Financial Crisis

[Naam]

Another take on eurobonds - http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2011/08/merkel-sarkozy-reject-euro-bonds-and.html

"Merkel, Sarkozy Reject Euro Bonds"

Mish should brush up his french. i heard what Sarkozy said. here's my interpretation: during yesterday's meeting he could not convince Merkel that "Euro Bonds" are THE solution and they both agreed to "postpone negotiations and decisions on this matter".

[Naam]

German growth disappointing at 0.1%

the rot starts

watch markets tomorrow

i'm watching but don't know on what to concentrate? Asian markets mostly green, EUR strong @ 1.44 vs USD (as opposed to the most famous currency forecasters who -according to BlackJack- prophesied "1.15" and are off 20%)

any rot elsewhere? shall i check the potatoes in my non existing basement?

[Naam]

I am now convinced that Naam knows how to solve the financial problems of the World and therefore would like to nominate him as President of the World

Do I hear a second?

frustration causes bad judgments

[Naam]

-CHF down vs EUR nearly 14% in five trading days. talk about peg to EUR at 1.15 but no explanation how it can be achieved respectively held steady. perhaps concerted actions by ECB and SNB?

-Anglo clowns on both sides of the Atlantic keep on spreading their EUR doom&gloom to divert from their domestic problems.

CHF now 15% down vs EUR. thinking of buying back my CHF except the formerly CHF-hedged gold ETFs.

[cloudhopper]

you give too much weight to the rubbish published in zero-blockspot-max_keiser-hedge-alphaville.turd.com websites Flying

p.s. and that applies to "cloudhopper" too :jap:

I rely mostly on Jon Stewart myself. But here's a great interview with Bill Black -

[midas]

Unreal

despite so many that have dismissed it as a conspiracy theory,

global corporate government has already arrived.

All Animals are Equal but some animals are more equal than others

And don't you ever forget that citizen number AS89765432109876534CXB

[Naam]

And don't you ever forget that citizen number AS89765432109876534CXB

an insult for all honest pigs!

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

I am now convinced that Naam knows how to solve the financial problems of the World and therefore would like to nominate him as President of the World

Do I hear a second?

frustration causes bad judgments

How much tea money do I get if I vote for Naam???

[Naam]

I am now convinced that Naam knows how to solve the financial problems of the World and therefore would like to nominate him as President of the World

Do I hear a second?

frustration causes bad judgments

How much tea money do I get if I vote for Naam???

[midas]

Debt can be useful especially when the cost of borrowing is almost zero and the economy is so bad it could use much more stimulus NOW. Long term debt is long term. Short term the most critical crisis in the US is JOBS and slow growth.

Then why do something like this Jingthing? Why on earth would the US Secret Service outsource

a job like this outside the borders of USA? This was a shovel ready job and they gave it away

' WASHINGTON -- President Obama is barnstorming the heartland to boost US jobs in a taxpayer-financed luxury bus the government had custom built -- in Canada, The Post has learned.

The $1.1 million vehicle, one of two that Quebec-based Prevost sold the government, has been tricked out by the Secret Service with state-of-the-art security features and creature comforts."

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/canucklehead_obama_bus_ted_gyztvw89k5MyKNS4B7Qp7O

[cloudhopper]

Debt can be useful especially when the cost of borrowing is almost zero and the economy is so bad it could use much more stimulus NOW. Long term debt is long term. Short term the most critical crisis in the US is JOBS and slow growth.

Then why do something like this Jingthing? Why on earth would the US Secret Service outsource

a job like this outside the borders of USA? This was a shovel ready job and they gave it away

' WASHINGTON -- President Obama is barnstorming the heartland to boost US jobs in a taxpayer-financed luxury bus the government had custom built -- in Canada, The Post has learned.

The $1.1 million vehicle, one of two that Quebec-based Prevost sold the government, has been tricked out by the Secret Service with state-of-the-art security features and creature comforts."

http://www.nypost.co...9k5MyKNS4B7Qp7O

oops crank trip, barnstorm cancelled. Here's a stimulating review of stimuli - http://www.zerohedge.com/news/putting-cart-top-horse-or-why-heaping-fiscal-stimulus-upon-stimulus-suicide-america

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

I am now convinced that Naam knows how to solve the financial problems of the World and therefore would like to nominate him as President of the World

Do I hear a second?

frustration causes bad judgments

How much tea money do I get if I vote for Naam???

