Protecting The Roof Over Your Head From A Devious Partner

[ade100]

I always thought that a westerner can own the house but not the land it's built on.

Yes this is true. But what if the relationship brakes down? Both you and your house could be evicted from Madame's land. So where would you take your house?

:-)

[ade100]

Perhaps an interesting solution (if you have trusted family living overseas), is to ensure that your assets in Thailand are actually legally owned by your brother, or mother (or whoever), who happens to reside in Oz or the UK or wherever. You can have some form of legal contract with them that is drawn up in your home country that gives you control over these assets. Bring your mother/brother over for a holiday when they need to sign any initial purchase papers. Then make sure your Thai partner knows that your mother owns all your assets. She/he will have to travel to Oz/UK to commit the murder . . . .

If she asks why all your assets are held by your mother/brother, just tell her that in your country, you look after your family before your spouse - just like they do in Thailand.

Simon

Sorry simon, but if you are a farang, your mother/brother/whoever will probably be farang too.

And they are not allowed to own land, that is what it is all about.

I think aliens can own land through inheritance although they may be forced to sell it after a certain time.

[Heng]

I always thought that a westerner can own the house but not the land it's built on.

Yes this is true. But what if the relationship brakes down? Both you and your house could be evicted from Madame's land. So where would you take your house?

:-)

Exactly. It's incredible that a lot of folks aren't thinking that far ahead.

[G54]

Also look up the Usufruct thread. Was a good topic about your assets and how to protect yourself.

[nidhogg]

I love living in the boonies of Issan. BUT, no way would I consider staying here if not for my Thai wife. She is the reason that I am happy and content here. Why would I go to the trouble and expense of having all sorts of contracts made to protect my investments? I will never be able to own any property in my name so why bother? If there comes a day when she no longer wants to live with me or if I no longer want to live with her, I will pack my personal things in MY truck and head back to MY condo. YES, I know you have all heard it before but the golden rule is to NOT spend more than you can afford to walk away from. The house, land and car are all in her name while I keep a vehicle and the condo in my name. Certainly there would be a lot of hurt and financial loss involved but I wouldn't miss any meals.

Kudos Gary A. The only sensible post on the entire thread.

Many of the problems seem to stem from the simple inability of foreign residents to understand a simple concept - as a foreigner you are not allowed to own land in Thailand (although, as a caveat, I understand that the situation is slightly different for Americans married to Thai's). Everything we see on this thread is designed to, in someway circumvent this simple fact.

[Naam]

Many of the problems seem to stem from the simple inability of foreign residents to understand a simple concept - as a foreigner you are not allowed to own land in Thailand (although, as a caveat, I understand that the situation is slightly different for Americans married to Thai's). Everything we see on this thread is designed to, in someway circumvent this simple fact.

the situation is NOT different at all for Americans married to Thais

[AmeriThai]

Legal matters aside, IMO on the practical side: beneficiaries who are not Thai will rarely want to have anything to do with the country after a sudden passing/murder of one of their family members here. If you look at it from their point of view, just think of how long it took you to adjust to how sort out your business here -it takes months at best, and some cases people are still trying to figure it out 5-10+ years later- and then imagine them going through it after your death within a limited time frame.

You're right Heng. But I think Maize was suggesting this as a means to hopefully avoid an unexpected and potential demise. Another way of looking at it is to protect your interests in the event of a split in the relationship. That's my take on it.

Another thought is what if your spouse or partner dies from an accident or illness and the family starts squabbling over selling off the assets? If you have no protection, you could not only be out on the street, but out your investment too.

Of course, I understand the idea was deterrence. My point was that if it gets to the point where the local wife or husband is not on your team, I'm sure they would understand the implications of your family (or your "team") being located on the other side of the ocean. It doesn't take much imagination to visualize two steps ahead in that if one decided to knock off one's partner, the victim's family would likely show up for the criminal trial but probably wouldn't stick around for a civil trial. Inheritance ensured.

And that's assuming that one is caught.

Again, you're right and I agree with you. I had a friend who sank most of his money into a house and land for wifey, then died under rather questionable circumstances and the matter 'conveniently dropped'. The most his family in the U.S. could do was put a freeze on his credit cards and notify agencies to stop his retirement benefits. He didn't take any legal precautions, even though he had every reason that he should have. Sadly, that was his mistake. As some have mentioned, it really is important to choose your partner wisely. But as also mentioned, there are other valid reasons to to provide such legal 'insurance'.

