Is A California Wow Going Out Of Business?

[CanInBKK]

Wonder if they're still selling lifetime memberships?

[ricklev]

Thai government agency wisely forced them to stop.

[flowerman134]

Thai government agency wisely forced them to stop.

link? source?

[trogers]

California Still Go Strong

[Declared] Balance shet is not too attractive.Here.

Oh dear. I'll re-think joining their Ekamai joint then.

I presume that if one were to pay for a lifetime membership and WOW goes out of business the next month you would lose all your payment and membership?

Depends on the definition of 'Lifetime'. Your life or life of the business?

[TheLaughingMan]

bah, they have been looking like they will shutdown for years, and I keep enjoying my ultra cheap lifetime membership... considering it was the cost of one year at most gyms Ive already gotten my moneys worth.

[ricklev]

Thai government agency wisely forced them to stop.

link? source?

My dog overheard it at a cocktail party and mentioned it to my ex wife who told my hair stylist......

[ricklev]

They had signs up that they were ending the selling of life time memberships and when I asked why, that's what one of the manager's told me.

[Kwasaki]

If there going out of business they should lodge a compensation claim with B.P.

[TheLaughingMan]

They had signs up that they were ending the selling of life time memberships and when I asked why, that's what one of the manager's told me.

Seriously? For real? Youre going to leave me hanging like that? and when I asked why... THEN NOTHING... <deleted>? Geeze man.....

[ricklev]

I asked the manager why they were stopping selling lifetime memberships and was told that the government was requiring them to stop. The reason why the agency was requiring them to stop selling lifetime memberships went unspoken, but was pretty obviously a legitimate concern of the risk of permanently shutting the doors. In Korea, I have heard, they continued selling lifetime memberships up until the day of closure.

Edited September 12, 2010 by ricklev

[ANTONIO91]

avoid them.

they follow a marketing pattern set up in USA years ago.

which resulted in numerous law suits.

unethical company not to be trusted, salespeople trained to make a sale, not honor the deal

My dog overheard it at a cocktail party and mentioned it to my ex wife who told my hair stylist......

[pjbradley]

If anyone is interested, I have some news on expansion plans for True Fitness. Source: personal trainer at the Asok branch who came from a group meeting with the Singaporean owner, who was in town the week of October 11.

The company plans to open five branches within the next year (which sounds way too ambitious to me, so I wouldn't count on it). The top priority is reopening (as part of the five) the branch around CentralWorld that was torched by those peace-loving advocates of democracy.

The next on the list is a Silom branch. True has already secured space near the BTS/MRT stations at Rama IV. California Disco has owned the Silom market forever.

The only other one I remember from the list will be at Paradise Park, formerly Seri Center, which in the 1990s had a Clark Hatch, but nothing is there now since the renovation and reopening of the mall as Paradise Park. Fitness First owns the market in Eastern Bangkok with branches at Central Bangna and Srinarkarin. California tends to concentrate itself in markets closer to town.

As one might expect, trainers are under the heaviest sales pressure at California, which has some of the cheapest membership fees around. Fitness First applies the least pressure to its staff, probably because its membership fees tend to be the highest. True is in the middle. Membership fees act as come-ons, and once you're in, the sales staff try to upsell you on stuff. Of course you don't have to pay more, and plenty of people don't, but that's the business model.

People here debate the merits of using a personal trainer. An analogy would be taking a class, say, on history, versus reading history books on your own. The issue isn't strictly about the material; other considerations enter into it, and people should probably do what works best for them.

If using a trainer, check out his/her credentials. I use a trainer, and he pays his own way to get advanced training/certification at FIT, which is akin to an academy for personal fitness instructors, and it ain't cheap. Recently at True's Asok branch, I saw a guy whom True had flown in from South Korea provide extra training to their junior personal trainers. Specifically, he was teaching them how to teach and guide new clients who are out of shape and new to the fitness regimen.

