How Do I Know My Lpg System Safe Or Not?

[sunny747]

sorry to open another lpg thread, but this is freaking me out. I just saw on thai news on TV and showed some burning cars road side caused due to LPG. Even though i don't understand thai much but it was obviously showing the cause of the fire was due to LPG. Later they were showing some gas station and shops.

I want to check thoroughly my LPG system. I want to make sure it is safe. I went to lpg shop but these guys are busy installling LPG on cars rather giving me time for small money. Often they give me a bad look when i go there to tune or check lpg. They just give me 5 minutes and sayz ....chai dai, mai me panha.

How does they understand in just 5 minutes?

is there any suitable and renowned shop where i can check my whole LPG system?

[hans1977]

There are a few aspects on this, and i wouldn't be at all surprised if PTT takes the opportunity to enlarge that kind of news to gain some new NGV customers...

NGV systems has the advantages of thicker cylinder walls and that PTT are looking after the installations and parts, but other than that, i think the differences in safety are very small system-wise.

Having said that, it very much depends on who did the installation for you, and i think the problem to find out if your system is safe or not will depend highly on you.

I would suggest that you do quite a bit of reading about this, followed by an inspection. There are LPG installation manuals that you could read, and i'm sure you can find other, more safety specific, information as well.

Some basic things you can check:

- Are there leaks? Check with soupy water!

- Is the copper pipe well suppoerted from below, and tightly mounted to the car?

- Are there loops as the pipe changes direction?

- Will the pipe get squeezed or flexed as the car moves over bumby roads?

- Try to figure out what will happen with the pipe if you would have collisions from different directions.

- Have you got electric safety valves at the cylinder and at the reducer, and will they close if the engine stopps?

- Is the cyllinder fitted so that it appears impossible that it would ever come lose?

If you have gone through this (and the things you'll find during your research), then been around to many different installation places with your questions (instead of an imprecise instruction to check the whole system) and still can not find anything unsafe about the your system; than i think you have quite a good chance to actually have a safe system.

/Hans

sorry to open another lpg thread, but this is freaking me out. I just saw on thai news on TV and showed some burning cars road side caused due to LPG. Even though i don't understand thai much but it was obviously showing the cause of the fire was due to LPG. Later they were showing some gas station and shops.

I want to check thoroughly my LPG system. I want to make sure it is safe. I went to lpg shop but these guys are busy installling LPG on cars rather giving me time for small money. Often they give me a bad look when i go there to tune or check lpg. They just give me 5 minutes and sayz ....chai dai, mai me panha.

How does they understand in just 5 minutes?

is there any suitable and renowned shop where i can check my whole LPG system?

[Boater]

i am going to check my LPG tank tomorrow after reading this

((

[teej]

I reallly believe we're going to get a lot more stories like this in the future. Garages installing LPG have been popping up all over the place, and they are

completely unregulated.

Unregulated in Thailand = Complete Disaster in the Making

Fly-by-night installers and their installations are going to become problematic, to say the least. Too much demand and too fast I've heard of some garages pumping out many many installations per day -- in, out, good luck with that explosive tank in your car! Next!

I'm not a doom-and-gloom guy, but I'd rather pay for petrol. Just one man's opinion.

[sunny747]

thank you so much hans. I'll check whether i have safely valve or not. Please recommend some repair shops if not so trouble.

While returning from office, i couldn't start my car. It was not battery problem as the headlight, stereo set was working perfect. I tried for 20 mins still no luck. Then this thai guy came and he increased /untied a spring knob from the lpg motor. Then he also did something with the accelerator string and then my engine started.

not sure what was the problem as i have noticed often i have problem starting the car from cold engine like in the morning after long gap.

so that spring knob from the lpg motor on top of black pipe, does it has to do anything with safety?

then i came back home and saw the burning car on TV. guys this is freaking me out. i'm scared to drive now.

please help.

[HDRIDER]

HI

If i was to use LPG i would find a "real" shop and not a cheap charlie shop i a backyard, but then again, i will NOT be using LPG, i am safe using petrol.

Heard the same thing happend in Kao Lak about a week ago

[hans1977]

Where are you located? I know one guy who owns an LPG installation place in Sriracha who has got good education and a bit of a brain, but he is not very skilled with using tools.

There is no such thing as an LPG motor, but i think that Thai guy increased the LPG supply by opening the low-speed valve on the reducer.