My wife and I built a modest place in the province of Saraburi. We both shared in paying for the house and property. We've been married many years now, and I have a lot of trust in her. Although she's more than proven herself trustworthy and sensible, unfortunately the same can't be said for some members of her family. We both agreed that we should take some legal steps to save a lot of future time, hassle and headaches in the event she ever died by accident or illness.

[james24]

My Wife has made a Thai will in Thai and English leaving everything to me and in the case of her own land and own house (not our house or land) has stated she does not want any member of her family to receive anything. How safe is this?

sorry mate don't believe that for a second. Why are people always trying to prove whos got the better thai bird???

[Naam]

Everything we see on this thread is designed to, in someway circumvent this simple fact.

wrong again! in this thread (amongst other things) leases and usufructs are discussed, both perfectly legal and no circumvention of prevailing law involved. moreover, it is also legal for a foreigner to own immobile property of all sorts built on leased land or made available to the foreigner by usufruct. rare cases with a lot of investment enables a foreigner to own land, max 1 Rai (see Bendix' posting).

[ObertoSanchez]

My Wife has made a Thai will in Thai and English leaving everything to me and in the case of her own land and own house (not our house or land) has stated she does not want any member of her family to receive anything. How safe is this?

sorry mate don't believe that for a second. Why are people always trying to prove whos got the better thai bird???

Maybe this thai lady is the most devious of all. She know she not going to die first!

[Naam]

My Wife has made a Thai will in Thai and English leaving everything to me and in the case of her own land and own house (not our house or land) has stated she does not want any member of her family to receive anything. How safe is this?

sorry mate don't believe that for a second. Why are people always trying to prove whos got the better thai bird???

why do people use derogatory comments without any reason?

[Naam]

My Wife has made a Thai will in Thai and English leaving everything to me and in the case of her own land and own house (not our house or land) has stated she does not want any member of her family to receive anything. How safe is this?

sorry mate don't believe that for a second. Why are people always trying to prove whos got the better thai bird???

Maybe this thai lady is the most devious of all. She know she not going to die first!

you know her and therefore can judge her?

[ObertoSanchez]

What thai lady doesnt want to help her family. Sounds strange to me.

[Heng]

My Wife has made a Thai will in Thai and English leaving everything to me and in the case of her own land and own house (not our house or land) has stated she does not want any member of her family to receive anything. How safe is this?

sorry mate don't believe that for a second. Why are people always trying to prove whos got the better thai bird???

Why are some folks so sensitive about how other folks feel about their spouses?

[SoCal]

I do my mental gymnastics trying to figure out how to take care of my family in the event of my future demise.

Maybe if you dwelled on this, instead of trying to figure out how to protect everything from your wife, then you wouldn't have to think so much about her offing you.

That is of course assuming your wife isn't a piece of ...

[ObertoSanchez]

Marrying farm women is not all its cracked up to be. They are unlike any species known to middle income men, who should know better. I left out high income men and poor city men because they do know to stay away from them.

Edited August 15, 2008 by ObertoSanchez

[GuestHouse]

If these things worry you then why not just buy a condo in your own name?

And if you are worried you may be murdered for your wealth then surely you ought to be learning the lesson of the past week and start putting distance between you and the person(s) you fear might murder you.

The root of the problem seems to me to be the fact that the biggest lies Farangs hear in Thailand are the lies they tell themselves.

Some personal honesty (Honesty with yourself) about the basis of your relationship ought to provide an indication of your partner's (and perhaps your partner's family) expectations. There are plenty of pointers to be found in TV threads on what to look out for and only you know how your relationship goes. If you are able to be honest with yourself be so and act accordingly.

The other No No is building a house in your wife's village - I just do not understand why guys do this.

We hear about scheming Thai partners who strip Farangs bare - but let's be honest, the biggest risk is that your relationship breaks down or that you simply drift apart.

In these, what I suspect are the far more common case, the Farang is left with a choice - stay in a relationship that has broken down, living right next door to the ex and her family or give up the house and the invested assets that go with it.

