Thailand Warns Angelina Jolie Over Comments On Rohingyas

[infernalman7]

Sadly enough but I really do think that this government and the military is trying to do what they think would save their faces to the Thais (or future voters).

Really, this government no longer cares about what the international community is thinking after they have tried to get into power the internationally recognized undemocratic way, the last thing they would do is to care what others are thinking but people in the country. They are trying their best to get the people to like them (free 2,000 baht for everyone with salary of less than 15,000 baht a month) and according to what I see, most of the Thais really agree that what the military has done was right.

However, to accuse them like this, is not fair either. Assuming that this is a totally new issue, the immigrants were all male. With the problems they have in southern Thailand really makes a BIG difference. They may think that it could have been a threat to national security. Who would have known.

And from some of the local claims on Thai Newspaper, the people around there they were robbed and threatened by the Rohinyas as well. True or not, I think we really have to think about this from both sides.

But again, it is also not fair for the military to physically torture them right there without any reasoning. Detaining them is probably the best thing they could have done in my opinion.

[Journalist]

The Thai military is not answerable to the Thai Government.

The moderate Japanese Government had that problem before WW2.

[ballpoint]

Now, why would they want to do that? Any policy towards the Rohingya was put in place by the proxies of your beloved Thaksin. If there was substantial truth to these stories, surely the current government would be shouting it to the world? What did you expect Abhisit to do when faced with a sensationalist story, which is increasingly looking somewhat exaggerated? "Admit" to wrong doings that may not even have taken place? He's offered to assist a UN investigation. I'm somewhat surprised by the wailing of the Thaksin brigade over this story, bearing in mind his less than perfect treatment of refugees, including the Rohingya, and legal Thai citizens. The story broke when Abhisit had been in office for less than a month, any world leader would check the facts before blindly condemning the alledged perpetrators. If any of it is proved to be true, you would hope that those perpetrators, and those who instructed them, will face justice. I await a further list of charges for Samak et al.

[sbk]

I find it interesting the need of some posters to lower themselves to inane, childish and denigrating comments about someone rather than address the real issues at hand. But, I guess its easier to criticize and insult than to actually post something topical, isn't it?

and how is your post not a personal off-topic attack and how is it in any way contributing to the problem?

...

ow, you were just talking about yourself then?

Actually, that was me speaking as a moderator, I find the need to belittle someone rather than address what is actually an interesting and imprortant issue juvenile and off topic.

You might try reading the forum rules first before posting, It does tend to help.

[Scott]

The argument that they might be insurgents is highly unlikely. If you are bringing in militants, you would have a better funded group than these people are. You would also want a group that was linguistically able to communicate. Finally, given the relative isolation of the Rohingyas, how would this get organized and implemented.

The military is fully aware that these people aren't insurgents and would be ill-equipped to do any militant activity in the South. One would hope the military isn't seriously using resources to fight the Southern insurgency in this manner.

[chiang mai]

From a more balanced AFP article...

A little research shows that the Rohingyas have been fleeing Burma since the 70s, mostly into neighboring Bangladesh but also into many other countries in the region. It's only the recent controversy regarding some treatment of a particular group of Rohingyas that has made it topical. So it's little wonder that the (rather terse) reply from the goverment also points out that the only reason she's mentioning them is because it was on the news lately.

Exactly, "Mrs Pitt" could have also have commented on the long standing plight of the Hmong, but that would seem to be old news and not nearly as interesting in the stakes for grabbing new headline, probably best that she shut up!

[Britannia]

Rather than taking the opportunity to take a swipe at the Thai approach to the problem of the Rohingya people can anyone suggest an alternative? These are an Islamic people. They were heading for an Islamic nation. Send them to Malaysia or Indonesia? Do they want them?

Do you want them going to the UK, Australia, US etc?

No I thought not. So, what to do? Send them on? Send them to the Muslem insurgents in the south of Thailand? Send them back?

How many Brits would like to send teh Muslems in the UK back to Arabic states?

See, it isn't as clear cut as you think.

No your right, there are a great number of Brits and I dare say Aussies that would like to send the Muselims back, But the Government does not give in to the desires of the people if it compemises Human Rights. That is what strong Government is, not always giving in to the wishes of the Natinalist, but rather striving to improve Human rights for all World Citizens. (Human Beings) something not understood by raciest or ignorant nationalist

[AsiaCheese]

...

