Thaksin Supporters To Rally During Two-day Parliament Meeting

[Plus]

So what if they succede in shutting down parliament today?

The session is postponed till 2PM now, and if they can't get MPs inside by that time it would probably be postponed until tomorrow.

All in all Abhisit has 15 days according to the constitution, until Jan 7. That is three working days next week. Can Reds stay on for that long?

What will they do if they can't? What image they will project of themselves?

That they stalled the government from working for a week? With all the crises coming down at once and no government, they won't get any simpathy from the public.

What if they force new elections? No government for about two months and then all this pro-Thaksin vs PAD fight starts all over again? How do they expect people to vote for them? They had a year in power and what good came out of it?

What they are doing now is a sure way to lose elections BIG time.

[Scott]

It was just covered a while ago on CNN, so Thailand is back in the news once again.

[sriracha john]

Red Shirt protesters on a previous occasion

Red Shirt Protesters Promise to Let MPs into Parliament

Key leaders of pro-PTP or the red shirt protesters have surrounded Parliament and have said MPs will be allowed to enter Parliament via the Pichai Rd entrance.

If MPs decided to travel to Parliament, they'll be force to park near Chart Thai party and make their way on foot to Parliament. However the Democrats are concerned about the safety of Party MPs, fearing a repeat of violent attacks against non-PTP MPs when PM Abhisit Vejjajiva was voted as premier.

TOC / 2008-12-29

[hammered]

-The Intnl media (and even some originating here ala Jonathan Head of the BBC) appear to paint Thaksin and his proxy parties as 'champions for the poor' also as 'victims' of an 'elite conspiracy', unfair courts and un-democratic processes. The merits or lack thereof of these constant Intnl media 'talking points' could be debated forever. The reality is, with Mr Kasit as Foreign Minister, these themes will be played over and over as the ONLY issues... It won't even matter 'if' or when PM Abhisit applies the rule of accountable law to the PAD's past actions, the main Intnl media 'talking points' will likely remain as if sung through a prepared one-sided hymn-sheet...

-I'll agree with Jonathan Head (if he stops reporting from his Bkk CBD balcony primarily) also with The Economist and others, a certain restrictive law on freedom of speech absolutely should be reviewed (by Parliament, whom are the body implementing it). It would also be refreshing if Mr Head, The Economist and others might also report rounded facts, not ill-researched one-sided pieces (at best) or innuendo, hyperbole or mere opinions masqueraded as 'news' or worse, insinuated as complete 'facts'...

-Speaking of which, Mr Thaksin, via his PR man's long-time partnership with Intnl media tone-setters such as 'The Economist' and 'BusinessWeek' and others appear to be having a field day at Thailand's expense. All pronouncing the same 'Thaksin victim' and 'champion for poor people' and 'defender of democracy' theme over and over and over as well, further casting a blindingly one-sided black-eye on Thailand. At least it makes for sympathetic Intnl reading for the self-appointed 'victim' (Thaksin apparently, not Thailand).

...

Some support Yellow, some support Red, I personally support Green (as in green-light) and Thailand moving forward.

Yes, the international media have got it all wrong, and some Canadian guy who runs a classified ads magazine has figured it all out. Would a democratic, forward looking, more egalitrian Thailand be bad for used car sales? Maybe that's why you chose the colour green?

Seriously though - this is not an outright flame - I agree with you that Thaksin is milking the victim thing and we know he's a bent as most other rich people in this country - and all those PAD-bureaucrats with their 23,245 Baht per month salaries - just enough to afford the cost of gas for their Benz.

So let's keep things in perspective. This isn't about Thaksin anymore (and probably never really was) - it's about the well-connected patron-client system abusers who are terrified that one-person-one-vote will lead to the dismantling of that system - one through which they have so richly feathered their nests. They saw what Thaksin was able to do through mobilizing the nation's poor behind him - this military-bureacratic-business/elite troika is determined that populist politics must be put down. That's their collective motivation. They are now frightened (or increasingly nervous at least) that the international media have figured this out so fast. It's alarming..that's why the attacks (legal and otherwise) against Head and the others are being stepped up on foreign journalists.

I think we need to be careful about not confusing two things.

When we talk about a patron client relationship we include apart fom those always labelled elite the very people in TRT/PPP/Whatever they are labelled now as the patrons as much as anyone else. These feudal barons, rice millers and elite provincial families along with Thaksin and PPP and TRT never ever intended to end the system. They were part of it and at best wanted a slight realignment to enable them over others.

