prove to others.

[kankaroo]

I think there is a lot of truth in what the op is saying. I believe there is a divide between the pretentious ex-pats who are trying to show off, and the rest of us that just want to distance ourself from the 'embarrassing' tourists.

Many times I have found myself in a shop / restaurant or whatever, and been totally shocked by the way some lagered up, loudmouthed, chang tank top wearer is making a fool of himself. I will usually smile to the abused member of staff, speak in a politer than normal way, and also in Thai.

I think it is just my little way of showing the Thai person - 'hey, we are not all like this !'

Does anybody agree ?

[Sir Burr]

For the record i both speak Thai and eat spicy food, but don't feel this is something i have the need to prove to others.

Oh, the irony.

I think you just did........

Edited May 9, 2008 by Sir Burr

[rixalex]

The backpackers hate the package tourists, the package tourists hate the sex pats, the long term expats hate the short term expats, the non teachers hate the teachers, the teachers hate the backpackers etc.

Ok, quite a generalisation, and of course not everyone is like that, but overall I think we can safely say a lot of farang hate other farang here for the stupidest reasons.

Even on this forum you can be ridiculed for meeting your wife in a bar, or living in too small an apartment, teaching English, your choice of holiday destination (think Phangan/Pattaya), choosing to eat farang food daily instead of Thai food etc.

The farang that are generally most negative towards other farang usually do so out of some need to compete against them and/or to try to win brownie points from the Thais.

Very well put Burman. I concur with all.

I wonder what the need to compete is then? Self doubt perhaps?

[rixalex]

For the record i both speak Thai and eat spicy food, but don't feel this is something i have the need to prove to others.

Oh, the irony.

I think you just did........

Thanks for the smart comment. I feel no need to prove it, but am willing to correct someone who presumes to know things about me.

[funfun]

"Meeting with other expats i find there can be an underlying current of competition as to who speaks the most Thai, eats the spiciest food, knows the most about Thai people, and so on..."

ill take that as you cant read or write Thai, in fact ill bet your one of those that cant even speak Thai!!!!

This attitude exactly proves the point i was making about those who shout about how good their Thai is, and admonish others - even those they have never met. Very sad.

For the record i both speak Thai and eat spicy food, but don't feel this is something i have the need to prove to others.

"For the record i both speak Thai "

so you cant read or write thai then?

You started it

"i find there can be an underlying current of competition as to who speaks the most Thai"

and it turns out you can only speak thai, unlike myselfe and many on here who are so fluent in thai i somtimes forget to speak english, well American english that is!!

[Kerryd]

Many expats i see, seem to go to great lengths to constantly show themselves as being more than just a tourist.

So just why is it expats are so keen to distance themselves from being a tourist. And why the need to prove it every time they step outside the front door? Or have i got it round the wrong way? Perhaps it's not so much a case of not wanting to be a tourist, but more like just trying to fit in. What do you think?

I suppose in part it's because too many tourists act like louts when they're here. The expats don't want to get tarred with the same brush.

I remember a time in Germany, when a bunch of young soldiers went to a nud_e beach. Acted like total jerks (didn't undress, made lots of rude comments without realising that most of the locals speak very good English, music blaring, tossing beer cans around, acting like total tossers). I used to go to that beach quite a bit, and could understand a fair bit of German. Soon as the locals saw me, they automatically assumed I was (probably) like those other jerks.

I try to communicate in Thai, within my limited ability. I've found that many, many Thais (much like most of the Germans I used to know) really appreciate it when you try to use their language. I muddle up the pronunciations/grammar/tones all the time but hey, if you don't try, how are you ever going to learn ? I ask my friends to correct my (many) mistakes, which they do, sometimes. (Sometimes I think they don't have a clue what I'm trying to say, so how can they correct me ?)

It's obvious I'll never "fit in" and be mistaken for a Thai, no matter how well I speak the language, or how spicy the food I eat is (not very, let me tell you !)

I'm not in Thailand to compete with other expats to prove who is more "local" than the others. In fact, I hardly even associate with other expats when I'm home (it just occurred to me that on my last trip, I never met up with any TV members at all. Well, there was one, but I didn't know she was on TV). So it's not like I'm trying to prove anything to any other expats.

