Silly Request By Embassy

[Khun Jean]

A friend of ours, whom we invited to go on a holiday and to be on my wifes and sons birthday, was requested an extraordinary amount of documents.

From me and my wife, salary for a YEAR!!, ownership of my house in the Netherlands, her residents card, our marriage certificate, a legalised guarantee. From her marriage certificate, previous visas (also old pasport if available), bankaccounts, and declare reason to return to Thailand as if going on a holiday and then returning to your own life with family and husband is not a good enough reason.

From me they have on record about 10 guarantees for previous visas for family members and friend during the last 8 years and this was the first time they asked for a lot more information.

This took a long time because first we just supplied the 'normal' amount of information as stated on their website and documents.

Every time after a few days delay something added to the list. Faxes had to be send because scans send with e-mail were not good enough.

All the time the birthday party was getting closer and closer, and the plan was that we all go traveling to a few countries for a while, so a total stay of three weeks was the minimum to be able to do that.

Three weeks later it was denied unless she got another invitation letter from me and this is the idiotic one:

A letter from her husband stating that he was allowing his wife to travel alone!

And this for a woman who has been married 20 years to an American and has enough money on her bankaccount to travel the world over many times. Her passport shows visas for the US (10 years), UK, New Zealand, Australia, etc.

As she also intended to go to friends in Canada after her visit to us, she also went to the Canadian embassy. She got that visa in 1 day. And without those crazy amounts of paperwork.

At the end she cancelled her visit to the Netherlands because time was running out and she could only stay for around 2 weeks which disupted the plans and reservations we made.

Gives you a reason to wait with these until the visa is in hand.

So our planned changed and coming winter we will see echother in Austria for a ski holiday. Austrian embassy already told her that would be no problem at all.

The Dutch really don't want any Thai tourists.

[FRM-BKK]

A friend of ours, whom we invited to go on a holiday and to be on my wifes and sons birthday, was requested an extraordinary amount of documents.

From me and my wife, salary for a YEAR!!, ownership of my house in the Netherlands, her residents card, our marriage certificate, a legalised guarantee. From her marriage certificate, previous visas (also old pasport if available), bankaccounts, and declare reason to return to Thailand as if going on a holiday and then returning to your own life with family and husband is not a good enough reason.

From me they have on record about 10 guarantees for previous visas for family members and friend during the last 8 years and this was the first time they asked for a lot more information.

This took a long time because first we just supplied the 'normal' amount of information as stated on their website and documents.

Every time after a few days delay something added to the list. Faxes had to be send because scans send with e-mail were not good enough.

All the time the birthday party was getting closer and closer, and the plan was that we all go traveling to a few countries for a while, so a total stay of three weeks was the minimum to be able to do that.

Three weeks later it was denied unless she got another invitation letter from me and this is the idiotic one:

A letter from her husband stating that he was allowing his wife to travel alone!

And this for a woman who has been married 20 years to an American and has enough money on her bankaccount to travel the world over many times. Her passport shows visas for the US (10 years), UK, New Zealand, Australia, etc.

As she also intended to go to friends in Canada after her visit to us, she also went to the Canadian embassy. She got that visa in 1 day. And without those crazy amounts of paperwork.

At the end she cancelled her visit to the Netherlands because time was running out and she could only stay for around 2 weeks which disupted the plans and reservations we made.

Gives you a reason to wait with these until the visa is in hand.

So our planned changed and coming winter we will see echother in Austria for a ski holiday. Austrian embassy already told her that would be no problem at all.

The Dutch really don't want any Thai tourists.

Khun Jean,

Although I understand your frustration, there may have been good reasons to doubt your friends intentions. Your story sounds confusing. I cannot accept your assertion about the Austrian Embassy either, unless she submits an application. At least the Dutch Embassy in Bangkok will try and assist in getting the applicant sorted out.

At least the Dutch embassy made an attempt to assist. The British embassy would just have refused; they would not have chased you for additional paperwork or information. On their refusal notice the British embassy states that the applicant had been given enough information to know in advance what should have been submitted.

We put in a 'first' application with the Dutch embassy for my partner, all the paperwork as per web-site was submitted with the application. 24 hours later the visa was issued. We then did the same with the British Embassy, we submitted as per requirements on the web-site. 3 days later we had the passport back .. the visa was refused ..

We submitted a second application within 10 days, plus another 4,225THB this time the visa was granted.

