Anyone Have Hands On Experience With Frog Farming ?

[fruity]

hello fruity seems like u got this graft sown up,im realy interested im in the uk just now but comin over end of feb, would be great to come an see u an have a chat about it an hopefully grab some breeding pairs from u if that would be ok with u?

cheers deano...

You are more than welcome Deano:)

Fruity I would like to get copy of the booklet also would like to buy some breeders from u. How about visiting u?

To the many guys who have pm'd me regarding breeding frogs; if you are sure want some, please let me know how many pairs you would like, as we are now down to only around fifty pairs available to sell.

The book is copied for those that want it. Anyone always welcome here. Someone sent me the attached pic. Maybe another way to earn from frogs....lol...

[peng]

hello fruity seems like u got this graft sown up,im realy interested im in the uk just now but comin over end of feb, would be great to come an see u an have a chat about it an hopefully grab some breeding pairs from u if that would be ok with u?

cheers deano...

You are more than welcome Deano:)

Fruity I would like to get copy of the booklet also would like to buy some breeders from u. How about visiting u?

To the many guys who have pm'd me regarding breeding frogs; if you are sure want some, please let me know how many pairs you would like, as we are now down to only around fifty pairs available to sell.

The book is copied for those that want it. Anyone always welcome here. Someone sent me the attached pic. Maybe another way to earn from frogs....lol...

Thanks for all the help Fruity. We really enjoyed our visit. Our tanks under construction.

The way I look at Frogs, they are an interesting way of making an extra income, without the need for BIG investment. The book and articles you gave us are great, so the wife tells me. Wish I could read Thai Thanks again.

[fruity]

hello fruity seems like u got this graft sown up,im realy interested im in the uk just now but comin over end of feb, would be great to come an see u an have a chat about it an hopefully grab some breeding pairs from u if that would be ok with u?

cheers deano...

You are more than welcome Deano:)

Fruity I would like to get copy of the booklet also would like to buy some breeders from u. How about visiting u?

To the many guys who have pm'd me regarding breeding frogs; if you are sure want some, please let me know how many pairs you would like, as we are now down to only around fifty pairs available to sell.

The book is copied for those that want it. Anyone always welcome here. Someone sent me the attached pic. Maybe another way to earn from frogs....lol...

Thanks for all the help Fruity. We really enjoyed our visit. Our tanks under construction.

The way I look at Frogs, they are an interesting way of making an extra income, without the need for BIG investment. The book and articles you gave us are great, so the wife tells me. Wish I could read Thai Thanks again.

I agree, Frogs are very interesting & for someone like myself who likes to see livestock doing well, i.e. growing fast, they are satisfying.

There are people who make Frogs their entire livelihood, some very big set ups. One of the articles we photocopied tells of one farm who shifts 2 tonnes of frogs every month. Thats not small scale!

Any more who would like the book, just pm me your address.

[teletiger]

for someone like myself who likes to see livestock doing well,

My first gut wrenching experience in thailand was going to Klong Toey market at 5 a.m. to be confronted with a metre high pyramid of (still) live, skinned frogs, all on their backs, doing the tango. Fortunately, other experiences in Thailand have brought the memory into context. (fancy sticking another pig vicar?)

I hear from New Holland that frogs are all the rage now. Gonna make us all sqillionaires. Well....I'm all for that.....On the beach in Patters, sipping martinis, in my frog-skin speedos....if I don't croak first of course.

Regards

[simon43]

Just out of interest, although you sell these frogs live, how are they normally killed? (apart from skinning them alive as Teletiger mentions!).

My ex buys live frogs from the local market and I think the cook just wacks them on the head....

Commenting about what part of the frog is eaten, here's a little story:

The very first time that I visited the family village in deepest Issan, they had no idea what to feed a farang! So they chose to BBQ frogs for me. That was fine and I was happily sitting on the ground eating the frog's legs until my ex's mother whispered to me (via translation), 'the crunchy heads and eyes are the best bit!!'

Since that date, this old woman was convinced that I only visited the village to taste the crunchy frog's head/eyes that she especially prepared for me...

I think that must the real reason be why I got divorced

Simon

[fruity]

Just out of interest, although you sell these frogs live, how are they normally killed? (apart from skinning them alive as Teletiger mentions!).

My ex buys live frogs from the local market and I think the cook just wacks them on the head....

Commenting about what part of the frog is eaten, here's a little story:

The very first time that I visited the family village in deepest Issan, they had no idea what to feed a farang! So they chose to BBQ frogs for me. That was fine and I was happily sitting on the ground eating the frog's legs until my ex's mother whispered to me (via translation), 'the crunchy heads and eyes are the best bit!!'

Since that date, this old woman was convinced that I only visited the village to taste the crunchy frog's head/eyes that she especially prepared for me...

I think that must the real reason be why I got divorced

Simon

I am sure teletiger is mistaken! .... A metre high pyramid of still alive skinned frogs!......How long do you think a frog or anything else for that matter would live after being skinned alive?............It wouldn't last as long as it took to finish the skinning. I ask myself why would they skin them anyway? All meat is best cooked in the skin, I doubt frog is different?

