Hotel Management Wages?

[tb86]

would you like me to list the names of hotels and salary rates that i have seen over the last year?

dosent bother me one bit, but i can asure you that as of 6 months ago there were plenty of six figure salaries out there,

and im sure there are still plenty of them out there

i can think of at least 6 or 7 resort in samui that could afford those kind of salaries, maybe im wrong but who knows

[Mark Wolfe]

About US$5,800 a month to make desserts?

tb86...are you talking about places in Samui? I suppose I could perhaps imagine some places in high volume areas in Bangkok, but Samui?

If that's so, then I better get out my recipe for chocolate chip cookies and start practicing for the day my name is called....

[hanno]

yeah but what kind of hotel do you work at? How did you get the job did they bring you in from europe or else where? how big is the hotel you work at? how expensive are the room rates 160-200, 300-600, 600+, how much volume do you do , how many restaurants do you have, do you do private events regulary? ect ect. If your working in a 50 room place that charges 175 usd a night then of course your not going to make that kind of money,

I know all that plays a factor, but from the OP's post I understand that his job offer wasn't exactly at the Oriental. Yes, I know of GM's that pull in 7-digit salaries, but those tend to be more the exception than the rule.

[lazygourmet]

About US$5,800 a month to make desserts?

tb86...are you talking about places in Samui? I suppose I could perhaps imagine some places in high volume areas in Bangkok, but Samui?

If that's so, then I better get out my recipe for chocolate chip cookies and start practicing for the day my name is called....

I know personally (I did recruit them!) two executive chefs in Samui who are making US$10,000/month on a full expat package.

But trust me, they don't have time to argue about their salaries!

tb86, I am completely agree with you...

As hanno noticed, the reason the OP asked for advice: it is because, he is not not cruising in the same water than us.

So, as I mentioned in a previous post, he should not expect more than THB 50,000/month...

[Ocean11]

About US$5,800 a month to make desserts?

tb86...are you talking about places in Samui? I suppose I could perhaps imagine some places in high volume areas in Bangkok, but Samui?

If that's so, then I better get out my recipe for chocolate chip cookies and start practicing for the day my name is called....

I know personally (I did recruit them!) two executive chefs in Samui who are making US$10,000/month on a full expat package.

But trust me, they don't have time to argue about their salaries!

tb86, I am completely agree with you...

As hanno noticed, the reason the OP asked for advice: it is because, he is not not cruising in the same water than us.

So, as I mentioned in a previous post, he should not expect more than THB 50,000/month...

Find that hard to believe.......

[fccalex]

About US$5,800 a month to make desserts?

tb86...are you talking about places in Samui? I suppose I could perhaps imagine some places in high volume areas in Bangkok, but Samui?

If that's so, then I better get out my recipe for chocolate chip cookies and start practicing for the day my name is called....

I know personally (I did recruit them!) two executive chefs in Samui who are making US$10,000/month on a full expat package.

But trust me, they don't have time to argue about their salaries!

tb86, I am completely agree with you...

As hanno noticed, the reason the OP asked for advice: it is because, he is not not cruising in the same water than us.

So, as I mentioned in a previous post, he should not expect more than THB 50,000/month...

Find that hard to believe.......

I doubt that there are even GM's in Samui that are on a 10,000 USD ++ package in Samui. Any Hotel under 150 room, would have a problem paying that kind of salary for a GM and specifically any F/B staff.

[lazygourmet]

About US$5,800 a month to make desserts?

tb86...are you talking about places in Samui? I suppose I could perhaps imagine some places in high volume areas in Bangkok, but Samui?

If that's so, then I better get out my recipe for chocolate chip cookies and start practicing for the day my name is called....

I know personally (I did recruit them!) two executive chefs in Samui who are making US$10,000/month on a full expat package.

But trust me, they don't have time to argue about their salaries!

tb86, I am completely agree with you...

As hanno noticed, the reason the OP asked for advice: it is because, he is not not cruising in the same water than us.

So, as I mentioned in a previous post, he should not expect more than THB 50,000/month...

Find that hard to believe.......

I doubt that there are even GM's in Samui that are on a 10,000 USD ++ package in Samui. Any Hotel under 150 room, would have a problem paying that kind of salary for a GM and specifically any F/B staff.

I was not talking about GM but executive chef. And yes these places have less that 150 rooms and they don't call themselves neither resort nor boutique hotel.

Previous confidentiality agreement does not allow me to name them; anyway I wouldn't...

As a GM job proposal, talking about myself, after 25 years in the business + 4 years at Lausanne + 2 years at Cornell: I would not move my (lazy) ass for less than EURO 10,000/ month. But isn't vulgar to talk about money?

