Body Building

[DLock]

DLock - My partner is 170 cms height and his weight is 74 kilo, he will be fighting in the Kung <deleted> Championships at the Ambassador Hotel Pattaya on the 29th & 30th of this month. All are welcome to go and the tickets is 3000 bt per person for two days, will be a good couple of days - Fighters coming from Worldwide. (World Kumite Organization)

Pattaya_Girl, thats 162lbs, so I was pretty close and thats where I guessed an athlete at his level needs to be, and would expect him to be very low body fat to be competitive. That's very impressive and I'm sure he trains hard and diets carefully. Keep in mind that I would expect a number of his opponents to be on steroids or hGH, but I doubt you will ever be aware of it - as it's not excessive and probably not steroids that will bulk up too much.

My only comment is that we are talking very different levels of muscularity...and he is an extreme athlete and not indicative of someone who would benefit from steroids or HRT. He's doing great on his own, albeit not the size I would feel comfortable at.

So, I understand why you post the way you do.

Good luck in his fight...post his results.

[pattaya_girl]

Thankyou DLock, i will sure post the outcome after the fights.

[tropo]

Hey come on people,,,,calm down.

We all know its whats in the heart thats important innit?

People come in all sorts of packages ( ),,If we all got excited for the same look we would all come in the same package together...(oh god what have I just said).

Some words of wisdom there.

The problem here is that this thread was titled "brainless steroid types" equating steroid use with brainless. One geriatric on here even equated steroid use with low education, low job prospects and complete losers.

The ironic thing is that I almost agreed with that while training natural for 3 decades before I experienced the benefits. Even if they do shorten life, I'd gladly trade some geriatric years at the sunset of life for some years of regained youth.

Another irony is that most die hard natural trainers would probably agree if they allowed themselves the experience of one short course.

[rixalex]

DLock - My partner is 170 cms height and his weight is 74 kilo, he will be fighting in the Kung <deleted> Championships at the Ambassador Hotel Pattaya on the 29th & 30th of this month. All are welcome to go and the tickets is 3000 bt per person for two days, will be a good couple of days - Fighters coming from Worldwide. (World Kumite Organization)

He's doing great on his own, albeit not the size I would feel comfortable at.

The guy is 170cms tall, so 74 kilos sounds pretty well proportioned to me, especially if he's all muscle. Dlock, if you were his height, what weight would you be comfortable at?

[DLock]

DLock - My partner is 170 cms height and his weight is 74 kilo, he will be fighting in the Kung <deleted> Championships at the Ambassador Hotel Pattaya on the 29th & 30th of this month. All are welcome to go and the tickets is 3000 bt per person for two days, will be a good couple of days - Fighters coming from Worldwide. (World Kumite Organization)

He's doing great on his own, albeit not the size I would feel comfortable at.

The guy is 170cms tall, so 74 kilos sounds pretty well proportioned to me, especially if he's all muscle. Dlock, if you were his height, what weight would you be comfortable at?

Rixalex, fair question.

I am 175cm and I am most comfortable at 220lbs (100kg). I don't consider that an extreme weight and any serious body builders wil probably laugh that someone so small is trying to defend steroid use. In fact,most people would not even think I use steroids.

Yes, 74kg at 170cm is well proportioned and I would think he has a body fat level less than 10%, so he'd look very good....but just not the look I like.

[rixalex]

DLock - My partner is 170 cms height and his weight is 74 kilo, he will be fighting in the Kung <deleted> Championships at the Ambassador Hotel Pattaya on the 29th & 30th of this month. All are welcome to go and the tickets is 3000 bt per person for two days, will be a good couple of days - Fighters coming from Worldwide. (World Kumite Organization)

He's doing great on his own, albeit not the size I would feel comfortable at.

The guy is 170cms tall, so 74 kilos sounds pretty well proportioned to me, especially if he's all muscle. Dlock, if you were his height, what weight would you be comfortable at?

Rixalex, fair question.

I am 175cm and I am most comfortable at 220lbs (100kg). I don't consider that an extreme weight and any serious body builders wil probably laugh that someone so small is trying to defend steroid use. In fact,most people would not even think I use steroids.

Yes, 74kg at 170cm is well proportioned and I would think he has a body fat level less than 10%, so he'd look very good....but just not the look I like.