I am not in the frog killing business, they go away from here alive; the exceptions being any my wifes parents eat & I don't how they dispatch those? I always assumed it was a whack to the head or by sticking. I'll enquire:)

[teletiger]

Welllll.....I'm pretty sure I know what a frog looks like. And yes, most of them were moving. Just the skin left on their head and feet. I may have overdone it with the "metre". But over 60 cms for sure. Go look for yourself. In the section where they sell all the insects, grubs and other such delicious fare.

Regards.

[slapout]

I have hunted,cleaned, and deep fried bullfrogs since being knee high to a pup. If not whacked and killed they can live quite a while after skinning, granted they do become kind of lifeless after skinning alive. We killed them, skinned, breaded the various pieces and deep fried. Cut tendons of legs prior to frying or the legs tend to hop around. Thai style cooking with skin on does not sound real whoopee to me, but then I will not eat their small frogs the way they prepare them. Tried them but no thank you, I want real bull frog legs.

[Isee]

Hi fruity,

Where have you sited your frog operation, I'm presuming close by the house to keep an eye on them so they don't disappear in the night, but the little buggers must make a bit of a racket at night which can't be good for you or your neighbours....

Cheers

[fruity]

Hi fruity,

Where have you sited your frog operation, I'm presuming close by the house to keep an eye on them so they don't disappear in the night, but the little buggers must make a bit of a racket at night which can't be good for you or your neighbours....

Cheers

Teletiger, I stand corrected. Will take your word for it. Grizzley! ........Slapout, these are Bullfrogs, have some here a kilo-plus apiece.

Isee, The frogs are not noisey, seldom making any noise apart from when it rains, however, personally, I find it not an unpleasent thing. We don't have close neighbours, so no problem on that score. The frogs are kept in blue net enclosures in a pool which is only a few metres from the back of my house.

It is not wise to keep young frogs in an area away from the homestead. We sold one guy a thousand youungsters, he put them in a net enclosure in a pool in his rice field, where they were all gobbled up by the Storks in a day or two:)

[Foreverford]

Hi fruity,

Where have you sited your frog operation, I'm presuming close by the house to keep an eye on them so they don't disappear in the night, but the little buggers must make a bit of a racket at night which can't be good for you or your neighbours....

Cheers

Teletiger, I stand corrected. Will take your word for it. Grizzley! ........Slapout, these are Bullfrogs, have some here a kilo-plus apiece.

Isee, The frogs are not noisey, seldom making any noise apart from when it rains, however, personally, I find it not an unpleasent thing. We don't have close neighbours, so no problem on that score. The frogs are kept in blue net enclosures in a pool which is only a few metres from the back of my house.

It is not wise to keep young frogs in an area away from the homestead. We sold one guy a thousand youungsters, he put them in a net enclosure in a pool in his rice field, where they were all gobbled up by the Storks in a day or two:)

Well fruity toot toot. How doody doo? Just finished a 12 day marathon on the farm (more in another post)but didn't have time to stop by. Here's the Frog Report hope it helps others. We had your frogs we bought in the three pens you saw when you came by just like yours the ones you can buy pre-made. But I told the wife the only money in farming is in real estate values and convinced her to go into the condo market and we started building condos instead. Very easy process. Went and purchased 8 200 liter blue plastic food grade barrels and got out the machete and started cutting down bamboo. Made a couple of 15 meter long runner poles and lashed four of the barrels to them and floated it in the pond. This bamboo was about 4" in diameter and every couple of meters we lashed (with about 1/4 inch nylon rope) cross members (about 8 of the same 4" size bamboo) that were about the length of the barrels to keep it all rigid and evenly spaced (sort of looking like a ladder tied to the floating barrels but with the rungs on top instead of between). We then took and made 7 outriggers ( 14 big long pieces 2" to 3" diameter lashed perpendicular to the two original main runners) that extended 3 meters outside the runners and barrels on each side. At the end of these extensions we ran 1" pieces perpendicular and lashed it all together. In each corner we lashed on another barrlel (4 more barrels) for this giant condo project. Think of a catamaran, and this created 12 large rectangular sections (we also lashed another 1" piece parrallel to the runners on the 7 outriggers about a foot from the runners to complete the rectangular square to tie on the nets. Final step to the super structure was to build a walking platform by lashing together a bunch of 1 1/2" stuff to make a 15 meter by 80cm platform and rolled it onto the top of the cross members and lashed it all together. By spacing things correctly we created about six inch square openings in each of the corners of the walking part of the structure (using the runners the outriggers and the cross members) and then placed four 4" diameter, at the bottom, and cut to a point, eucalyptus poles, about 4 meters long and pounded them into the pond vertically to allow the entire thing to rise and fall as the water doesand not float around wildly. Had the wife and her sister stich up the nets and shazam it was frog condos. Almost! I decided that they needed tops on them so I showed the girls how to make the sewwing machine fly and stiched a roll of wide blue netting to the end of each net and then left a space of about 6 inches and then stiched another net on. That created a top that covered the entire one side, 6 nets. We hand stiched with heavy cord and a BIG rice bag needle the nets to the bambboo rectangles asnd bingo bango bongo condos for the masses.