OK You got my vote

[JimGant]

Then why do something like this Jingthing? Why on earth would the US Secret Service outsource a job like this outside the borders of USA? This was a shovel ready job and they gave it away

Shovel ready? I believe it's called "comparative advantage," which has even sweeter overtones within the context of NAFTA. We'll buy armored busses from Canada, whose economy of scale in this endeavor saves us some bucks. Meanwhile, they'll buy GM armored limos from us.

Shovel ready doesn't mean refurbishing a shuttered Greyhound bus factory, with no competitive future.

(Sorry, Jingthing, for jumping in. But, I'm 100% with you on the fiscal and monetary (phuck you, Gov Perry) stimulus issue.)

[midas]

Then why do something like this Jingthing? Why on earth would the US Secret Service outsource a job like this outside the borders of USA? This was a shovel ready job and they gave it away

Shovel ready? I believe it's called "comparative advantage," which has even sweeter overtones within the context of NAFTA. We'll buy armored busses from Canada, whose economy of scale in this endeavor saves us some bucks. Meanwhile, they'll buy GM armored limos from us.

Shovel ready doesn't mean refurbishing a shuttered Greyhound bus factory, with no competitive future.

(Sorry, Jingthing, for jumping in. But, I'm 100% with you on the fiscal and monetary (phuck you, Gov Perry) stimulus issue.)

so what was the "comparative advantage " that led to Obama lending US$2 billion to a Brazilian oil company with no financial gain for the U.S.?

[midas]

Then why do something like this Jingthing? Why on earth would the US Secret Service outsource a job like this outside the borders of USA? This was a shovel ready job and they gave it away

Shovel ready? I believe it's called "comparative advantage," which has even sweeter overtones within the context of NAFTA. We'll buy armored busses from Canada, whose economy of scale in this endeavor saves us some bucks. Meanwhile, they'll buy GM armored limos from us.

Shovel ready doesn't mean refurbishing a shuttered Greyhound bus factory, with no competitive future.

(Sorry, Jingthing, for jumping in. But, I'm 100% with you on the fiscal and monetary (phuck you, Gov Perry) stimulus issue.)

so what was the "comparative advantage " that led to Obama lending US$2 billion to a Brazilian oil company with no financial gain for the U.S.?

and there he goes again

Obama uses subsidies to outsource American jobs to China

" Despite all the talk of green jobs, the overwhelming majority of stimulus money spent on wind power has gone to foreign companies, according to a new report by the Investigative Reporting Workshop at the American University’s School of Communication in Washington, D.C. "

http://washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/opinion-zone/2011/04/obama-uses-green-subsidies-outsource-american-jobs-china

Edited August 17, 2011 by midas

[midas]

I am now convinced that Naam knows how to solve the financial problems of the World and therefore would like to nominate him as President of the World

Do I hear a second?

frustration causes bad judgments

How much tea money do I get if I vote for Naam???

that won't even pay for a cup of coffee. how many bitcoins will you offer ?

[12DrinkMore]

Don't worry guys!

It's all in hand. The next ObamaPlan will be unveiled next month, once Congress has come back from its well deserved break after all the hard work they have been putting in.

So what's coming up next?

New Ideas

More spending

More cuts

And self-financing too

Yep, it's all in there.

An administration official told Bloomberg the president will ask Congress for additional spending to boost the economy and call for long-term cuts beyond the US$1.5 trillion that Congress charged a 12-member bipartisan "super-committee" of legislators to trim.

A source told the Associated Press the plan would contain new proposals, not simply a rehash of ideas Obama has been promoting.

Obama's plan will likely have a mix of tax cuts and infrastructure spending and will include proposals beyond the ideas that he has mentioned on his bus tour, such as extending the payroll tax holiday and unemployment insurance benefits.

It would also pay for itself through debt reduction

Make a note in your diary, this one is not to be missed.

Obama will present the plan in a speech soon after the Sept. 5 Labor Day holiday

http://business.fina...-boost-economy/

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-17/obama-said-to-seek-spending-to-boost-economy-with-deficit-cuts-in-future.html

Edited August 17, 2011 by 12DrinkMore

[JimGant]

Despite all the talk of green jobs, the overwhelming majority of stimulus money spent on wind power has gone to foreign companies, according to a new report by the Investigative Reporting Workshop at....blah, blah, blah

Yeah, definitely not a good thing. Nobody has said the fire hose of stimulus spending has all been well-directed. Sounds like a case of the 'global warming nuts' and their inefficient 'green' theories trumping doing what certainly could be more effective for 'jump starting' the economy. Unfortunately, theorists -- environmental, economical (or not), and political -- make for a lot of crap to be waded through.