Just as with a university or hospital, the care one gets from a personal trainer depends on the person, not the institution. Every place has good and less-than-good people. I'd say the most important trait of a trainer, assuming basic competence, is a desire to nurture, to teach his/her students. Some trainers like older clients, others don't. Some trainers like advanced clients, some have no patience with the out-of-shape relics like me. As a former teacher, I often watch interactions between trainers and their clients: some of what I've seen is nice, other times it's almost painful to watch the lack of chemistry.

Here's to everyone's good health!

[travelmann]

Theyre going bust it was in the UK papers the other day along with a few other well known companies.

[basjke]

Theyre going bust it was in the UK papers the other day along with a few other well known companies.

Why it would be in the UK papers since Cawow is purely asia based company

[Chunky1]

i don't get true fitness.

i have cali wow lifetime for <10k baht and true wanted 25k/yr

both shops are about the same in quality.

[HollandChampion]

I want to join a gym somewhere in sukhumvit, Bangkok so i went to visit a few. I received clear offers from all gyms except California WOW asok, it's like they are keeping something away from me.

California wow offered me a 1-year membership at 14k thb and 19k thb for 2 years after bargaining for one hour and talking to 3 sales reps! I asked about the signup fee and deposit a few times but they evade my question every time. Can anyone tell me if there's a deposit, sign up fee or any extra hidden fees taken from the creditcard after signing up?

I don't want to give them any large deposit due to the fact that there are rumors about their poor financial position. I'm only willing to pay the 14k thb / 12 = 1166 thb/month.

[Samuian]

bah, they have been looking like they will shutdown for years, and I keep enjoying my ultra cheap lifetime membership... considering it was the cost of one year at most gyms Ive already gotten my moneys worth.

Yes, when you DID enjoy it a "lifetime" send me an E-mail... as you write "ultra-cheap" lifetime membership, may bring them fast customers and some cashflow, but I can't see how the business can survive a lifetime!

Don't forget... the mail PN will do!

[frenchfarangjomtien]

bah, they have been looking like they will shutdown for years, and I keep enjoying my ultra cheap lifetime membership... considering it was the cost of one year at most gyms Ive already gotten my moneys worth.

Exactly, same situation here, and it's funny to see the morons keep complaining... 5 years of cheap lifetime was worth paying, and they can close anytime they want, i don't mind now ! How much others did spend at their "better" gyms ? more than 100k for 5 years ? Good! And don't forget to pay again next year!

555... and who is going to believe that the government asked CAWOW to stop selling lifetime !!! Sometimes it sounds like you all just arrived here, right ?

[jfchandler]

This item was in the local news today...

Yesterday, the Stock Exchange of Thailand suspended trading in CAWOW, pending its consideration of the company's financial status and operating performance to determine whether it might be delisted by March 4.The company's shareholders' equity was found to be less than zero.The Securities and Exchange Commission might ask CAWOW to either submit a special audit, revise its financial statements or just stick to its initial report.

With paid-up capital of 550 million baht, CAWOW posted a loss of 93 million baht in 2007 for its first year on revenue of 1.61 billion baht. Losses rose to 120 million in 2008 on revenue of 1.76 billion. Losses in 2009 and 2010 were 274 million and 466 million baht, respectively.

[FarangBuddha]

The scamster at the top of this Ponzi scheme recently cashed out of his Phuket manse. Probably already living next door to Taksin and Mubarak somewhere in Dubai or Croatia.

Levine = Madoff...never trust these types.

Edited February 25, 2011 by FarangBuddha

[doggie888888]

i don't get true fitness.

i have cali wow lifetime for <10k baht and true wanted 25k/yr

both shops are about the same in quality.

One is reputable and fairly upfront, the other is not reputable, unethical, plays silly word games and tries to muddy waters with what they are actually giving you.

[Hermes100]

Yes, they are going under and selling off.