Then we have a fair and just system if such a thing exisits which is moot for all the people of Thailand. That is a completely seperate issue and one that cannot be resolved by coattailing Thaksin, and probbaly cant be resolved until such a false prophet as Thaksin is out of the way or exposed as a false prophet.

Which leads us to what it is about right now is whether Thaksin remains a viable politco in Thailand or not. If the current government last a while he ceases to be this. Oddly enough that would be worse for the patron-client system than if he were to return. A return would just set back the masses a they accpeted another reinstalled version of patron-client with a new figurehead. Still I doubt the western media or the even worse Thai media or any of the useless academics who claim a background in Thai studies will be able to analyse anything outside their one shoe fits all or heavily assumption based theories.

By the way note how a complete rake of populist policies are about to be enacted by the current governmetn without any criticism by the so called troika. Just another point that exposes it is currently about Thaksin and not about populist policies and all that stuff. The fair system is a stage we possibly (conditions allowing) move onto later when the false prophets are exposed and the ordinary people realise the nature of the power. There are no short cuts to this. It will occur, if it is going to occur at all, when the ordinary people realise what is going on and organise themselves and create their own politcal parties. Some bunch of self serving red shirt publicity heads allied to the very people in the provinces that exploit the poor aint going to bring any change to ordinary peeople. However, it will bring a realignemnt of more political power to the nice upper middle class and elite groups that support the red shirt movement.

Peace

[Briggsy]

All the ducks are lining up for the military to come out on the streets.

They will go to extreme measures to protect the power they have plotted hard to regain. They will go to extreme measures if they perceive any threat to the nation's highest institution. International condemnation is only a minor consideration for them.

I do hope it doesn't end in mass bloodshed again.

[hammered]

All the ducks are lining up for the military to come out on the streets.

They will go to extreme measures to protect the power they have plotted hard to regain. They will go to extreme measures if they perceive any threat to the nation's highest institution. International condemnation is only a minor consideration for them.

I do hope it doesn't end in mass bloodshed again.

It is fairly obvious to a lot of people that this is the last chance for parliament to sort it out and try to install a government. It is fairly obvious that a lot of people are also sick and tired or street demos and paralysis. It is fairly obvious that further street protests by either side will no longer be popular if they ever were. It is fairly obvious that the business community and increasingly other sectors of the country have had enough of governments that do nothing to govern and only exist for other purposes. It is fairly obvious where this will all end up if parliament cannot sort it out in its last chance.

[nikster]

Thailand finally has an honest PM with good experience and the proper education and desire to save the country. Toxic Shitawatra is only interested in regaining his pot of gold. He doesn't give a *@% about Thailand's people.

It is totaly beyond reason that Toxic can manipulate the backing of so many stupid people after stealing so much from them. Thai stupidity is something most westerners will never understand. On second thought, many ThaiVisa people seem to understand. I guess Thais don't have an exclusive on stupidity.

Nope, people are stupid everywhere. Like, electing Bush not once, but twice, I think that's the pinnacle of stupidity I have seen during my lifetime. With tragic consequences too numerous to list.

For Thaksin, a few Billion Dollars go a long way anywhere, but even longer in Thailand. His support is 50% people who would personally benefit of his return, and the other 50% poor fools who still think the cares about them. Who don't see that his only motivation is an insatiable hunger for power and money.

I am mostly baffled about what seems to be the international press' verdict on Thaksin. I assume that this has been agreed upon by AP and Reuters because no matter where you get your news from, it's the same thing: Thaksin is the only politician in Thai history to get elected twice, he is the champion of the poor, and beacon of democracy in Thailand. The rich and old elite have ousted him. Of course there is a grain of truth in all of these assertions, but what is never mentioned is that he also killed thousands without trial in the "war on drugs", and other humanitarian offenses. His corrupt schemes are also never mentioned even though he pretty much directly siphoned billions of tax payer money into his own companies and family businesses.

[animatic]

Thaksin's terrified that Aphisit's government, containing talented individuals such as himself, Korn, Jurin etc, will be successful and win over Issan's hearts. Then it's bye- bye for him forever and his minions who have come to depend on his funds for so long.

Some hearts will never be won, but enough to tip the balance would suffice.

But the acts needed to create this social turn-around would in of themselves be

a proof of the sea-change from the old Dems of memory, to a new entity with similar name.

I think this name is not on top of the same heads it once was.

And being saddled with the inevitable coallition dead weight,

doesn't mean it's there by choice, but by pragmatism.

If you can't get the controls you can't change things for good or ill.

Yes, Thaksin most be having many less than tranquil nights these days.

