Issan Village Election Vote Buying

[bergen]

Some people take the money, and vote how they want to, but that is not usually the case in some villages. The money is handed out (usually by just one party) and has a veiled threat. Basically villagers are told that if they do not vote for the candidate that has paid them, they will be ineligible to vote in future and will not be able to take a loan from the village fund.

Now of course we know that is not true, but the mainly uneducated villagers will believe anything they are told by someone they perceive as being "higher" than them!

As it is no secret that votes are bought, and I and probably most foreigners living in the villages could prove that money is changing hands, I fail to understand why the election watchdog and their teams, (no doubt highly paid) rarely come up with a prosecution. Whether or not every voter in Isaan receives money, it is a virtual certainty that every winning candidate handed out money, and as such should be disqualified.

It never ceases to amaze me !! despite several personal accounts in this post to the contrary we get:

"The money is handed out (usually by just one party)"

well just like the other posters ------ in our village the money is offered by more than "just one party". the villagers accept (generally) from anyone offering.

But this is the best:

"The mainly uneducated villagers will believe anything they are told by someone they perceive as being "higher" than them!"

Mainly uneducated-----maybe. Stupid----absolutely not!

The elected officials in our village are very attentive to the (many) complaints & requests they receive from their voters. They realize only too well that if they don't at least give the impression of acting for your "uneducated villagers" no amount of money will save them come next election! The rewards for them are just too great. they don't threaten---they respectfully request. It is a joke around here that you can always tell election time be the depth of the wai's being delivered to the villagers.

These people are very independent and are never lead around like the sheep you seem to think they are.

"it is a virtual certainty that every winning candidate handed out money" ------ you are probably close --- but you forget to include the loosing candidates!

Good post

[plachon]

I really don't think that vote buying is a prevalent as many people think.

I do.

More so for local elections. Some take the money and vote for whoever they please. Some take the money and are sh*t scared that the filth who hands over the money will know if they voted for someone else.

My daughter belongs to the former, my wife the latter. And they are not simple Isaan folk.

And your wife and daughter are no less "filthy" for having accepted the money I suppose?

Bribees and bribers in most societies are equally guilty of a crime. Apparently different standards exist in Thailand.

I always like to tell this story.

Some years ago a village headman in Issan posted an ad in a Thai newspaper offering to sell about 30 votes from people in his village to the highest bidder. Some newspaper in BKK got ahold of the story and criticised that headman for being so "stupid" to sell their votes like that. Didn't he know about democracy?

The headman replied that he knew perfectly well they shouldn't be selling their votes. But for years he had been trying to get the government to fund a health clinic for his village. Every election one party or the other promised them that if they voted for that party, that party would bring the health clinic to their village. Then once that party was elected, they promptly forgot their promise about the clinic. So this election, he was making it official in the newspaper, so that it would be on the record, and the politicians couldn't get out of their promise after the elections. And when he got the money, he was going to use it to open the clinic, and hire a doctor or nurse.

Now you may not agree with the methods, but who was the "stupid" person, the people who criticised that Issan village headman or the Issan village headman? At least he got his money in advance.

And who do you think really had a better idea about how "democracy" really worked?

Nice story IMAFARANG, but as long as you realise it is just that..........

Think about it, even if it was true that this headman put an ad in the national newspaper and broadcast his intention to sell "his" villagers block vote.

30 votes, at a maximum (based on what we've all heard and read) of 1,000 baht (although votes are sold as low as 200 baht), would give him an illegally obtained income of 30,000 baht. Not enough to build even a toilet, let alone a clinic, and then how to hire a nurse and doctor to staff this field hut for a mere 30 villagers? A nurse costs at least 10,000 baht a month, a doctor several times that. And in any case, each tambon already has a relatively well-equipped health clinic with well-trained staff paid for by the state. No villagers are going to want to use their "hard-earned" cash from selling their votes to hire someone who should be working for free. A quaint story, but no substance to it I'm afraid. It might have been apocryphal tale told by a newspaper correspondent to illustrate a more general point, such as one sees quite often in the Nation and Bangkok Post.

[soundman]

30 votes, at a maximum (based on what we've all heard and read) of 1,000 baht (although votes are sold as low as 200 baht), would give him an illegally obtained income of 30,000 baht. Not enough to build even a toilet

More proof that the right to vote should be taken away from the un-educated.

anyway... before we bog down on my sarcasim....

OK we accept that vote buying is inevatable in rural issan.

So why don't the voters get smart and sell their votes for what they are really worth, instead of selling themselves short.

I reckon the cost of one vote should be around 10,000B - 20,000B to win a national election, not a paltry 200B.