The finishing touch was to stich the tops to a couple of long 1" (lashed together to make 15 meters) bamboo where the tops (tops originally stiched in the house to the outside edge of the nets) covered the nets next to the runners so you can easily raise the tops and prop them up with a couple of short sticks. It was all tight as a drum and you know that that farm is about a couple of kilometers from the house but with the top on it there is no way any birds can get in. I also designed it so you can't get on from the ground around the pond unless you have a gangway plank to place on to the walkway (to keep out the other two footed predators that are always a problem on Thai farms (and Mexico and and and). Strategically placed barbed wire below water level will greet any other thieves that are of the more persistant variety (just like net throwers in your remote fish ponds).

Anyway anyone can do this as bambbo can be purchased for next to nothing if you don't have any growing and the nets can be purchased already made as you and the wife did originally and just build the structure to the net size. It is easy to attach with nylon cord and the rice needles and a sewing machine isn't necessary at all.

I'm sure I've confused the heck out of everyone but this does allow remote frog raising without worrying about predators and allows you to get your young into a large body of water (if you have it). It is very light weight and this allows the barrels to keep it all well above (nearly a half meter) water level. My wife smuggled out about a dozen of the "eaters" i earlier bought from you before they could be munched and lucky she did as i have had a few since. Amazingly while we were building, one of the family got a very very big wild frog of the best tasting variety in Issan so we had a "bar b que off" that night with both of them cooked together with nothing but a bit of salt. Man that wild one was sweet and juicy tasting, very very delicious but then we had a "Fruity Special" and there was no comparison as the juice almost popped out of your mouth and the meat was as tender as could be and two times more flavorable. three of us did the taste off and no question these babies are far far superior to anything they have ever tasted around here.

I have to say thank you thank you thank you again as this has really pulled the family together and given them a great project that they can persue year round. Pops is complaining (only once) asking what in the heck are we going to do with all these frogs when and if this works out. I laughed and said I hope it is a really really big problem and we would manage and told them the cost of an average size one for dinner in Paris, France. Hey that gives me an idea if you take bamboo and lash it together get some small nylon rope and hook up about a dozen or so frogs to it how long would it take to get them to haul themselves to market. Heck it would float halfway to France anyway. I get back to you something a bit more detailed and longetr than this when i get it all figure out. Give the wife a big hug from me and kiss that beautiful sow of yours on the nose for me also. peace and a lotta love me

[basjke]

Thanks fruity , will surely give you a visit once i finish my concrete tanks . A few breading pairs is a must ok ?

OK:)....As I said earlier, we'll be sorting them out soon. More than welcome to visit when your ready.

What is the cost of a pair of breeding frogs also how many would you recommend to start up to make it viable?

The frogs are my wifes really; she wants B500 for a breeding pair, which isn't expensive. We have paid B1500 for pairs in the past.

Depending on how many frogs you want to rear, I would recommend ten pairs of breeders, each female will lay literally thousands of eggs, between 7-10,000. If you get a 30% hatching rate, which is average, that should give you 25-30,000 tapdoles / 20-25,000 froglets. Even if you were to sell off the baby frogs at the going rate of 2 baht apiece, you would be well ahead of the game, much more money if you reared the frogs on to marketable size, which should take no more than four months. You then should have one hel_l of a lot of kilos to sell at no less than 80 baht per kilo wholesale, 130 retail.

Let me see if I understand this and have my math correct:

You buy a breeding pair for avg 1000 baht.... One breeding pair produces approx 2400 frogs. (8,000 avg eggs with 30% being hatched). You feed these fogs for four months with little work involved and each frog will grow to being about 1/2 kg (or less).... So total after four months you have approx. 600-800 kg of mature frogs. Selling them for 80B/kg (appears that this may be the low end depending on your initiative) you will gross approx 48kB - 64kB..... This makes a net of 47-63kB minus the food and just for using one breeding pair. (Of course you will have to first provide the expenses of setting up your ponds/environment). So if one was to have 10 breeding pairs with the same above success rate the gross return would be approx: 470-630kB.....not bad for 4 months.....actually probably (sounds like) easier work and better return than rice farming in Issan.

Now I am wondering a few things:

1) How much is an estimated cost to feed 1 breeding pair and all siblings for four months (until the siblings get to market size)?

2) Why isn't everyone a frog farmer if it appears this easy?

3) Are there diseases or plagues that hit frogs that could wipe out your entire population?

4) How is theft handled?

5) What are really the downsides to frog farming in Issan?

I am currently living in CM but my wife is from Surin (Prasat) and we currently have a place there as well as land where we plan on building a house and having a small farm of some sort. Even though we own a store in Prasat (unestablished business at this time) I am looking for means of some hobby/supplemental income when I go to retire there within the next 5 years. I have other ideas in mind but this frog farming has gotten me very curious. I am interested in learning more to see what go I could make of this.