Thanks Dlock, a fair answer.

It seems to me then that by your own admission, 170cm and 75kgs of muscle is a good shape to be in, and that he would look like a well proportioned, healthy, strong guy. Your taste however seems to favour that extreme and in my opinion unnatural look - muscles that are out of proportion to body size. Of course it's all subjective and if that's the shape that makes you happy, so be it. I guess the only downside is that people judge people who look the way you do, as being conceited and vain, but this obviously doesn't bother you and anyway you pass it off as being jealousy. You're right, they probably are jealous to some degree, just as you are probably vain.

[DLock]

DLock - My partner is 170 cms height and his weight is 74 kilo, he will be fighting in the Kung <deleted> Championships at the Ambassador Hotel Pattaya on the 29th & 30th of this month. All are welcome to go and the tickets is 3000 bt per person for two days, will be a good couple of days - Fighters coming from Worldwide. (World Kumite Organization)

He's doing great on his own, albeit not the size I would feel comfortable at.

The guy is 170cms tall, so 74 kilos sounds pretty well proportioned to me, especially if he's all muscle. Dlock, if you were his height, what weight would you be comfortable at?

Rixalex, fair question.

I am 175cm and I am most comfortable at 220lbs (100kg). I don't consider that an extreme weight and any serious body builders wil probably laugh that someone so small is trying to defend steroid use. In fact,most people would not even think I use steroids.

Yes, 74kg at 170cm is well proportioned and I would think he has a body fat level less than 10%, so he'd look very good....but just not the look I like.

Thanks Dlock, a fair answer.

It seems to me then that by your own admission, 170cm and 75kgs of muscle is a good shape to be in, and that he would look like a well proportioned, healthy, strong guy. Your taste however seems to favour that extreme and in my opinion unnatural look - muscles that are out of proportion to body size. Of course it's all subjective and if that's the shape that makes you happy, so be it. I guess the only downside is that people judge people who look the way you do, as being conceited and vain, but this obviously doesn't bother you and anyway you pass it off as being jealousy. You're right, they probably are jealous to some degree, just as you are probably vain.

I don't really think about what other think to be honest. I get envious of guys with better physiques that me, so I think that is natural, but it motivates me, not make me try an rationalize why they are better. And vanity is definately why people try to improve themselves. Everyone wants to look good and feel better. I don't see anything wrong with that, as long as it's not taken too extremes.

Would I like to be bigger? Yes. But I don't have the genetics to get there and I'm not prepared to take the risks with my health to get there.

I think if people ask questions then this thread would have much more useful to a lot of people. Steroids are a very broad subject and very different things to different people. Guys like Tropo and Bobbin have been honest and up front. Whilst they know the risks, they have many years experience, have done the research and have taken the time to seek out medical advice. And both have experienced dramatic positive results...although Bobbin, I'd recommend adding some Anavar to that Andriol, but that's just me...and in looking at the survey on age of Thaivisa members, they could benefit a lot of people.

[poshthai]

For all the pumped up pattaya studs.

do you actualy inject these drugs,if so where do you inject,the leg,the stomach.sounds horrible to me,and i dont mean pain horrible i mean just plain horrible,sounds like junkies..

[poshthai]

THis sounds like the for and against smoking.some say its an addiction and some say its an uncontrolable drug.

ps,

i dont have to justify my 2 mates dying to you and to discuss the autopsy that showed both with enlarged hearts and the conditions of old men.

[bangkokrick]

For all the pumped up pattaya studs.

do you actualy inject these drugs,if so where do you inject,the leg,the stomach.sounds horrible to me,and i dont mean pain horrible i mean just plain horrible,sounds like junkies..

Not a Pattaya steroid type but you would normally inject the steroid into the buttocks or thighs. Large muscles!

Cheers, Rick

[poshthai]

thanks for that rick.do you inject because it gets into your system quicker.is there any pills on the market that do the same thing.i could ask a few <deleted> mates who sell the stuff but i dont trust them for a honest answer.

[bangkokrick]

thanks for that rick.do you inject because it gets into your system quicker.is there any pills on the market that do the same thing.i could ask a few <deleted> mates who sell the stuff but i dont trust them for a honest answer.