It would have been an opportunity for a PR savvy minister [edit or Permanent Secretary for that matter] to highlight the exaggerations whilst explaining how the programme was being extended. Face saved all round.

Regards

Couldn't agree more. So easy. But that takes a brain, and such things seem to be in short supply, the world over...

[ballpoint]

Rather than taking the opportunity to take a swipe at the Thai approach to the problem of the Rohingya people can anyone suggest an alternative? These are an Islamic people. They were heading for an Islamic nation. Send them to Malaysia or Indonesia? Do they want them?

Do you want them going to the UK, Australia, US etc?

No I thought not. So, what to do? Send them on? Send them to the Muslem insurgents in the south of Thailand? Send them back?

How many Brits would like to send teh Muslems in the UK back to Arabic states?

See, it isn't as clear cut as you think.

No your right, there are a great number of Brits and I dare say Aussies that would like to send the Muselims back, But the Government does not give in to the desires of the people if it compemises Human Rights. That is what strong Government is, not always giving in to the wishes of the Natinalist, but rather striving to improve Human rights for all World Citizens. (Human Beings) something not understood by raciest or ignorant nationalist

No, these governments just lock them up in detention or removal centres before deporting them. Look up Woomera, Harmondsworth, Lindholme and Yarl's Wood for a view of the hypocrisy of the west.

[anon467367354]

I'm wondering, did these Rohinya enter Thailand? Did they actually do the entering, or were they washed up on shore, much like a coconut washes up on shore? Did the Thai "navy" pick them up and bring them here? If they were brought here, then they ought to be cared for properly. Who's your daddy shouldn't really matter in this case, whether it's the UN or not.

[Journalist]

Thailand should complain about Angelina's treatment of Jennifer Aniston.

[Hawkup2000]

Thai mothers.

All your kids came back home from school today?

I've got some news for you. Most Thai mothers live outside Pattaya. Also, most Thai mothers take care of their kids and are wonderful loving moms.

[Crash999]

Exactly, "Mrs Pitt" could have also have commented on the long standing plight of the Hmong, but that would seem to be old news and not nearly as interesting in the stakes for grabbing new headline, probably best that she shut up!

I wouldn't hold your breathe on that one. Jolie probably hasn't seen Gran Torino yet and the orphan kids in Minneapolis aren't cute enough!

[Mobi]

It really doesn't matter whether Jolie is stupid, intelligent, or is is in any way qualified to make the statement that she made.

The fact remains, whether we approve or not, that she is an official representative of UNCR, and as a figurehead, so to speak she was entitled to give her views, which she did in a very careful and respectful manner. Surely she was appointed to bring a spotlight to these issues.

Jolie is a world famous movie star, known in most countries of the world, and for a senior civil servant of the Thai government to make such a statement will probably turn out to be the biggest PR disaster of 2009.

This story is going to be in every newspaper, every radio and TV show in the western world, and the chattering classes will pillory Thailand for their treatment of the refugees (true or not, it doesn't matter), and even more so, the treatment of their beloved film star, who dared to go to far flung and dangerous corners of the world to highlight the plight of refugees. How dare they criticise her!

You'll probably get Bill O'Reilly organising a boycott of Thailand products.

[Lite Beer]

Post containing insulting remarks about Thai Women deleted.

[pothai]

Sangate/Calais.....now that would be something

[SmugFarangBore]

Now, why would they want to do that? Any policy towards the Rohingya was put in place by the proxies of your beloved Thaksin.

The military stopped listening to requests from the PPP a long time ago.

You also fail to note that the ISOC, the military unit accused of the atrocities, was only called back into service by the military junta after the coup that ousted Thaksin and has been given 'special powers' by the military to conduct such operations.

But don't let the facts get in the way of another obsessive anti-Thaksin rant eh?

If there was substantial truth to these stories, surely the current government would be shouting it to the world?

There is more than substantial truth to these stories. All the major networks have covered this story in past weeks, and are continuing to do so, exposing these human rights abuses to the World.

What did you expect Abhisit to do

I expect him to address the matter as leader of the country would do. Unfortunately he cannot do that, as he has no control over the Thai military.

which is increasingly looking somewhat exaggerated?

Links to back up your claims please.

He's offered to assist a UN investigation.

He's also assigned the very military unit accused of the crimes to investigate.