By the way, while growing up in Ohio (USA) my father was an avid outdoors man. We would go gigging bullfrogs on the creeks and rivers there. Of course we only ate the frog legs as the rest of the frog didn't provide much meat. I can remember as a kid growing up where dad took pictures of some of the legs (only legs) of these monster bullfrogs and they would be as long (stretched out) as a long-neck beer bottle. And they delicious.... I am wondering how bull frog tastes in LOS? The only frog I have eaten here (and only twice) was pitiful as one time it appeared the whole frog (bones and all) were ground up with the meat.... And for the other time the size of the frog legs I had here in LOS were no bigger than a pair of normal nail clippers....

Perhaps I made all of this sound just too easy? It certainly isn't rocket science, however, without a decent set up & some basic knowledge & husbandry skills the novice would never breed any froglets. Of course there are pitfalls & disease to contend with as there are with any livestock. Frogs are cannabilistic, start with 2,000 froglets, leave unsorted & you will be lucky to end up with a fifth of that number, similarly, overfeed & they will simply 'burst' frogs, seemingly don't have a cut off point, they apparantly don't know when they are full. So many pro's & cons.

Fruity,

I'm reading this topic with much interest at the moment as I want to help some long time thai friend out of her financial troubles.And as I know she has access to the use of some expanded farmland in isaan this might be an idea to get her back with her feet on the ground with a little financial help.However I am a skeptical in many way i'm always in for good ideas,and I'm starting to get convinced that this might an be interesting.

Can you please provide an answer to question 1 and 5 from dingdongrob's post.

[fruity]

Hi fruity,

Where have you sited your frog operation, I'm presuming close by the house to keep an eye on them so they don't disappear in the night, but the little buggers must make a bit of a racket at night which can't be good for you or your neighbours....

Cheers

Teletiger, I stand corrected. Will take your word for it. Grizzley! ........Slapout, these are Bullfrogs, have some here a kilo-plus apiece.

Isee, The frogs are not noisey, seldom making any noise apart from when it rains, however, personally, I find it not an unpleasent thing. We don't have close neighbours, so no problem on that score. The frogs are kept in blue net enclosures in a pool which is only a few metres from the back of my house.

It is not wise to keep young frogs in an area away from the homestead. We sold one guy a thousand youungsters, he put them in a net enclosure in a pool in his rice field, where they were all gobbled up by the Storks in a day or two:)

Well fruity toot toot. How doody doo? Just finished a 12 day marathon on the farm (more in another post)but didn't have time to stop by. Here's the Frog Report hope it helps others. We had your frogs we bought in the three pens you saw when you came by just like yours the ones you can buy pre-made. But I told the wife the only money in farming is in real estate values and convinced her to go into the condo market and we started building condos instead. Very easy process. Went and purchased 8 200 liter blue plastic food grade barrels and got out the machete and started cutting down bamboo. Made a couple of 15 meter long runner poles and lashed four of the barrels to them and floated it in the pond. This bamboo was about 4" in diameter and every couple of meters we lashed (with about 1/4 inch nylon rope) cross members (about 8 of the same 4" size bamboo) that were about the length of the barrels to keep it all rigid and evenly spaced (sort of looking like a ladder tied to the floating barrels but with the rungs on top instead of between). We then took and made 7 outriggers ( 14 big long pieces 2" to 3" diameter lashed perpendicular to the two original main runners) that extended 3 meters outside the runners and barrels on each side. At the end of these extensions we ran 1" pieces perpendicular and lashed it all together. In each corner we lashed on another barrlel (4 more barrels) for this giant condo project. Think of a catamaran, and this created 12 large rectangular sections (we also lashed another 1" piece parrallel to the runners on the 7 outriggers about a foot from the runners to complete the rectangular square to tie on the nets. Final step to the super structure was to build a walking platform by lashing together a bunch of 1 1/2" stuff to make a 15 meter by 80cm platform and rolled it onto the top of the cross members and lashed it all together. By spacing things correctly we created about six inch square openings in each of the corners of the walking part of the structure (using the runners the outriggers and the cross members) and then placed four 4" diameter, at the bottom, and cut to a point, eucalyptus poles, about 4 meters long and pounded them into the pond vertically to allow the entire thing to rise and fall as the water doesand not float around wildly. Had the wife and her sister stich up the nets and shazam it was frog condos. Almost! I decided that they needed tops on them so I showed the girls how to make the sewwing machine fly and stiched a roll of wide blue netting to the end of each net and then left a space of about 6 inches and then stiched another net on. That created a top that covered the entire one side, 6 nets. We hand stiched with heavy cord and a BIG rice bag needle the nets to the bambboo rectangles asnd bingo bango bongo condos for the masses.

The finishing touch was to stich the tops to a couple of long 1" (lashed together to make 15 meters) bamboo where the tops (tops originally stiched in the house to the outside edge of the nets) covered the nets next to the runners so you can easily raise the tops and prop them up with a couple of short sticks. It was all tight as a drum and you know that that farm is about a couple of kilometers from the house but with the top on it there is no way any birds can get in. I also designed it so you can't get on from the ground around the pond unless you have a gangway plank to place on to the walkway (to keep out the other two footed predators that are always a problem on Thai farms (and Mexico and and and). Strategically placed barbed wire below water level will greet any other thieves that are of the more persistant variety (just like net throwers in your remote fish ponds).

