If It Walks Like A Duck And ...

[highdiver]

mattias posted.

I agree with the overdevelopment statement. But i have to ask you hd, why do you always compare prices in the west? People go halfway around the world, and pay expensive tickets, partly because its cheap in Thailand. Comparing prices to the west is irrelevant. If a family of 4 choose chiang mai or chumporn for a holiday destination, instead of Samui, they save a shitload of money. THATS the comparison. The prices in the west has nothing to do with it at all.

Ohh, and yeah. "planespotters" should come to samui. One of the few places you get so close to a starting yet. Watched one take off today aswell. Standing right next to the river and it felt like i could almost tuch the plane! Massive.

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from a tourist point of view samui is a great destination.

since most of the tourist arrive from other countries mainly west and specially western Europe.

When you need to relate or market samui to to tourists you need to examine.....how they see the holiday in Samui.

a tourist coming here has a choice of taking his vacation in Europe or in any other holiday destination. samui is cheaper even with flight costs and the "extras" cost even if you are "riped off" by local standards, a tourist who lives in western currency terms still finds Samui a bargain and they do make the calculations.

the tourists don't use the local infrastructure as the locals so they don't see may of the problems that posters who ,live here see. and if they see them. i think, they don't really care because they are on vacation and they want to enjoy not complain.

Highdiver, you try to think like a tourist, but i think it was a long time since you were one yourself. With all your respect. I really dont think any, even European tourist nowadays think of Samui as a cheap destination. Hence, groceries in tops or tesco in samui is twice the price from Bkk, and same price as my exp. country in Europe. A beer chang on the beach is 80 baht witch is a Swedich price. I hear what you say, dont get me wrong. But i just think they took it too far when it comes to pricing. Thinking like you do. "Its still cheap". Samui is not cheap anymore.

i agree with you i have not been a tourist in samui... but i own business in tourist sector and i am very interested in what tourists have to say. so i try to speak and find out from tourists what they think and how they feel.

as for beer the cost of beer in most European towns i visited a few months ago was a bout 4-6 euro depending on the size of the glass and the location. 5 euro is about 240 baht per beer.

[Jambo]

I agree with some points from the OP.

But there are some that are trying to improve Koh Samui.

I attended a meeting yesterday where the dive companies on Samui are working together with Thai Hotels Association (THA).

Between the dive schools and THA we are have agreed an agenda where we are going to work together and arrange beach clean up days. meet with the local tesserban and push for beach rubbish bins etc.

The THA have also arranged for a childrens day on 10th Jan where local school children will be invited to hotels and shown differant forms of recycling methods.

Im not sure if im allowed to mention hotels, but Kandaburi Hotel are one of the big hotels who are backing this project.

I know it is only a very small project, but hopefully this post may encourage some other posters who are living here long term to get involved with projects like this, which can only improve Koh Samui.

Thanks.

[mattias33]

mattias posted.

I agree with the overdevelopment statement. But i have to ask you hd, why do you always compare prices in the west? People go halfway around the world, and pay expensive tickets, partly because its cheap in Thailand. Comparing prices to the west is irrelevant. If a family of 4 choose chiang mai or chumporn for a holiday destination, instead of Samui, they save a shitload of money. THATS the comparison. The prices in the west has nothing to do with it at all.

Ohh, and yeah. "planespotters" should come to samui. One of the few places you get so close to a starting yet. Watched one take off today aswell. Standing right next to the river and it felt like i could almost tuch the plane! Massive.

================================================================================

===============

from a tourist point of view samui is a great destination.

since most of the tourist arrive from other countries mainly west and specially western Europe.

When you need to relate or market samui to to tourists you need to examine.....how they see the holiday in Samui.

a tourist coming here has a choice of taking his vacation in Europe or in any other holiday destination. samui is cheaper even with flight costs and the "extras" cost even if you are "riped off" by local standards, a tourist who lives in western currency terms still finds Samui a bargain and they do make the calculations.

the tourists don't use the local infrastructure as the locals so they don't see may of the problems that posters who ,live here see. and if they see them. i think, they don't really care because they are on vacation and they want to enjoy not complain.

Highdiver, you try to think like a tourist, but i think it was a long time since you were one yourself. With all your respect. I really dont think any, even European tourist nowadays think of Samui as a cheap destination. Hence, groceries in tops or tesco in samui is twice the price from Bkk, and same price as my exp. country in Europe. A beer chang on the beach is 80 baht witch is a Swedich price. I hear what you say, dont get me wrong. But i just think they took it too far when it comes to pricing. Thinking like you do. "Its still cheap". Samui is not cheap anymore.

i agree with you i have not been a tourist in samui... but i own business in tourist sector and i am very interested in what tourists have to say. so i try to speak and find out from tourists what they think and how they feel.

as for beer the cost of beer in most European towns i visited a few months ago was a bout 4-6 euro depending on the size of the glass and the location. 5 euro is about 240 baht per beer.