And, all the published links here -- well, too many are just tabloid, akin to "Elvis Lives!.'

It all boils down to: Are you Keynesian, or not? Would we have been worse-off without the stimulus (QE and fiscal)? Is more stimulus needed now, to jump-start an economy to where we can then address the deficit problem?

In my lowly opinion, yes. Jingthing's quote pretty well hits the nail squarely:

Debt can be useful especially when the cost of borrowing is almost zero and the economy is so bad it could use much more stimulus NOW. Long term debt is long term. Short term the most critical crisis in the US is JOBS and slow growth

That certainly fits the US today. Sadly, not Europe. If, of course, you think Keynesian theory is applicable today. And, I admit, many learned folks don't. What a shiite hole....

[JimGant]

How many US bases in Germany alone?

Well, the Marshall Plan certainly helped Europe get back on its feet. After that bit of kindness, the US should have said, "All your problem now -- why do you thing Grandpa emigrated?." Christ, I guess Germany did declare war on us -- so we had to react to that. But afterwards -- why did we sacrifice so much US treasure -- to assure Western Europe didn't have to learn cyrillic? And why are we still in Europe? Crazy.

How many US military golf courses?

A lot. But since I retired from the Air Force in '87, they've all had to pay for themselves. Became a civilian -- and my green fees quadrupled at the same time. No way to treat a vet.

[midas]

Despite all the talk of green jobs, the overwhelming majority of stimulus money spent on wind power has gone to foreign companies, according to a new report by the Investigative Reporting Workshop at....blah, blah, blah

Yeah, definitely not a good thing. Nobody has said the fire hose of stimulus spending has all been well-directed. Sounds like a case of the 'global warming nuts' and their inefficient 'green' theories trumping doing what certainly could be more effective for 'jump starting' the economy. Unfortunately, theorists -- environmental, economical (or not), and political -- make for a lot of crap to be waded through.

And, all the published links here -- well, too many are just tabloid, akin to "Elvis Lives!.'

It all boils down to: Are you Keynesian, or not? Would we have been worse-off without the stimulus (QE and fiscal)? Is more stimulus needed now, to jump-start an economy to where we can then address the deficit problem?

In my lowly opinion, yes. Jingthing's quote pretty well hits the nail squarely:

Debt can be useful especially when the cost of borrowing is almost zero and the economy is so bad it could use much more stimulus NOW. Long term debt is long term. Short term the most critical crisis in the US is JOBS and slow growth

That certainly fits the US today. Sadly, not Europe. If, of course, you think Keynesian theory is applicable today. And, I admit, many learned folks don't. What a shiite hole....

]

This is not about Keynes versus Mises ? This is about ( again ) wasteful misallocation of public resources.

Whether it's converting buses, drilling for oil or making windmills if they can't find people in a country with a 9% unemployment rate and with a population of over 300,000,000 to undertake these tasks at a competitive rate then it's time to cut up the government credit card .

[midas]

Don't worry guys!

It's all in hand. The next ObamaPlan will be unveiled next month, once Congress has come back from its well deserved break after all the hard work they have been putting in.

So what's coming up next?

New Ideas

More spending

More cuts

And self-financing too

Yep, it's all in there.

An administration official told Bloomberg the president will ask Congress for additional spending to boost the economy and call for long-term cuts beyond the US$1.5 trillion that Congress charged a 12-member bipartisan "super-committee" of legislators to trim.

A source told the Associated Press the plan would contain new proposals, not simply a rehash of ideas Obama has been promoting.

Obama's plan will likely have a mix of tax cuts and infrastructure spending and will include proposals beyond the ideas that he has mentioned on his bus tour, such as extending the payroll tax holiday and unemployment insurance benefits.

It would also pay for itself through debt reduction

Make a note in your diary, this one is not to be missed.

Obama will present the plan in a speech soon after the Sept. 5 Labor Day holiday

http://business.fina...-boost-economy/

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-17/obama-said-to-seek-spending-to-boost-economy-with-deficit-cuts-in-future.html

yes indeed..................

" The fact that we are here today to debate raising America’s debt limit is a sign of leadership failure. It is a sign that the U.S. Government can’t pay its own bills. It is a sign that we now depend on ongoing financial assistance from foreign countries to finance our Government’s reckless fiscal policies. … Increasing America’s debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that ‘the buck stops here. Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better."