[animatic]

-The Intnl media (and even some originating here ala Jonathan Head of the BBC) appear to paint Thaksin and his proxy parties as 'champions for the poor' also as 'victims' of an 'elite conspiracy', unfair courts and un-democratic processes. ....

-Speaking of which, Mr Thaksin, via his PR man's long-time partnership with Intnl media tone-setters such as 'The Economist' and 'BusinessWeek' and others appear to be having a field day at Thailand's expense. ............

So let's keep things in perspective. This isn't about Thaksin anymore (and probably never really was) - it's about the well-connected patron-client system abusers who are terrified that one-person-one-vote will lead to the dismantling of that system - one through which they have so richly feathered their nests. They saw what Thaksin was able to do through mobilizing the nation's poor behind him - this military-bureacratic-business/elite troika is determined that populist politics must be put down. That's their collective motivation. They are now frightened (or increasingly nervous at least) that the international media have figured this out so fast. It's alarming..that's why the attacks (legal and otherwise) against Head and the others are being stepped up on foreign journalists.

I think we need to be careful about not confusing two things.

When we talk about a patron client relationship we include apart fom those always labelled elite the very people in TRT/PPP/Whatever they are labelled now as the patrons as much as anyone else. These feudal barons, rice millers and elite provincial families along with Thaksin and PPP and TRT never ever intended to end the system. They were part of it and at best wanted a slight realignment to enable them over others. ....

....Then we have a fair and just system if such a thing exisits which is moot for all the people of Thailand.

That is a completely seperate issue and one that cannot be resolved by coattailing Thaksin,

and probably cant be resolved until such a false prophet as Thaksin is out of the way or exposed as a false prophet. ....

.......Some bunch of self serving red shirt publicity heads allied to the very people in the provinces that exploit the poor

aint going to bring any change to ordinary peeople.

However, it will bring a realignemnt of more political power to the nice upper middle class and elite groups

that support the red shirt movement.

Peace

Yes. The people are 'being played' by Thaksin for power and not their benefit.

He would just install his own elite, but with tighter and more vindictive reigns on all dissent.

[Maverell]

Here we go again... I am sure that one of the red shirts protesting today was wearing a yellow shirt at the airport the other week !! The joke continues.

[PeaceBlondie]

Maybe there is a ready market for a reversible tshirt, red on one side, yellow on the other. Or maybe alternating stripes....

[MyphuketLife]

UDD protesters on a previous occasion

UDD dares PM to enter parliament

<snip>

Come on how can you post an old picture that show ANIT-PAD in negative light with a new story? Why did you not show the gun shooting PAD picture with every PAD article you posted??????

Edited December 29, 2008 by MyphuketLife

[britmaveric]

^sriracha john is using unrelated imagery to manipulate the tone of the story. Clearly obvious he is promoting biased view point.

[MyphuketLife]

Red Shirt protesters on a previous occasion

Red Shirt Protesters Promise to Let MPs into Parliament

Key leaders of pro-PTP or the red shirt protesters have surrounded Parliament and have said MPs will be allowed to enter Parliament via the Pichai Rd entrance.

If MPs decided to travel to Parliament, they'll be force to park near Chart Thai party and make their way on foot to Parliament. However the Democrats are concerned about the safety of Party MPs, fearing a repeat of violent attacks against non-PTP MPs when PM Abhisit Vejjajiva was voted as premier.

TOC / 2008-12-29

Again with a picture that is old and not part of the story

But if the MP are worried about thier saftey they could always have the armed pad gaurds escort them ....

[Samuian]

Maybe there is a ready market for a reversible tshirt, red on one side, yellow on the other. Or maybe alternating stripes....

I would suggest merge them, to one constructive support power movement = green!

then we got the colors of Jamaica and can reggae all along, reggae, reggae, reggae...

"song of freedom", hope it's going to be rewritten in the near future!

But then it seems that many do have an opinion, express the same, for the sake of it,

but are hardly are sure or double check, what information, made them observe the build up opinion.

The situation is now getting to the stress & fatigue points, as in:

"the patient looks similar to the one we just released and has similar wound and symptoms too, let him die!"

Would that be a clever conclusion?

[Thai at Heart]

Indeed, posting pictures which are not from today's protests is extremely disingenuous.

[Felt 35]

I really wonder where are the people with genuine good intentions and when will they find the support of the majority.....

Im afraid there are some words in the above sentence left out of Thai history.....