4-6 euro / beer i can agree on in a bar nightime in downtown London. Or Stockholm for that matter. Oslo even more. In copenhagen or Amsterdam you can half that price. (And take in that price-comparission that in Europe a beer is a pint or half a litre, in thailand we are talking 33 cl bottles). But when i sit on the beachtable daytime in my town Malmö in Sweden, summertime, i can get served a cold beer for 1,50 Euro. I dont expect to pay as much at op bungalow but infact i have to. If i sit on the river in Bkk i can get a cold beer for 45 baht. Also in chumpon i got a beachbeer for 50 baht a couple on months ago. Before we turn this whole thread into beerpricing in the world (or did i already?) my point was more a remark to the "samui is cheap" comment. I have the deepest respect that you do speak to alot of tourists, and if that is the case, i´m pretty sure you must have heard my arguments before. Samui is offcourse as you say cheap compared to Europe still, but alot of tourists are getting their eyes open that samui is infact alot more expensive than other destinations in Thailand. Some of them think it´s totaly worth it, because they have the money and love this island. Some of them dont. And they dont come back.

All i´m saying is that i think the greedyness bite the people in the tourist-industri in the neck sooner or later. To constantly raise the prices, little by little every year, try to see were the limits are. Taxis, hotels, restaurants, beers. "It´s still cheap for them". Yes, but in the end they can see how much last years holiday in Samui cost the family of 4 instead of the year before when they went to Chiang mai or hua hin.

Btw, just oppinions, not facts!

[mark lamai]

there is something to be said for the Aus local government system (negative side is the over-regulation),

where building construction has to conform to guidelines like height, setback, distance from boundaries etc.

The idea that a beach foreshore, say 50-100 metres from high tide, should be public land, would be a good thing for thailand.

yesterday i went to the beach in Lamai, on a small plot next to the Bikini bar they are building another bar, guess what, its all concrete right on the beach.

I can only assume that the Thai authorities have no interest at all in how the island looks and works.

Its not difficult to implement buliding codes i wouldn't have thought.

In my opinion a building on that land firstly, simply should not have been allowed.

If it was allowed it should have been set back from the beach.

And an appropriate style of building for a beachfront be required.

Such western thinking, i know.

Someone above said stop moaning and do something positive,

haa haa, a farang can make changes to Thai government systems?????

If all the THA can come up with is fiddling around with a bit of rubbish, then that kind of says it all.

No imagination, no big picture thinking, no future thinking.

maybe the answer is simply that the money and power people are so completely in control that noone dares to try anything that may annoy them.

lack of thinking is a Thai trait of course, learnt early on in school.

Its a nationwide problem, not just Samui.

But Samui being fairly small and manageable, think of the example they could set by implementing good sensible planning and development laws, now.

Is there a Thai person in a position of influence who cares enough and is brave enough?

I doubt it.

[samuibeachcomber]

marklamai you are thinking like a westerner to a western problem with a western solution which is fair enough.as its a thai problem you'd have to get into the thai mindset which would be near impossible.think tea money,think laziness and as you say its not in the thai mentality to plan for the future,only the now!and also they do not think of the consequences.but i think the basic problem is "greasing palms"

So we can come up with all the solutions we know would work...................but it ain't ever going to happen.look at all the westerners who buy/build lovely properties only to find later the land near them is beginning to be filled up with small concrete houses,noisy neighbours,hundreds of dogs,then someone opens a bar and more noise............end of that persons perceived paradise..........its what you get in thailand and i dont think anyone can change the thai mindset,so all we are left with is to commiserate and have a whinge..........what more can a poor boy do!

[sezze]

I know Samui is far from perfect but I hope it never ends up like Pattaya.

High rise blocks, odd strip of sand that they call a beach, regular deliveries of drunk Navy boys.

Pattaya has had a few decades longer to develop a tourist industry than Samui and personally I don't like what they've done with the place.

Quote from the OP's list

let's look at Samui's attributes.

Beaches: Some really good, some really awful.got some great beaches but sad lack of up keep

Resorts: Very good to acceptable.From 6star to back packer accom . What more could you want ?

Value for money: poor.Depends on your point of view and the strength of your home currency (even with the double pricing system)

roads and public transport: very poor.Can't argue with that one

Places of interest: beaches, mountains, waterfalls. Limited.We got water falls,mountains & beaches coming out of our ears !