In my dealings with both the Dutch and the British embassies, have I found that the Dutch Embassy has been most helpful, whereas the British embassy's behaviour has been unhelpful and arrogant, with an air of superiority that could only be described as........ truly British!

I am sorry your friend had a bad experience.

FRM-BKK

Edited June 27, 2008 by FRM-BKK

[roygsd]

Three weeks later it was denied unless she got another invitation letter from me and this is the idiotic one:

A letter from her husband stating that he was allowing his wife to travel alone!

The Dutch really don't want any Thai tourists.

Sorry you have had this problem but in my experience submitting the application to fit in with their timescales for processing rather than hoping that the application will be approved to fit in wih your travel arrangements is far more productive.

Giving them whatever information they require and more importantly providing the original documention is a must.

In this day and age you cannot really expect them to acccept documents which have been scannng and sent by emails, in fact I m amazed they accepted the information sent by fax.

The Embassy is processing this persons application, nothing whatsoever to do with any previous applications you may have had dealings with regarding other people.

We all know it is stressful dealing with Officialdom but, lets be fair here, they have a serious job to do.

I also dont understand why they want a letter from her husband, but if they require it why should it not be provided?

As for an updated letter from yourself, sorry but that is pretty much standard procedure as I understand it.

The reason the application has been cancelled by your friend is because the birthday was fast approaching, fail to prepare= prepare to fail.

Embassy staff get a rough ride, sometimes deservedly but they are the first line of defence for their country, holland has a long history of economic migration and people trafficing, its good to see that at last they are tightening up their procedures.

Your friend may be married to a usa citizen and may be very wealthy, but that doesnt entitle them to expect preferential treatment from the embassy staff.

Roy Gsd

[Khun Jean]

The reason i mentioned it is that i find it rather strange to ask permission from your husband.

If she was 12 and asked permission from her parents i would understand.

But when you are 44 years old i would think that is rather stupid and very degrading.

My dealings with the Dutch embassy are always difficult. That is because i am Dutch. If i ask a visa with the Austrian embassy it is ready within a day. I guess the same is for UK people, when you go to your own embassy it is difficult and other countries are more easy. As another example, in this case my wife getting a permission to stay in the Netherlands was very difficult and a lot of costs and documents involved. Going to Austria it was a week and 60 euro for a 10 year residency card (european rules).

It seems like embassies are not really helpfull to their own countrymen but are more inclined to assist people from other european countries. The risk of staying is probably a lot less and they are actually forced to use European rules when it is not about their own countries citizens.

This topic was about a 'simple' tourist visa.

I allowed a 3 week timeframe for asking for it and expected no problems. Normally it is issued within 3 days. But knowing the slowness and strange demands we took 2 and a half weeks extra. When someone travelled many times to many different countries it should not be that difficult. I posted this more as a warning so other people not make the same mistake by thinking it can be arranged in a few weeks. Something out of the ordinary can happen.

As the updated letter i found that strange because they already had a new one. It was about a week later i had to send a new one. I had no problem with that as i see it just as a double check.

The embassy 'should' make a decision within 3 days. That is their own policy. But by demanding one document evrytime they stretched it very long. Instead of requesting everything needed in 1 time there were 5 requests in a 2 week timeframe.

[FRM-BKK]

The reason i mentioned it is that i find it rather strange to ask permission from your husband.

If she was 12 and asked permission from her parents i would understand.

But when you are 44 years old i would think that is rather stupid and very degrading.

My dealings with the Dutch embassy are always difficult. That is because i am Dutch. If i ask a visa with the Austrian embassy it is ready within a day. I guess the same is for UK people, when you go to your own embassy it is difficult and other countries are more easy. As another example, in this case my wife getting a permission to stay in the Netherlands was very difficult and a lot of costs and documents involved. Going to Austria it was a week and 60 euro for a 10 year residency card (european rules).

It seems like embassies are not really helpfull to their own countrymen but are more inclined to assist people from other european countries. The risk of staying is probably a lot less and they are actually forced to use European rules when it is not about their own countries citizens.

This topic was about a 'simple' tourist visa.

I allowed a 3 week timeframe for asking for it and expected no problems. Normally it is issued within 3 days. But knowing the slowness and strange demands we took 2 and a half weeks extra. When someone travelled many times to many different countries it should not be that difficult. I posted this more as a warning so other people not make the same mistake by thinking it can be arranged in a few weeks. Something out of the ordinary can happen.

As the updated letter i found that strange because they already had a new one. It was about a week later i had to send a new one. I had no problem with that as i see it just as a double check.

