Bars To Stay Open To 4 Am

[geriatrickid]

To improve business revenues for the Patong bars doing poorly, there are consultations with bar owners to allow bars to remain open till 4 am with music.

How do I know? Because the coppers were handing out the fliers for the meetings when I was in the bar

Very very stupid idea.

This will solve nothing.

More drunks on the road.

[Carib]

mmm, the time for "falling' of buildings will shift too..

[PhilHarries]

Disagree that there will be more drunks on the road. The bars are doing poorly because there's not the quantity of high spending customers. Allowing them to open later only spreads those customers more thinly. Okay there will be a few that are encouraged to stay later because of the music but the bottom line is in times of drought there is only so much water. The only way to make that water go further is to reduce the numbers drinking from the trough.

So I agree with the bottom line : It'll solve nothing.

[LivinginKata]

The only way to make that water go further is to reduce the numbers drinking from the trough.

But it's not about making the water go further by reducing the numbers drinking, surely it's about increasing the supply of water, i.e.increasing the numbers drinking. You might want to rephrase the above.....

[PhilHarries]

The only way to make that water go further is to reduce the numbers drinking from the trough.

But it's not about making the water go further by reducing the numbers drinking, surely it's about increasing the supply of water, i.e.increasing the numbers drinking. You might want to rephrase the above.....

Yes, but how are the bar owners going to increase the number of tourists who make up the majority of drinkers in places like Phuket?

Of course you are also right that the bar owners could do something to encourage more people to spend time in the bars like reduce prices . But that breaks the Thailand bar operating rule #1 : It is better to be making 80 Baht profit per beer on five customers drinking for two hours than 50 Baht on ten customers drinking for four hours with the additional food/snack sales potential. But this remedy is more likely to lead to more drunk on the roads, but I suppose if you have to have drunks on the roads better they are there 4am than 11pm.

So sticking within the operating rules it seems a cull of the weaker bars may be the way forward. Exactly the same as will inevitably happen not only countrywide but worldwide and not only the bar business.

[LivinginKata]

So sticking within the operating rules it seems a cull of the weaker bars may be the way forward. Exactly the same as will inevitably happen not only countrywide but worldwide and not only the bar business.

Ah... but your are forgetting the golden rule in Thailand, if profits are down due to decrease in income, no problem .. just increase the income by increasing the prices = same profit. Only problem is that the regular punters quickly catch onto the increase and move on the bars with non tourist prices. Tourist numbers will soon be way down = big problem for the 'expensive' bars.

[keestha]

It is always a good idea to allow bars to stay open longer, ideally they should be allowed to operate around the clock if they wish so.

In the Netherlands, it is up to the municipality to decide at what time bars have to close, if they want to put a closing time in place at all.

In cities where a closing time is enforced, drinkers all of a sudden find themselves on the street at 1AM or so, and they create noise and sometimes disturbances. In cities without a closing time, for those not ready to call it a day (night?) yet there is always another place to go to.

I remember feeling sorry for the few police officers around at 2AM in Soi Cowboy, Bangkok, when the street suddely filled up with noisy not satisfied yet revellers.

[samuibeachcomber]

Disagree that there will be more drunks on the road. The bars are doing poorly because there's not the quantity of high spending customers. Allowing them to open later only spreads those customers more thinly. Okay there will be a few that are encouraged to stay later because of the music but the bottom line is in times of drought there is only so much water. The only way to make that water go further is to reduce the numbers drinking from the trough.

So I agree with the bottom line : It'll solve nothing.

or reduce opening and closing hours,hence cutting overheads.not practical i know.

[huggybear]

The only way to make that water go further is to reduce the numbers drinking from the trough.

But it's not about making the water go further by reducing the numbers drinking, surely it's about increasing the supply of water, i.e.increasing the numbers drinking. You might want to rephrase the above.....

Of course you are also right that the bar owners could do something to encourage more people to spend time in the bars like reduce prices .

That's spot on. 150thb for a beer is a joke...............

[geriatrickid]

Lost in this discussion is the hel_l it will wreak on the workers lives. What many people do not appreciate is that those bargirls/boys are virtual prisoners in many of these establishments. Here's the daily routine in working chronology.

Night Focus: Typical soi bar (excluding some of the bigger clubs) starts welcoming customers from 7-8pm onwards. Business picks up at 10pm and runs until 1:30 pm for most bars. Even though there may be no customers or only a handful, staff is expected to sit around trying to attract customers. Bar closes when boss says so. If it is 4 am then that will be the time. Staff will either go inside, whereby the owner then locks down the bar (yes, that's right, the workers are locked inside.) If staff wants out, it has to pay bar fine or maybe go with customer. At present closing of approx. 2 am, bar owner usually reappears next morning to unlock bar and allow workers out at around 12-1pm. Workers then clean the bar or run errands for boss. Workers are allowed a few hours off in afternoon, however, there is usually a meeting at 5 pm to discuss activities. If not back in time, the workers gets reprimanded.

