Pad Announcement 29/2008: Conditions For New Government

[OlRedEyes]

What is unreasonable is that a self appointed vigilante group is able to make these demands....

The "demands" are most basic, most of them are right there in the constution and related laws.

What is sad, as I said already, is that they need to be spelled out publicly and officially.

Actually it's any citizen's right to demand the government to perform it's duties. Call them vigilantes or not.

What exactly do you find unreasonable there?

It's not the citizens demanding it. It is obvious who is in charge. Anybody who cannot see that must be totally blind.

Edited December 13, 2008 by OlRedEyes

[OlRedEyes]

Ok i have just read the above and starting at number 8 (i just picked a number from 1 to 13 and high lighted it) it would be interesting to hear from people who agree or dissagree about this statement, or any other 1 - 13 statements come to that

Unfortunately, in this democracy , the primary statements may not be discussed.

Edited December 13, 2008 by OlRedEyes

[tigerbalm]

................. the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) has the following statement to make.

If the conditions and ideologies of the PAD are denied or ignored, it is ready to stage activities according to the situation.

With deepest respect,

People's Alliance for Democracy

December 12, 2008

Link

Ok i have just read the above and starting at number 8 (i just picked a number from 1 to 13 and high lighted it) it would be interesting to hear from people who agree or dissagree about this statement, or any other 1 - 13 statements come to that

Read the last sentence by the PAD 2 or 3 times.....slowly...and think; just think...

Is that enough ?.... or do you wish me to explain the frightening and threatening language, followed by: WITH THE DEEPEST RESPECT ?

It's

LaoPo

Yes yes yes that bit is a little scarey... but what about any of the 1-13 statements

[Plus]

The Nation said PAD is thinking to form a political party.

It has been corrected.

PAD co-leader Chamlong Srimuang dismissed the speculation about forming a political party

http://nationmultimedia.com/2008/12/13/pol...cs_30090864.php

[LaoPo]

The Nation said PAD is thinking to form a political party.

It has been corrected.

PAD co-leader Chamlong Srimuang dismissed the speculation about forming a political party

http://nationmultimedia.com/2008/12/13/pol...cs_30090864.php

"Chamlong says movement has no plan for new party"

Of course they don't need a 'new' party; they founded already one, back in 2006.

How come I don't believe any of the PAD leaders...whatever they say ?

LaoPo

[Plus]

That party was formed during junta period when no one knew what was going to happen after the new constitution was accepted, long before Samak debacle and "new politics", and they specifically stated they are not going to participate in politics for at least five years.

Does it still exist, btw? They have to submit annual statements to the EC and if they don't comply with several rules they are automatically disbanded. Every year several parties go down quietly like this.

If you say that there's some sort of covert operation to take over the country via that long forgotten party - show some evidence. Show at least that it still exists, then maybe show evidence that it is active in any way.

Otherwise your refusal to believe Chamlong when he publicly denies setting up a party sounds a bit paranoid.

[presscamera]

This makes me very angry I am a farang in Australia with links to Thailand through my wife and son. We holiday in Thailand bi annually hoping to come back in July.

Reading this statment and their other utterances smacks of Pol Pot, Year Zero and re education. Someone has to stop these lunatics before it is too late.

I can see it getting to a stage where they kill anyone who opposes their ideology. This is Elite Fascism not Democracy.

[Ulysses G.]

I can see it getting to a stage where they kill anyone who opposes their ideology. This is Elite Fascism not Democracy.

An excellent classification of the PAD philosophy!

[Plus]

So much talk - fascist, Pol Pot, Cultural revolution - bla bla bla.

What exactly is not reasonable in those demands? I said it on the first page, I'll say it again - ANY government shoul heed those "demands" without reminding.

[Ulysses G.]

I just love the constructive criticism you can muster up...

I just love how some people fail to see how anti-democratic, racist, violent, murderous and Nazi-like the PAD really are.

I'd compare them to sheep, but that would be putting them a little bit too high on the evolutionary scale.

Lemmings might be more accurate.

[sriracha john]

Meanwhile, following the arrest of a pro-government supporter this week, Chiang Mai police have arrested 38-year-old Nopparat Sangpetch, a suspect in an attack that killed 60-year-old PAD supporter Settha Jiamkijwattana on November 26.