Now, I off to Hua Hin,

Happy New Year to all of you, with some special thoughts for all the braves in the hospitality industry.

[Ocean11]

About US$5,800 a month to make desserts?

tb86...are you talking about places in Samui? I suppose I could perhaps imagine some places in high volume areas in Bangkok, but Samui?

If that's so, then I better get out my recipe for chocolate chip cookies and start practicing for the day my name is called....

I know personally (I did recruit them!) two executive chefs in Samui who are making US$10,000/month on a full expat package.

But trust me, they don't have time to argue about their salaries!

tb86, I am completely agree with you...

As hanno noticed, the reason the OP asked for advice: it is because, he is not not cruising in the same water than us.

So, as I mentioned in a previous post, he should not expect more than THB 50,000/month...

Find that hard to believe.......

I doubt that there are even GM's in Samui that are on a 10,000 USD ++ package in Samui. Any Hotel under 150 room, would have a problem paying that kind of salary for a GM and specifically any F/B staff.

I was not talking about GM but executive chef. And yes these places have less that 150 rooms and they don't call themselves neither resort nor boutique hotel.

Previous confidentiality agreement does not allow me to name them; anyway I wouldn't...

As a GM job proposal, talking about myself, after 25 years in the business + 4 years at Lausanne + 2 years at Cornell: I would not move my (lazy) ass for less than EURO 10,000/ month. But isn't vulgar to talk about money?

Now, I off to Hua Hin,

Happy New Year to all of you, with some special thoughts for all the braves in the hospitality industry.

No Chef in Samui makes Baht 300,000 net plus expat package (living allowance, flights, medical, tax, bonus etc.) You talk at least 400,000 gross here. !!!! Sorry, that is crap.

And if YOU have a job which pays 10,000 Euro (approx. Baht 480,000) even after 25 years with Lausanne, Cornell etc etc etc ...... then you are one lucky sob, but I also doubt that very seriously. Anyway, off to Makro now....

Edited December 31, 2008 by Ocean11

[lazygourmet]

About US$5,800 a month to make desserts?

tb86...are you talking about places in Samui? I suppose I could perhaps imagine some places in high volume areas in Bangkok, but Samui?

If that's so, then I better get out my recipe for chocolate chip cookies and start practicing for the day my name is called....

I know personally (I did recruit them!) two executive chefs in Samui who are making US$10,000/month on a full expat package.

But trust me, they don't have time to argue about their salaries!

tb86, I am completely agree with you...

As hanno noticed, the reason the OP asked for advice: it is because, he is not not cruising in the same water than us.

So, as I mentioned in a previous post, he should not expect more than THB 50,000/month...

Find that hard to believe.......

I doubt that there are even GM's in Samui that are on a 10,000 USD ++ package in Samui. Any Hotel under 150 room, would have a problem paying that kind of salary for a GM and specifically any F/B staff.

I was not talking about GM but executive chef. And yes these places have less that 150 rooms and they don't call themselves neither resort nor boutique hotel.

Previous confidentiality agreement does not allow me to name them; anyway I wouldn't...

As a GM job proposal, talking about myself, after 25 years in the business + 4 years at Lausanne + 2 years at Cornell: I would not move my (lazy) ass for less than EURO 10,000/ month. But isn't vulgar to talk about money?

Now, I off to Hua Hin,

Happy New Year to all of you, with some special thoughts for all the braves in the hospitality industry.

No Chef in Samui makes Baht 300,000 net plus expat package (living allowance, flights, medical, tax, bonus etc.) You talk at least 400,000 gross here. !!!! Sorry, that is crap.

And if YOU have a job which pays 10,000 Euro (approx. Baht 480,000) even after 25 years with Lausanne, Cornell etc etc etc ...... then you are one lucky sob, but I also doubt that very seriously. Anyway, off to Makro now....

Sorry for misunderstanding, but I was talking about gross package (salary+housing+insurance+kids schooling+plane tickets+++ all the trimmings!); on which I base my fees when I recruit them. What lefts in their pocket at the end of month does not interest me!

Now I am really off...

Enjoy your shopping at Makro, hope you will find some descent wines!

[Ocean11]

About US$5,800 a month to make desserts?

tb86...are you talking about places in Samui? I suppose I could perhaps imagine some places in high volume areas in Bangkok, but Samui?

If that's so, then I better get out my recipe for chocolate chip cookies and start practicing for the day my name is called....

I know personally (I did recruit them!) two executive chefs in Samui who are making US$10,000/month on a full expat package.

But trust me, they don't have time to argue about their salaries!

tb86, I am completely agree with you...