Ok, so basically what will happen is that the workers will have to work several extra hours with no additional pay. Nice.

Day Focus: Won't matter as the bars will probably still close at the customary hours.

I think where we will see the longer operating hours will be Bangla Rd and Paradise complex area of Patong. Personally, I won't shed a tear if the heavens rain down meteorites upon both locations and render them silent, preferably with some of the bar owners too.

[markg]

Good points Geriatric.

From my own experience in the West, when bars went from fixed 2 am closing times, to varied 'up to you' closing times, many bar/club owners told me that it just wasnt worth staying open much after 3am because everyone is already drunk and really not much more beer gets sold after 2am, The extra beer they sold was offset by the extra staff wages.

On a positive note, in the city i come from in the UK, not having clubs all closing at the same time was an initiative led by the Police. It stopped a large influx of drunk people being on the streets at the same time. The taxi-drivers could cope with the numbers if the bars closed at different times throughout the night. Apparently the initiative worked too.

In a 'normal' city, i think 3am is late enough. However, Patong is a 'holiday' city so different rules apply.

[Yahooka]

Lost in this discussion is the hel_l it will wreak on the workers lives. What many people do not appreciate is that those bargirls/boys are virtual prisoners in many of these establishments. Here's the daily routine in working chronology.

Night Focus: Typical soi bar (excluding some of the bigger clubs) starts welcoming customers from 7-8pm onwards. Business picks up at 10pm and runs until 1:30 pm for most bars. Even though there may be no customers or only a handful, staff is expected to sit around trying to attract customers. Bar closes when boss says so. If it is 4 am then that will be the time. Staff will either go inside, whereby the owner then locks down the bar (yes, that's right, the workers are locked inside.) If staff wants out, it has to pay bar fine or maybe go with customer. At present closing of approx. 2 am, bar owner usually reappears next morning to unlock bar and allow workers out at around 12-1pm.

geriatrickid, can you please enlight us where in Patong/Phuket you find bars which "lock" their employes inside after closing hours ???? Been coming here for 15 years and the only seen that ONCE and that was more than 10 years ago !!

Edited January 11, 2009 by Yahooka

[PhilHarries]

So sticking within the operating rules it seems a cull of the weaker bars may be the way forward. Exactly the same as will inevitably happen not only countrywide but worldwide and not only the bar business.

Ah... but your are forgetting the golden rule in Thailand, if profits are down due to decrease in income, no problem .. just increase the income by increasing the prices = same profit. Only problem is that the regular punters quickly catch onto the increase and move on the bars with non tourist prices. Tourist numbers will soon be way down = big problem for the 'expensive' bars.

Correct! I'd forgotten that golden rule that applies across the board in Thai business. But that's back to my original post regarding numbers of drinkers and profit margins.

But keestha is correct in that government should not get involved in fixing trading hours for any kind of business. No businessman is going to be open and paying overheads when there is no trade to be had.

As for the UK there were howls of protest from all manner of people when the government introduced unlimited drinking hours. People were throwing up Hogarthian visions of a modern day Soddom and Gomorrah with raging drunks roaming the streets on a 24/7 basis. As it was, in the entire country, a grand total of 12 (roughly, can't recall exact number but that is close) establishment applied for 24 hour licences and I don't think one of them kept up 24 hour opening more than a few symbolic months. Now it has settled down and whilst pubs have licences for extended hours few actually use them on a regular basis. But it does mean if they have a good crowd in one night they can stay open a little longer. Also if there is a major sports event in say Asia they can stay open for it without having to apply for an extension to permitted hours.

But it's funny how people moan about government interference in daily life but then call for more restrictions on anything that they don't either like or participate in. Oh well huMAN natURE I suppose (to quote BT).

As an off topic footnote the problems they're having in UK city centers these days with drunks has nothing to do with opening hours. It's more to do with happy hour drink promotions and the fact that most revellers are half p1ssed on cheap supermarket grog before they leave home.

I too would be interested in what bars lock their staff in when they close. Apart from fire regulations that must be against a whole raft of other laws. I have never known any bar in Thailand lock it's staff inside overnight.

[LivinginKata]

Staff will either go inside, whereby the owner then locks down the bar (yes, that's right, the workers are locked inside.) If staff wants out, it has to pay bar fine or maybe go with customer.