Nopparat was reportedly found wearing a red shirt and holding a knife at the crime scene, and is one of several alleged attackers. The Chiang Mai police have issued arrest warrants against seven others thought to be involved in the incident.

Nopparat has also been charged for attacking a Constitution Court official at Chiang Mai International Airport, and arrest warrants have been issued for six other red-shirt supporters in the case.

- TOC / 2008-12-12

[RealityCheck]

Many of the sentiments expressed in the document are laudable, however.....

The problem is the dicatorial way the author(s) presume that they can impose these conditions/changes upon every citizen in the country - claiming to do so on the citezens behalf and for the citezens own good.

In publishing these dictates, threatening civil misconduct and law-breaking if their demands are not met, they are basically advocating a facist state overseen by the PAD rather than the democratic one they claim they want.

The PAD really do need to step back and let the democratic process take over now. They remind me of a spoilt child that insists on getting it's own way. Unfortunately, in this case, the child is holding a shot gun.

[thai thai]

The Thai are like children fighting in the livingroom over their toys...while the house is on fire...

As near as I can tell, Sondhi and Thaksin are cut from the same cloth, and one has to accept he fact that corruption here in LOS is genetic...

[presscamera]

So much talk - fascist, Pol Pot, Cultural revolution - bla bla bla.

What exactly is not reasonable in those demands? I said it on the first page, I'll say it again - ANY government shoul heed those "demands" without reminding.

What is unreasonable is that a minority group of unelected, lawless thugs are laying down conditions on who makes up the formation of the next Government. And making threats if their demands are not met.

They the PAD, have already committed crimes punishable by Death under Thai Law. IE: Holding Thailand and the whole world Hostage by the Hijacking of Airports, 350,000 Tourists stranded.

In Australia the last Goverment made unpopular changes to industrial relations laws. In November last year the people of Australia lined up at the Ballott Booths and voted the Government out of office. And the Prime Minister John Howard even lost his seat. All of this happened peacefully, there were no shots fired, no Grenades thrown, no one was killed, no Airports were closed down. The Government was changed ! Some people were not happy about that. However after 3 years they get another chance to put their Government back in. This is how Democracy works.

[thai thai]

In order for DEMOCRACY to work...it requires a certain socio-economic level and degree of intellect, to be successful...

What we have going on here is what Thailand is only capable of, and what has been going on more or less for many, many generations. It sprang from somewhere deep in the past, and has nothing in common with the evolution or origins of western culture.

Edited December 13, 2008 by thai thai

[RealityCheck]

So much talk - fascist, Pol Pot, Cultural revolution - bla bla bla.

What exactly is not reasonable in those demands? I said it on the first page, I'll say it again - ANY government shoul heed those "demands" without reminding.

It's because they are "DEMANDS".

If the author(s) had said - "We suggest...." - it would have been acceptable. Because they DEMAND, and hold the country to randsom if their demands are not met, it is unacceptable (at least to those wanting a democracy).

And in specific cases, compliance with their DEMANDS will doubtless cause, at the least, international incidents...if not war. Quote: "Announce the cancellation of the Thai-Cambodian joint communiqué ...."

[ThaiLife]

With the Royal Decree on Thursday December 11, 2008 for the launch of an extraordinary Parliamentary session to allow the House of Representatives to select the new prime minister on Monday December 15, 2008, the People’s Alliance for Democracy (PAD) has the following statement to make.

The PAD wants all politicians to realize that its 193-day rally is a great sacrifice of a large group of people, some with their lives. It has been successful in blocking an amendment to the Constitution, thus allowing the corruption cases against politicians and electoral fraud cases to be deliberated by the court, resulting in the current political change.

The sacrifice of the people must not be for a proxy government of the Thaksin regime to be set up, and the PAD does not want to see a mere change in the political alliance to seek benefits for a particularly political group.

The PAD wants to see a resolution to the problems of politics in the past, restoration of justice for the people, and a move ahead with the people to reform politics and install new politics that will not see a recurrence of past political crisis.

The PAD would like to announce its stance for the selection of the new prime minister in the extraordinary Parliamentary session as follows:

Firstly, the PAD opposes any proxy prime minister from the Pheu Thai Party and any prime minister from a political party that is part of a coalition involving the Pheu Thai Party, which is a newly-established proxy political party of the Thaksin regime.