Yes you can get more into your system quicker and its also safer than taking them in tablet form because there is less chance of liver damage. There are many types of steroid that can be taken in tablet form. Dianabol being one of the most common.

Cheers, Rick

[poshthai]

Thanks rick,nice to chat with a sensible guy.

[bangkokrick]

Thanks rick,nice to chat with a sensible guy.

Its a pleasure. I just sent you a PM.

Cheers, Rick

[rixalex]

I don't really think about what other think to be honest. I get envious of guys with better physiques that me, so I think that is natural, but it motivates me, not make me try an rationalize why they are better. And vanity is definately why people try to improve themselves. Everyone wants to look good and feel better. I don't see anything wrong with that, as long as it's not taken too extremes.

Indeed, most things in life if taken to extremes are not healthy. I guess it depends on what you consider to be extreme.

One possible way of gauging how far you've taken it, could be how much of your time it is occupying. And could that time be better spent? If you spend 20 hours a week on trying to improve your physical appearance, do you consider that time well spent? How about if you divided that time with half in the gym and half in the library. Would that make you a more rounded and interesting individual?

Of course every one of us is guilty of spending too much time doing things that don't achieve a lot. Take watching TV for example. How many people would trade TV time with reading? Not many i guess. Wouldn't be a bad idea though would it.

Getting back to vanity driven activites... in terms of wasting time, i've always puzzled at the number of holiday makers who come away and spend the whole time lying on a beach, absolutely intent on getting some colour in their skin. They devote themselves to the activity for two weeks, then go back home, and a few weeks later they have returned to their natural colour. Funny old world we live in!

[DLock]

I don't really think about what other think to be honest. I get envious of guys with better physiques that me, so I think that is natural, but it motivates me, not make me try an rationalize why they are better. And vanity is definately why people try to improve themselves. Everyone wants to look good and feel better. I don't see anything wrong with that, as long as it's not taken too extremes.

Indeed, most things in life if taken to extremes are not healthy. I guess it depends on what you consider to be extreme.

One possible way of gauging how far you've taken it, could be how much of your time it is occupying. And could that time be better spent? If you spend 20 hours a week on trying to improve your physical appearance, do you consider that time well spent? How about if you divided that time with half in the gym and half in the library. Would that make you a more rounded and interesting individual?

Of course every one of us is guilty of spending too much time doing things that don't achieve a lot. Take watching TV for example. How many people would trade TV time with reading? Not many i guess. Wouldn't be a bad idea though would it.

Getting back to vanity driven activites... in terms of wasting time, i've always puzzled at the number of holiday makers who come away and spend the whole time lying on a beach, absolutely intent on getting some colour in their skin. They devote themselves to the activity for two weeks, then go back home, and a few weeks later they have returned to their natural colour. Funny old world we live in!

In terms of how much time in the gym, I spend 1 - 1.5 hours in the gym 5 days a week. Probably the same as anyone else, with each day being for a different body part(s). I also spend 30 minutes every second day either on a stationary bike, or actually riding my mountain bike.

The steroids really only help me recover quicker and synthesize protein more efficiently, which ultimately lets me work our harder and longer and lift heavier weights to grow faster.

So, I think I have a good balance of time. I don't watch TV and rarely go out.

I understand your question, but it might be a better question asked of people who spend 5 hours a day drinking in the bar, sleeping, or in front of the TV if their balance of life is ideal.

[DLock]

THis sounds like the for and against smoking.some say its an addiction and some say its an uncontrolable drug.

ps,

i dont have to justify my 2 mates dying to you and to discuss the autopsy that showed both with enlarged hearts and the conditions of old men.

Whilst I have stated again and again, steroids come with "potential" risks. No doubt about it. We know.

But just because a person who uses steroids dies, or kills somone or himself, it doesnt mean steroids were to blame.

And whilst steroid deaths happen, they are extremely rare and almost always invlove recreational drugs or diuretics. Diet can also play a part as can congenital and genetic heart defects. Not all bodybuilders do regular health checks because steroids are illegal in most countries and there is fear associated with telling the doctor the truth. Underground steroids, animal grade, fake and dirty steroids also figure into the mix of health problems that the outlaw of steroids have forced on people who want to use them.