Anyway anyone can do this as bambbo can be purchased for next to nothing if you don't have any growing and the nets can be purchased already made as you and the wife did originally and just build the structure to the net size. It is easy to attach with nylon cord and the rice needles and a sewing machine isn't necessary at all.

I'm sure I've confused the heck out of everyone but this does allow remote frog raising without worrying about predators and allows you to get your young into a large body of water (if you have it). It is very light weight and this allows the barrels to keep it all well above (nearly a half meter) water level. My wife smuggled out about a dozen of the "eaters" i earlier bought from you before they could be munched and lucky she did as i have had a few since. Amazingly while we were building, one of the family got a very very big wild frog of the best tasting variety in Issan so we had a "bar b que off" that night with both of them cooked together with nothing but a bit of salt. Man that wild one was sweet and juicy tasting, very very delicious but then we had a "Fruity Special" and there was no comparison as the juice almost popped out of your mouth and the meat was as tender as could be and two times more flavorable. three of us did the taste off and no question these babies are far far superior to anything they have ever tasted around here.

I have to say thank you thank you thank you again as this has really pulled the family together and given them a great project that they can persue year round. Pops is complaining (only once) asking what in the heck are we going to do with all these frogs when and if this works out. I laughed and said I hope it is a really really big problem and we would manage and told them the cost of an average size one for dinner in Paris, France. Hey that gives me an idea if you take bamboo and lash it together get some small nylon rope and hook up about a dozen or so frogs to it how long would it take to get them to haul themselves to market. Heck it would float halfway to France anyway. I get back to you something a bit more detailed and longetr than this when i get it all figure out. Give the wife a big hug from me and kiss that beautiful sow of yours on the nose for me also. peace and a lotta love me

Hey ForeverFord....Thanks for the update:) Sounds like you have built the Hilton hotel for frogs out there:) Next time you are up this way let me know & we'll drop over, be good to see you & your lovely wife again. What did you pay for the plastic drums?

My wife tells me some of your frogs developed an eye problem. Did it clear with the antibiotics?

All the very best

[fruity]

Thanks fruity , will surely give you a visit once i finish my concrete tanks . A few breading pairs is a must ok ?

OK:)....As I said earlier, we'll be sorting them out soon. More than welcome to visit when your ready.

What is the cost of a pair of breeding frogs also how many would you recommend to start up to make it viable?

The frogs are my wifes really; she wants B500 for a breeding pair, which isn't expensive. We have paid B1500 for pairs in the past.

Depending on how many frogs you want to rear, I would recommend ten pairs of breeders, each female will lay literally thousands of eggs, between 7-10,000. If you get a 30% hatching rate, which is average, that should give you 25-30,000 tapdoles / 20-25,000 froglets. Even if you were to sell off the baby frogs at the going rate of 2 baht apiece, you would be well ahead of the game, much more money if you reared the frogs on to marketable size, which should take no more than four months. You then should have one hel_l of a lot of kilos to sell at no less than 80 baht per kilo wholesale, 130 retail.

Let me see if I understand this and have my math correct:

You buy a breeding pair for avg 1000 baht.... One breeding pair produces approx 2400 frogs. (8,000 avg eggs with 30% being hatched). You feed these fogs for four months with little work involved and each frog will grow to being about 1/2 kg (or less).... So total after four months you have approx. 600-800 kg of mature frogs. Selling them for 80B/kg (appears that this may be the low end depending on your initiative) you will gross approx 48kB - 64kB..... This makes a net of 47-63kB minus the food and just for using one breeding pair. (Of course you will have to first provide the expenses of setting up your ponds/environment). So if one was to have 10 breeding pairs with the same above success rate the gross return would be approx: 470-630kB.....not bad for 4 months.....actually probably (sounds like) easier work and better return than rice farming in Issan.

Now I am wondering a few things:

1) How much is an estimated cost to feed 1 breeding pair and all siblings for four months (until the siblings get to market size)?

2) Why isn't everyone a frog farmer if it appears this easy?

3) Are there diseases or plagues that hit frogs that could wipe out your entire population?

4) How is theft handled?

5) What are really the downsides to frog farming in Issan?

I am currently living in CM but my wife is from Surin (Prasat) and we currently have a place there as well as land where we plan on building a house and having a small farm of some sort. Even though we own a store in Prasat (unestablished business at this time) I am looking for means of some hobby/supplemental income when I go to retire there within the next 5 years. I have other ideas in mind but this frog farming has gotten me very curious. I am interested in learning more to see what go I could make of this.