Secondly, the PAD condemns threats, intimidation, negotiations, and payment to politicians for them to join the Pheu Thai in being able to form government without care to the damages to the country and the public.

Finally, the PAD will monitor the change in political alliance of the old-style politics and whether it will be able to break through the political crisis, deal with the Thaksin regime, and enter the era of new politics. The PAD, as representative of the public, issues 13 conditions for the new government.

1. Speed up the lese majeste cases against Jakrapob Penkair, Weera Musikapong, websites, publications, community radio stations, and crack down on the movement that endangers the Monarchy as a priority.

2. Announce its stance of not amending the 2007 Constitution or any other law that will whitewash the crimes of politicians, that will benefit politicians’ own interests, that will lessen the authority of the Monarchy or disturb the foundation of the country’s Constitutional Monarchy.

3. Support good and talented people into power; prevent evil people from taking power; managing the country with transparency; and stop unacceptable politicians or state officials, those with conflicts of interest, or those with corrupt tendency to take power.

4. Speed up corruption cases to enter the judicial process and prevent direct and indirect interference into the cases. Transfer state officials who have been serving the Thaksin regime out of power, such as the director-general of the Department of Special Investigation, the director-general of the Public Relations Department, the director of the Budget Bureau, the secretary-general of the Food and Drugs Administration, etc. Seize corrupt assets to become state assets once again.

For the benefit of the country, the new government should announce its stance in speeding up the Kao Kradong State Railway Authority of Thailand land violation case and the violation of public land in Satuk district of Buri Ram province. It should also cancel the rental contract for illegitimate shops at the Suvarnabhumi Airport and cancel the shows and prosecute state officials and private companies involved in the non-transparent rental of buying of airtime on the Public Relation Department’s Channel 11.

5. Cancel the passport of Pol. Lt. Col. Thaksin Shinawatra, a runaway convict of the country.

6. Speed up the extradition process of Pol. Lt. Col. Thaksin Shinawatra, a runaway convict, to return to serve his jail term in Thailand immediately.

7. Announce the cancellation of the Thai-Cambodian joint communiqué that gave away Preah Vihear Temple and its surrounding areas to Cambodia and protect Thai sovereignty over its land and natural gas and oil resources in the Gulf of Thailand.

8. Speed up the eradication of a police state and transfer police officers who accuse, trick, and intimidate PAD supporters to an inactive post. Prosecute police officers involved in the killing of the people on October 7, 2008 and those who accuse the public of being traitors and terrorists, particularly Pol. Gen. Chongrak Chutanont, Pol. Lt. Gen. Suchart Muenkaew, Pol. Maj. Gen. Amnuay Nimmano, Pol. Lt. Gen. Somyos Poompanmuang, Pol. Col. Luechai Sudyod, etc. Restore justice for the police officers who have been honest and brave in protecting the people’s interest through promotions in their job.

9. Speed up the cases and prosecute those implicated by the National Human Rights Commission and the Senate committees for being involved in the killing of the people, such as Somchai Wongsawat, Gen. Chavalit Yongjaiyudh, and state officials. Prosecute thugs who side with the government in hurting and killing protesters to the fullest extent.

10. Stop using state media to issue propaganda and lie to the public for the Thaksin regime, particularly the ‘Truth Today’ program on NBT station and its hosts. Launch a media reform to allow the public access to complete information to benefit the country and the people.

11. Cancel large-scale and non-transparent projects that will lead to the demise of the country, such as the 4,000 NGV bus rental, the construction of the new Parliament, etc.

12. Cancel the 1999 State Enterprise Bill and replace it with a state enterprise development and restructuring plan for the utmost benefit of the people. Restore privatized state enterprises as state property, especially PTT.

13. Show the stance of supporting the public in building new politics with greater public participation in politics to ensure true democracy for politics, the economy, and the society accordingly to the way of the PAD and to prevent a future political crisis.

The PAD calls on politicians who are forming the new government to consider the ideologies of the people and heroes who have sacrificed for the country more than negotiations to compete for benefits by different political groups. The new government should announce its stance and follow the above conditions so as not to disappoint the people and prevent them from losing faith in the current political system.

If the conditions and ideologies of the PAD are denied or ignored, it is ready to stage activities according to the situation.

