Legal Advice Required, Murder Perhaps?

[jaylord]

Hello

I wonder if anyone can recommend a good lawyer in Isaan or perhaps offer some advice on a tricky situation?

My wife's father recently passed away and this happended soon after he had suffered a beating at the hands of a village policeman and a couple of the village teenagers. Its not clear why they did this to him - maybe a gambling or women related dispute.

Anyway, my wife's father was a very sick man and has been for long time mainly due to alcohol abuse and has been in and out of hospital over the years. He was certainly in no fit state to defend himself in a situation like this so it was no surprise to anyone when he was hopitalised as a result. Nobody expected him to actually pass away however, which he did within 36hrs.

Seemingly the report from the hospital confirms that he died from his injuries but there seems to be no case going forward to prosecute those responsible. As with anything thai, the details are a bit fuzzy but it seems that the witnesses from the village are unwilling to come forward and make any kind of statement. I'm sure it doesnt help that it is a policeman involved as this has probably created a fear factor among them.

Has anybody had any similar experience of this or can anyone make any kind of suggestion? We would like to see justice done but at the same time we dont want to endanger anyone. My wife's mother, brother and neice are still in the village and we would not want to see them persecuted as a result of anything we do.

Thanks

[mahtin]

Hello

I wonder if anyone can recommend a good lawyer in Isaan or perhaps offer some advice on a tricky situation?

My wife's father recently passed away and this happended soon after he had suffered a beating at the hands of a village policeman and a couple of the village teenagers. Its not clear why they did this to him - maybe a gambling or women related dispute.

Anyway, my wife's father was a very sick man and has been for long time mainly due to alcohol abuse and has been in and out of hospital over the years. He was certainly in no fit state to defend himself in a situation like this so it was no surprise to anyone when he was hopitalised as a result. Nobody expected him to actually pass away however, which he did within 36hrs.

Seemingly the report from the hospital confirms that he died from his injuries but there seems to be no case going forward to prosecute those responsible. As with anything thai, the details are a bit fuzzy but it seems that the witnesses from the village are unwilling to come forward and make any kind of statement. I'm sure it doesnt help that it is a policeman involved as this has probably created a fear factor among them.

Has anybody had any similar experience of this or can anyone make any kind of suggestion? We would like to see justice done but at the same time we dont want to endanger anyone. My wife's mother, brother and neice are still in the village and we would not want to see them persecuted as a result of anything we do.

Thanks

My sympathies.

Lawyer is a good idea, independent action not.

[sassienie]

OK, keep in mind that this is Thailand.

There is no system here, the law is whatever it is according to the official you see at the time.

There is something you can try, but as is usual in Thailand it may cost you:

I don’t know in what area this murder took place, but travel to your nearest city outside the area from where you live.

Visit a main police station and insist on seeing the head of that station.

Tell him/her what had happened and that you wish to press criminal charges against the men who perpetrated GBH on your father in law. If they don’t seem interested, go to another police station and so on.

Whatever police area decides to take up the case, they will probably ask you for some monies under the counter.

Sorry, but this is how things work in Thailand.

Wish you all success with this.

[jaylord]

Thanks both - is anyone able to recommend a reputable lawyer in Ubon area?

Cheers

[Dakhar]

OK, keep in mind that this is Thailand.

There is no system here, the law is whatever it is according to the official you see at the time.

There is something you can try, but as is usual in Thailand it may cost you:

I don’t know in what area this murder took place, but travel to your nearest city outside the area from where you live.

Visit a main police station and insist on seeing the head of that station.

Tell him/her what had happened and that you wish to press criminal charges against the men who perpetrated GBH on your father in law. If they don’t seem interested, go to another police station and so on.

Whatever police area decides to take up the case, they will probably ask you for some monies under the counter.

Sorry, but this is how things work in Thailand.

Wish you all success with this.

Purchase a one way ticket out of Thailand prior to doing the above.

[fredfromalaska]

op answered his own question.

if he fears for his relatives. let it go! u aint in kansas anymore dorothy!

[geriatrickid]

If you intend to pursue a criminal case, it is vital that there be physical evidence. The best way to do that is to have an autopsy report. I apologize if this is insensitive, but if you have not dealt with the body, try and have an autopsy. Although a hospital is expected to fill out a death certificate and effect a medical exam subsuquent to a death where a crime may be involved , it is not usually the case. The hospital report may not provide enough evidence to bring charges, as it would have to be shown that the death was attributable to the beating.

