Building House

[ZOVOX]

If you own some land, and then later build a house on the land, is there something added to the title deeds to reflect the value of the house and that a structure has been built on the land ?

If yes, I assume this would be done at the land registration dept. ?

[astral]

No, nothing.

In some area you are supposed to ask permission from the Amphur to build,

but I think it is more honoured in the breach than in the observance.

Either way, no-one checks the standards afterwards, so it is irrelevant.

They will ask when you sell the land, and you will be taxed then accordingly to how

big a house is on the land.

[ZOVOX]

Thanks astral ! I understand that my thai wife can own the land and i own the structure on it as a foreigner, so would i have any papers which states i own the structure from the land dept ?

[astral]

Thanks astral ! I understand that my thai wife can own the land and i own the structure on it as a foreigner, so would i have any papers which states i own the structure from the land dept ?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think you will need a lease on the land for 30 years.

What you build is up to you, but it reverts to the lessor and the end of the lease.

Within the period of the lease you can sell the house, and the remaining portion of the lease, if you wish to do so.

A lawyer will be able to clarify the details.

[ZOVOX]

If i hold the title deeds to the land in my safe and she cannot get access to the deeds, will this prevent her from selling the land ? Or can she simply get a duplicate copy from the land dept. ?

[Doctor John]

If i hold the title deeds to the land in my safe and she cannot get access to the deeds, will this prevent her from selling the land ? Or can she simply get a duplicate copy from the land dept. ?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

She can sell when she wants, it's her land.

Sounds like a good trusting relationship.

[Digger]

You can put a loan on the property/land in the same way as a mortgage. This MUST be registered at land office and will show on the chanot as an uncleared loan. Nobody (except some dumb farang without advice) would buy any such land until the loan has been repaid.

[chico]

i am no expert , but according to my knowledge you can only make this kind of lease for 30 years if the lady (your wife) really owns the land (chanot)

[andy50]

hi zovox, you as a falang ,cant own any land in thailand, if ur wife owns some, all you can "own"is the house you have built ,sometimes ,once the house is finished and furnished etc the wife simply boots the falang husband out on his butt ,there is no recourse he can do about it

also if wifey dies wifeys family become the new proud owners of the land ,---get the lot on a mortgage , then youve got some fianancal power as you pay the payments!making it less lightly her asking you to "vacate the premisis"

[mbkudu]

hi zovox, you as a falang ,cant own any land in thailand, if ur wife owns some, all you can "own"is the house you have built ,sometimes ,once the house is finished and furnished etc the wife simply boots the falang husband out on his butt ,there is no recourse he can do about it

also if wifey dies wifeys family become the new proud owners of the land ,---get the lot on a mortgage , then youve got some fianancal power as you pay the payments!making it less lightly her asking you to "vacate the premisis"

It's a catch 22. Try getting a mortgage on a plot of land from a Thai bank as a foreigner and you'll quickly see the doors shut in front of you unless it's in the missus' name, then you're back to sqare 1. Jeeze, what am I saying?

Edited January 18, 2005 by mbkudu

[astral]

You can put a loan on the property/land in the same way as a mortgage. This MUST be registered at land office and will show on the chanot as an uncleared loan.  Nobody (except some dumb farang without advice) would buy any such land until the loan has been repaid.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I have a feeling that a loan from a farang cannot be registered in this way!!

Better to go the company route, then you do control the land and house, in the event that the lady dies or leaves you!!

Make a will so that she gets it when you die.

[Sumitr Man]

Zovox:

There is a general presumption under Thai land law such that any structure built on land belongs to the landowner; unless an application is made to the Land Dept. otherwise to the effect.

In effect, what this means is if you want to build a house on your wife's land, and want to be the registered owner of the house, you and your wife need to go the Land Dept. where the land is registered and submit an application for registration of ownership of the land to be recognised as being different to that of the house. Not too onerous a task - but I cannot remember the fee structure.

SM

[ZOVOX]

Zovox:

There is a general presumption under Thai land law such that any structure built on land belongs to the landowner; unless an application is made to the Land Dept. otherwise to the effect.

In effect, what this means is if you want to build a house on your wife's land, and want to be the registered owner of the house, you and your wife need to go the Land Dept. where the land is registered and submit an application for registration of ownership of the land to be recognised as being different to that of the house.  Not too onerous a task - but I cannot remember the fee structure.

SM 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks SM ! If i were to do this would i get seperate papers for the house, or would it be recorded on the title deeds of the land ?

[_Echinochloa_]

Set it all up in a company.Then you can turf her out at anytime and all it costs is approx Baht15,000-20,000.Ask SunBeltAsia or Indo-Siam.

[jaidee36]

Set it all up in a company.Then you can turf her out at anytime and all it costs is approx Baht15,000-20,000.Ask SunBeltAsia or Indo-Siam.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I have heard that some people have managed to set up a company for as little as Bt20,000 to own property but this has not been my experience. Please also note that the company must be properly audited on an annual basis and that you will incur additional annual auditing costs of at least Bt20,000. People have also run into problems with the Inland Revenue because you are operating a non-trading company (they want you to pay some VAT). There are advantages of the Company route particularly if you sell the property in the future - by selling the company you can save on transfer taxes.

In my experience, the company route is suitable if the land and property are valuable (say worth in excess of Bt10m).

A cheaper and simpler route is to say register the land in your wife's name and then lease it off her for 30 years. That way, if you split up, you will still own the land and the house for the period of the lease. Also, Foreign nationals may own a building (as distinct from it's land) and may register such transfer of ownership into their names at the local district office.

Apologies if I have simply repeated other peoples posts. I have not read the whole thread but I noticed that several comments were wrong.