One doesn't need to look far to see how wealthy the politicians get in office even though it costs them an arm and a leg to win in the first place.

One thing I do know about is the local OBT elections in Kabinburi and surrounding districts. 3milB - 5milB to guarantee a win and you will expect to make four times this or more in your office term, provided you are not asked to kick too much up-stairs to the big party above if you were stupid enough to campaign on their ticket in the first place.

Cheers,

Soundman.

[mpdkorat]

Well, look at it this way, at least in Thailand the voter gets something out of an election, in our modern western election circus the voter " thinks" he will get something, like tax reductions, peace, lower fuel prices , well you know the usual promises which are soon forgotten if "the chair" has been won.

And make no mistake, look at all the millions which are spent on elections, and you really believe that it is for free and just a donation??

I don`t.

Vote buying occurs but I am not sure it happens in quite such a uniform way as people here say. I also didn't think it was as manifest during the last general election as in the August OBT elections. In August I heard lots of stories about X and Y having got 300 or 500 baht etcetera from A or B, but when canvassers came to my house they didn't offer my wife anything. To the best of my knowledge a Thai friend nearby was not paid (he was complaining about the PAD 'mob' most days at around that time and seemed fairly committed to a particular cause). There were certainly loads of canvassers and pick-ups with loudspeakers circulating in the area and competing strongly with each other. If everything was absolutely bought and paid for, would this be necessary? I suspect that the picture may vary according to where you live. My village is strongly behind PPP and I don't think the Democrats would have much success in buying votes. So I think the picture of complete absence of interest in policy and concern only with bribes is wrong. Perhaps what happens sometimes is that people take money but only vote for an option they deem acceptable. Overall though I agree that many Isaan people are their own worst enemies when it comes to preserving democracy and electing a government which will implement economic and social policies fair to the North East.

The other interesting point is that if all the votes were bought what would the cost be? At 500 baht per time, and a lot more for the big wigs, how many could a party afford to fund?

Lots and lots!!

[plachon]

30 votes, at a maximum (based on what we've all heard and read) of 1,000 baht (although votes are sold as low as 200 baht), would give him an illegally obtained income of 30,000 baht. Not enough to build even a toilet

More proof that the right to vote should be taken away from the un-educated.

anyway... before we bog down on my sarcasim....

OK we accept that vote buying is inevatable in rural issan.

So why don't the voters get smart and sell their votes for what they are really worth, instead of selling themselves short.

I reckon the cost of one vote should be around 10,000B - 20,000B to win a national election, not a paltry 200B.

One doesn't need to look far to see how wealthy the politicians get in office even though it costs them an arm and a leg to win in the first place.

One thing I do know about is the local OBT elections in Kabinburi and surrounding districts. 3milB - 5milB to guarantee a win and you will expect to make four times this or more in your office term, provided you are not asked to kick too much up-stairs to the big party above if you were stupid enough to campaign on their ticket in the first place.

Cheers,

Soundman.

Rhetorical question that Soundman...................but as we know from all the latent Toxinophiles on TV Isaan voters are much smarter than we think. It's also one that has taxed a lot of Thai people who do not sell their votes for the cost of a massage (in a low-end joint ) and some quite sensibly, have thought it through and concluded that electoral democracy has failed the country and there has to be a new way of ensuring decent, honest government, whether at OBT level or national level. In other words, a "new politics" is needed. This idea seems to appall the old lot who were quite content with the old system that gave them such marvels of participatory democracy as Chavalit, Banharn, Newin and Toxin himself, and apparently are quite happy to kill and destroy those who would suggest otherwise........the rest maybe history...................

[citizen33]

The other interesting point is that if all the votes were bought what would the cost be? At 500 baht per time, and a lot more for the big wigs, how many could a party afford to fund?

Lots and lots!!

Yes! But what kind of percentage of votes would it be viable to buy, especially if some voters get more than one payment? I'm not sure - irrespective of where we stand on the politics - that we have really faced up honestly to the economics. Banks do report increased bank notes in circulation at election time, but if everybody was being paid the sum involved is mind-bogglingly huge. Surveys have found that a significant proportion of respondents (I think from memory up to about 25% for some elections) say they had first hand experience of vote buying but it is hard to assess how reliable that might be. I don't know if anybody has seen any calculations of the costs of vote buying at various hypothetical thresholds (i.e. say 25% or 50% of vote) or cares to try a back-of-envelope estimate themselves. I still think that it isn't financially viable beyond a certain point, especially given that those at the middle level are going to want a lot more that 500 baht.