A full autopsy may also show that the death was due to natural causes brought on by alcoholism etc. If that's the case, it might actually bring peace of mind to know that the person was not beaten to death.

I think an honest and experienced lawyer would share these views. If the lawyer would just charge for paper work and filings, then you might be taken advantage of, since there was no evidence to substantiate the allegations.

[dotcom]

I think you have to let your wife take her case to the village headman. That's how they resolve disputes; tribal fashion.

You stay out of it.

[jaylord]

Ok thanks for your thoughts everyone. You have all certainly confirmed my feeling that this is a sensitive issue and one that should be treated carefully.

Proceed with caution is the overwhelming advice unless we have hard physical evidence. The hospital have issued a report but it is unclear whether this is a full autopsy report, and i dont know the exact content (We are in England, which makes obtaining info even more difficult). But yes it certainly would be comforting to have a definative answer as to what casued the death

There is no thoughts of taking independant action - but it is frustrating to know that nothing will be done unless you actively pursue it and even then justice based on fact and evidence still doesnt seem to be enough. This is the first time i have been in a situation which has touched upon the darker or greyer side of Thai life and you do end up feeling helpless and alone.

Thanks All

[misterman21]

Ok thanks for your thoughts everyone. You have all certainly confirmed my feeling that this is a sensitive issue and one that should be treated carefully.

Proceed with caution is the overwhelming advice unless we have hard physical evidence. The hospital have issued a report but it is unclear whether this is a full autopsy report, and i dont know the exact content (We are in England, which makes obtaining info even more difficult). But yes it certainly would be comforting to have a definative answer as to what casued the death

There is no thoughts of taking independant action - but it is frustrating to know that nothing will be done unless you actively pursue it and even then justice based on fact and evidence still doesnt seem to be enough. This is the first time i have been in a situation which has touched upon the darker or greyer side of Thai life and you do end up feeling helpless and alone.

Thanks All

Sorry to hear of your situation. I would recommend that you read 'Wandering in to Thai Culture'. As you have become aware these people are primitive and dangerous once the mask is removed. Tread very carefully - it is a rude awakening!

[patklang]

I can understand that some farangs enjoy going upcountry to live with their tiraks but the law stinks there and no way will a farang get justice unless you pay and move quick.this is an up country copper who wouldnt think twice about shooting you and feeding you to the pigs.

[fredfromalaska]

i cant understand why farngs enjoy going upcountry to live with their treerats. too much downside!

[johnson36]

I can understand that some farangs enjoy going upcountry to live with their tiraks but the law stinks there and no way will a farang get justice unless you pay and move quick.this is an up country copper who wouldnt think twice about shooting you and feeding you to the pigs.

Is it really that bad with the police when you go up country ?

This is enough to make anyone think twice about living up country. My wife is from a village a few miles of the main road between Sakhon Nakhon and Udon Thani and I have no plans of ever living there, outskirts of BKK sounds better to me and more farang to mix with.

[johnson36]

i cant understand why farngs enjoy going upcountry to live with their treerats. too much downside!

I totally agree. Too much downside and I have yet to find any up side.

In my wifes village there are no farang at all. Nobody to have a chat with and a few beers and a game of pool.

The most I have managed is 4 nights in row. Then we get her mother and father to come and stay in BKK for a week or so. What is there to do in the village ? all I see is cook, eat, go get some fish / rats / snails / bugs / ants, cook eat, cook something else, eat again, sleep 8pm, get up 5am (why I don't know) and then it all starts again. I will stick with BKK thanks, ive found a nice croud of people there that I have known for 4 years or more.

[JetsetBkk]

If you want an example of Thai justice, read this: http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,185060,00.html

[borracho]

advice on a tricky situation?

Yea....stay the heck out of it. Let the Thai people sort it out.

Better yet go take a trip somewhere, so you can be away.

[johnson36]

advice on a tricky situation?

Yea....stay the heck out of it. Let the Thai people sort it out.

Better yet go take a trip somewhere, so you can be away.

Post 9. OP says he is in England

[Maizefarmer]

What did the death certificate say - actual cause of death?