I don't try (consciously) to "fit in". I just try to be comfortable and happy. I'll worry about trying to fit in some time in the future, after I'm married, have a few kids and need to guide the buffalo around the rice paddy (to give the wife a break) !

[scotwumman]

Self preservation (particularly in the high season)

Self justification?

Some expats are delighted to pal up with tourists particularly those (expats) running short of the readies

[Seizhin]

I wonder, what's merit do you get for 'localizing' yourself?

[rixalex]

"Meeting with other expats i find there can be an underlying current of competition as to who speaks the most Thai, eats the spiciest food, knows the most about Thai people, and so on..."

ill take that as you cant read or write Thai, in fact ill bet your one of those that cant even speak Thai!!!!

This attitude exactly proves the point i was making about those who shout about how good their Thai is, and admonish others - even those they have never met. Very sad.

For the record i both speak Thai and eat spicy food, but don't feel this is something i have the need to prove to others.

"For the record i both speak Thai "

so you cant read or write thai then?

You started it

"i find there can be an underlying current of competition as to who speaks the most Thai"

and it turns out you can only speak thai, unlike myselfe and many on here who are so fluent in thai i somtimes forget to speak english, well American english that is!!

All i started was asking the question why some expats are competitive about stuff like how well they speak the language. For some reason you interpreted this as me wanting to engage in a pissing contest with you about Thai language. So whilst i congratulate you on your mastery of Thai language, i suggest you might need to brush up on some of the other aspects of communication, like understanding.

[sibeymai]

There is competition in any society. Yes, there is an undercurrent of discrimination in thailand between expats and tourists. mostly the comments I've heard from tourists when I say I live here id that "you're so lucky". But, try to live here and it's not the same experience as a tousist has.

It's really neither here nor there, doesn't have anything to do with how much spicy food you can eat or how much you can speak the lingo. It's about how happy you are to be in Thailand and whether you can survive here.

As a minority in Thailand and out of respect for our hosts we, as foreigners, should always try to present out best qualities to our hosts while we enjoy ourselves. there are some, almost excusively tousists, who make the expats look bad by their behaviour. this is a small percentage. I think this is why expats want to distance themselves from tourists.

Reality is that whether a tousist, an expat or a permanent resident you will be judged by Thais and others alike by your behaviour, not by your language skills or your how many chillis you can eat.

If you meet people who judge you on other criteria then perhaps you should assess you own choices on who to associate with.

[Fantasteak]

The backpackers hate the package tourists, the package tourists hate the sex pats, the long term expats hate the short term expats, the non teachers hate the teachers, the teachers hate the backpackers etc.

Ok, quite a generalisation, and of course not everyone is like that, but overall I think we can safely say a lot of farang hate other farang here for the stupidest reasons.

Even on this forum you can be ridiculed for meeting your wife in a bar, or living in too small an apartment, teaching English, your choice of holiday destination (think Phangan/Pattaya), choosing to eat farang food daily instead of Thai food etc.

The farang that are generally most negative towards other farang usually do so out of some need to compete against them and/or to try to win brownie points from the Thais.

Very well put Burman. I concur with all.

I wonder what the need to compete is then? Self doubt perhaps?

Its a man thing. You will find that most of these competing types are men. Woman generally dont get involved in such nonsense. There far to busy cooking dinner and cleaning.

[toptuan]

Tourists? What tourists?

TT in Isaan

[funfun]

"Meeting with other expats i find there can be an underlying current of competition as to who speaks the most Thai, eats the spiciest food, knows the most about Thai people, and so on..."

ill take that as you cant read or write Thai, in fact ill bet your one of those that cant even speak Thai!!!!

This attitude exactly proves the point i was making about those who shout about how good their Thai is, and admonish others - even those they have never met. Very sad.

For the record i both speak Thai and eat spicy food, but don't feel this is something i have the need to prove to others.

"For the record i both speak Thai "

so you cant read or write thai then?

You started it

"i find there can be an underlying current of competition as to who speaks the most Thai"

and it turns out you can only speak thai, unlike myselfe and many on here who are so fluent in thai i somtimes forget to speak english, well American english that is!!