As hanno noticed, the reason the OP asked for advice: it is because, he is not not cruising in the same water than us.

So, as I mentioned in a previous post, he should not expect more than THB 50,000/month...

Find that hard to believe.......

I doubt that there are even GM's in Samui that are on a 10,000 USD ++ package in Samui. Any Hotel under 150 room, would have a problem paying that kind of salary for a GM and specifically any F/B staff.

I was not talking about GM but executive chef. And yes these places have less that 150 rooms and they don't call themselves neither resort nor boutique hotel.

Previous confidentiality agreement does not allow me to name them; anyway I wouldn't...

As a GM job proposal, talking about myself, after 25 years in the business + 4 years at Lausanne + 2 years at Cornell: I would not move my (lazy) ass for less than EURO 10,000/ month. But isn't vulgar to talk about money?

Now, I off to Hua Hin,

Happy New Year to all of you, with some special thoughts for all the braves in the hospitality industry.

No Chef in Samui makes Baht 300,000 net plus expat package (living allowance, flights, medical, tax, bonus etc.) You talk at least 400,000 gross here. !!!! Sorry, that is crap.

And if YOU have a job which pays 10,000 Euro (approx. Baht 480,000) even after 25 years with Lausanne, Cornell etc etc etc ...... then you are one lucky sob, but I also doubt that very seriously. Anyway, off to Makro now....

Sorry for misunderstanding, but I was talking about gross package (salary+housing+insurance+kids schooling+plane tickets+++ all the trimmings!); on which I base my fees when I recruit them. What lefts in their pocket at the end of month does not interest me!

Now I am really off...

Enjoy your shopping at Makro, hope you will find some descent wines!

You buy wines at Makro ? I see.....your screen name explains.

[jimbob]

The figures quoted don't seem that far fetched for a very select number of highly talented chefs.

There are a few ultra expensive resorts/hotels in Thailand that cater for the super rich and celebrities who are willing to pay thousands of dollars a night and expect only the best in return with food being a big part of that.

$4,000 or $5,000 a month is not that much if a chef can keep high paying guests happy.

That type of salary would only account for a small percentage of expats though.

[MJo]

Why would a hotel/resort, pay more than 50,000 per month for a western F&B manager? A Thai manager can do it just as well, and 99% of the time, do it much better. Won't get into all the reasons why, just need say he is Thai, can speak Thai, understands Thai staff.

When it comes to hotel managing i dont at all agree that a thai would do it anywhere near as good as a westerner. Honestly. Many hotels dont rent to thais at all, and all hotels on this island for sure have 98% western customers, or more. The thing in the managers job that needs a thai, a good manager have thais among the staff that helps him out with. Understanding the Thai things is one thing, but the thing a thai can´t is understanding his customers, and thats the more important thing. Also westerners have a complete different understanding in areas like keeping the fridge full so everything on the menu can be served, serving food at the same time for everybody on the table etc. I was recently living 3 days in a hotel in surath. Thai managed. For 3 days i tried to order ham and cheese sandwich and got the answer "solly, no cheese". The hotel was door to door to 7/11. Thai just have no understanding for certain things that are important in westerners eyes. Thai manager in a hotel in surath, were the customers are 80 % thai, fine. In samui, no way.

Ohh, and when it comes to staff. My old gardener just got a new job. He asked me when i offered him the job "is it falang or thai owners/managers?". He told me that he dont work with thai managers. Have to be farang. Thais is only problem he said. Happy one day and fired the next. Speak very "strong words" to the staff.

30 to 50K as a f&b manager,??????? dude i have some great head hunter contacts, i used them when first looking into re locating here, as a pastry chef my offers were almost always 180,000 to 200,000 a month as a f&b manager you should be much higher, ifr your responsible for all of the operations outlets, pirvate events, catering, room service, ect.... 30k is what a thai sous chef gets per month.... if its a guest house ok but a proper resort no way let me know if you want and i can send the head hunter info to you......30k cmon, thais do a better f&b job???? if you like ice in your beer and chilled red wine maybe.

And how much was this headhunters fee? You know, just advance payment for him to get the contract arranged....

[Samuian]

About US$5,800 a month to make desserts?

tb86...are you talking about places in Samui? I suppose I could perhaps imagine some places in high volume areas in Bangkok, but Samui?

If that's so, then I better get out my recipe for chocolate chip cookies and start practicing for the day my name is called....

I know personally (I did recruit them!) two executive chefs in Samui who are making US$10,000/month on a full expat package.

But trust me, they don't have time to argue about their salaries!

tb86, I am completely agree with you...

As hanno noticed, the reason the OP asked for advice: it is because, he is not not cruising in the same water than us.

