Red-shirted People Raid Santi Asoke Branch In Chiang Mai

[Xangsamhua]

Thy are all (Red and Yellow) like a bunch of kids at school it is about time they all grew up.They all have no interest in thailand just themselves.Do they not see what damage they are doing to the country.

I would have thought the contrary was the case. They are passionate about what is happening in their country. They just see things from opposite perspectives. (I'm not including the thousands who are brought to Bangkok for the big extravaganzas at the stadium or family picnic days at Sanam Luang.)

"A plague on both their houses" is a sentiment I can understand when confronted with unacceptable behaviour from both camps, but to dismiss their sincerity or wish they'd simply not arisen is to ignore the serious tensions in Thai society and the responses of the opposing sides. I think people have to take a stand, but without painting themselves into a corner.

[cmsally]

If local radio is correct there was in fact a bigger incident at Chiang Mai Uni yesterday when red shirts surrounded a meeting hall looking for Suthep. He apparently escaped out of a back entrance and there was one person injured with a gunshot wound. Just reporting what the local radio said.

What the red shirts are doing is no worse than what the yellow shirts did, they passionately hate the new govt and its entourage and won't accept it here.

[Xangsamhua]

Chamlong shouldn't hide behind his supporters, whether they be monks or old ladies.

One can picture him peeping out from under a refractory table, quivering with fear, "Don't tell the red shirts and the Nation that i'm under here".

In the meantime, as usual, his frontline supporters are taking the punishment - in this case a foot clapper beating.

If his case is as strong as he says it if, and if Kwanchai is such a lummox, ho should have no trouble defeating either him or Thaksin in public debate.

<edit: that should be a 'refrectory' table>

Try "refectory".

Journalist, this is good cartoon stuff, or perhaps melodrama, but really....!

I don't know about Kwanchai, but Thaksin would never agree to a public debate. Sonthi Limthongkul invited him in 2006, but he would only agree to a discussion behind closed doors.

[sriracha john]

Roi Et - Some 2,000 red-shirt supporters of former prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra yesterday stormed through a security cordon of nearly 1,000 police officers

It reminds me of Tom Clancy's novel titled, "Red Storm Rising"

Police barricades stormed

Scores of red-shirted demonstrators stormed police barricades outside Chiang Mai University yesterday in an apparent attempt to stop Deputy Prime Minister Suthep Thaugsuban from attending the CMU alumni night. One person was reportedly injured after some demonstrators tried to crash their cars into police blockades set up outside the CMU auditorium. Police reportedly fired shots to flatten car tyres and stop the demonstrators from ramming their vehicles into the barriers. The demonstrators, led by Phetchawat Wattanapongsirikul of the Rak Chiang Mai 51 group, split into two groups with one gathering at Chiang Mai airport and the other at the gates of the Wing 41 late in the afternoon following reports that Mr Suthep would arrive at about 6pm to join the party. As the arrival time approached, another group of demonstrators was mobilised to seal off the two access routes to the CMU auditorium, where 300 police had erected barricades to beef up security. Some of the demonstrators then tried to crash their vehicles into the barriers in their attempt to break through police lines. Several gunshots were then heard, leaving a demonstrator injured. Phetchawat, upset by the police action, called a radio station run by members of a red-shirted network and asked them to urge "the reds" to come out in force to protest against the police. The party proceeded last night without Mr Suthep in attendance. In Roi Et, supporters of the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) yesterday decided to cancel their gathering when some 2,000 red-shirted demonstrators turned up at Bueng Plan Chai, the designated venue. The outnumbered PAD demonstrators were forced to dismantle the stage. There were reports of scuffles, but no serious injuries.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/local/1037...ricades-stormed

[animatic]

This all highlights what is so drastically wrong with the Red Shirt side.

They allow NO dissenting talk if they can stop it.

I have heard yellow shorts called fascists many times,

but what is called violence, occuring infrequently, from their side,

pales in comparison with the other side's frequent stronger tactics

vs anyone disagreeing at ANY time.

Thaksin can only regain his booty by civil war, or close to it as a barganing chip.

His hyped up / hopped up minions seem to have taken on a life of their own

as barely-controlled rabble, and use his defeat as their reason for existence.

They don't see that he's toast, or if they do, they want revenge on-going...

Problem is their tactics, such as raiding temples and hitting monks with foot clappers,

and attacking universities and such, as Standard Operating Procedures, is abysmal.

