Financial Crisis

[Datsun240Z]

That would be tha bomb, if planes crashed where set up on times they would need it in the economy...

So AlexLah what you are trying to say that you are " the one " ?

[AlexLah]

Datsun, look the movie The Matrix again and see the humor in it. It is one of my favorite movies therefore the Avator and "The One That Knows.

Same with Naam he claims to be a Klingon, but that cannot be possible as I thought the Klingons were wiped from our planet a long time ago.

Maybe he was left here as an orphan?

[lannarebirth]

That would be tha bomb, if planes crashed where set up on times they would need it in the economy...

So AlexLah what you are trying to say that you are " the one " ?

I think its a cry for help. Any mental health care professionals here?

[Datsun240Z]

That would be tha bomb, if planes crashed where set up on times they would need it in the economy...

So AlexLah what you are trying to say that you are " the one " ?

I think its a cry for help. Any mental health care professionals here?

Did you ever study the Bush administration? 9/11 was an inside job!

[lannarebirth]

That would be tha bomb, if planes crashed where set up on times they would need it in the economy...

So AlexLah what you are trying to say that you are " the one " ?

I think its a cry for help. Any mental health care professionals here?

Did you ever study the Bush administration? 9/11 was an inside job!

I studied the Bush administration to this extent. Hearing him give a single speech in 1999 campaigning for election, I decided he was just the kind of idiot who might likely win. Based on that I stopped watching television and moved to a lovely island in British Columbia, Canada. 18 months later I moved to Thailand.

[BlackJack]

I know when the next crash is planned...

it goes without saying that "the one that [sic] knows" knows when the next crash is planned

p.s. i can understand why people make fun of themselves, i do that myself and it shows character as well as mental strength. what i don't understand is why people would ridicule themselves

Klingon rule 15

thou shalt not ridicule thy self

[Naam]

Come on Naam it is weekend, have a bit of fun once in a while. Life is boring enough at times, so here you can be a Klingon or say that you know when the next crash is, maybe I will crash at the bar tonight, ha ha ha!

believe me or not Alex... i fully agree with you that we are facing another crash. but i don't know when and whether or how it will affect me.

[AlexLah]

Maybe have a look at what GS is doing as below article claims they are the masters of bubble creation and will be most likely heavily involved in the cap and trade scam.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story...e_machine/print

(Not sure if this story was linked already)

[12DrinkMore]

Well, hello again.

Here's a few snippets from the UK crisis front.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/finance...tgage-debt.html

So that is a MASSIVE swing from the so-called "housing equity release", which should possibly be termed "housing negative equity increase", of around 16 BILLION quid/quarter. If this trend carries on, it will knock a huge hole in Brown's economic recovery, which he reckons will take place in the fourth quarter. :D :D That <deleted> is hoping EXACTLY the opposite, and considers that the UK is populated by utter idiots, who are just about to launch themselves into even more debt.

But I find this very positive for the long term, and has restored a little of my faith in the UK (but only if Brown, Darling and the Labour party are kicked out forever)

And then moving on to the unemployable figures, these will surely be distorted by actions such as

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbys...uarter-pay.html

BT has proposed that employees take up to a year off, in return for taking a 75 per cent pay cut. To encourage as many workers to take up of the offer, the company will pay their reduced salary as an upfront cash payment.

It is also offering staff a one-off payment of £1,000 if they switch from full-time to part-time work.

Somehow I don't see many of these "rare as hen's teeth" green shoots lurking in that news.

And then to the state of the pensioners

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/persona...ners-soars.html

I have zero sympathy with these guys....

And many pensioners with outstanding credit card debts taken on during the credit boom now find themselves unable to meet repayments when their incomes shrink back on retirement, he added.

And also no sympathy with those who, in the few years before they were due to retire, decided it was a good time to increase debts by the "releasing equity" trick.

But unfortunately more than a few are going to be caught up in the bankrupt pension schemes and ZIRP "rape the saver" policies. The pensions issue has been swept under the carpet by every government as it is something "in the future". But now the baby-boomers are wanting their pensions and the situation is going to get worse very year.

For me a very simplistic way of looking at this problem is you are going to work for a maximum of 45 years and can expect to live another 22 years after that. Assuming you can earn an inflation meeting return on investments, then you need to be saving around 25% of your salary every year in some form of pension or other, and probably even more. Yes, I know there are a few astute investors around here in TV, but for the average peep this is the case. And the average peep saves zilch and expects the Nanny state to provide for them.