Really ... Can you supply the names of any bars that do that ??? Only places I've heard that lock-down their girls are the bigger brothels that 'buy' the girls (usually from the parents) such as the Kristin. Never heard of bars doing that.

[1000baht]

Staff will either go inside, whereby the owner then locks down the bar (yes, that's right, the workers are locked inside.) If staff wants out, it has to pay bar fine or maybe go with customer.

Really ... Can you supply the names of any bars that do that ??? Only places I've heard that lock-down their girls are the bigger brothels that 'buy' the girls (usually from the parents) such as the Kristin. Never heard of bars doing that.

Me either, I seriosuly cant see that happening, maybe the owner locks the place down, but surely the workers can go.

[geriatrickid]

Basically, any bar that provides a place to sleep to the workers (usually one room in which up to 10 boys or girls will sleep on mats) with little air circulation, subject to mosquito infestations and often no fans. These bars are the ones that have the corrugated doors that swing down and are padlocked from the outside.

Obviously, not all bars behave in such a manner, but I saw enough last year to know Patong has a plenty. I'd say it's only a matter of time until there is a tragedy in the Paradise complex. Don't believe me, go and see for yourself. The bars closest to Rat U do this every night. You can't access subjects at times because they are locked inside. They either have to climb down from the 3rd floor using ledges and wires or climb up if the doors are locked. It's an absolute violation of the fire code, but hey, in Patong the local authorities do not do anything about it, nor do the police. The Issan slaves are expendable and easily replaced. I was interviewing a bunch of them 2 nights ago and watched them scramble back to their concrete cages or face getting locked out. Many staff members are not thrilled by extended hours.

I'm all for longer operating hours if the situation was monitored and policed, but TiT, so it will just go crazy until the pendulum shifts the otherway. No thought has gone into this. Sure I can understand some bars on Bangla. It might make sense for smaller bars, but does Tiger or Tai Pan really need to operate another 2 hours? In respect to the host/hostess bars, I wonder what good it will do since the customers will have already selected their companion by midnight and left for whatever.

[Samuian]

Places who do operate under a "special License" are jam packed after closing time 02:00 am!

tells a clear story somewhere...why not spread it ore evenly and let the consumer decide?

[misterman21]

Lost in this discussion is the hel_l it will wreak on the workers lives. What many people do not appreciate is that those bargirls/boys are virtual prisoners in many of these establishments. Here's the daily routine in working chronology.

Night Focus: Typical soi bar (excluding some of the bigger clubs) starts welcoming customers from 7-8pm onwards. Business picks up at 10pm and runs until 1:30 pm for most bars. Even though there may be no customers or only a handful, staff is expected to sit around trying to attract customers. Bar closes when boss says so. If it is 4 am then that will be the time. Staff will either go inside, whereby the owner then locks down the bar (yes, that's right, the workers are locked inside.) If staff wants out, it has to pay bar fine or maybe go with customer. At present closing of approx. 2 am, bar owner usually reappears next morning to unlock bar and allow workers out at around 12-1pm. Workers then clean the bar or run errands for boss. Workers are allowed a few hours off in afternoon, however, there is usually a meeting at 5 pm to discuss activities. If not back in time, the workers gets reprimanded.

Ok, so basically what will happen is that the workers will have to work several extra hours with no additional pay. Nice.

Day Focus: Won't matter as the bars will probably still close at the customary hours.

I think where we will see the longer operating hours will be Bangla Rd and Paradise complex area of Patong. Personally, I won't shed a tear if the heavens rain down meteorites upon both locations and render them silent, preferably with some of the bar owners too.

You are certainly well named my grumpy fellow. I think you may find that the bar girls and boys would have more to complain about if hours were to be reduced. Pesonaly I won't shed a tear if the geriatric types are snuffed out by a meteorite

[misterman21]

Basically, any bar that provides a place to sleep to the workers (usually one room in which up to 10 boys or girls will sleep on mats) with little air circulation, subject to mosquito infestations and often no fans. These bars are the ones that have the corrugated doors that swing down and are padlocked from the outside.

Obviously, not all bars behave in such a manner, but I saw enough last year to know Patong has a plenty. I'd say it's only a matter of time until there is a tragedy in the Paradise complex. Don't believe me, go and see for yourself. The bars closest to Rat U do this every night. You can't access subjects at times because they are locked inside. They either have to climb down from the 3rd floor using ledges and wires or climb up if the doors are locked. It's an absolute violation of the fire code, but hey, in Patong the local authorities do not do anything about it, nor do the police. The Issan slaves are expendable and easily replaced. I was interviewing a bunch of them 2 nights ago and watched them scramble back to their concrete cages or face getting locked out. Many staff members are not thrilled by extended hours.