By the way, while growing up in Ohio (USA) my father was an avid outdoors man. We would go gigging bullfrogs on the creeks and rivers there. Of course we only ate the frog legs as the rest of the frog didn't provide much meat. I can remember as a kid growing up where dad took pictures of some of the legs (only legs) of these monster bullfrogs and they would be as long (stretched out) as a long-neck beer bottle. And they delicious.... I am wondering how bull frog tastes in LOS? The only frog I have eaten here (and only twice) was pitiful as one time it appeared the whole frog (bones and all) were ground up with the meat.... And for the other time the size of the frog legs I had here in LOS were no bigger than a pair of normal nail clippers....

Perhaps I made all of this sound just too easy? It certainly isn't rocket science, however, without a decent set up & some basic knowledge & husbandry skills the novice would never breed any froglets. Of course there are pitfalls & disease to contend with as there are with any livestock. Frogs are cannabilistic, start with 2,000 froglets, leave unsorted & you will be lucky to end up with a fifth of that number, similarly, overfeed & they will simply 'burst' frogs, seemingly don't have a cut off point, they apparantly don't know when they are full. So many pro's & cons.

Fruity,

I'm reading this topic with much interest at the moment as I want to help some long time thai friend out of her financial troubles.And as I know she has access to the use of some expanded farmland in isaan this might be an idea to get her back with her feet on the ground with a little financial help.However I am a skeptical in many way i'm always in for good ideas,and I'm starting to get convinced that this might an be interesting.

Can you please provide an answer to question 1 and 5 from dingdongrob's post.

Hi..In answer to question 1; Basically, How long is a piece of string?.....so many variables, however, we are talking very small money. An adult pair eats less each day than one growing Pladuk (catfish) Depending on the number of hatchlings per brood, the feed amount varies. We have a steady population here of around a hundred pairs, plus followers, if we use one 20kg bag of feed per week we are going some. If someone had ten pairs which bred fairly successfully a bag of feed would last a good long time. Remember, younger groing frogs eat a slightly smaller, higher protein pellet, so when I say one bag / week, we would actually say, use half a bag of each approx.

In answer to question 2; Downsides? There really are none! Frogs are very easy from a husbandry perspective; like most things it boils down to common sense, providing the right conditions & off you go. One thing I would say before deciding to grow frogs is to check around your district making sure there is a market. There are some areas throughout the country where frogs aren't so popular, so best to check this out. Where I am, they prefer frog to chicken & pork:)

If you would like to pm an address, I'll send some literature (in Thai) so your friend could read up a bit & see if it would suit her.

Frogs are basically whatever you want to make of them. There are people running big operations, making by Thai standards sizeable incomes, others, keeping a few for their own consumption. I contend, Frogs are easy & profitable.

[basjke]

Thanks for your reply fruity.I see you feed them 2 different kind of pellets.Can you tell us how much each of those 20 kg bags will cost?

[fruity]

Thanks for your reply fruity.I see you feed them 2 different kind of pellets.Can you tell us how much each of those 20 kg bags will cost?

My wifes department, however, from memory, I am sure the adult pellets run at around 400-420 baht per 20kg bag, the smaller pellets for youngsters are slightly more expensive, not sure, but maybe 40-50 baht / bag more.

[Foreverford]

Hi fruity,

Where have you sited your frog operation, I'm presuming close by the house to keep an eye on them so they don't disappear in the night, but the little buggers must make a bit of a racket at night which can't be good for you or your neighbours....

Cheers

Teletiger, I stand corrected. Will take your word for it. Grizzley! ........Slapout, these are Bullfrogs, have some here a kilo-plus apiece.

Isee, The frogs are not noisey, seldom making any noise apart from when it rains, however, personally, I find it not an unpleasent thing. We don't have close neighbours, so no problem on that score. The frogs are kept in blue net enclosures in a pool which is only a few metres from the back of my house.

It is not wise to keep young frogs in an area away from the homestead. We sold one guy a thousand youungsters, he put them in a net enclosure in a pool in his rice field, where they were all gobbled up by the Storks in a day or two:)

Well fruity toot toot. How doody doo? Just finished a 12 day marathon on the farm (more in another post)but didn't have time to stop by. Here's the Frog Report hope it helps others. We had your frogs we bought in the three pens you saw when you came by just like yours the ones you can buy pre-made. But I told the wife the only money in farming is in real estate values and convinced her to go into the condo market and we started building condos instead. Very easy process. Went and purchased 8 200 liter blue plastic food grade barrels and got out the machete and started cutting down bamboo. Made a couple of 15 meter long runner poles and lashed four of the barrels to them and floated it in the pond. This bamboo was about 4" in diameter and every couple of meters we lashed (with about 1/4 inch nylon rope) cross members (about 8 of the same 4" size bamboo) that were about the length of the barrels to keep it all rigid and evenly spaced (sort of looking like a ladder tied to the floating barrels but with the rungs on top instead of between). We then took and made 7 outriggers ( 14 big long pieces 2" to 3" diameter lashed perpendicular to the two original main runners) that extended 3 meters outside the runners and barrels on each side. At the end of these extensions we ran 1" pieces perpendicular and lashed it all together. In each corner we lashed on another barrlel (4 more barrels) for this giant condo project. Think of a catamaran, and this created 12 large rectangular sections (we also lashed another 1" piece parrallel to the runners on the 7 outriggers about a foot from the runners to complete the rectangular square to tie on the nets. Final step to the super structure was to build a walking platform by lashing together a bunch of 1 1/2" stuff to make a 15 meter by 80cm platform and rolled it onto the top of the cross members and lashed it all together. By spacing things correctly we created about six inch square openings in each of the corners of the walking part of the structure (using the runners the outriggers and the cross members) and then placed four 4" diameter, at the bottom, and cut to a point, eucalyptus poles, about 4 meters long and pounded them into the pond vertically to allow the entire thing to rise and fall as the water doesand not float around wildly. Had the wife and her sister stich up the nets and shazam it was frog condos. Almost! I decided that they needed tops on them so I showed the girls how to make the sewwing machine fly and stiched a roll of wide blue netting to the end of each net and then left a space of about 6 inches and then stiched another net on. That created a top that covered the entire one side, 6 nets. We hand stiched with heavy cord and a BIG rice bag needle the nets to the bambboo rectangles asnd bingo bango bongo condos for the masses.