Or even, and this pi55e5 me right off, and doubtless I'll get some flak, some think that they should be able to pass on all their assets to the BRATS and then the TAX PAYER should pay for the nursing home etc. SORRY GUYS, you are not working to provide for the BRATS, you are working to provide for YOUR retirement. But sure, once you are firmly nailed in the box or sent up the chimney, then whatever is left can be distributed in a family squabble.

And turning to QE and economics, this guy is worth reading

http://cynicuseconomicus.blogspot.com/

and also the replies

https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=78...602479053674365

But back to the UK economy. I am now fed up with the focus of the press on "house prices". This is the GREAT UK OBSESSION. I do not believe that we currently have a "real" market, the volume is well down, first time buyers cannot get mortgages without a substantial deposit and the prices are still way above what they can afford anyway, based on the good old three times salary. But the fundamental issue I have is, do the peeps of the UK still think that a new housing bubble will cure the problem????

Maybe Ripley should put it into his collection, "unbelievable but true".

:D

[BlackJack]

Maybe have a look at what GS is doing as below article claims they are the masters of bubble creation and will be most likely heavily involved in the cap and trade scam.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story...e_machine/print

(Not sure if this story was linked already)

so when they list i suggest we all jump on board and buy shares - should be good for a few years until that bubble bursts

[teletiger]

Maybe have a look at what GS is doing as below article claims they are the masters of bubble creation and will be most likely heavily involved in the cap and trade scam.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story...e_machine/print

(Not sure if this story was linked already)

Alexlah. For the real juice on GS. try: http://www.zerohedge.com/node/11779

They present raw facts and seem to get up everyones nose. Ie. CNBC, NYSE, Goldman themselves. Funny that, the effect the truth has.

Regards

[12DrinkMore]

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/busi...icle6637528.ece

There are those at the top with bailouts

Goldman Sachs is on course to pay bonuses of $20 billion, or $700,000 per employee, twice last year’s payout, and Morgan Stanley is projected to top last year’s average bonus of $262,000 per employee with cheques close to $340,000.

And another half a million poor guys at the bottom with kickouts

But Americans began firing up their barbecues only after hearing that some 467,000 non-farm payroll jobs had disappeared in June, bringing the total number of jobs lost in this recession to 6.5m and the number of workers in search of jobs to 14.7m. The jobless rate has risen to 9.5%, almost double the rate when the recession began to bite. In addition, millions of workers have accepted pay cuts and reductions in hours. Things are so grim in some towns — 15 metropolitan areas have jobless rates in excess of 15%, and Detroit clocks in at 14.9% — that their mayors diverted funds from fireworks and parade budgets to supplement food banks and other programmes to ease the plight of the unemployed.

You'd have thought that GS could ease up a little on the profits and help out the at least the food banks if not the parades and fireworks. And anyway, how the f$%^ are these guys making so much money when everything is going down the pan?

Although at the beginning, when all this mysterious QE stuff started I was convinced that a massive dose of inflation was on the way. Now I am beginning to doubt it, to be honest, I am not even certain where all the hundreds of billions of new USDs and GBPs actually are, except maybe in the bonus payments to GS, MS and the rest of those scalawags (trying to be polite here). But they don't appear to be forcing their way into my bank account, which would in turn force me out into the real estate agents looking to pump up the property prices or maybe chuck a load into the FTSE, and indeed nor do they seem to be going into the creation of more debt, as the banks are being a little more cautious in lending.

With ever increasing numbers of umemployables and the currently lucky ones in the private sector paying down debt and/or being placed on short time, where is the hyperinflation going to come from? Surely even the lucky lot at GS are not going to be able to create hyperinflation with their spending power, even if they do get paid hyperinflated remuneration packages. They can only eat so much bread. (If the GS bonus guys created a new country GSLand, they would rank around 100 in the world GDP table, and that is just for the bonus bit, I wonder what there total PROFIT is and where they would rank then?)

But the newly born cyber-GBPs and cyber-USDs are not ending up as bits of paper in the pockets of the peeps, bread is still plentiful and affordable and the TV is still receiving mind numbing pap in endless amounts, so we'll all sit on the sofa waiting for the leaders to do something (thanks to Abrak for that observation).

The IMF is quietly ramping up its operation as a bank.

http://www.imf.org/external/np/sec/pr/2009/pr09248.htm

Does anybody know under what rules it can lend out to countries? Only the deposits or can it also start generating its own limitless SDR fiat money? I wonder if our good friends GS have a finger or two in the pie here?