I'm somewhat surprised by the wailing of the Thaksin brigade over this story, bearing in mind his less than perfect treatment of refugees, including the Rohingya, and legal Thai citizens. The story broke when Abhisit had been in office for less than a month, any world leader would check the facts before blindly condemning the alledged perpetrators. If any of it is proved to be true, you would hope that those perpetrators, and those who instructed them, will face justice. I await a further list of charges for Samak et al.

Again trying to blame Thaksin for abuses committed under this government's watch by their allies; the Thai military.

[eastbaybob]

As always, If the government denies it, then it doesn't exist. The problem for the Puppet Government is that most of the rest of the world know what a load of <deleted> this government is coming out with.

Most of the world doesn't know that Thailand is different that Taiwan. As far as knowing any specific policy of the government no one would have the slightest clue. Having said that I agree completely with you.

[karlski]

I reckon Abhisit is scared s-less of the military. He isn't powerful enough to challenge them. Given his situation, I really don't know what he can do differently if he hopes to stay as PM more than five minutes.

exactly.

[amarka]

Rather than taking the opportunity to take a swipe at the Thai approach to the problem of the Rohingya people can anyone suggest an alternative? These are an Islamic people. They were heading for an Islamic nation. Send them to Malaysia or Indonesia? Do they want them?

Do you want them going to the UK, Australia, US etc?

No I thought not. So, what to do? Send them on? Send them to the Muslem insurgents in the south of Thailand? Send them back?

How many Brits would like to send teh Muslems in the UK back to Arabic states?

See, it isn't as clear cut as you think.

hi..

no it is not clear cut, i think you are right.

the UN has failed in so many conflicts and is at least incompetent, if not worse. why should the thai government have to take orders or advise from them...

The UN has been "working" on the palestinian problem now for some 50 years... never mind Dafur... the day of the massacre in srebinicia was the final day of any beleif i had in the UN

the UN has nothing to offer here and the thai's know what they do not want.

amarka

[Africanteacher]

Thai mothers.

All your kids came back home from school today?

I've got some news for you. Most Thai mothers live outside Pattaya. Also, most Thai mothers take care of their kids and are wonderful loving moms.

You of course didn't get the point, but you're excused.

FYI I loathe that P-City you mentioned.

So Thai women make sure you've got your kids with you. Jolie may just flash cash on your faces and adopt them..... She did so in Malawi when she went on a UNHCR 'mission' too.

To be honest, I have no problem with Thailand giving her a 'stern warning'. Keep off Thai policies, Pritti-Jolie

[henryalleman]

There are some very negative comments towards people who made remarks that most of the Aussie, Brits and other Europeans would be very glad if their government send Muslims back home. I lived 25 years amongst them so I do understand the sentiment of negativism towards Muslims.

But sending them back to Burma is not possible because once a Muslim cross the border the Burmese Junta will not allow them to enter anymore.

The reaction of the Thai government towards the statements of an so-called movie star was not very intelligent. If they ignored that statement the whole thing only got a few lines in some newspaper and was already long time forgotten. Now they only draw attention to it, not clever at all.

The treatment of the Thai government regarding Burmese fugitives is a very questionable matter. I saw a documentary made by another UNCHR ambassador filmed in secret. Its was showed on a commercial station in my country. Lucky for the Thai government its a small country, if this was showed on a major TV Station of lets say the US or Britain, a real scandal would brake loose.

Some members asked to which Islamic country you will send Muslims back? Well their is plenty of choice. Morocco, Algeria, Indonesia, Pakistan, Tunisia, Malaysia Iran to name only a few,and I almost forget to mention the UK, France, who are becoming Muslim countries very rapidly.

[Lite Beer]

Thai mothers.

All your kids came back home from school today?

(Removed quote)

I've got some news for you. Most Thai mothers live outside Pattaya. Also, most Thai mothers take care of their kids and are wonderful loving moms.

You of course didn't get the point, but you're excused.

African Teacher. Hawkup2000 was not answering you . He was refering to an offensive post I removed.

Sorry for any confusion.

[A_Traveller]

If there was substantial truth to these stories, surely the current government would be shouting it to the world?

There is more than substantial truth to these stories. All the major networks have covered this story in past weeks, and are continuing to do so, exposing these human rights abuses to the World.

which is increasingly looking somewhat exaggerated?

Links to back up your claims please.