No matter how much of a fringe element Santi Asoke is, it's STILL monks and a temple

being attacked. Few Thai's will be tolerant of hitting monks, of any variation, with foot shapes.

Lets not forget killing the father of the radio host too, dragging him from his car,

in blatant disregard for all human rights. Oh my, his son disagrees with us; KILL HIM!

Sickening mindset, or mob mentality.

My wife wants us to move to Chaing mai, and I just can't imagine it....

Not while these nut cases rule the roost up there.

Edited January 25, 2009 by animatic

[Ulysses G.]

Neither side is peaceful and nothing that they are doing is going to help the country in the long run. Still, at least the reds have waited until high season is nearly over before acting up.

[justanothercybertosser]

jbowman/josky

I don't think MOST Thais are too well versed in the Santi Asoke movement but in many instances the government has not been too kind to them. (They are a strict vegetarian movement that ordains female monks and is led by a controversial leader .. they are not a part of the Thai sangha and their dogma is not strictly orthodox though they certainly present it as such.) They are an interesting group, I have studied at Pathom Asoke for a weekend retreat and found them very interesting!

This incident here is a clear case of 'you reap what you sow'.

During the airport occupation a Dhamma Army lorry of Santi Asoke on the way to Suvarnabhumi was raided by police, guns and other weapons were confiscated.

That though was only worth one line in the news:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/291108_News/29Nov2008_news14.php

[sriracha john]

jbowman/josky

I don't think MOST Thais are too well versed in the Santi Asoke movement but in many instances the government has not been too kind to them. (They are a strict vegetarian movement that ordains female monks and is led by a controversial leader .. they are not a part of the Thai sangha and their dogma is not strictly orthodox though they certainly present it as such.) They are an interesting group, I have studied at Pathom Asoke for a weekend retreat and found them very interesting!

This incident here is a clear case of 'you reap what you sow'.

During the airport occupation a Dhamma Army lorry of Santi Asoke on the way to Suvarnabhumi was raided by police, guns and other weapons were confiscated.

That though was only worth one line in the news:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/291108_News/29Nov2008_news14.php

It was given as much print in the article as the news about the murder committed by red-shirts and the bit about ASTV getting bombed.

[animatic]

So we should not make distinctions between :

A small group of individuals in one truck, allegedly from a group, and no charges brought publicly.

vs

A large group acting violently, under direction, in concert, on a regular basis?

Within Santi Asoke they likely would be some PAD sympathizers, with access to a S.A. truck.

But that doesn't mean ALL Santi Asoke are PAD or had anything to do with the airport.

Nor does it automatically imply that it is a violent movement.

So why should ALL S.A. members be tarred with the same brush?

One truck incident doesn't justify attacking a temple in any way.

But it DOES show the violent propensity of this group in Chaing Mai.

They think it is OK to attack a temple because they don't like one man....

i.e. Shut up and leave or we will give you a beating or worse.

Edited January 25, 2009 by animatic

[Ulysses G.]

Shut up and leave or we will give you a beating or worse.

I'm sorry to have questioned your jugement Sir. You are right about everything!

[Journalist]

What is a 'foot clapper' anyway?

Is it a metre long and made of cast iron with nails sticking out of it? Or is it a small fluffy pillow?

[justanothercybertosser]

It was given as much print in the article as the news about the murder committed by red-shirts and the bit about ASTV getting bombed.

In this article it may have been given the same space. Nevertheless violence committed by yellow shirts has been given far less coverage than violence committed by red shirts. And there were plenty of violent acts committed by PAD, including 3 homicides that are known, and dozens of attempted homicides.

You may counter that 6 PAD members were killed by Red Shirts (2 more got themselves killed during Oct. 7), and i could answer that the first casualty was a Red Shirt beaten to death by PAD guards.

But this is not a numbers game.

If Santi Asoke or Yellow Shirts are attacked by Red Shirts, my compassion has limits, and the same counts for Red Shirts attacked by PAD. Both are movements that have shown themselves to be violent.

It is though amusing how some here desperately try to defend the indefensible, and are still siding with PAD. What makes this even more hilarious is that foreigners in Thailand defend PAD - a group that has shown numerous times to have clear anti-foreign tendencies.

[PoorSucker]

What is a 'foot clapper' anyway?

Is it a metre long and made of cast iron with nails sticking out of it? Or is it a small fluffy pillow?

A footclapper symbolizes the dirtiest part of the human body and is meant as an insult.