Everone can find a death on Google that the media blame on steroids. Easy to do.

So, if in fact you had 2 friends die, it wasn't as a direct result of steroids, unless of course they were stupid and didn't know what they were doing or failed to get medical checks regularly. There are many reasons for enlarged hearts - blood pressure, diabetes, excess sodium, as well as recreational drugs, genetics and host of other health and consumption issues. To blame steroids alone for an enlarged heart is ignorant.

Here is a medical report that substantiates what I am saying...as much as I hate to do

http://arpa.allenpress.com/arpaonline/?req...CS%3E2.0.CO%3B2

But I don't want to appear like a smoker or cigarette company trying to defend smoking. Steroids are potentially dangerous and no-one should ever take them without consulting a doctor regularly and being open with him on what you are taking. Chances are they don't know anything about steroids, but at least they know how to read blood tests, LFT, KFT and other charts to check how your insides are.

[rixalex]

I understand your question, but it might be a better question asked of people who spend 5 hours a day drinking in the bar, sleeping, or in front of the TV if their balance of life is ideal.

Being overly concerned about your physical appearance, spending many hours of your life pumping weights, taking drugs that are potentially dangerous and may do you harm... none of those things sound good. Better though than watching TV, sleeping or drinking in a bar? I guess that's down to the person. We all choose our own path and live with the consequences.

With regards your own exercise regime, it sounds very reasonable and sensible.

Taking the drugs... well to me that doesn't sound so sensible, but i'm one of those who thinks we should be happy with making the most of what we were given. If you can't naturally by way of exercise make your body the shape and size you want it to be, there's a good reason for that. If you want to argue with mother nature be prepared to suffer her wrath!

[Crow Boy]

This topic has crossed the lines of acceptable posting several times and would have warranted being closed because despite what seems to be the presumption the use and sale of anabolic steroids is illegal in Thailand and consequently against Thai Visa rules. That said I have been monitoring the topic as I am finding it very interesting.

It seems that we have passed beyond the personal abuse and insult stage and are moving into a more mature discussion on the subject. I am letting this topic continue but have changed the title to something less inflammatory. However please note - if the posting style reverts to insults and derogatory remarks I will start to issue formal warnings and close the thread.

regards

Crow Boy

Moderating Team

Thai Visas

[Meg_2003]

What do you guys think about this for body building, then..

http://forum.sanook.com/forum/?topic=2437313

Sorry, Its in Thai, but you can see the pictures... And no, They aren't men!

[poshthai]

THis sounds like the for and against smoking.some say its an addiction and some say its an uncontrolable drug.

ps,

i dont have to justify my 2 mates dying to you and to discuss the autopsy that showed both with enlarged hearts and the conditions of old men.

Whilst I have stated again and again, steroids come with "potential" risks. No doubt about it. We know.

But just because a person who uses steroids dies, or kills somone or himself, it doesnt mean steroids were to blame.

And whilst steroid deaths happen, they are extremely rare and almost always invlove recreational drugs or diuretics. Diet can also play a part as can congenital and genetic heart defects. Not all bodybuilders do regular health checks because steroids are illegal in most countries and there is fear associated with telling the doctor the truth. Underground steroids, animal grade, fake and dirty steroids also figure into the mix of health problems that the outlaw of steroids have forced on people who want to use them.

Everone can find a death on Google that the media blame on steroids. Easy to do.

So, if in fact you had 2 friends die, it wasn't as a direct result of steroids, unless of course they were stupid and didn't know what they were doing or failed to get medical checks regularly. There are many reasons for enlarged hearts - blood pressure, diabetes, excess sodium, as well as recreational drugs, genetics and host of other health and consumption issues. To blame steroids alone for an enlarged heart is ignorant.

Here is a medical report that substantiates what I am saying...as much as I hate to do

http://arpa.allenpress.com/arpaonline/?req...CS%3E2.0.CO%3B2

But I don't want to appear like a smoker or cigarette company trying to defend smoking. Steroids are potentially dangerous and no-one should ever take them without consulting a doctor regularly and being open with him on what you are taking. Chances are they don't know anything about steroids, but at least they know how to read blood tests, LFT, KFT and other charts to check how your insides are.