As I noted in my earlier post "..reports have suggested that there had been exaggeration over the recent claims out of Indonesia, with the Arakan Project noting that key elements of the testimony was now being rebutted by the Rohingya themselves. Claims about some 20 deaths, 9 boats and maybe 1000+ refugees being put to sea having been detained for 2 months are now shown to be false.

However, there remains evidence of harsh treatment at the hands of the Thai authorities, which was substantiated by Indonesian doctors. .."Post

Further, SFB, since you asked for 'links', a newspaper article in The Age here quotes the independent Arakan Project on this subject. Again, I do not claim that there was not intimidation, but there was exaggeration.

Regards

Edited February 11, 2009 by A_Traveller

[Africanteacher]

Thailand should complain about Angelina's treatment of Jennifer Aniston.

AMEN!

[sriracha john]

The Thai military is not answerable to the Thai Government.

The moderate Japanese Government had that problem before WW2.

We should warn Pearl Harbor Naval Station now then.

[Africanteacher]

Thai mothers.

All your kids came back home from school today?

(Removed quote)

I've got some news for you. Most Thai mothers live outside Pattaya. Also, most Thai mothers take care of their kids and are wonderful loving moms.

You of course didn't get the point, but you're excused.

African Teacher. Hawkup2000 was not answering you . He was refering to an offensive post I removed.

Sorry for any confusion.

No worries, Sir. I got it wrong there and I'm sorry if I came out somewhat harsh. Peace

[Africanteacher]

Sorry there Hawk Up 2000 Peace.

Slight mix-up in here.

Peace again....

[Jin]

Rather than taking the opportunity to take a swipe at the Thai approach to the problem of the Rohingya people can anyone suggest an alternative? These are an Islamic people. They were heading for an Islamic nation. Send them to Malaysia or Indonesia? Do they want them?

Do you want them going to the UK, Australia, US etc?

No I thought not. So, what to do? Send them on? Send them to the Muslem insurgents in the south of Thailand? Send them back?

How many Brits would like to send teh Muslems in the UK back to Arabic states?

See, it isn't as clear cut as you think.

Spot on!

It is MADE a "Thai Problem" as it is on of the closest Nation and one of the wealthiest in the Region!

Why it is forgotten how many of these "Boat People" have been dealt with already - why are people so quick with blaming Abhisit and the "new Government" for it, taking a swipe at "the Military" without any genuine grounds?

Statement from the Government has been already that the resources are limited..... and the real Culprit is the Military Junta of Myanmar!

It will be a hot issue at the ASEAN Conference, shortly!

Why nobody asks if the Thai Government maybe may need some very urgent international (UNHCR) help with this burning issue?

Instead bash, bash, bash!

Every country in the world seems to face global economic and financial crisis and so is Thailand. It stemmed from a few mistakes that only very few people started for their personal gain in the first place. Every taxpayer in every country is now affected by such a.s.s.hol.ism. Everyone and every government is also affected somewhat by real crisis and somewhat by the mere pretense of it!

While a number of people have claimed their rights to criticize or blame anyone in Thailand, starting from the monarchy down to the Prime Minister, Government and perhaps to everyone existing in this Kingdom, they are so pathetic not looking at the real sides of things but putting up emotional bull.shit to achieve their own selfish mindless goals. Wow, what a masterpiece of invention. You guys are so rich and so willing to spend big bucks on airfares flying across the globes here and there to lecture our people without realising what big problems we are being affected by with all these immigration problems and accential force of mistery from multiculuralism as people from unwanted grades keep escaping into this kingdom. We spend countless amount of our taxpayers money solving this problems and you or your parents can't even realize what we are going through.

Isn't it time to look down at your dimmed shadows and admit that you are running out of time to carry out this compregensive manipulation? The Americans are so good at practising solving the problems from their causes and take preventive measures from them. Ain't it time for Jolie and UNHCR to return to those prestigious lucrative schools to get enlightened instead of coming here and painting wrong colours on our Kingdom.

We all know what caused Rohingya and the illegal immegrants to come to this country. You therefore should ask the Thais why not so many of them illegally migrate to another country and perhaps learn what we do to look after our people instead of trying to outperform our wisdom and refinement by exercising your compregensive manipulation scheme... needless to say!

In going to any land or staying in any country, one ought to respect their laws and understand what burdens they are carrying otherwise it would be one's ignorance to open one's mouth inventively with critics.