The embassy 'should' make a decision within 3 days. That is their own policy. But by demanding one document evrytime they stretched it very long. Instead of requesting everything needed in 1 time there were 5 requests in a 2 week timeframe.

Actually Khun Jean,

I am a Dutch citizen, just like you. I have had dealings with the Dutch embassy here in Bangkok several times over the last 6 months. I reiterate that my experience with the Dutch embassy has been very positive. One day I was there, they were trying to help an elderly Thai lady, who was obviously in a state of confusion. The poor woman was in and out, for additional pictures, photocopies etc. At least they took the trouble to get her sorted out.

Again the British embassy would have happily taken the 83.00 euros!! and returned the passport together with the refusal notice. So, your argument about embassies and the difficulties they create for their own citizens does not hold up!

One certainty is that any application has to be absolutely complete. If anything is missing it will create additional work.

The other thing you have to keep in mind is that visa officers look and deal with applications in a manor where they have no emotional involvement with the applicant. In other words, they look at what is in front of them, on paper. Some things might look very obvious to you because you know the applicant. The visa officer doesn't know the applicant and can therefore only go by what is on the paper in front of them. That is where a 100% complete application comes into effect.

I am sorry you feel the way you do about your own embassy.

All the best anyway......

FRM-BKK

[TheJoker]

The reason i mentioned it is that i find it rather strange to ask permission from your husband.

If she was 12 and asked permission from her parents i would understand.

But when you are 44 years old i would think that is rather stupid and very degrading.

My dealings with the Dutch embassy are always difficult. That is because i am Dutch. If i ask a visa with the Austrian embassy it is ready within a day. I guess the same is for UK people, when you go to your own embassy it is difficult and other countries are more easy. As another example, in this case my wife getting a permission to stay in the Netherlands was very difficult and a lot of costs and documents involved. Going to Austria it was a week and 60 euro for a 10 year residency card (european rules).

It seems like embassies are not really helpfull to their own countrymen but are more inclined to assist people from other european countries. The risk of staying is probably a lot less and they are actually forced to use European rules when it is not about their own countries citizens.

This topic was about a 'simple' tourist visa.

I allowed a 3 week timeframe for asking for it and expected no problems. Normally it is issued within 3 days. But knowing the slowness and strange demands we took 2 and a half weeks extra. When someone travelled many times to many different countries it should not be that difficult. I posted this more as a warning so other people not make the same mistake by thinking it can be arranged in a few weeks. Something out of the ordinary can happen.

As the updated letter i found that strange because they already had a new one. It was about a week later i had to send a new one. I had no problem with that as i see it just as a double check.

The embassy 'should' make a decision within 3 days. That is their own policy. But by demanding one document evrytime they stretched it very long. Instead of requesting everything needed in 1 time there were 5 requests in a 2 week timeframe.

I agree with you. I am also Dutch and just want to have my girlfriend for a short tourist visa to the netherlands. it seems almost impossible mission. They keep asking for more documents same as you. and with every new apply they make up something new. While our financial status is 100%. You are right, maybe the want foreigner to live in our country and the dutch move out to another country? If that's what they want....

[TheJoker]

But by demanding one document evrytime they stretched it very long. Instead of requesting everything needed in 1 time there were 5 requests in a 2 week timeframe.

Yes very unclear to you. I think it's al about making the money. 2700 baht each request! I got mad because this is the fuc_king dutch embassy, but nobody can speak dutch in there , just behind the scenes, but they won't let you talk with them.

[jdg]

But by demanding one document evrytime they stretched it very long. Instead of requesting everything needed in 1 time there were 5 requests in a 2 week timeframe.

Yes very unclear to you. I think it's al about making the money. 2700 baht each request! I got mad because this is the fuc_king dutch embassy, but nobody can speak dutch in there , just behind the scenes, but they won't let you talk with them.

Hmm they must have changed that yesterday. In the six years I am here I have been a few times to the embassy and there are only Dutch people who help you.

The only Thais there, are the security guys and the woman at the desk before you enter the building.

btw. I am dutch also

JDG

Edited December 16, 2008 by jdg

[ourmaninbangers]

A friend of ours, whom we invited to go on a holiday and to be on my wifes and sons birthday, was requested an extraordinary amount of documents.

From me and my wife, salary for a YEAR!!, ownership of my house in the Netherlands, her residents card, our marriage certificate, a legalised guarantee. From her marriage certificate, previous visas (also old pasport if available), bankaccounts, and declare reason to return to Thailand as if going on a holiday and then returning to your own life with family and husband is not a good enough reason.