I would tend to agree with what you say.My 2 friends had taken steroids for ages and they were into competition body showing(dont know what it is called) and they were huge and were always ill and tired.

[tropo]

What do you guys think about this for body building, then..

http://forum.sanook.com/forum/?topic=2437313

Sorry, Its in Thai, but you can see the pictures... And no, They aren't men!

The female bodybuilders in your link are pretty small and lean. Believe it or not, most people who go to the gym would appear quite muscular if they eliminated all their bodyfat. A few decent meals later these girls would appear quite normal.

If you want to see freaky female bodybuilders, check out the Ms Olympia and top pro show competitors. As a bodybuilder myself, I still don't understand why females wish to develop such freaky muscle...and I've watched these females competitors advance since they started competing in the early 80's. I would be proud to sport a body as good as some of the top pro female bodybuilders.

[tropo]

I would tend to agree with what you say.My 2 friends had taken steroids for ages and they were into competition body showing(dont know what it is called) and they were huge and were always ill and tired.

I'm hardly ever ill and don't feel tired unless I've just pounded my body in the gym. Try 2 hours of intense weight training someday...you maybe surprised to learn that it can be tiring.

It would seem likely that your friends were suffering from other, non-steroid related conditions, and you've assumed steroid use was the cause. No autopsy will ever state that someone died of steroid abuse. You were probably making that assumption to back up your biased attitude towards bodybuilding.

[buckeroo2]

I would tend to agree with what you say.My 2 friends had taken steroids for ages and they were into competition body showing(dont know what it is called) and they were huge and were always ill and tired.

I'm hardly ever ill and don't feel tired unless I've just pounded my body in the gym. Try 2 hours of intense weight training someday...you maybe surprised to learn that it can be tiring.

It would seem likely that your friends were suffering from other, non-steroid related conditions, and you've assumed steroid use was the cause. No autopsy will ever state that someone died of steroid abuse. You were probably making that assumption to back up your biased attitude towards bodybuilding.

I left Califonia WOW yesterday and was walking in the direction of Pattaya Klang. I walked to the next white crosswalk and right at that crosswalk I encountered a pharmacy that advertised steroids on the side of its establishment - There was a pic of a body builder type guy and it was called "40UP". The sign said to come inside to talk to the pharmacist about steroids - seemed rather obvious that this place was pushuing steroid sales - not sure about the quality or legality - but the place certainly was not selling the stuff "under the counter".

[Tolley]

I don't understand why the average person would see the need to take steroids.

Professional athletes l can sort of understand especially where big money is involved.

But for your average person you can do weight training and get a nice body without it being ridiculously big and also feel quite good.

You are better off supplementing with vitamins,antioxidants and good diet and that will surely make you look and feel good.

[bangkokrick]

I don't understand why the average person would see the need to take steroids.

Professional athletes l can sort of understand especially where big money is involved.

But for your average person you can do weight training and get a nice body without it being ridiculously big and also feel quite good.

You are better off supplementing with vitamins,antioxidants and good diet and that will surely make you look and feel good.

People tend to take steroids when they have reached their maximum potential and can go no further without extra help. There is a lot of competition in weight gyms and it feels good when you can lift the heavier weights. When i was training it was the ultimate feeling for me if i could increase my max bench press by 1 to 2 KGS. This gives you the motivation to train again and again to see if you can beat your previous maximum. It really is a matter of competing against yourself and it gives you a good dicpline in life. I never took steroids but i did take many suppliments and i had a strict diet regimen. If you want to stay natural i can heavily recommend taking the creatine supplement from which i had great results.

Cheers, Rick

[basjke]

I would tend to agree with what you say.My 2 friends had taken steroids for ages and they were into competition body showing(dont know what it is called) and they were huge and were always ill and tired.

I'm hardly ever ill and don't feel tired unless I've just pounded my body in the gym. Try 2 hours of intense weight training someday...you maybe surprised to learn that it can be tiring.

It would seem likely that your friends were suffering from other, non-steroid related conditions, and you've assumed steroid use was the cause. No autopsy will ever state that someone died of steroid abuse. You were probably making that assumption to back up your biased attitude towards bodybuilding.