Access to island: Air is ok but expensive. land is slow and tedious.Land travel tends to be that way

Entertainment: reasonable.clubs ,pubs and girls/boys of negotiable affection we have , not much when you compare to phukets Fantasia,The stunt show,ect ect

Here's my idea ...

beaches : used to be clean and perfect water ... nope not anymore .... sorry for that . beaches still relatively ok

resorts : too much of them ... money hunger . A lot more luxury then 10 or even 5 years ago .

value for money : about the same like 5 years ago , not like 10 years ago . always depending on your own currency but everything is more expensive then the mainland and has always been and will always be .

roads and public transport : 10 years ago NON existent except songthows . about 6 to 7 years ago 1st motorbike taxis on the island , about 5 years 1st taxis ... . Roads , Better every year . Yes they are not good but they are working on it and are improving them . espescially getting water from the road in rainy season a lot has beendone past 3 years . Some parts of the island are still horrible .

Places of interest : It used to be a coconut island with beaches and mountains and coconuts .. It is all still there ... no different then 10or 20 years ago . What did you want to see ???

entertainment : bars/clubs blablabla ... you know . Everything still there .

So your point actually is probably or the island hasn't developed enough to your taste ??? It grew to fast , espescially on the building side but for the rest ... it is just the same like any other place in the world . It changes . Internet onthe island is getting better every word we speak ( it used to break down every raindrop falling on the island ) . ATM machines , 10 years ago , Lamai had 1 and no bank .. had to go to Nathon . If your complaint is the building and the dirt from beach and sea i agree ... but the rest ... i see normal growing development .

[Ecchi]

Can you recommend any place with a more friendly

atmosphere and good beaches?

blackpool

That made me laugh.

[PhilHarries]

I agree with some points from the OP.

But there are some that are trying to improve Koh Samui.

I attended a meeting yesterday where the dive companies on Samui are working together with Thai Hotels Association (THA).

Between the dive schools and THA we are have agreed an agenda where we are going to work together and arrange beach clean up days. meet with the local tesserban and push for beach rubbish bins etc.

The THA have also arranged for a childrens day on 10th Jan where local school children will be invited to hotels and shown differant forms of recycling methods.

Im not sure if im allowed to mention hotels, but Kandaburi Hotel are one of the big hotels who are backing this project.

I know it is only a very small project, but hopefully this post may encourage some other posters who are living here long term to get involved with projects like this, which can only improve Koh Samui.

Thanks.

This is just the kind of initiative I was on about. It doesn't take a mega buck, sensational publicity stunt. What it does need is events like this to change attitudes and make people aware of the damage they are doing and how, with very little effort, they can improve their environment. Then when they can see that this improvement it will encourage them further and more people to join in and the place becomes more enjoyable both for locals and tourists.

One day events like beach cleanups, whilst admirable and only to be encouraged, only correct the effect whilst not addressing the cause. Attitudes need changing so thay people don't just write off their piece of litter as "just one little plastic bag" but consider the effect of one bag perperson per day. The push for beach rubbish bins is also an important support effort but they need to be reguarly emptied.

Okay this only affects the cleanliness of the place but it's a start. Get people to take a pride in their surroundings and you've taken a great step forward in many ways not just one.

[Japhrodisiac]

What is sad about living here is that the island is close to being great, but fails misreably to change itself that last few percent that would make it that much more habitable and enjoyable. Some things will never change. When Chaweng was developed, the beach road was put in the wrong place, cutting off the beach from the public. You have to walk through a resort, reastaurant or find one of the few narrow paths that squeeze between buildings to get to the beach, which is public. This only happens in Samui, as Pattaya, Phuket, Krabi etc all planned their beach strips accordingly. This will never change on Samui. The allocation and planning of land use here benefits only a few locals, that's it.

There are few places on the island where you can walk comfortably without trespassing on private property. Where to picnic or take your dog for a walk? My mother was here last year and proclaimed the island the most pedestrian -unfriendly place in the world, and she has travelled every continent.

What can change here are the roads, drainage, garbage bins and collection etc. tidied up power lines, zoning, building restriction enforced and more. My Thai neighbors have garbage strewn all around their road and lawn, with a public bin and daily pickup 15 meters from their house. They can't seem to ever put garbage in a bag and put it in the bin, ever, even when i buy the bags for them. Therefore there are rats sometimes running around their house and they will spend hours trying to catch them and devise ways to get rid of them. Guhhh. 1+1=I dunno...

Samui seems to be unique in this regard. Go have a look at Krabi, the roads are immaculate, planning is well carried out and the place is spotless. My girlfriend is from a small town with no money in northern thailand, and their town is clean, no garbage left about and things kept in their place. If there is a hole in the road near their house and the tessabaan won't fix it, they pour some leftover concrete in the hole themselves.

Some good, some bad, a lot of potential that may never be reached. Samui in a nutshell.