[pumpuiman]

Red Shirt protesters on a previous occasion

Red Shirt Protesters Promise to Let MPs into Parliament

Key leaders of pro-PTP or the red shirt protesters have surrounded Parliament and have said MPs will be allowed to enter Parliament via the Pichai Rd entrance.

If MPs decided to travel to Parliament, they'll be force to park near Chart Thai party and make their way on foot to Parliament. However the Democrats are concerned about the safety of Party MPs, fearing a repeat of violent attacks against non-PTP MPs when PM Abhisit Vejjajiva was voted as premier.

TOC / 2008-12-29

Again with a picture that is old and not part of the story

But if the MP are worried about thier saftey they could always have the armed pad gaurds escort them ....

Apparently someone is used to that kind of propaganda being fed to the sheep watching ASTV.....And is trying to serve it here. He doesn't realize that there are only 3 or 4 sheep here (we all know who they are) and that the rest of us can think for ourselves.

I've given up arguing with them...their posts are so ridiculous no argument is necessary

Edited December 29, 2008 by pumpuiman

[baht&sold]

UDD may find passion for protest waning

Bangkok Post/Veera Prateepchaikul Dec 29, 2008

It is obvious that the pro-Thaksin United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD) will not give the Democrat-led government a moment's peace, let alone a five-day long holiday to celebrate the New Year that the government granted as a gift to the working people.

The red shirt supporters of fugitive former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra - many of them bused to Bangkok from the North and Northeast courtesy of the rally organisers - descended on Sanam Luang yesterday where they began a marathon protest against the government until there is a general election. The pretext for the protest is that Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva has no legitimacy to lead the administration because he dodged mandatory military conscription two decades ago. (The army earlier explained that Mr Abhisit, although he was not drafted as he was overseas studying, served as a teacher in the military academy.) It was also alleged that his cabinet could not be trusted as several of them are under-qualified while others have tainted records.

Well, the red shirt leaders can dream up whatever allegations they like to justify their protest. But the bottom line is quite obvious, that is they want a fresh election so the Puea Thai party will have a chance to stage a comeback and thus pave the way for the triumphant return home of their dear big boss, Thaksin, who will be whitewashed of all the pending charges against him and granted amnesty for his conviction.

The UDD core leaders have assured their supporters will not storm the parliament in the same way the anti-Thaksin People's Alliance for Democracy seized Government House when Mr Abhisit delivers his policy statement today.

But given the recent attack with stones on the cars of some Democrat MPs outside the parliament by some red shirt thugs to vent their fury against the Friends of Newin's "betrayal" of their boss, the assurance cannot be completely trusted, although the prime minister himself does not appear worried. Police have been told to exercise extreme restraint and to avoid using force against the protesters to avoid a repeat of the blunder by the previous Somchai administration when police resorted to excessive force to break up the PAD protesters outside the parliament in October.

According to the UDD's plans, Thaksin was invited to join the rally by phoning in from his undisclosed hideaway, perhaps in Hong Kong, to give his faithful supporters a rousing morale booster with his usual boring self-pitying and finger-pointing rhetoric.

Sadly though, the phone-in session which is always touted as the highlight of UDD rallies seems to have lost the magic touch. The last phone-in session which took place in Khon Kaen was not even mentioned in any mainstream newspaper.

There is an old Thai saying which goes: "Three days away, a girl changes heart."

Veera Prateepchaikul is Deputy Editor-in-Chief, Post Publishing Co Ltd.

Continues here....

Edited December 29, 2008 by baht&sold

[Samuian]

I really wonder where are the people with genuine good intentions and when will they find the support of the majority.....

Im afraid there are some words in the above sentence left out of Thai history.....

it's 3 aren't they?

that would explain then, why even so called "social critics" or "intellectuals", seem to criticize for the sake of it and be in the lime light as well, not being left out, some of what they say seems so out of context.

having all the assembled watchdogs out there - give 'em a chance, befoer they have to resign... there is a chance!

[animatic]

All the ducks are lining up for the military to come out on the streets.

They will go to extreme measures to protect the power they have plotted hard to regain. They will go to extreme measures if they perceive any threat to the nation's highest institution. International condemnation is only a minor consideration for them.

I do hope it doesn't end in mass bloodshed again.

It is fairly obvious to a lot of people that this is the last chance for parliament to sort it out and try to install a government. It is fairly obvious that a lot of people are also sick and tired or street demos and paralysis. It is fairly obvious that further street protests by either side will no longer be popular if they ever were. It is fairly obvious that the business community and increasingly other sectors of the country have had enough of governments that do nothing to govern and only exist for other purposes. It is fairly obvious where this will all end up if parliament cannot sort it out in its last chance.