So, as I mentioned in a previous post, he should not expect more than THB 50,000/month...

Find that hard to believe.......

I doubt that there are even GM's in Samui that are on a 10,000 USD ++ package in Samui. Any Hotel under 150 room, would have a problem paying that kind of salary for a GM and specifically any F/B staff.

I was not talking about GM but executive chef. And yes these places have less that 150 rooms and they don't call themselves neither resort nor boutique hotel.

Previous confidentiality agreement does not allow me to name them; anyway I wouldn't...

As a GM job proposal, talking about myself, after 25 years in the business + 4 years at Lausanne + 2 years at Cornell: I would not move my (lazy) ass for less than EURO 10,000/ month. But isn't vulgar to talk about money?

Now, I off to Hua Hin,

Happy New Year to all of you, with some special thoughts for all the braves in the hospitality industry.

No Chef in Samui makes Baht 300,000 net plus expat package (living allowance, flights, medical, tax, bonus etc.) You talk at least 400,000 gross here. !!!! Sorry, that is crap.

And if YOU have a job which pays 10,000 Euro (approx. Baht 480,000) even after 25 years with Lausanne, Cornell etc etc etc ...... then you are one lucky sob, but I also doubt that very seriously. Anyway, off to Makro now....

Only things come to mind are ostrich eggs, when I read the above, I wonder why?

[Ocean11]

The figures quoted don't seem that far fetched for a very select number of highly talented chefs.

There are a few ultra expensive resorts/hotels in Thailand that cater for the super rich and celebrities who are willing to pay thousands of dollars a night and expect only the best in return with food being a big part of that.

$4,000 or $5,000 a month is not that much if a chef can keep high paying guests happy.

That type of salary would only account for a small percentage of expats though.

You are absolutely correct. USD 5,000 is paid to many Chefs in Samui. But USD 10,000 not in Samui, some other hotels in BKK can afford that of course..

[tb86]

Why would a hotel/resort, pay more than 50,000 per month for a western F&B manager? A Thai manager can do it just as well, and 99% of the time, do it much better. Won't get into all the reasons why, just need say he is Thai, can speak Thai, understands Thai staff.

When it comes to hotel managing i dont at all agree that a thai would do it anywhere near as good as a westerner. Honestly. Many hotels dont rent to thais at all, and all hotels on this island for sure have 98% western customers, or more. The thing in the managers job that needs a thai, a good manager have thais among the staff that helps him out with. Understanding the Thai things is one thing, but the thing a thai can´t is understanding his customers, and thats the more important thing. Also westerners have a complete different understanding in areas like keeping the fridge full so everything on the menu can be served, serving food at the same time for everybody on the table etc. I was recently living 3 days in a hotel in surath. Thai managed. For 3 days i tried to order ham and cheese sandwich and got the answer "solly, no cheese". The hotel was door to door to 7/11. Thai just have no understanding for certain things that are important in westerners eyes. Thai manager in a hotel in surath, were the customers are 80 % thai, fine. In samui, no way.

Ohh, and when it comes to staff. My old gardener just got a new job. He asked me when i offered him the job "is it falang or thai owners/managers?". He told me that he dont work with thai managers. Have to be farang. Thais is only problem he said. Happy one day and fired the next. Speak very "strong words" to the staff.

30 to 50K as a f&b manager,??????? dude i have some great head hunter contacts, i used them when first looking into re locating here, as a pastry chef my offers were almost always 180,000 to 200,000 a month as a f&b manager you should be much higher, ifr your responsible for all of the operations outlets, pirvate events, catering, room service, ect.... 30k is what a thai sous chef gets per month.... if its a guest house ok but a proper resort no way let me know if you want and i can send the head hunter info to you......30k cmon, thais do a better f&b job???? if you like ice in your beer and chilled red wine maybe.

And how much was this headhunters fee? You know, just advance payment for him to get the contract arranged....

the hotels pay the fee usualy 3 months of the candidates salary, as a candidate you will pay nothing they will review your cv background check/ references, and you simply talk to your contact set up what is a acceptable salary, location, ect. they find a client that suits your requirements and they negotiate for you and set up your package

Edited January 4, 2009 by tb86

[lazygourmet]

Here is a 2008 survey regarding tourism and hospitality salaries in Southeast Asia.

TMS_Salary_Report_Asia_2008.pdf

Hope it helps...

[livinthailandos]

jee with everything going on now hard believe any realistic wages will be seen especially if the red shirt people mess things up as badly as the yellow shirt thai and given the global recession

[Mark Wolfe]

So the average F&B manager makes 54,900 US dollars a year.

I guess that about wraps up this discussion.