And here's another national dig from France at the UK.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=206...id=axfXt8JrJOok

That scary looking woman Lagarde said

that any discussion of currencies needs to encompass the dollar, the euro, the yuan and the yen and that the meetings of the Group of 20 are the appropriate place to have it. “The appropriate platform is the one in which all the major currencies are represented,” she said.

Oh, well what happened to the Quid, the GBP that mighty currency across the channel? Maybe she's right, it won't be worth squit anymore after Darling and Brown have finished their term. And maybe the IMF will replace it with the Yuan at the next opportunity, late next year?

http://www.imf.org/external/np/exr/facts/sdr.HTM

Or, Oh my God, the GBP joins the EUR..............

:D

[lannarebirth]

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/busi...icle6637528.ece

There are those at the top with bailouts

Goldman Sachs is on course to pay bonuses of $20 billion, or $700,000 per employee, twice last year's payout, and Morgan Stanley is projected to top last year's average bonus of $262,000 per employee with cheques close to $340,000.

And another half a million poor guys at the bottom with kickouts

But Americans began firing up their barbecues only after hearing that some 467,000 non-farm payroll jobs had disappeared in June, bringing the total number of jobs lost in this recession to 6.5m and the number of workers in search of jobs to 14.7m. The jobless rate has risen to 9.5%, almost double the rate when the recession began to bite. In addition, millions of workers have accepted pay cuts and reductions in hours. Things are so grim in some towns — 15 metropolitan areas have jobless rates in excess of 15%, and Detroit clocks in at 14.9% — that their mayors diverted funds from fireworks and parade budgets to supplement food banks and other programmes to ease the plight of the unemployed.

You'd have thought that GS could ease up a little on the profits and help out the at least the food banks if not the parades and fireworks. And anyway, how the f$%^ are these guys making so much money when everything is going down the pan?

Although at the beginning, when all this mysterious QE stuff started I was convinced that a massive dose of inflation was on the way. Now I am beginning to doubt it, to be honest, I am not even certain where all the hundreds of billions of new USDs and GBPs actually are, except maybe in the bonus payments to GS, MS and the rest of those scalawags (trying to be polite here). But they don't appear to be forcing their way into my bank account, which would in turn force me out into the real estate agents looking to pump up the property prices or maybe chuck a load into the FTSE, and indeed nor do they seem to be going into the creation of more debt, as the banks are being a little more cautious in lending.

With ever increasing numbers of umemployables and the currently lucky ones in the private sector paying down debt and/or being placed on short time, where is the hyperinflation going to come from? Surely even the lucky lot at GS are not going to be able to create hyperinflation with their spending power, even if they do get paid hyperinflated remuneration packages. They can only eat so much bread. (If the GS bonus guys created a new country GSLand, they would rank around 100 in the world GDP table, and that is just for the bonus bit, I wonder what there total PROFIT is and where they would rank then?)

But the newly born cyber-GBPs and cyber-USDs are not ending up as bits of paper in the pockets of the peeps, bread is still plentiful and affordable and the TV is still receiving mind numbing pap in endless amounts, so we'll all sit on the sofa waiting for the leaders to do something (thanks to Abrak for that observation).

The IMF is quietly ramping up its operation as a bank.

http://www.imf.org/external/np/sec/pr/2009/pr09248.htm

Does anybody know under what rules it can lend out to countries? Only the deposits or can it also start generating its own limitless SDR fiat money? I wonder if our good friends GS have a finger or two in the pie here?

And here's another national dig from France at the UK.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=206...id=axfXt8JrJOok

That scary looking woman Lagarde said

that any discussion of currencies needs to encompass the dollar, the euro, the yuan and the yen and that the meetings of the Group of 20 are the appropriate place to have it. "The appropriate platform is the one in which all the major currencies are represented," she said.

Oh, well what happened to the Quid, the GBP that mighty currency across the channel? Maybe she's right, it won't be worth squit anymore after Darling and Brown have finished their term. And maybe the IMF will replace it with the Yuan at the next opportunity, late next year?

http://www.imf.org/external/np/exr/facts/sdr.HTM

Or, Oh my God, the GBP joins the EUR..............

Seriously, if you were daytrading the US treasury with 8x leverage and had a 25%-30% quarterly return, while you were making a market in eveything that can be traded, while you could see the orders on the other side of the trade, you don't think you could mint a little bit of coin? Sure you could. The relevant question is will it be allowed to continue? My guess is yes over the intermediate term and if that's true, it's a horse you have to ride or get left standing at the gate.