The finishing touch was to stich the tops to a couple of long 1" (lashed together to make 15 meters) bamboo where the tops (tops originally stiched in the house to the outside edge of the nets) covered the nets next to the runners so you can easily raise the tops and prop them up with a couple of short sticks. It was all tight as a drum and you know that that farm is about a couple of kilometers from the house but with the top on it there is no way any birds can get in. I also designed it so you can't get on from the ground around the pond unless you have a gangway plank to place on to the walkway (to keep out the other two footed predators that are always a problem on Thai farms (and Mexico and and and). Strategically placed barbed wire below water level will greet any other thieves that are of the more persistant variety (just like net throwers in your remote fish ponds).

Anyway anyone can do this as bambbo can be purchased for next to nothing if you don't have any growing and the nets can be purchased already made as you and the wife did originally and just build the structure to the net size. It is easy to attach with nylon cord and the rice needles and a sewing machine isn't necessary at all.

I'm sure I've confused the heck out of everyone but this does allow remote frog raising without worrying about predators and allows you to get your young into a large body of water (if you have it). It is very light weight and this allows the barrels to keep it all well above (nearly a half meter) water level. My wife smuggled out about a dozen of the "eaters" i earlier bought from you before they could be munched and lucky she did as i have had a few since. Amazingly while we were building, one of the family got a very very big wild frog of the best tasting variety in Issan so we had a "bar b que off" that night with both of them cooked together with nothing but a bit of salt. Man that wild one was sweet and juicy tasting, very very delicious but then we had a "Fruity Special" and there was no comparison as the juice almost popped out of your mouth and the meat was as tender as could be and two times more flavorable. three of us did the taste off and no question these babies are far far superior to anything they have ever tasted around here.

I have to say thank you thank you thank you again as this has really pulled the family together and given them a great project that they can persue year round. Pops is complaining (only once) asking what in the heck are we going to do with all these frogs when and if this works out. I laughed and said I hope it is a really really big problem and we would manage and told them the cost of an average size one for dinner in Paris, France. Hey that gives me an idea if you take bamboo and lash it together get some small nylon rope and hook up about a dozen or so frogs to it how long would it take to get them to haul themselves to market. Heck it would float halfway to France anyway. I get back to you something a bit more detailed and longetr than this when i get it all figure out. Give the wife a big hug from me and kiss that beautiful sow of yours on the nose for me also. peace and a lotta love me

Hey ForeverFord....Thanks for the update:) Sounds like you have built the Hilton hotel for frogs out there:) Next time you are up this way let me know & we'll drop over, be good to see you & your lovely wife again. What did you pay for the plastic drums?

My wife tells me some of your frogs developed an eye problem. Did it clear with the antibiotics?

All the very best

Barrels were 500 and 520 baht (520's were the best because they had a firm extended ridge at both ends as opposed to the others that only had it on the top and this allowed for easier tying of the rope). Only one male had an eye infection and since I wasn't around and medication was 30 kilometers away he din't get any internal or external antibiotics until I arrived and when he was pulled (they didn't isolate him) from the nets the eye looked so bad that my wife said "give him the gun" and was I glad as he made a great test subject for the great "bar-b-que cook off". I have never tasted a frog so delicious sweet and juicy and he was just an average sized one. I hope to build another Hilton Condotel in the 2nd pond just to try to create two ecosystems in case of any kind of water disease problems as I feel the more diversity in raising them the better. I will definitely be in touch the next time around but this was a whirlwind two weeks of non-stop no time to breath sunrise to sunset and i was stupid enough to not think that you could have come my way (probably that love affair I have with your sow and me wanting to see her) to check out our construction project, I think you might have been impressed. We got the barrels in Nong Rong but I'm sure you'd be going to Buri Ram for them. I'm alsdo going to check prices around Hua Hin just to compare. Wish us luck as Asean is going to be in town and they are starting to get crazy around here hopefully it will chase me back to farm and get me to rebuild the fuel injection pump that is leaking on the Ford. Boy do I have a blog about that but don't know if I have it in me to put it down today. It's a great one I think I'll label it "it's so good it has to be illegal". choke Dee me

[hunglikea]

Fruity we have been thinking about entering the Frog farming biz but have just noticed there is a worldwide disease affecting all amphibians especially frogs, it is chytrid fungus. First identified just over a decade ago, the fungus (Batrachochytrium dendrobatidis) has spread through hundreds of amphibian species on different continents. It sweeps some to extinction in a matter of months, while others are apparently immune.