With deepest respect,

People’s Alliance for Democracy

December 12, 2008

Link

Can any one please tell me where to find this in Thai

Thanks

[sriracha john]

Meanwhile, following the arrest of a pro-government supporter this week, Chiang Mai police have arrested 38-year-old Nopparat Sangpetch, a suspect in an attack that killed 60-year-old PAD supporter Settha Jiamkijwattana on November 26.

Nopparat was reportedly found wearing a red shirt and holding a knife at the crime scene, and is one of several alleged attackers. The Chiang Mai police have issued arrest warrants against seven others thought to be involved in the incident.

Nopparat has also been charged for attacking a Constitution Court official at Chiang Mai International Airport, and arrest warrants have been issued for six other red-shirt supporters in the case.

- TOC / 2008-12-12

Vocational students battle red-shirted people

A group of Pathumwan Vocational College students fought with a group of red-shirted people in front of the National Stadium Saturday morning.

Witnesses said gunfire was heard during the fight, which broke out at 8:10 am.

An explosion was also heard inside the college following the fight, police said, adding that students apparently lit firecrackers.

The fight came after a group of pro-Thaksin red-shirted people arrived outside the stadium waiting to attend the mobile Truth Today. The college had the reunion party Friday night and some group of active and former students crossed the road to the stadium and fought with the red-shirted people.

Following the fight, Pathumwan police station chief Pol Col Paisarn Luasomboon deployed 300 police to be stationed in front of the school to prevent students from coming out to clash with the supporters of former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra again.

- The Nation / 2008-12-13

[sriracha john]

Students clash with Thaksin supporters

Students of a vocational school clashed with supporters of ex-premier Thaksin Shinawatra on Saturday morning in front of Supachalasai stadium, where they gathered to wait for his phone-in speech at night. According to witnesses, gun shots were heard inside the compound of the Pathumwan Institute of Technology. But there are no reports of injuries. About 200 police were deployed in front of the institute to prevent the students from clashing with the supporters of United Front of Democracy Against Dictatorship. After the clash, police opened the entrance of the stadium to let the

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/b...s.php?id=135368

[permanent_disorder]

Can any one please tell me where to find this in Thai

Thanks

There you go!

http://www.manager.co.th/Daily/ViewNews.as...D=9510000146579

[Koo82]

What is unreasonable is that a minority group of unelected, lawless thugs are laying down conditions on who makes up the formation of the next Government. And making threats if their demands are not met.

They the PAD, have already committed crimes punishable by Death under Thai Law. IE: Holding Thailand and the whole world Hostage by the Hijacking of Airports, 350,000 Tourists stranded.

In Australia the last Goverment made unpopular changes to industrial relations laws. In November last year the people of Australia lined up at the Ballott Booths and voted the Government out of office. And the Prime Minister John Howard even lost his seat. All of this happened peacefully, there were no shots fired, no Grenades thrown, no one was killed, no Airports were closed down. The Government was changed ! Some people were not happy about that. However after 3 years they get another chance to put their Government back in. This is how Democracy works.

They will never understand this. Wait, they understand, but don't want to do it the right way. They must have their own protesting style like bringing children in, using women as fences to protect PAD leaders.

Who do they think they are? Why do they think they can demand those conditions? They must have some kinds of backup and if PAD's barking job is done, these people (supporters) will have a share of what ever conditions the new government will set up just for them.

[henryalleman]

I like to think of it as the criminals versus the educated, moral high ground middle class. If you allow Taksin to buy his way out of the current situation then Thailand will never move away from corruption and rich/powerful buying their way out of anything, irrespective of the law. Thailand should have the rule where no prime minister can serve more than two terms like the US. Being voted in by buying votes/MPs is not democratic; its corrupt. Did you see the claim on Bangkok Post of 55M baht for each MP that backs Peua Thai?

[/quote

Thailand should have the rule where no prime minister can serve more than two terms like the US.

You should know that here is a big difference between a presidential regime US and Russian style where the president even has the power to veto proposals from the parliament and have an injunction right and an parliamentary democracy.

A good example is France where Mitterrand was elected as president but the PM was leading a government formed by other parties. They called it Co-Habitation.

And by my knowledge Thailand is not a republic, So the PM is not the head of state. But maybe this is Thaksins ultimate dream.

[Plus]

It's because they are "DEMANDS".