Everybody gaming everyone else while someone's gaming you. Graham and Dodd spinning in their graves.

Edited July 5, 2009 by lannarebirth

[MJP]

I sent this email I recieved tonight to 12D earlier, but gives you all a flavour of what's going on in the UK right now.

Edited a bit for legal reasons.

Hi mike

Good to hear from you, glad to hear things are going well. I’d love to see photos of your place.

We’ve moved from CTO to 2B which is much better and less formal. We’re right next to the stadium. The Olympic park is really changing shape and it’s beginning to look quite good. There are about 15 of us left and people are being let go all the time now. There’ll be 8 of us left by the end of August; Me, Fiona, arun, Jason, Katie, dan, Margaret and Amelia. I’m confirmed until November with a 30% chance I’ll still be there until June 2010.

[Environmental consultancy H] made 22 environment people redundant in May and we were told they wouldn’t may any promises about more going in the autumn. Well – yesterday we all got an email from a guy quite a high up in the environment section that he was taking 1 months unpaid leave! This is not uncommon now but came a bit of shock for him to do it. But the email told me that things may not be getting better and this was management slowing preparing us.

All [Environmental Consultancy X] staff have had a 30% pay cut and still doing the same hours. All Environmental Consultancy Y] directors have had a 10% pay cut.

It’s debt deflation not stagflation/hyperinflation. Surprised about what you say about Thai ecnonomy, I have a very large chunk of my pension in SE Asia –oops!

Anyway it’s been really hot in London this last week and we’re having a great time with bbqs, beer and friends.

Cheers P

[AlexLah]

Yes Tele, ZH is doing a fine job opening all those cans with worms. Another site exposing the mighty monsters of the financial universe is this one: http://www.goldmansachs666.com.

Here a picture that shows how some of these bloodsucking parasites and institutions are connected.

I just wonder why they did not use the 12 Trillion to start up 12 new banks with a clean slate.

And 12 the only way I can see inflation coming (In the US) is when the Dollar weakens significantly. As now there is no way that inflation could happen as there are more peeps unemployed by the month that have less money to spend, the peeps that still have a job are spending less and increase their debt payments. Tax income is lower, factory output is lower, peeps are working less hours and all of those things just tells you that the velocity of money is less and there is less money in the system. It is a downward spiral as when people spend less, more people will loose their job as more shops will be closed and more bizz will go bankrupt

Imagine you have just landed a job, it is highly likely that you are on a one year contract. In my HC there was no way you could get a long term loan while on a one year contract.

The "Official" unemployment number is a joke, shadowstatistics is saying it is more like 16-17%. Subcontractors cannot even file for unemployment benefits so also they are left out from the calculation.

A lot of people look at the stock market performance as an indicator how well the economy is, but what if the stock market is propped up by banks that have a whole legion of mathematicians and powerful computers that do the trading for them including some backdoor deals that are financed by taxpayers money.

A way out of this mess could be some kind of new invention that will change the world just like we had with the industrial revolution, invention of electricity that kind of stuff.

A pandemic that would kill Billions of people or some big war that would fuel lending in order to fund the war machine.

Just ask yourself what would be needed to get people a job again so they can start spending.

My apologies for the negative outlook I see, but I just not see a recovery soon.

Kind regards,

Alex

[12DrinkMore]

it's a horse you have to ride or get left standing at the gate.

Well come on then, how do us mere peeps get a slice of the action and mount this horse?

[lannarebirth]

it's a horse you have to ride or get left standing at the gate.

Well come on then, how do us mere peeps get a slice of the action and mount this horse?

Well. it's already left the gate now hasn't it? In fact it may be pulling up lame at the half post if I'm not mistaken.

[jcon]

eff GS!

Federer vs. Roddick 10-ALL in the 5th set as of right now.

This is way better.... at least Wimbledon isn't rigged.

[MJP]

eff GS!

Federer vs. Roddick 10-ALL in the 5th set as of right now.

This is way better.... at least Wimbledon isn't rigged.

Did it rain much this year at Wimbledon? Can't remember a year when it didn't.

[Datsun240Z]

Just ask yourself what would be needed to get people a job again so they can start spending.

Do you know the answer?

[jcon]

eff GS!

Federer vs. Roddick 10-ALL in the 5th set as of right now.

This is way better.... at least Wimbledon isn't rigged.

Did it rain much this year at Wimbledon? Can't remember a year when it didn't.

Yeah, plenty of rain, as always. Not today, though - beautiful day.