[ricklev]

Should be interesting to see what happens. I hope I don't show up to work out one day and they are closed. Mayber the high percentage of ownership by Major will keep them in business, at least at the branches that they don't have to pay rent.......

[jfchandler]

If you read the other news report on this subject, that TV won't allow to be posted or linked to here, you'd see sources talking about how the Calif. WOW business model of cheap memberships simply isn't supportable over the longer term...

I'm not a member and never have been of theirs, or any of their competitors. Another TV member above called them a "ponzi scheme." I don't know about that, but the way they operate and market their business, it certainly gives off that kind of appearance.

If I was the owner of one of their lifetime memberships right now, I wouldn't be feeling too happy.

i don't get true fitness.

i have cali wow lifetime for <10k baht and true wanted 25k/yr

both shops are about the same in quality.

One is reputable and fairly upfront, the other is not reputable, unethical, plays silly word games and tries to muddy waters with what they are actually giving you.

[janverbeem]

^ Like another member said already,I would be more unhappy if I had paid every year for a membership at another club the same amount what I paid WOW for the past 3 years.

[Nawtier]

Wonder if TV can be sued for the demise of CA WOW.....I surely would not by a membership here now after reading all of this.....

[robblok]

Owner of my own home gym and lifetime of cali wow. However i got my money from it already. I mostly train at home anyway because cali wow is a bit too far.

Like others said if you bought your lifetime membership a couple of years ago its ok.

[ace]

oh well caveat emptor i guess. at least i dont have to worry about renewal fee any more

[JPPR2]

The fitness chain pump and dump was pioneered in America (we're innovators!), so we're kind of familiar with it. I don't know if various European countries or Australia or the like went through it, but this is exactly what happened. Guy founds fitness chain, oversells memberships, everything's great. The chain begins expansion to make more money, runs up a ton of debt and suddenly the credit card rebilling complaints start rolling in to local authorities. The reps get pushier and pushier, the high pressure sales kick in and by now other companies have seen the model and started competing, so a price war develops. Unable to reap the fat profits when there's direct competition, the high pressure stuff gets worse, the rebilling gets worse and often the expansion continues as a way of keeping the appearance of a healthy company while hoping to build something worth selling. In the US, everyone who pulled this model eventually got picked up by a holding company or hedge fund or something, if not a larger gym chain, though I can't recall how many involved bankruptcies. Gold's Gym, 24 Hour Fitness and Bally's are the majors. 24 Hour Fitness has a number of private label brands across the world, of which I've heard California WOW is one, though I haven't verified that. You can google "24 Hour Fitness" or "Bally's" and "class action" for some examples of the consumer end of this.

I was a member of California WOW for about three years on a monthly plan that was supposed to have included access at any gym. When I moved across town and tried to go to the local outlet I was told "Silom only, cannot." I canceled my membership and wouldn't go back. I don't think the place is a bad deal if you're careful about the bargain you make up front, but be careful about their credit card billing and don't expect the promises during the sales process to actually be true (and don't give them your mobile number, heh). Though of course most people in the thread already know this. As for whether they're going out of business, it's tough to say in Thailand. In America they'd get absorbed or picked up by someone, that's the point of the business model. In Thailand, who knows?

What I'd really like is a neighborhood gym and there are a few around Bangkok, but there's not one just close enough to me yet (around Thong Lo, South side of Sukhumvit).

24 Fitness is the worst of the bunch. They just got dinged again in the US for dbl billing customers. I am USA'n and found it much nicer to invest in my own little weight set and work core. Gyms are a scam, always have been always will be. It is a shell game and it appears that CAL WOW will belly up soon. Funny California WOW. I moved here from California....I utterly laughed when I saw it..

[bonobo]

I paid CW 9,000 baht four years ago for a lifetime membership. I use it three times a week unless I am on the road. And a bench press is a bench press no matter where it is.

Even if it goes belly up, I will certainly have gotten my money's worth.