[ballpoint]

Now, why would they want to do that? Any policy towards the Rohingya was put in place by the proxies of your beloved Thaksin.

The military stopped listening to requests from the PPP a long time ago.

You also fail to note that the ISOC, the military unit accused of the atrocities, was only called back into service by the military junta after the coup that ousted Thaksin and has been given 'special powers' by the military to conduct such operations.

But don't let the facts get in the way of another obsessive anti-Thaksin rant eh?

If there was substantial truth to these stories, surely the current government would be shouting it to the world?

There is more than substantial truth to these stories. All the major networks have covered this story in past weeks, and are continuing to do so, exposing these human rights abuses to the World.

What did you expect Abhisit to do

I expect him to address the matter as leader of the country would do. Unfortunately he cannot do that, as he has no control over the Thai military.

which is increasingly looking somewhat exaggerated?

Links to back up your claims please.

He's offered to assist a UN investigation.

He's also assigned the very military unit accused of the crimes to investigate.

I'm somewhat surprised by the wailing of the Thaksin brigade over this story, bearing in mind his less than perfect treatment of refugees, including the Rohingya, and legal Thai citizens. The story broke when Abhisit had been in office for less than a month, any world leader would check the facts before blindly condemning the alledged perpetrators. If any of it is proved to be true, you would hope that those perpetrators, and those who instructed them, will face justice. I await a further list of charges for Samak et al.

Again trying to blame Thaksin for abuses committed under this government's watch by their allies; the Thai military.

You'll find that this isn't some issue that suddenly appeared last month as soon as Abhisit came into power, but is the continuation of a policy put in place by Samak. But you have just jumped on the bandwagon because you see it as a way of nailing Abhisit. It has all been covered in the other recent Rohingya thread, and others dating back a year ago. Of course, you won't be interested in those because Samak was in charge then. But here's the link any way...

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Samak-Rohing...nd-t177347.html

Also, from Human Rights Watch, Arakan, March last year:

"Human Rights Watch(HRW),Arakan has drawn its attention with grave shock to the news of above published in the Bangkok Post dated March 29,2008. It is also learnt that relation between Mr. Samak, Prime minister of Thailand and Than Shwe, PM, Burma is improving since recent days on the basis of mutual economic interest amid severe economic sanctions on Burma Junta government by USA and EU since Junta`s crack donw on Monks peaceful protests. At a result 31 protesters were shot dead and hundreds were arrested. Now Mr. Samak is ignoring the economic sanctions and Burma People`s interest and cooperating Than Shwe, the human slaughter and power monger.

Moreover, Samak`s decision to put Rohingyas in a deserted Island ( tough place ) is totally against humanity. There are different religious and different races of people from Burma taking shelter as refugees in Thailand . Why Samak has chosen only Rohingyas to put in tough place ? Why such a religious discrimination was generated in the mind and conscience of Mr. Samak even though Rohingya in Thailand are small in quantity ? It is suspected that Gen. Than Shwe planned to eliminate Rohingya Muslims not only from Burma but also from globe. That’s why a question is arising that Than Shwe is trying to exploit the good relationship between he and Samak. It is perceived that Samak is going to materialize the dream of Than Shwe and possibility of silent genocides time to time on such deserted Island"

And, The Guardian, from late last year:

"In Burma, the Rohingya are considered stateless with few rights. Their circumstances have prompted many to seek a better life in prosperous Muslim Malaysia. Most slip into Bangladesh, where people smugglers organize their passage for about £200. Boats packed with migrants set off during October and April, when the seas are calmer. Middlemen in Thailand pay off immigration authorities then take the travelers by land to Malaysia. Thailand turned a blind eye to the traffic, as the Rohingya never planned to stay. But last March the then prime minister, Samak Sundaravej, announced a crackdown on the Rohingya. In December, the new policy of pushing boats out to sea seemed to take effect. The Thai navy intercepts the migrants and hands them to the army, but it seems the army detains them and uses its own boats to push migrants out to sea. By the end of 2005, the UN refugee agency recorded 13,000 Rohingya in Malaysia. Up to 7,000 are estimated to have slipped into the country since, bringing the total to about 20,000."

For a more up to date article, I suggest you get hold of a copy of this weeks Economist, which also lays the blame squarely with Samak. You're correct that the global news media is covering this story, but not in the way you would have it.

No rants, just facts.

Edited February 11, 2009 by ballpoint