This year it's incredible, 13-12 Federer right now , but Roddick serving... Are Sampras/Borg in the Royal Box? Incredible. Best tennis I've seen.

Edit: Federer won. Roddick played the game of his life... These guys were pure class today.

It's ok to derail this snoozer of a thread for awhile

Back to GS. Well they pay bonuses because they make money, and they make money because they run the market. Maybe things will change in the future. Hopefully they do. Anybody who thinks markets are 'fair' doesn't trade. Traders know it's a scam, you just have to play the game...

Edited July 5, 2009 by jcon

[MJP]

Just ask yourself what would be needed to get people a job again so they can start spending.

Do you know the answer?

Yep, it's quite easy. But for another time . . . must go to bed now.

[Datsun240Z]

This thread now has 119 pages of "analysis" guys, that's the problem in the world. People talk to much and do to less.

[12DrinkMore]

This thread now has 119 pages of "analysis" guys, that's the problem in the world. People talk to much and do to less.

Well that post didn't help, did it?

Anyway a quote in

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=206...id=aHxGBHaYwGC8

amazed me

“I am not trying to make any excuse, but certainly it has been difficult,” said John Taylor, chairman of New York-based FX Concepts, which manages about $12 billion. “Unfortunately, there’s lack of consistence of what’s happening. I am wondering how stupid the market can be for how long.”

presumably related to

FX Concepts Inc., the world’s largest currency hedge fund, says it lost 5.4 percent in this year’s first five months. John W. Henry & Co.’s foreign-exchange fund told investors it lost 2 percent, after 2008’s 76 percent gain, the best since its 1986 launching.

Both use computer models to spot currency trends and, along with other momentum chasers, are getting hammered by this year’s lack of clear direction as the markets are pulled in opposing directions. Deflationary pressure from the first global recession since World War II is being countered by the inflationary forces of record stimulus spending and currency printing across the globe.

So this guy is claiming the market is stupid because he can't make any money from his "stupid" computer models?

Maybe currencies have arrived at an equilibrium. I hope so, because I am very fed up with the way they have been shooting up and down over the last year.

But I suppose I have a personal problem with people trying to make money off the back of world trade, which should determine to an extent the value of currencies, by using computers to follow historic numbers and then piling in once some trend has been determined, driving the trend further.

Here is more evidence that we are in a deflationary downturn, or at least a non-inflationary recession.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=206...id=apzVRyR2Nbp0

At what point are Our Leaders going to announce we are in a depression?

U.S. consumer confidence slipped unexpectedly in June, reflecting unemployment that rose to 9.5 percent and wealth destruction triggered partly by a drop in property values. U.S. employers slashed 467,000 jobs last month, and about 6 million jobs have been eliminated since the recession began in December 2007. June’s jobless rate was the highest since August 1983.

It doesn't look like Bernanke's infusion of QE Prozac is lifting us up out out it.

[12DrinkMore]

After an hiatus here's an article about the possibility of civil unrest.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/comment...ly-ticking.html

French president Nicolas Sarkozy, with a good nose for popular moods, says: "We must overhaul everything. We cannot have a system of rentiers and social dumping under globalisation. Either we have justice or we will have violence. It is a chimera to think that this crisis is just a footnote and that we can carry on as before."

The message has not reached Wall Street or the City. If bankers know what is good for them, they will take a teacher's salary for a few years until the storm passes. If they proceed with the bonuses now on the table, even as taxpayers pay for the errors of their caste, they must expect a ferocious backlash.

I think that there are three polarised groups developing,

the industrial peeps, who actually produce stuff, but are being hammered by globalisation leading to deflating wages, redundancy and joblessness.

the public services and qangoes, who are seen by the peeps above to be inefficient, corrupt and have guaranteed inflated wages and pensions, paid for by the private sector

the bankers and financial "industry", who produce absolutely nothing except massive bonuses for themselves, even in times like now, and suck the wealth out of the peeps

"We must overhaul everything. We cannot have a system of rentiers and social dumping under globalisation. Either we have justice or we will have violence"

20 Billion Dollar bonuses for a handful? GBP 700,000 annual pension for a piss-poor performance wrecking RBS and in the same month another 400,000 jobless, hmmm, I just wonder where this could head.

I wonder, Abrak, whether the TV will really be enough to captivate the peeps?

[Datsun240Z]

It really doesn't take rocket science, te get the economy back on feet.

[12DrinkMore]

It really doesn't take rocket science, te get the economy back on feet.