[Sumitr Man]

Thanks SM ! If i were to do this would i get seperate papers for the house, or would it be recorded on the title deeds of the land ?

The land dept will keep a record of this. You can get separate papers for a house - the Household registration papers - but this is done at the Ministry of Interior and I don;t think it gives you legal recourse to say you own the house, but rather that you reside there for the purposes of voting/residency/ID-card, etc. I need to double check that with my source.

[Welsh John]

A cheaper and simpler route is to say register the land in your wife's name and then lease it off her for 30 years. That way, if you split up, you will still own the land and the house for the period of the lease.

Exactly what I did on both of my properties and no hassle as well. Just get a good Lawyer!!!!

[Digger]

Set it all up in a company.Then you can turf her out at anytime and all it costs is approx Baht15,000-20,000.Ask SunBeltAsia or Indo-Siam.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I have heard that some people have managed to set up a company for as little as Bt20,000 to own property but this has not been my experience. Please also note that the company must be properly audited on an annual basis and that you will incur additional annual auditing costs of at least Bt20,000. People have also run into problems with the Inland Revenue because you are operating a non-trading company (they want you to pay some VAT). There are advantages of the Company route particularly if you sell the property in the future - by selling the company you can save on transfer taxes.

In my experience, the company route is suitable if the land and property are valuable (say worth in excess of Bt10m).

A cheaper and simpler route is to say register the land in your wife's name and then lease it off her for 30 years. That way, if you split up, you will still own the land and the house for the period of the lease. Also, Foreign nationals may own a building (as distinct from it's land) and may register such transfer of ownership into their names at the local district office.

Apologies if I have simply repeated other peoples posts. I have not read the whole thread but I noticed that several comments were wrong.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Its not VAT they want, its a correctly filed and audited company account. From this you most likely will need to pay some taxes, e.g property rental tax and or corporation tax. VAT only applies if your turnover is something like more than 1,600,000 baht per annum. You really just need some income and expense (e.g income being rent your paying to the company, say 10,000 baht a month and expenses, e.g UBC bills made out to the company, Furniture receipts from Index etc. From that your accountant can make up a balance sheet. Calculate tax from the Profit & Loss statement and file it. Quite simple really but not as cheap as it used to be as tax needs to be paid rather than ignored in the past.

[Sumitr Man]

Exactly what I did on both of my properties and no hassle as well. Just get a good Lawyer!!!!

Whilst it is always helpful to find a good lawyer, what you actually need is to find 6 Thai who you can trust enough to make shareholders of your company. IME, this is a far bigger ask - unless, of course, you're happy to pick the first 6 people walking down the street (as many are)

Its not VAT they want, its a correctly filed and audited company account. From this you most likely will need to pay some taxes, e.g property rental tax and or corporation tax. VAT only applies if your turnover is something like more than 1,600,000 baht per annum. You really just need some income and expense (e.g income being rent your paying to the company, say 10,000 baht a month and expenses, e.g UBC bills made out to the company, Furniture receipts from Index etc. From that your accountant can make up a balance sheet. Calculate tax from the Profit & Loss statement and file it. Quite simple really but not as cheap as it used to be as tax needs to be paid rather than ignored in the past

VAT would only apply if you were involved in a service industry. I would contend that they want to audit your accounts for two reasons: (1) to make sure you are paying the 30% corporate income tax [and VAT and Special Business Tax (SBT), if applicable]; and (2) to make sure that you are not using your company as a front to avoid the restrictions on foreign ownership of land. IME, Thais are not quite as stupid as many farangs would like to think they are

SM

[astral]

I have heard that some people have managed to set up a company for as little as Bt20,000 to own property

Its not VAT they want, its a correctly filed and audited company account.  From this you most likely will need to pay some taxes, e.g property rental tax and or corporation tax.  You really just need some income and expense (e.g income being rent your paying to the company, say 10,000 baht a month and expenses, e.g UBC bills made out to the company, Furniture receipts from Index etc.  From that your accountant can make up a balance sheet.  Calculate tax from the Profit & Loss statement and file it.  Quite simple really but not as cheap as it used to be as tax needs to be paid rather than ignored in the past.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Cost 15-20,000 baht a year.

Small money for peace of mind!!

[ProThaiExpat]

Seeking the most protection from my Thai's family in the event I was a widower, I put the house and land in my Thai's name, but at the same time leased the land and house back and also placed a "non-disturbance " penalty clause with a 5 million price tag in the lease. I also "loaned" the purchase money to my Thai which was recorded as a mortgage. The mortgage payments equal the rent payments, so it is a wash.

Both the lease and the mortgage appear on the back of the chanot for all to see and beware.

You do have to pay recording fees on the mortgage and the lease and negotiated taxes on the rent payments. Total for me on a 2 million house was 50K.

[No beleeeeve!]

Thai eviction notice:

A foreign guy builds a house on property his Thai wife-g/f or family owns. One day the guy comes home to see all his belongings thrown in front of the house and his Thai girl sitting there with her brothers and all of their friends.

"What's this?" The foreigner asks his cute little Thai girl.

"You no live here no more, go!" His sweet little innocent doe replies.

"What? I built this house! I paid for this house!" He screams back.

The group of Thai guys now stand up when they hear the hopeless farang raise his voice.

She calmly replies "This my land, this my house, you go!"

The loser farang now can either grab his belongings and leave with his tail between his legs and lose everything or argure more, get jumped by the ten plus guys there and then they call the police who come and arrest the foreigner.

Then he pays big fines at the police station and STILL loses his house.

He has no legal rights whatsoever to that house. Yeah, sure the courts this and that, good luck!

This is not a joke, I know guys and know of guys who have had this happen.

You have to go into it knowing you can lose it all after the first argument or when a younger more weathly guy comes along and you are then history.

Good luck!