Barack Hussein Obama 2006

[midas]

and just when we thought everything was " hunky dory " in the

powerhouse of Europe............

but remember ....there is no crisis !!!!

Mercedes Targeted as Luxury Cars Burned in German Globalization Protests

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-16/luxury-cars-burned-in-berlin-protests.html

[lovetotravel]

This is interesting:

http://money.cnn.com...id=HP_Highlight

But Fisher argues that at this point, banks and businesses don't necessarily want to

borrow more money. They're already sitting on an abundance of cash.

"The banking system is awash with liquidity," he said. "These excess bank reserves

are waiting on the sidelines to be lent to businesses."

Instead, Fisher says businesses that could potentially create jobs are paralyzed by

uncertainty coming from lawmakers in Washington D.C. Consumers, for the same

reason, are holding back on spending, he said.

"I would suggest that unless you were on another planet, no consumer with access to

a television, radio or the Internet could have escaped hearing their president,

senators and their congressperson telling them the sky was falling," he said.

"It does not take much imagination to envision consumers deciding to forego or

delay some discretionary expenditure they had planned."

Signaling that rates aren't going up anytime soon can only make the problem worse by

allowing businesses and consumers to delay their spending decisions, Fisher

explained.

telling them the sky was falling

Maybe you could add a few posters from TV to this?

[midas]

This is interesting:

http://money.cnn.com...id=HP_Highlight

But Fisher argues that at this point, banks and businesses don't necessarily want to

borrow more money. They're already sitting on an abundance of cash.

"The banking system is awash with liquidity," he said. "These excess bank reserves

are waiting on the sidelines to be lent to businesses."

Instead, Fisher says businesses that could potentially create jobs are paralyzed by

uncertainty coming from lawmakers in Washington D.C. Consumers, for the same

reason, are holding back on spending, he said.

"I would suggest that unless you were on another planet, no consumer with access to

a television, radio or the Internet could have escaped hearing their president,

senators and their congressperson telling them the sky was falling," he said.

"It does not take much imagination to envision consumers deciding to forego or

delay some discretionary expenditure they had planned."

Signaling that rates aren't going up anytime soon can only make the problem worse by

allowing businesses and consumers to delay their spending decisions, Fisher

explained.

http://static.thaivisa.com/forum/public/style_emoticons/default/whistling.gif

telling them the sky was falling

Maybe you could add a few posters from TV to this?

i think it will on the " far left " supporters

[Naam]

and just when we thought everything was " hunky dory " in the powerhouse of Europe............

but remember ....there is no crisis !!!!

Mercedes Targeted as Luxury Cars Burned in German Globalization Protests

my wife's Benz and my BMW are OK although both of us are citizens of Europe's powerhouse. shall we complain about discrimination?

joke aside, there's nothing "hunky dory" in Germany. but by any standards it was and is a powerhouse since half a century and will remain an economic powerhouse in future.

by the way, the alleged "fat cats" targeted were not that fat. real fat cats park their cars in locked garages and not on public streets. i also wonder how many of the arsonists the smartass political scientist, who claimed "protest against capitalism, globalization and gentrification", has interviewed.

[12DrinkMore]

This is interesting:

http://money.cnn.com...id=HP_Highlight

But Fisher argues that at this point, banks and businesses don't necessarily want to

borrow more money. They're already sitting on an abundance of cash.

"The banking system is awash with liquidity," he said. "These excess bank reserves

are waiting on the sidelines to be lent to businesses."

Instead, Fisher says businesses that could potentially create jobs are paralyzed by

uncertainty coming from lawmakers in Washington D.C. Consumers, for the same

reason, are holding back on spending, he said.

"I would suggest that unless you were on another planet, no consumer with access to

a television, radio or the Internet could have escaped hearing their president,

senators and their congressperson telling them the sky was falling," he said.

"It does not take much imagination to envision consumers deciding to forego or

delay some discretionary expenditure they had planned."

Signaling that rates aren't going up anytime soon can only make the problem worse by

allowing businesses and consumers to delay their spending decisions, Fisher

explained.

telling them the sky was falling

Maybe you could add a few posters from TV to this?

The Great Consumers are deleveraging.

Debt has been (finally) given a bad name, and it is firmly implanted into the skulls that more debt is BAD, there is too much debt around, the sub-prime mess was a result of debt, the EURomess is all about debt.

The "raise the US debt ceiling" debacle has helped hammer in the message.