Hitting monks with it is to show the deepest disrespect for Buddhism.

It is though amusing how some here desperately try to defend the indefensible, and are still siding with PAD. What makes this even more hilarious is that foreigners in Thailand defend PAD - a group that has shown numerous times to have clear anti-foreign tendencies.

And Thai Rak Thai was very friendly to foreigners.

Edited January 25, 2009 by PoorSucker

[sriracha john]

It was given as much print in the article as the news about the murder committed by red-shirts and the bit about ASTV getting bombed.

In this article it may have been given the same space. Nevertheless violence committed by yellow shirts has been given far less coverage than violence committed by red shirts. And there were plenty of violent acts committed by PAD, including 3 homicides that are known, and dozens of attempted homicides.

You may counter that 6 PAD members were killed by Red Shirts (2 more got themselves killed during Oct. 7), and i could answer that the first casualty was a Red Shirt beaten to death by PAD guards.

But this is not a numbers game.

If Santi Asoke or Yellow Shirts are attacked by Red Shirts, my compassion has limits, and the same counts for Red Shirts attacked by PAD. Both are movements that have shown themselves to be violent.

It is though amusing how some here desperately try to defend the indefensible, and are still siding with PAD. What makes this even more hilarious is that foreigners in Thailand defend PAD - a group that has shown numerous times to have clear anti-foreign tendencies.

Almost as amusing as those people removed from the forum returning with the same comments.

btw, there's been dozens, if not hundreds, of articles posted in news clippings that detail the violence of both sides.

[Ulysses G.]

It is though amusing how some here desperately try to defend the indefensible, and are still siding with PAD. What makes this even more hilarious is that foreigners in Thailand defend PAD - a group that has shown numerous times to have clear anti-foreign tendencies.

And Thai Rak Thai was very friendly to foreigners.

They did not want us thrown out of the country and made it easier for us to get visas. That is good enough.

[Koo82]

I have 2 foot clappers bought when we joined the rally on 30 Dec 2008.

Feet are important. Without them, you cannot stand up for your rights.

[PoorSucker]

It is though amusing how some here desperately try to defend the indefensible, and are still siding with PAD. What makes this even more hilarious is that foreigners in Thailand defend PAD - a group that has shown numerous times to have clear anti-foreign tendencies.

And Thai Rak Thai was very friendly to foreigners.

They did not want us thrown out of the country and made it easier for us to get visas. That is good enough.

Hmm, didn't they take away the 400.000 baht bank option for extension based on marriage.

This one is back again.

[henryalleman]

This is despicable, inexcusable. The ones who commit this raid are lowlifes. Because is there a greater sign of lowlife than hit a monk whit clappers who are feet. . I hope in next life that will be re-born as cockroaches.

I'm not a religious man but I spend some time visiting various temples and monastery's and talked with monks. I had the opportunity to spend a day in an Santi Asoke monastery in Paisalee.

Its was one of the few times that I saw real Buddhism practised in Buddhist monastery or temple. I was impressed by the genuine atmosphere of happiness that I could feel all over in the monastery. Its was also the only time that a temple refused an envelop. I do advise to visit some Santi Asoke monastery or community, to see for yourselves. During the meal with I did understand immediately why 25 year's before they where considered as an enemy of the state and they where brought to court. and why they are not a part of Thai Buddhist Saga.

Till know I considered the Red Shirts as normal protesters, but till some apologize or regret is given or shown by there leaders, they are Fascist movement IMO, and lost the last little bot of respect I had.

I did notice the hidden sentiment in the title of the Topic

Red-shirted people raid Santi Asoke branch in Chiang Mai

Would they write like this if it was an attack on some Thai Buddhist sage monastry.

[sbk]

It is though amusing how some here desperately try to defend the indefensible, and are still siding with PAD. What makes this even more hilarious is that foreigners in Thailand defend PAD - a group that has shown numerous times to have clear anti-foreign tendencies.

And Thai Rak Thai was very friendly to foreigners.

They did not want us thrown out of the country and made it easier for us to get visas. That is good enough.

Hmm, didn't they take away the 400.000 baht bank option for extension based on marriage.

This one is back again.

Correct me if I am wrong here but I am pretty sure that under TRT the visa fees went from 500 baht for an extension to 1900 baht. Income requirements for the extension went from 200,000 to 400,000. Permanent residency went from 25,000 baht if married to a Thai national to 95,000 baht.