The other valve in line with the black pipe is the high-speed (or power) valve. So, not a safety utility.

If those cars in the news were heavily burned, i'd rather suspect that they just happened to have an LPG system fitted, but the actual cause of the accident would be more likely to actually be in the petrol system. It is very common in Thailand that a petrol pipe bursts and cause the car to catch fire. Many of those accidents happens to cars with an LPG system fitted, since there are so many cars with LPG systems in Thailand, but the LPG system will get blamed anyway.

/Hans

thank you so much hans. I'll check whether i have safely valve or not. Please recommend some repair shops if not so trouble.

While returning from office, i couldn't start my car. It was not battery problem as the headlight, stereo set was working perfect. I tried for 20 mins still no luck. Then this thai guy came and he increased /untied a spring knob from the lpg motor. Then he also did something with the accelerator string and then my engine started.

not sure what was the problem as i have noticed often i have problem starting the car from cold engine like in the morning after long gap.

so that spring knob from the lpg motor on top of black pipe, does it has to do anything with safety?

then i came back home and saw the burning car on TV. guys this is freaking me out. i'm scared to drive now.

please help.

[hans1977]

Yes, finding the right shop is the most difficult thing about fitting an LPG system, and the expensive places are not necessarily better.

However, a petrol system is not a very nice and safe system, and in an accident the risk is that your car will ignite into a massive fire because of it.

A petrol system can be safe because the car manufacturer designed it well, and to remain safe, such a system has to be maintained to make sure that it is at a minimum risk to have a burst along the path from the tank to the engine (and back, but that path is at the low pressure side and less vulnerable). The tank itself also has to be in a good condition.

A gas system has got similar concerns, and i would say that whether you are using petrol, LPG or CNG can not be pinpointed as being more (or less) dangerous. It depends on the circumstances in an accident which one will be the most dangerous at that time, but keep in mind that the system (no matter which one) has to be well maintained and properly installed to be "safe".

/Hans

HI

If i was to use LPG i would find a "real" shop and not a cheap charlie shop i a backyard, but then again, i will NOT be using LPG, i am safe using petrol.

Heard the same thing happend in Kao Lak about a week ago

[sunny747]

thanks a lot Han. Well, so that means the valve in line with the black pipe is the high-speed (or power) right? what i understand from the cooking cylinder that if you increase the knob it fires a lot and cook faster. Some times the dish get burns.

will it burn my engine coz the valve is set too high? Otherwise my engine is not starting. While on halt, rpm remains on "1" so i guess this is normal .

once again, thanks so much for explaining.....i can feel the breathe inside me now.

i live my Rama 9. I don't mind driving far just to find renowned LPG station where they are willing to help me.

[hans1977]

It's not really like a cooking system, it's a closed system and you will waste gas if you open the valve(s) more than sufficient.

From what i can see now, you rely highly on external competence in this. I think driving to see Khun Uraphong at PJ Gas between Bang Phra and Sriracha opposite the Jet "Jiffy" petrol station would be a good start. He is also working in another place, so you'll have to call him to know when he will be there: 0815880316. He knows some English, but i suspect you'll need to speak Thai with him to get it right.

/Hans

thanks a lot Han. Well, so that means the valve in line with the black pipe is the high-speed (or power) right? what i understand from the cooking cylinder that if you increase the knob it fires a lot and cook faster. Some times the dish get burns.

will it burn my engine coz the valve is set too high? Otherwise my engine is not starting. While on halt, rpm remains on "1" so i guess this is normal .

once again, thanks so much for explaining.....i can feel the breathe inside me now.

i live my Rama 9. I don't mind driving far just to find renowned LPG station where they are willing to help me.

[sunny747]

thanks hans. I'll have my thai colleague speak to him. I really appreciate your support.

[ratcatcher]

i am going to check my LPG tank tomorrow after reading this

((

Interesting reading.

I had my installation done at a licensed LPG installation shop in Satthu Pradit area, doing mainly taxis. After the professional installation, I was required to take my car (Suzuki Caribian) to the Land transportation Department at Chatuchak for inspection and registration.

I was under the impression ( TIT) that all conversions had to be inspected for leaks and quality etc.