From me they have on record about 10 guarantees for previous visas for family members and friend during the last 8 years and this was the first time they asked for a lot more information.

This took a long time because first we just supplied the 'normal' amount of information as stated on their website and documents.

Every time after a few days delay something added to the list. Faxes had to be send because scans send with e-mail were not good enough.

All the time the birthday party was getting closer and closer, and the plan was that we all go traveling to a few countries for a while, so a total stay of three weeks was the minimum to be able to do that.

Three weeks later it was denied unless she got another invitation letter from me and this is the idiotic one:

A letter from her husband stating that he was allowing his wife to travel alone!

And this for a woman who has been married 20 years to an American and has enough money on her bankaccount to travel the world over many times. Her passport shows visas for the US (10 years), UK, New Zealand, Australia, etc.

As she also intended to go to friends in Canada after her visit to us, she also went to the Canadian embassy. She got that visa in 1 day. And without those crazy amounts of paperwork.

At the end she cancelled her visit to the Netherlands because time was running out and she could only stay for around 2 weeks which disupted the plans and reservations we made.

Gives you a reason to wait with these until the visa is in hand.

So our planned changed and coming winter we will see echother in Austria for a ski holiday. Austrian embassy already told her that would be no problem at all.

The Dutch really don't want any Thai tourists.

Khun Jean,

Although I understand your frustration, there may have been good reasons to doubt your friends intentions. Your story sounds confusing. I cannot accept your assertion about the Austrian Embassy either, unless she submits an application. At least the Dutch Embassy in Bangkok will try and assist in getting the applicant sorted out.

At least the Dutch embassy made an attempt to assist. The British embassy would just have refused; they would not have chased you for additional paperwork or information. On their refusal notice the British embassy states that the applicant had been given enough information to know in advance what should have been submitted.

We put in a 'first' application with the Dutch embassy for my partner, all the paperwork as per web-site was submitted with the application. 24 hours later the visa was issued. We then did the same with the British Embassy, we submitted as per requirements on the web-site. 3 days later we had the passport back .. the visa was refused ..

We submitted a second application within 10 days, plus another 4,225THB this time the visa was granted.

In my dealings with both the Dutch and the British embassies, have I found that the Dutch Embassy has been most helpful, whereas the British embassy's behaviour has been unhelpful and arrogant, with an air of superiority that could only be described as........ truly British!

I am sorry your friend had a bad experience.

FRM-BKK

I am dutch, my boyfriend UK.. I have found the british embassy to be one of the better ones

and they do seem to go the extra mile for their subjects in troubles

[Tinkelbell]

quoted.......".In this day and age you cannot really expect them to acccept documents which have been scannng and sent by emails, in fact I m amazed they accepted the information sent by fax..."

That's true.

Dealing with the Thai Embassy in the US makes the OP's experience feel like a walk in a park. I'm a Thai but in '07, they made me flew all the way to the Thai Consular in NY ( since my home is in Florida, they let me chose between The Thai Embassy in D.C. or Consular in NY), to handed out all my documents in person. They told you flatly....."we don't take anythings sent by e-mail or fax , period.."

I should also add, from that time on, I learn that the Thai Embassy provides this type of service annually to its citizen on a moving van to some States that has large Thai communities.

Sorry to hear about the OP plight.

I always tell myself everything has to go by the rules, not by your way.

[FRM-BKK]

I am dutch, my boyfriend UK.. I have found the british embassy to be one of the better ones

and they do seem to go the extra mile for their subjects in troubles

Our man in Bangers,

We are talking about Visa applications here, not people in trouble!

The British Visa application center on Rajadamri is a typical example of how to put up barriers so that VCO's do not have to face applicants and possibly speak to them.

I am Dutch! and I have plenty of experience with the British people and authorities, to stand by what I have said.

Frm-Bkk

[Moonbase]

I have a Dutch friend that has been through the process with his girlfriend of 3-4 years, she has travelled solo to Holland a few times for extended holidays with no visa 'issues' they have mentioned.

[merijn]

I'm Dutch living in Thailand for about 20 years and married to Thai wife.

She/We went a few times to Holland and never had any problems to get a visa for her.

Visa always ready within 24 hrs with the normal documentation required. ( i have income from overseas and a business in Thailand )

The last time she went to Holland is now about 4 years ago so maybe some things have changed.