[jdinasia]

sbk ---- shhhh don't disillusion the folks that can't remember how anti foreigner Thaksin and his policies really were!

[DaleBlue]

even though Santi Asoke is not part of the Thai Buddhist Sangha, all religions are protected here, particularly Buddhism.

Yet again the Red's step over the line but this type of offense can land them in jail for a LONG time!

All but Islam if I remember correctly. However, I might have been mistaken. Shame on Thailand.

[jdinasia]

even though Santi Asoke is not part of the Thai Buddhist Sangha, all religions are protected here, particularly Buddhism.

Yet again the Red's step over the line but this type of offense can land them in jail for a LONG time!

All but Islam if I remember correctly. However, I might have been mistaken. Shame on Thailand.

ALL (Islam included)

[Ulysses G.]

It is though amusing how some here desperately try to defend the indefensible, and are still siding with PAD. What makes this even more hilarious is that foreigners in Thailand defend PAD - a group that has shown numerous times to have clear anti-foreign tendencies.

And Thai Rak Thai was very friendly to foreigners.

They did not want us thrown out of the country and made it easier for us to get visas. That is good enough.

Hmm, didn't they take away the 400.000 baht bank option for extension based on marriage.

This one is back again.

Correct me if I am wrong here but I am pretty sure that under TRT the visa fees went from 500 baht for an extension to 1900 baht. Income requirements for the extension went from 200,000 to 400,000. Permanent residency went from 25,000 baht if married to a Thai national to 95,000 baht.

I am all for cheap prices, but those original charges were amazingly cheap compared to many other countries. Don't get me wrong, I rather pay next to nothing too, but I rather have the visa easily and legally available for a reasonable price, than having pay bribes to get it like in the old days.

[Mario2008]

I am all for cheap prices, but those original charges were amazingly cheap compared to many other countries. Don't get me wrong, I rather pay next to nothing too, but I rather have the visa easily and legally available for a reasonable price, than having pay bribes to get it like in the old days.

The visas I agree, but permanent residency is expensive. Also compared to other countries.

[cmsally]

We now have the bizarre scenario where the red shirts (who are seen as anti establishment) are battling the Santi Asoke who are also anti establishment (need to read their history back by about 20yrs).

So what do we have the Red Army vs the Dharma Army?

As usual a smokescreen of deflection, just one of many layers on the onion.

[yumidesign]

Oh, I think the red-shirts will be around for a while.

So true, like the KKK in America.

thats a nice comparison

[justanothercybertosser]

And Thai Rak Thai was very friendly to foreigners.

The most rabid nationalist factions of TRT have split when Thaksin increasingly attracted his powerbase within the rural population of Isaarn and the North. They then found themselves in the PAD, which was joined and backed by the old sakdina forces looking for the opportunity of correcting what they perceived as wrong developments Thai society has taken since the brief experiment with western style Democracy began not too long before.

To make it simple, just see on whose political side both Chamlong and Sondhi were once, what drove them to Thaksin, and what caused their ideological split.

Thai politics is a bit complicated...one should look beyond the obvious.

[h90]

It is though amusing how some here desperately try to defend the indefensible, and are still siding with PAD. What makes this even more hilarious is that foreigners in Thailand defend PAD - a group that has shown numerous times to have clear anti-foreign tendencies.

And Thai Rak Thai was very friendly to foreigners.

They did not want us thrown out of the country and made it easier for us to get visas. That is good enough.

Hmm, didn't they take away the 400.000 baht bank option for extension based on marriage.

This one is back again.

Correct me if I am wrong here but I am pretty sure that under TRT the visa fees went from 500 baht for an extension to 1900 baht. Income requirements for the extension went from 200,000 to 400,000. Permanent residency went from 25,000 baht if married to a Thai national to 95,000 baht.

I am all for cheap prices, but those original charges were amazingly cheap compared to many other countries. Don't get me wrong, I rather pay next to nothing too, but I rather have the visa easily and legally available for a reasonable price, than having pay bribes to get it like in the old days.

Well for Austria, my wife had to show 0 Euro to get a 10 year Visa

[mc2]

Because is there a greater sign of lowlife than hit a monk whit clappers who are feet. .

Technically they are not monks, just keep that in mind.

As has already been mentioned, they are not recognised by the Thai Sangha.

They can be described as 'a movement'.

[Scott]

I wonder if people would be happier if they attacked the people in a mosque?