Not only that, but in cases where there is a scheme going on, being right next door to the In-Laws puts the final nail in the Farang's fortunes.

To my mind building in Nakhon Nowhere right next to the inlaws is about the dumbest thing a Farang can do. I mean really really dumb.

Edited August 15, 2008 by GuestHouse

[Tolley]

If these things worry you then why not just buy a condo in your own name?

And if you are worried you may be murdered for your wealth then surely you ought to be learning the lesson of the past week and start putting distance between you and the person(s) you fear might murder you.

The root of the problem seems to me to be the fact that the biggest lies Farangs hear in Thailand are the lies they tell themselves.

Some personal honesty (Honesty with yourself) about the basis of your relationship ought to provide an indication of your partner's (and perhaps your partner's family) expectations. There are plenty of pointers to be found in TV threads on what to look out for and only you know how your relationship goes. If you are able to be honest with yourself be so and act accordingly.

The other No No is building a house in your wife's village - I just do not understand why guys do this.

We hear about scheming Thai partners who strip Farangs bare - but let's be honest, the biggest risk is that your relationship breaks down or that you simply drift apart.

In these, what I suspect are the far more common case, the Farang is left with a choice - stay in a relationship that has broken down, living right next door to the ex and her family or give up the house and the invested assets that go with it.

Not only that, but in cases where there is a scheme going on, being right next door to the In-Laws puts the final nail in the Farang's fortunes.

To my mind building in Nakhon Nowhere right next to the inlaws is about the dumbest thing a Farang can do. I mean really really dumb.

I can only stay about 3 or 4 days in my girls place outside of Phayao in northern Thailand. She actually owns a beautiful western style house there but what is there to do there?

Nada nothing zilch....the locals are bored crazy and many of them have drinking problems.

A lot of them just leave for anything anywhere better.

The countryside is beautiful no doubt but living there no way in the world.

I cannot understand any farang living in rural Thailand.

As for the property issue even if you trust your partner explicitly...if you buy a house in her name and she dies first then maybe you have nowhere to live unless she has a will in your name.

Is it possible to have a common law contract which gives you a 50 percent share in the value of the land and house even if the house is in your partners name?

[ObertoSanchez]

Building village people a house is actually dumber than dumb, but its all good for the people of the village. I think said man is trying to buy the love and admiration of the VILLAGE PEOPLE, only way to do it is with money. Love and kindness aint gonna do it.

[lifeisrandom]

My Wife has made a Thai will in Thai and English leaving everything to me and in the case of her own land and own house (not our house or land) has stated she does not want any member of her family to receive anything. How safe is this?

sorry mate don't believe that for a second. Why are people always trying to prove whos got the better thai bird???

why would a wife leave her assets to anyone other than her husband?

[Naam]

My Wife has made a Thai will in Thai and English leaving everything to me and in the case of her own land and own house (not our house or land) has stated she does not want any member of her family to receive anything. How safe is this?

sorry mate don't believe that for a second. Why are people always trying to prove whos got the better thai bird???

Why are some folks so sensitive about how other folks feel about their spouses?

for the record: it does not concern me personally as i am not married to a Thai lady but i resent people's derogatory comments in this respect. it is against forum rules to call an obvious moron a moron (id est insult ad hominem) but deragotory comments concerning wives or partners of fellow TV-members should be tolerated with a smile?

GIMME A BREAK Heng! in what environment did you grow up to adopt those kind of values?

[lifeisrandom]

they get a smile because its obvious what their experiences in Thailand have been like. have someone tell you that all Thais are robbers and liars and its probably true based on their experiences because social darwinism plays its role in life... perhaps heng pitys them and offers a smile when they tell people that there is no way a thai women loves them more than her family or isnt a bar girl or whatever other stereotype mr. farang is convincing himself of today.

Edited August 15, 2008 by lifeisrandom

[Heng]

My Wife has made a Thai will in Thai and English leaving everything to me and in the case of her own land and own house (not our house or land) has stated she does not want any member of her family to receive anything. How safe is this?

sorry mate don't believe that for a second. Why are people always trying to prove whos got the better thai bird???