Well, somehow I don't think you have applied any thought to the incredibly complex web of vested interests, many of which are extremely powerful and are certainly not in favour of any simple solution, or indeed any solution which will reduce their massive incomes or power. Rocket Science is trivial compared to the world economy. The scientists know EXACTLY what it takes to fire projectiles, there are physical laws governing the process. Physical laws don't even fuc_king exist in finance and I don't even want to broach the topic of legal or moral laws.

but moving on

http://cynicuseconomicus.blogspot.com/2009...ot-tougher.html

has put up a thought provoking analysis of the East versus the West.

The banter between "Lord Keynes" and "Cynicus" following the main blog is worth following.

And if everybody around here in TV is following the links mentioned, for example

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/03/opinion/..._r=2&reddit

http://www.oftwominds.com/survival-plus1.html

http://www.brookings.edu/papers/2009/0423_canada_nivola.aspx

http://www.vanityfair.com/magazine/2009/01/stiglitz200901

http://www.counterpunch.org/roberts01222009.html

this thread could die out of despair and Alex won't claim the number 3,000 post :D

Edited July 6, 2009 by 12DrinkMore

[AlexLah]

I am surprised you did not mention your friend Brown's latest comment that it is likely the situation will get worse.

I guess those people like him and Biden are on the same diet?

If you missed it Biden recently told that they did not expected the economy to be in such bad shape.

Look at the initial forecast of the Whitehouse economic team.

And the revised one.

I suggest they hire Dr. Doom and next time take the red pill instead of the blue

But you can see the pattern here. First they will say it is not that bad and the subprime crisis is under control and the worst is over kinda talk.

Slowly step by step the sheeple are being prepared to expect worser stuff to come.

I would not be surprised if another simulation package proposal is in the make, we just need another crisis/shock most likely somewhere in September or October. It will be interesting to look at CA when no bank will accept the I.O.U's anymore and possibly start defaulting on their bonds.

So maybe Naam would be so kind to explain if that could happen?

The too big to fail institutes (I guess) are very busy thinking of ways to sell their toxic waste and calling it another financial innovation. Maybe Jcon can give some insight?

Oh, and talking about change and transparency, you do know that journalists are required to send in their questions first and will be reviewed and decided if they can ask such question or not. You know it takes a bit of time to program the teleprompter.

Let me make a prediction by saying that at least another million jobs will be lost in the US by the end of this year and perhaps a bit sooner.

Edited July 6, 2009 by AlexLah

[Datsun240Z]

It really doesn't take rocket science, te get the economy back on feet.

Well, somehow I don't think you have applied any thought to the incredibly complex web of vested interests, many of which are extremely powerful and are certainly not in favour of any simple solution, or indeed any solution which will reduce their massive incomes or power. Rocket Science is trivial compared to the world economy. The scientists know EXACTLY what it takes to fire projectiles, there are physical laws governing the process. Physical laws don't even fuc_king exist in finance and I don't even want to broach the topic of legal or moral laws.

I'm not going to give my opinion either, not interested. There was once a sentence: " If your good at something, never do it for free ".

[12DrinkMore]

I am surprised you did not mention your friend Brown's latest comment that it is likely the situation will get worse.

Presumably this post is aimed at me???

But no, I didn't see Brown making that statement and I don't believe he did or ever will, he is a an inveterate liar and I don't quite understand how he has the audacity to call himself Prime Minister.

I would not be surprised if another simulation package proposal is in the make, we just need another crisis/shock most likely somewhere in September or October.

The stimuli keep coming along with no end in sight, it is the ardent belief of Bernanke, Brown and Darling that given enough stimuli the peeps will take out more debt and keep the good ship steaming along for a few years until the current incumbent "decision makers" have earned enough to bugger off to some other universe.

The too big to fail institutes (I guess) are very busy thinking of ways to sell their toxic waste and calling it another financial innovation. Maybe Jcon can give some insight?

I believe this process has been in place for some months now. Toxic debt is being swapped for good ol' USD's and GBP's and now EUR's and placed on the broken back of the tax payers.

"quote"

Let me make a prediction by saying that at least another million jobs will be lost in the US by the end of this year and perhaps a bit sooner.

"end quote"

You won't fail there. Come on, we're looking at that figure in the UK alone. Six month's at the current rate of creating unemployables and 2,500,000 newly desperate in the US is on the cards.

Add in the short time workers and those who have given up hope of finding a job.....

Green shoots??? This means the yellow and decayed shoots are now covered with algae.

Edited July 6, 2009 by 12DrinkMore