Sums it up fairly.

[animatic]

Red Shirt protesters on a previous occasion

Red Shirt Protesters Promise to Let MPs into Parliament

Key leaders of pro-PTP or the red shirt protesters have surrounded Parliament and have said MPs will be allowed to enter Parliament via the Pichai Rd entrance.

If MPs decided to travel to Parliament, they'll be force to park near Chart Thai party and make their way on foot to Parliament. However the Democrats are concerned about the safety of Party MPs, fearing a repeat of violent attacks against non-PTP MPs when PM Abhisit Vejjajiva was voted as premier.

TOC / 2008-12-29

Again with a picture that is old and not part of the story

But if the MP are worried about thier saftey they could always have the armed pad gaurds escort them ....

Yes, old picture... like last week old...

and it's 'Red Shirts at Parlement' just like today was forecast.

Completely relevant.

Edited December 29, 2008 by animatic

[MyphuketLife]

Yes, old picuture... like last week old...

and it's 'Red Shirts at Parlement' just like today was forecast.

Completely relevant.

It's not relevant to todays protest, it is of an earlier protest.... But don't put an old violent picture up with an article about today's so far peaceful protest. It gives the viewer the impression that things are violent, and currently that is not the case.

Also it's "red shirts at parlement", but the old picture he used does not even have a red shirt

Now if it turns violent today, then put up todays violent pictures with a story about the protest today....

Edited December 29, 2008 by MyphuketLife

[chowder]

It's not relevant to todays protest, it is of an earlier protest.... But don't put an old violent picture up with an article about today's so far peaceful protest. It gives the viewer the impression that things are violent, and currently that is not the case.

Now if it turns violent today, then put up todays violent pictures with a story about the protest today....

same thug different day man!!!

[sriracha john]

Red Shirt protesters on a previous occasion

Red Shirt Protesters Promise to Let MPs into Parliament

Key leaders of pro-PTP or the red shirt protesters have surrounded Parliament and have said MPs will be allowed to enter Parliament via the Pichai Rd entrance.

If MPs decided to travel to Parliament, they'll be force to park near Chart Thai party and make their way on foot to Parliament. However the Democrats are concerned about the safety of Party MPs, fearing a repeat of violent attacks against non-PTP MPs when PM Abhisit Vejjajiva was voted as premier.

TOC / 2008-12-29

Again with a picture that is old and not part of the story

I'll understand if you've forgotten this part of the story... afterall, it has been 14 days.

[sriracha john]

Indeed, posting pictures which are not from today's protests is extremely disingenuous.

Does that include the plethora of photos that have been posted from the 1930's?

Edited December 29, 2008 by sriracha john

[Plus]

I don't know why SJ put that picture in the post, but if you were thinking about passing through a long corridor of red shirts and assessing your chances, images like that are a kind of come to mind first. Or the other famous one, with a huge brick smashing through car window.

Suthep has offered negotiations with Red leaders, he said Dems won't use force but rather negotiate their way out. He himself has been chased away by reds recently, on a visit to Isan, had to flee the hotel via back door. Pretty much the same treatment PAD gave to ministers visiting the South.

[MyphuketLife]

It's not relevant to todays protest, it is of an earlier protest.... But don't put an old violent picture up with an article about today's so far peaceful protest. It gives the viewer the impression that things are violent, and currently that is not the case.

Now if it turns violent today, then put up todays violent pictures with a story about the protest today....

same thug different day man!!!

Really that same guy featured in the picture is at the protests today? and is carying around bricks today?

If he wanted to feature a picture of the RED crowd with todays article then it should be a picture from today.

[Thai at Heart]

Indeed, posting pictures which are not from today's protests is extremely disingenuous.

Does that include the plethora of photos that have been posted from the 1930's?

I have tried to find pictures of what is happening myself today. Can't really find any, but did see on TV that the police are sleeping soundly in the car park after a heavy lunch.

[sriracha john]

Yes, old picuture... like last week old...

and it's 'Red Shirts at Parlement' just like today was forecast.

Completely relevant.

It's not relevant to todays protest, it is of an earlier protest.... But don't put an old violent picture up with an article about today's so far peaceful protest. It gives the viewer the impression that things are violent, and currently that is not the case.

Also it's "red shirts at parlement", but the old picture he used does not even have a red shirt

Now if it turns violent today, then put up todays violent pictures with a story about the protest today....

Hence.... the use of "on a previous occasion" which, apparently, I mistakenly presumed that everyone knew its meaning.