No 3 Elephant's Suffering On The Island

[ham]

Yesterday I learned that there is now no 3 Elephant Trekking place in Ko Phangan. Driving on the street from the hospital to Chaloklum, we saw a new Elephant attraction, the 3rd now.

I'm so sorry for this amazing animal and creature, but also understand the Thais to make money for the daily living. I hope at least they have a lot of customer, so the animal get some movement and money for some bananas given by the passing tourists. Anyway it is an nice experience to sit on them when they climbing up the steep hill (the one on the other street to Chaloklum, coming from the Police Station, see pictures).

It is 500 Baht per 1/2 hour, excellent view there on the top.

[baco]

but having people on his back is very bad for an elephant's back, it is very unhealthy.

[seville]

Is the one in Ban Tai open? The animals near the Chinese Temple look skinny to me and not very happy. How are the Mahouts with them anyone know. Whoever, got the elephants on the island and the land to do the tour on is not having money problems. Nor do they need to make a living. I hope for the animals sake and the people that were brought down to run the camps are compassionate to the animals and the "big boss". Is also.

I spent some time up in Chiang Mai at the Elephant Heaven. I saw some pretty bad treatment and even one group of Elephants with their Mahouts that had been left out in the middle of now where more or less to fend for themselves. The man who brought them to the area had not brought them food for the mahouts or the Elephants for a week and they were trying to figure out how to make the journey back to their village. The biggest problem is that they had a one year old baby elephant with them and he and the Mom were not going to make the journey make without help.

Edited July 22, 2008 by seville

[marcus]

Ask a mahout for the meaning of the word "phajaan" - I'm curious to find out their reactions

http://www.femail.com.au/elephantstorturethailand.htm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1AR_Zife-c

Have a nice ride !

[seville]

Ask a mahout for the meaning of the word "phajaan" - I'm curious to find out their reactions

http://www.femail.com.au/elephantstorturethailand.htm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1AR_Zife-c

Have a nice ride !

Are you sure meant to put the smile after that? I know what the phajaan is and not something you want to watch any part of.

[ham]

but having people on his back is very bad for an elephant's back, it is very unhealthy.

senseless work is in any case unhealthy

[Galong]

I'm so sorry for this amazing animal and creature, but also understand the Thais to make money for the daily living. I hope at least they have a lot of customer, so the animal get some movement and money for some bananas given by the passing tourists.

Unfortunately that attitude promotes more and more elephants being tortured. Tourists need to stop riding elephants so the mahouts will stop their elephants from having more baby elephants... who, as a result, will spend their entire as a slave.

The mahouts need to learn a new trade. Animal cruelty is NOT justified just because someone is making money doing it. There are alternatives to riding on elephants and there alternative methods of 'training' elephants. Thais are generally cruel to animals and tourist need to be enlightened as to what exactly they're supporting.

Please don't think that I'm suggesting that you don't care about elephants, but that perhaps you need to think this through a tad more.

Edited July 23, 2008 by Galong

[marcus]

Ask a mahout for the meaning of the word "phajaan" - I'm curious to find out their reactions

http://www.femail.com.au/elephantstorturethailand.htm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1AR_Zife-c

Have a nice ride !

Are you sure meant to put the smile after that? I know what the phajaan is and not something you want to watch any part of.

The smile was ment sarcastic, I'm really curious to hear what excuses they will use when tourist will start asking the wrong questions.

Edited July 23, 2008 by marcus

[Mark Wolfe]

From the Web site:

While the mahouts claim to have killed "only one" elephant, it is estimated that half of all elephants subjected to the breaking process do not survive.

"It is estimated" by whom? This is just something pulled out of a hat. It would never make it into a well-edited and professional newspaper, for example. It's unfounded speculation couched in language as if it were true.

[marcus]

From the Web site:

While the mahouts claim to have killed "only one" elephant, it is estimated that half of all elephants subjected to the breaking process do not survive.

"It is estimated" by whom? This is just something pulled out of a hat. It would never make it into a well-edited and professional newspaper, for example. It's unfounded speculation couched in language as if it were true.

It's not really important how many elephants survive (I suppose most of them given their economic value), but what's important is the fact that almost nobody seem to know about this torturing. Most of the tourists (and falang over here) still think that by booking these ridiculous "safaris" they support the poor local people (they support the owner of the camp who is already a millionaire) and they help the elephants because they read in the LP that "the poor elephants became unemployed the day government banned logging"

I agree with you that that website is written by some idealistic people without journalistic background, and you have to take it with a pinch of salt. However, National Geographic wrote in this article more or less the same.

[seville]

If any of you are interested in the truth of Paajaan or getting more stats and information about the condition of the Asian Elephant in Thailand I suggest you go to the Thai Focus Website. You can also check on The Wildlife friends of Thailand.

PETA did a documentry on Paajaan and it caused a big problem for the people who came forward with the practice and the fact that it is still practiced.

One of the hardest things is teaching people that negative reinforcement is not the only way to train an animal or a child for that matter.

Want to support Elephants and help them have a happy life check out the two places I've mentioned. I can tell you that it might be the most rewarding and wonderful thing that you ever do. Hard work, but rewarding.

[phuketrex]

PETA did a documentry on Paajaan and it caused a big problem for the people who came forward with the practice and the fact that it is still practiced.

Part of the video is here>>> http://en.netlog.com/go/explore/videos/videoid=1664557 It is very depressing to watch.

The traditional way in Thailand to train elephants is to break their spirit completely and totally so that they are mortally afraid of humans. The way this is done is with the “phaajaan.”

Baby elephants are captured, put into a pen that does not allow them to move side to side, forward, or sit, and then for 3-7 days everyone in the village takes turns breaking the animal using sticks with nails at the end, ropes and hot irons.

There is a petition site though I doubt signing a petition is going to have any effect on the way they "break-in" these wild animals>>> http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/stop-the-...lands-elephants

[Shotime]

From the Web site:

While the mahouts claim to have killed "only one" elephant, it is estimated that half of all elephants subjected to the breaking process do not survive.

"It is estimated" by whom? This is just something pulled out of a hat. It would never make it into a well-edited and professional newspaper, for example. It's unfounded speculation couched in language as if it were true.

OP, I don't get it. You say you feel sorry for the elephants, but then you say it's nice to sit on them when they climb up the hill.

Is this also a case of unfounded concern lamely couched, I'm not sure in what language, to sound as if it were true?

[Shotime]

Sorry, it should have been "founded concern .....