I'm all for longer operating hours if the situation was monitored and policed, but TiT, so it will just go crazy until the pendulum shifts the otherway. No thought has gone into this. Sure I can understand some bars on Bangla. It might make sense for smaller bars, but does Tiger or Tai Pan really need to operate another 2 hours? In respect to the host/hostess bars, I wonder what good it will do since the customers will have already selected their companion by midnight and left for whatever.

I must add that you are constantly assuming that what you imagine is true! FACT - I personaly, and most of my mongering friends rarely select a companion before midnight - usualy after 2am when the bars are still open - unofficialy. We see it as a form of philanthropy

[LivinLOS]

Night Focus: Typical soi bar (excluding some of the bigger clubs) starts welcoming customers from 7-8pm onwards. Business picks up at 10pm and runs until 1:30 pm for most bars. Even though there may be no customers or only a handful, staff is expected to sit around trying to attract customers. Bar closes when boss says so. If it is 4 am then that will be the time. Staff will either go inside, whereby the owner then locks down the bar (yes, that's right, the workers are locked inside.) If staff wants out, it has to pay bar fine or maybe go with customer. At present closing of approx. 2 am, bar owner usually reappears next morning to unlock bar and allow workers out at around 12-1pm. Workers then clean the bar or run errands for boss. Workers are allowed a few hours off in afternoon, however, there is usually a meeting at 5 pm to discuss activities. If not back in time, the workers gets reprimanded.

Absolute <deleted>.. No 'typical soi bar' locks its staff in after the night.. In fact around the bangla road area its really rare to have onsite accommodation any more.. Even the seadragon places that have rooms and ST rooms are rarely using them for staff any more..

Yes longer hours mean longer work.. Of course.. But this talk of locking up staff at 2am and unlocking them midday the next day is fantasy. Maybe the Thai run Kata swamp bars ?? But normal soi bar beer bars.. Nope !!

[phuketrex]

I was interviewing a bunch of them 2 nights ago and watched them scramble back to their concrete cages or face getting locked out. Many staff members are not thrilled by extended hours.

Strange thing to say. So you a journalist then?

[K2K]

Lost in this discussion is the hel_l it will wreak on the workers lives. What many people do not appreciate is that those bargirls/boys are virtual prisoners in many of these establishments. Here's the daily routine in working chronology.

Night Focus: Typical soi bar (excluding some of the bigger clubs) starts welcoming customers from 7-8pm onwards. Business picks up at 10pm and runs until 1:30 pm for most bars. Even though there may be no customers or only a handful, staff is expected to sit around trying to attract customers. Bar closes when boss says so. If it is 4 am then that will be the time. Staff will either go inside, whereby the owner then locks down the bar (yes, that's right, the workers are locked inside.) If staff wants out, it has to pay bar fine or maybe go with customer. At present closing of approx. 2 am, bar owner usually reappears next morning to unlock bar and allow workers out at around 12-1pm.

geriatrickid, can you please enlight us where in Patong/Phuket you find bars which "lock" their employes inside after closing hours ???? Been coming here for 15 years and the only seen that ONCE and that was more than 10 years ago !!

Yes Yahooka ... I can ... but wont and you know which they were anyway

(Wasnt 10 years ago eirher ... you got a short memory ... bloody A nal Gas & Co)

[Yahooka]

Lost in this discussion is the hel_l it will wreak on the workers lives. What many people do not appreciate is that those bargirls/boys are virtual prisoners in many of these establishments. Here's the daily routine in working chronology.

Night Focus: Typical soi bar (excluding some of the bigger clubs) starts welcoming customers from 7-8pm onwards. Business picks up at 10pm and runs until 1:30 pm for most bars. Even though there may be no customers or only a handful, staff is expected to sit around trying to attract customers. Bar closes when boss says so. If it is 4 am then that will be the time. Staff will either go inside, whereby the owner then locks down the bar (yes, that's right, the workers are locked inside.) If staff wants out, it has to pay bar fine or maybe go with customer. At present closing of approx. 2 am, bar owner usually reappears next morning to unlock bar and allow workers out at around 12-1pm.

geriatrickid, can you please enlight us where in Patong/Phuket you find bars which "lock" their employes inside after closing hours ???? Been coming here for 15 years and the only seen that ONCE and that was more than 10 years ago !!

Yes Yahooka ... I can ... but wont and you know which they were anyway

(Wasnt 10 years ago eirher ... you got a short memory ... bloody A nal Gas & Co)

555555555555555555......."thanks" a lot for reminding me !!

PS :Don`t tell geriatrickid !!