Has anyone else had to take their vehicle to LTD and have Green book marked

[Sakeopete]

There was a story in the Bangkok Post recently where a CNG commercial truck exploded at the fill station. The cause of that was scrap yards cleaning and painting outdated tanks and selling them as new to installation shops. Maybe something to be aware of as earlier posters mention nothing is regulated at these installation shops.

[tracker]

my experience:

bought a benz with lpg in march07. lpg installation was new then. To pass the paperwork, an extra safety valve was installed, and immediately after that, we went to a road department in bkk from the government to check the car's lpg system and get a stamp on the paperwork. All was good, until 3 months later. I got a gas smell in the car. It was very easy to detect. Under the hood, I found that extra installed safety valve leaking. IT was easy to see bcs ice was forming on the valve. I bought a new valve and replaced it, only to find that that valve also leaked!! A second replacement valve was ok.

So, leaks, in 99% of the cases, form slowly, and can be smelled easily. Far ahead of seeing your car going up in flames. But you're warned again here: work here is inferior! check it yourself. Every person can make soapwater and check the lines. Let someone point out the lines if you do not know where they are, so you can do it regularly by yourself.

[tigerbeer]

one poster mentioned about the number of LPG installation centers that have popped up over the last couple of months. let me share my 2 satangs of opinion in this. be very careful where you get your installation done at. be very careful where you fill up your tank at. mom and pop shops have turned into LPG centers.

LPG is a superb alternative fuel to benzene but just please play safe. have regular check ups. spend more on modern and systems with quality parts. never compromise on cheaper and older systems. your savings in future would attest to this.

regulation is totally needed and cannot say enough about how installation of NGV/CNG systems is regulated here in Thailand by PTT. The vigorous testings done on the tanks and certifications prove that your installation is a safe one. a lot of people have read my posts on NGV and perhaps think that maybe i work for PTT or something!. Of course not. Just a happy user of NGV. Go for a NGV system if you can afford one and can tolerate the short range of travel on a filling. NGV is the way to go! and more importantly, its friendly to the environment.

[hans1977]

Yes, or someone payed them to put the story that way...

/Hans

There was a story in the Bangkok Post recently where a CNG commercial truck exploded at the fill station. The cause of that was scrap yards cleaning and painting outdated tanks and selling them as new to installation shops. Maybe something to be aware of as earlier posters mention nothing is regulated at these installation shops.

[hans1977]

Neither of the fuel add-on systems is the way to go IMHO, they are just emergency patches to compensate for what the people in the fuel- and vehicle businesses are doing as a result of their obvious obsession about money and power.

I would say that CNG _might_ be the way to go, but it has to be designed into the vehicle at the very beginning. For Thailand there is a non-technical problem as well; using CNG systems is certainly a very uncertain way to go as long as there is only one company "to rule them all".

/Hans

one poster mentioned about the number of LPG installation centers that have popped up over the last couple of months. let me share my 2 satangs of opinion in this. be very careful where you get your installation done at. be very careful where you fill up your tank at. mom and pop shops have turned into LPG centers.

LPG is a superb alternative fuel to benzene but just please play safe. have regular check ups. spend more on modern and systems with quality parts. never compromise on cheaper and older systems. your savings in future would attest to this.

regulation is totally needed and cannot say enough about how installation of NGV/CNG systems is regulated here in Thailand by PTT. The vigorous testings done on the tanks and certifications prove that your installation is a safe one. a lot of people have read my posts on NGV and perhaps think that maybe i work for PTT or something!. Of course not. Just a happy user of NGV. Go for a NGV system if you can afford one and can tolerate the short range of travel on a filling. NGV is the way to go! and more importantly, its friendly to the environment.

[sunny747]

i am going to check my LPG tank tomorrow after reading this

((

Interesting reading.

I had my installation done at a licensed LPG installation shop in Satthu Pradit area, doing mainly taxis. After the professional installation, I was required to take my car (Suzuki Caribian) to the Land transportation Department at Chatuchak for inspection and registration.

I was under the impression ( TIT) that all conversions had to be inspected for leaks and quality etc.

Has anyone else had to take their vehicle to LTD and have Green book marked

yes after installing i had to go to mochit for road permit. I needed a LPG certificate from the shop and showed at Mochit.

[Plus]

Guys, where were you with your safety tips when someone was asking if it's ok to use your home cooking gas bottle instead of a proper tank and was told that it's ok 'cos lots of Isan motorbikes use them.