All i started was asking the question why some expats are competitive about stuff like how well they speak the language. For some reason you interpreted this as me wanting to engage in a pissing contest with you about Thai language. So whilst i congratulate you on your mastery of Thai language, i suggest you might need to brush up on some of the other aspects of communication, like understanding.

see thats difference, you are getting upset with yourselfe all beacause you know your inferior to me as im fluent in thai, not just reading and writing but im now calm but you on the other hand as a mere tourist have your bad temper, and this is probly down to drinking, go on admit it ill bet you use alcohol at least once a week!!!

thought so, then you come on here and blame everyone else, you brits make me laugh!!!

[JimsKnight]

Many expats i see, seem to go to great lengths to constantly show themselves as being more than just a tourist.

Some use Thai language in situations where it's not necessary. For example, i've seen expats in banks trying to explain something in Thai (and failing), when it seems that the bank teller's command of English is somewhat better than theirs in Thai.

Another instance of trying to prove one has settled in Thailand is in the ordering of the spiciest food. Not that i question that the expat in question doesn't enjoy hot food, but there seems to be an element of pride in being able to stomach what the locals do.

It sometimes even seems like the tourists themselves are doing anything to avoid the tag. Some frequent travellers to Thailand are a bit like wannabe expats, and try to convince you they really are the genuine article.

Meeting with other expats i find there can be an underlying current of competition as to who speaks the most Thai, eats the spiciest food, knows the most about Thai people, and so on...

So just why is it expats are so keen to distance themselves from being a tourist. And why the need to prove it every time they step outside the front door? Or have i got it round the wrong way? Perhaps it's not so much a case of not wanting to be a tourist, but more like just trying to fit in. What do you think?

I know what you mean, sat in a bar one night a while back:

JK: Well I work half the year offshore and the other half here in CM/Thailand.

Some smug photographer: So you're a tourist then! (He sneers instantly catagorising me!)

I thought 'Golly, glad I'm not so far up my own ass as this gimp!'

This guy should of had a big neon sign above him saying 'Ask me about what I do! I'm an EXPAT and everyone else who is not like me is a TOURIST!

Apart from him I've never really found the whole expat scene too exclusionistic, they tend to welcome tourists into their ranks pretty well. After all, most of them started off as tourists

[Seizhin]

Its a man thing. You will find that most of these competing types are men. Woman generally dont get involved in such nonsense. There far to busy cooking dinner and cleaning.

Another way of saying that you men are too free?

[ade100]

I certainly don’t look down on tourists but I’m not sure I want to be treated like one. And I am pretty sure they can tell the difference.

Just the other day I went to a gym and was given the price list. The regular price was 200 THB per session but the Thai price was just 30 THB. On establishing that I lived just around the corner in a house, not a hotel, he was delighted to offer me the Thai price. I think he suspected I wasn’t a tourist immediately, as I removed my shoes before stepping inside.

Well I had a warm glow for the rest of the day I can tell you…

[funfun]

I certainly don’t look down on tourists but I’m not sure I want to be treated like one. And I am pretty sure they can tell the difference.

Just the other day I went to a gym and was given the price list. The regular price was 200 THB per session but the Thai price was just 30 THB. On establishing that I lived just around the corner in a house, not a hotel, he was delighted to offer me the Thai price. I think he suspected I wasn’t a tourist immediately, as I removed my shoes before stepping inside.

Well I had a warm glow for the rest of the day I can tell you…

Have you got. Brown feet? Mine are still tanned but with white lines over where my sanddles hold on!!!!

[sibeymai]

Mods, please close this thread.....you know where it's going.

[burman]

Oh don't be silly Sibeymai.

[WAERTH]

Has it ever occurred that some ex pats speak Thai, because they like to be able to speak another language? Not because they want to show of? When I was still at school and working part-time at the beach in Scheveningen I always appreciated it when someone from another country came along and at least tried to speak Dutch. It shows respect for the country you are in.

I hate the many people who only speak one language and expect everyone in the world to understand their language. And then complain that people are stupid and uneducated because they do not speak their language. I meet them regularly. Although my English is pretty ok and I can understand most of what people tell me in German and can understand bits of French as well. I regularly deny knowing any one of those languages when I am dealing with a person with that attitude.

When visiting another country try to at least speak a few words in the language they speak there. Even if only thank you! This will show that at least you make some effort. This has nothing to do with showing of!