If the author(s) had said - "We suggest...." - it would have been acceptable. Because they DEMAND, and hold the country to randsom if their demands are not met, it is unacceptable (at least to those wanting a democracy).

And in specific cases, compliance with their DEMANDS will doubtless cause, at the least, international incidents...if not war. Quote: "Announce the cancellation of the Thai-Cambodian joint communiqué ...."

Yeah, "We suggest that Pheu Thai stops throwing grenades...", "We suggest that the government follows the laws when treating convicted criminals..." - these are not suggestions, these are minimum requirements for any government, and EVERY citizen should demand that they are met.

Thai-Cambodian commnique is based on Cabinet decision that was ruled illegal and unconstitutional, of course it should be cancelled or revoked or re-written or whatever.

[Plus]

Why do they think they can demand those conditions?

Actually it's a social and political duty of every citizen to demand those conditions, not just PAD.

[Bangyai]

Meanwhile, following the arrest of a pro-government supporter this week, Chiang Mai police have arrested 38-year-old Nopparat Sangpetch, a suspect in an attack that killed 60-year-old PAD supporter Settha Jiamkijwattana on November 26.

Nopparat was reportedly found wearing a red shirt and holding a knife at the crime scene, and is one of several alleged attackers. The Chiang Mai police have issued arrest warrants against seven others thought to be involved in the incident.

Nopparat has also been charged for attacking a Constitution Court official at Chiang Mai International Airport, and arrest warrants have been issued for six other red-shirt supporters in the case.

- TOC / 2008-12-12

This is good news and shows that the police in Chiang Mai are trying to do their duty. Violence of this kind, by both sides , should be cracked down on. Too bad the police in Bangkok have failed to arrest members of the PAD security who beat a man and left him naked and unconscious in a ditch.

[henryalleman]

What is unreasonable is that a self appointed vigilante group is able to make these demands....

The "demands" are most basic, most of them are right there in the constution and related laws.

What is sad, as I said already, is that they need to be spelled out publicly and officially.

Actually it's any citizen's right to demand the government to perform it's duties. Call them vigilantes or not.

What exactly do you find unreasonable there?

You are absolutely correct. Its the legitimate right of every citizen, political movement or pressure group to make a list of there demands.

Most of the comments are completely overreacted. I don't think they fully understand how a democracy works.

[Koo82]

I hate to be melodramatic but if the army does not get involved soon there could be a real problem country wide. There are reports filtering through that the red shirts have been to Udon Airport threatening unrest.

A coup is looking better every day.

Didn't they just have a silent coup so PPP was out?

It's time the Army and others stop interfering. Thais can never grow up. The losers always bite in hope the Army will jump in and make a coup. Then Army will be in power for a while. They don't know how to manage but no problem. No one dies. They'll take some assets to be their own and things will be quiet after new election. And soap opera starts again.

[KireB]

PAD have broken the law on so many occasions with total impunity of course their megalomaniac hierarchy think they can now DICTATE what ever they wish.

Choose any word from the above comment that illustrates PAD intentions - no clues.

Yes they broke the law in protest against stealing, thieving, robbing, manipulating, greedy, self-serving, murderous and corrupt politicians.

[permanent_disorder]

Students clash with Thaksin supporters

Students of a vocational school clashed with supporters of ex-premier Thaksin Shinawatra on Saturday morning in front of Supachalasai stadium, where they gathered to wait for his phone-in speech at night. According to witnesses, gun shots were heard inside the compound of the Pathumwan Institute of Technology. But there are no reports of injuries. About 200 police were deployed in front of the institute to prevent the students from clashing with the supporters of United Front of Democracy Against Dictatorship. After the clash, police opened the entrance of the stadium to let the

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/b...s.php?id=135368

how about a new topic for the phone-in show?

[Bangyai]

1. Speed up the lese majeste cases against Jakrapob Penkair, Weera Musikapong, websites, publications, community radio stations, and crack down on the movement that endangers the Monarchy as a priority.

.With deepest respect,

People's Alliance for Democracy

December 12, 2008

Link

Can any one please tell me where to find this in Thai

Thanks

Talk about the pot calling the kettle black. Sondhi recieved a 3 year jail sentance for defamation and dragging the monarchy into politics. He's still free as a bird

http://www.bangkokpost.com/election2007/26..._261207_04.html

As for signing off with ' deepest respect ' , who is that for ??? The Thai people ??