But there is, in the end, a big issue with debt repayment. On an individual basis a debt can be paid off, but on the aggregate it is not possible. The system can only be sustained by a constant upwards debt spiral. The limiting controls to this spiral have been removed over the last decade or so, which makes the outcome uncertain.

The control of "prudence" in issuing debt was removed through "financial engineered products" and relying on rating agencies, allowing banks to issue vast amounts of debt to people who can't afford it.

The control of "price", or interest rates, was removed by at the start of the century by Greenspan through the reduction of interest rates in order to blow FED bubbles, and since 2008 by Ben with ZIRP and QE.

The control of "penalty" was removed once banks realised they had declared themselves too big to fail and Ben would bail them out, by acting to support the "too big to fall" asset prices.

Instead of having a constant stream of smaller resets to the debt spiral over the last 20 years, the Central Banks have considered it their duty to ensure there are only rewards for failure and no penalties. Banks should have failed, bond holders and shareholders taken the hit.

The result is a humongous volume of cash swilling around doing nothing more than blowing up one asset price and then the other around the globe. With absolutely no benefit to the average person.

Real industrial activity and international trade, the historic wealth generators, have been reduced to less than 15% of the economy in the UK and States.

As sending all this cash around the globe only requires a computer, I do not understand why there are hundreds of thousands of financial industry employees. What they do all day I don't know, simply looking at screens and graphs I suppose. Surely the vast majority could now be simply replaced by algorithms?

[midas]

okay seriously folks ......I am quite anxious about the following subject.

I know there's nothing we can really do to prevent it other than be mentally prepared for

it but I would bet all the money I have it is coming eventually this is the thin end of the wedge

and there are too many little signs to convince me otherwise.

I'm talking about potentially losing our freedom eventually to communicate as we are doing here today on this website and others.

The following happened last weekend in the good old US of A -land of the free. think about the circumstances

under which this happened?

Another brick in the wall.

#OPBart And #MuBARTek Coverage Roundup: BART's Cell Phone Shutdown, Site Hack, And Protest Tonight

BART's decision last Thursday to cut off cell phone service underground and in several of their SF platforms to avoid a possible protest has become international news, shocked civil and digital rights experts, and been the inspiration for a hack of a BART website and another protest scheduled for 5 PM Monday at Civic Center Station.

Of course, all this happened over the weekend, when you might have been doing something besides following the news.

http://sfappeal.com/news/2011/08/opbart-and-mubartek-coverage-roundup-everything-you-need-to-know-about-barts-cell-phone-shutdown-hac.php

Edited August 18, 2011 by midas

[JimGant]

The following happened last weekend in the good old US of A -land of the free. think about the circumstances under which this happened? Another brick in the wall.

... been the inspiration for a hack of a BART website and another protest scheduled for 5 PM Monday at Civic Center Station.

Yeah, we've got to find a way to stop all this hacking by creepos.

Oh, shutting down cell phone service? Great idea in this age of kooks and instant communications. I'm sure Scotland Yard wishes they'd been able to do this during the recent madness in their neck-of-the-crazies.

Midas, aren't you a transplanted Limey to Oz? Why are you so transfixed with what's going on in Yankee land? We'll land on our feet, as always. Chill out. Or, at least worry about what happens when natural resources run out down under....

[lovetotravel]

As a former commuter there, I'm glad they did this. For sure, look how things got heated up in the UK. Or many other hot spots around the world. This is from CNN:

"BART temporarily interrupted service at select BART stations as one of many tactics to ensure the safety of everyone on the platform," the transit agency said in a statement on its website Friday.

BART said it took the actions because protesters said they "would use mobile devices to coordinate their disruptive activities and communicate about the location and number of BART Police."

Duh. The protesters said they would do this so the authorities responded. Good for them.:jap:

And then there is this:

The incident happened Thursday, the same day that British Prime Minister David Cameron proposed a crackdown on social media to quell riots.

"Everyone watching these horrific actions will be struck by how they were organized via social media," Cameron said Thursday during an address to Parliament. "Free flow of information can be used for good. But it can also be used for ill. And when people are using social media for violence, we need to stop them."

Protesters in San Francisco have used websites and social media to organize demonstrations, including a rally last month that shut down a subway stop.

This has nothing to do with freedom of speech. Back to the OP please.

[flying]

Duh. The protesters said they would do this so the authorities responded. Good for them.:jap:

Have no horse or real interest in this but...........

If all it takes to shut down an essential service is a statement of "They said so we did"

Then Duh indeed.......resistance is futile as the sheep are so easily herded.

Just sayin