Have you any problem with it or knowledge about it?

[Ullini]

Hi Fruity

I will be in Kornburi from the 9 till the 19th. I like to visit you and buy some frog pairs from you.

May i come and visit? Can you let me know the address?

[pderrick28]

Two of my wifes cousins have asked her if she wants to invest in a 1/3rd share of a frog farm they are going to set up , nothing to do with me wife has her own money and she can spend and invest where she sees fit .

Basicly the two cousins have 4 fish ponds about a metre deep that they breed and rear fish that they then sell in the market they seem to do ok with the fish and they now want to set up a frog farm .

I did not know that frog farms existed in isaan until the wife mentioned it but have now seen them being sold in the local market near where we live .

By reading this site i see you guys are involved in many parts of farming anyone know anything about setting up cost of producing frogs and upside / downside risk rewards ?

JB

Hi Joe,

We set up at the beginning of this year, after visiting a few farms & gathering information. All I can say is, so far, so good:)

We have only reared in concrete tanks we constructed, approx 3 by 4 metres each, however, I intend utilising a couple of our pools for next years season.

Firstly; I have never seen anything with such a fast growth rate. My initial thoughts have been confirmed thus far, i.e. Frogs eat less are therefore much cheaper to rear than Pladuk, they are fed on the same food, eat much less of it, grow amazingly fast & most importantly sell for much more money.

Makro even sells frogs....lol....135 baht/kilo.

I really don't think your wife can lose, if her relatives do things properly, they will do well.

We purchased eight breeding pairs, all our original stock came from these; a female lays many thousands of eggs, a good percentage of which will hatch into tadpoles/grow quickly into frogs. In some parts of Thailand where frog farms are scarce, I've heard prices upto 300 baht/kilo retail mentioned. There is seemingly a very healthy market for these frogs. We have wholesaled all we have sold so far to one guy @ 80 baht/kilo. I am rearing on & will sort later many more breeding pairs for next year.

[canuckamuck]

My wife and I are very interested in starting a small frog farm. We were hoping to get some info from Fruity but so far we haven't heard back. Does anybody else out there have frogs from Fruity. I ask this because they seem to be very high quality (big and tasty). I would like to get at least one breeding pair. Also I was wondering if frog farming is seasonal, and if it is, is it too late for this year to get any offspring, and when is the breeding season?

Any info would be appreciated.

[Isee]

Has anyone wondered why the frogs at the markets don't jump out of the bucket?

[hunglikea]

Has anyone wondered why the frogs at the markets don't jump out of the bucket?

OK I've bitten, why don't they?

Maybe, just maybe, because they are strung together with a net over the bucket.

Your answer may be more intriguing though.

I tried 'fruity' a while back asking if he'd had any problems with the disease that was going around but never heard back. Maybe they all died?

[Pond Life]

We ate some of our frogs for the first time yesterday.

The Thai's had it chopped up & curried & I BBQ'd a couple.

The ones on the BBQ were a bit tough, but tasty, will try frying next time.

Can anyone suggest a quick & humane way to kill them ?

I whacked them in the head with a big stick like I do to fish.

But it was not very effective & had to bash some of them several times.

[slapout]

we used a ice pick thru the head, this method, if done on a wooden plank/tree is a good anchor in skinning. A incision around the neck in front of the front legs, pliers to pull the skin off and your ready to gut , cut up, wash and cook.

[Pond Life]

Slapout,

Sounds like a good way to skin them,

but does it kill them quick ?

Seems to me trying to hit a frog sized brain with an ice pick could be difficult

[SpeedTriple]

Any updates from Fruity or anyone who tried this?

The whole thread seems to have disappeared.

I am very interested in setting up a vermi/aquaponics system when I come back to TL (surin - prasat) in Feb 2010.

Would love to know how you guys got on with the frogs, seems like a very nice way to supplement diet/income.

Rich.

[Pond Life]

I dont know about worms but they love to eat snails.

I'm thinking snails would be very easy to raise.

[billd766]

Any updates from Fruity or anyone who tried this?

The whole thread seems to have disappeared.

I am very interested in setting up a vermi/aquaponics system when I come back to TL (surin - prasat) in Feb 2010.

Would love to know how you guys got on with the frogs, seems like a very nice way to supplement diet/income.

Rich.

I am also interested in frog farming and downloaded/copied the whole thread but as you and other posters have noted, Fruity does not seem to be around any more since about March.

Could the mods assist on his whereabouts or if he is still a member of TV?

[Isan999]

Somebody know where i can bye breeding pair near Surin for my Thai family