I left Califonia WOW yesterday and was walking in the direction of Pattaya Klang. I walked to the next white crosswalk and right at that crosswalk I encountered a pharmacy that advertised steroids on the side of its establishment - There was a pic of a body builder type guy and it was called "40UP". The sign said to come inside to talk to the pharmacist about steroids - seemed rather obvious that this place was pushuing steroid sales - not sure about the quality or legality - but the place certainly was not selling the stuff "under the counter".

They are advertising for andriol testocaps which is a testosterone derivate which among some others is completely legal in thailand and most european country's.

[poshthai]

tropo,

once again,i have nothing against body builders but i dont like drugs of any kind.all of them can be dangerous if not properly supervised.with the risk of repeating myself more people are taking these steriods because non professional expats are selling them for a profit,to enhance their little bit of money.

Up to 40 years of age i was playing football saturday,training 3 hours a night for 2 nights and playing footie sunday and sunday afternoon full contact karate.I tore a cartlidge,had a dvt and nealry died.this put me back 2 years and never realy stayed fit after that,other than packing up smoking(twice now).

[Tolley]

I don't understand why the average person would see the need to take steroids.

Professional athletes l can sort of understand especially where big money is involved.

But for your average person you can do weight training and get a nice body without it being ridiculously big and also feel quite good.

You are better off supplementing with vitamins,antioxidants and good diet and that will surely make you look and feel good.

People tend to take steroids when they have reached their maximum potential and can go no further without extra help. There is a lot of competition in weight gyms and it feels good when you can lift the heavier weights. When i was training it was the ultimate feeling for me if i could increase my max bench press by 1 to 2 KGS. This gives you the motivation to train again and again to see if you can beat your previous maximum. It really is a matter of competing against yourself and it gives you a good dicpline in life. I never took steroids but i did take many suppliments and i had a strict diet regimen. If you want to stay natural i can heavily recommend taking the creatine supplement from which i had great results.

Cheers, Rick

Interesting comments Rick.

I suppose I am not that competitve that i want to lift more than someone else or whether i reach my max potential.

I do weights as part of a fitness regime which includes,yoga and palying some sports like squash.

I do it to look and feel good and that is enoug for me.

The benefits of creatine are not really enough to sway me to want to take it. Most people put on weight from fluid retention i guess and i have noticed a lot of people get a bit more agro after taking creatine. Still it is a better option that going down the steriod route if you want to look bigger and lift heavier weights. Inevitably we all have some limit to how big we can get and how much we can lift even if we take steroids or any other sort of enhancement drugs.

[bangkokrick]

I don't understand why the average person would see the need to take steroids.

Professional athletes l can sort of understand especially where big money is involved.

But for your average person you can do weight training and get a nice body without it being ridiculously big and also feel quite good.

You are better off supplementing with vitamins,antioxidants and good diet and that will surely make you look and feel good.

People tend to take steroids when they have reached their maximum potential and can go no further without extra help. There is a lot of competition in weight gyms and it feels good when you can lift the heavier weights. When i was training it was the ultimate feeling for me if i could increase my max bench press by 1 to 2 KGS. This gives you the motivation to train again and again to see if you can beat your previous maximum. It really is a matter of competing against yourself and it gives you a good dicpline in life. I never took steroids but i did take many suppliments and i had a strict diet regimen. If you want to stay natural i can heavily recommend taking the creatine supplement from which i had great results.

Cheers, Rick

Interesting comments Rick.

I suppose I am not that competitve that i want to lift more than someone else or whether i reach my max potential.

I do weights as part of a fitness regime which includes,yoga and palying some sports like squash.

I do it to look and feel good and that is enoug for me.

The benefits of creatine are not really enough to sway me to want to take it. Most people put on weight from fluid retention i guess and i have noticed a lot of people get a bit more agro after taking creatine. Still it is a better option that going down the steriod route if you want to look bigger and lift heavier weights. Inevitably we all have some limit to how big we can get and how much we can lift even if we take steroids or any other sort of enhancement drugs.

I agree with the fluid retention but you also make significant gains in strength ( well it worked for me ). The weird thing with steroids is that there is no maximum and the more you take the bigger you will get period. look at the American wrestlers they just get bigger. The main worry is that steroids are psychologically addictive because when you have achieved you goal the only way to maintain it is to carry on taking the steroids and this can be physically and mentally damaging.

Cheers, Rick