Why are some folks so sensitive about how other folks feel about their spouses?

for the record: it does not concern me personally as i am not married to a Thai lady but i resent people's derogatory comments in this respect. it is against forum rules to call an obvious moron a moron (id est insult ad hominem) but deragotory comments concerning wives or partners of fellow TV-members should be tolerated with a smile?

GIMME A BREAK Heng! in what environment did you grow up to adopt those kind of values?

Lolz. Language barrier, Naam. Please re-read. Defending one's own spouse is the norm. Taking offense at another poster who apparently feels proud about who their spouse is... is what my comment is directed at.

So, no break will be issued.

[Heng]

they get a smile because its obvious what their experiences in Thailand have been like. have someone tell you that all Thais are robbers and liars and its probably true based on their experiences because social darwinism plays its role in life... perhaps heng pitys them and offers a smile when they tell people that there is no way a thai women loves them more than her family or isnt a bar girl or whatever other stereotype mr. farang is convincing himself of today.

I'm smiling because I just had some rather delicious strawberry shortcake. As for pity, I wasn't expressing that in any way on this thread.

[lifeisrandom]

he was saying the guy you responded to did not deserve the smiley face.

[GuestHouse]

Naam,

(id est insult ad hominem)

id est probrum ad hominem ?!

But I agree there is far too much slinging the dirt at people in the absence of any reasoned response.

[quiksilva]

as is almost always the case in these types of threads.

[lannarebirth]

If these things worry you then why not just buy a condo in your own name?

And if you are worried you may be murdered for your wealth then surely you ought to be learning the lesson of the past week and start putting distance between you and the person(s) you fear might murder you.

The root of the problem seems to me to be the fact that the biggest lies Farangs hear in Thailand are the lies they tell themselves.

Some personal honesty (Honesty with yourself) about the basis of your relationship ought to provide an indication of your partner's (and perhaps your partner's family) expectations. There are plenty of pointers to be found in TV threads on what to look out for and only you know how your relationship goes. If you are able to be honest with yourself be so and act accordingly.

The other No No is building a house in your wife's village - I just do not understand why guys do this.

We hear about scheming Thai partners who strip Farangs bare - but let's be honest, the biggest risk is that your relationship breaks down or that you simply drift apart.

In these, what I suspect are the far more common case, the Farang is left with a choice - stay in a relationship that has broken down, living right next door to the ex and her family or give up the house and the invested assets that go with it.

Not only that, but in cases where there is a scheme going on, being right next door to the In-Laws puts the final nail in the Farang's fortunes.

To my mind building in Nakhon Nowhere right next to the inlaws is about the dumbest thing a Farang can do. I mean really really dumb.

This is a very good post Guesthouse. All the more so, as it was nort delivered with your usual condescending tone. You have a lot of very good insight to offer and when you deliver it without judgement I think it's value is very much greater.

[kiakaha]

My Wife has made a Thai will in Thai and English leaving everything to me and in the case of her own land and own house (not our house or land) has stated she does not want any member of her family to receive anything. How safe is this?

sorry mate don't believe that for a second. Why are people always trying to prove whos got the better thai bird???

i am the sole beneficiary of my wifes estate.

my father is the sole beneficiary of my mothers estate.

pretty normal stuff really james24.

[sakaew]

Simor asserts that a lease--usually a 30 year lease--dies when YOU die, assuming YOU are the person whose name appears on the lease and the chanaut.

A few weeks ago, my wife's friend and her husband danced up to the Pattaya land office, where, it is alleged, the Land Office guy told them the law had been changed.

Now it seems, ....the lease carries on even AFTER the leasee dies.

To take up another poster's point.....for those given to uncertainty about whether or not thay may be murdered in their beds....putting the lease in a FALANG family member's name...one who lives in a country other than Thailand, would seem to offer as much security as we can get.

( eg...even if you are murdered, the rotters do not get your house )

It's then up to the new leaseholder--be in brother, son etc....to ask a Real Estate Agent to find a tenant.

One hopes such measures are unnecessary.

But as we all know....the path of true love (?) does not always run so smoothly.

It's an issue we all need to address, and finding the appropriate balance of trust verses security is a difficult one to address.

Throw in the negative possibilities in the future..and it's time to have a Beer Chang.

I haven't had a chance to ask a lawyer if there was such a change....so I am only repeating what I've been told.

It's worth checking.