Working in thailand without a work permit ?

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Keethsa, En 184 has been told over and over that his proposed employers are without doubt crooked, and that he cannot work without the appropriate visa and permit. He persists with the questions hoping to find someone who supports his wonderful idea. Not a clever guy out En 184

[dtoodnut]

A QUESTION more than a Reply.

OK, the business of work.  It is very nebulous.  You are over there and contract a team of people to do some quicky totally legal work for you.   Software development, elec. gadgets, 500 leather bags....you put the work team together and the work gets done in a couple of weeks, or a month.  You pay them in Euros or TBHT whatever they want, and pay them well.  Maybe get their cavities filled and check ups for their little ones.

What is the punishment for that?   Or, is there any...is it, like not really work but just business development.

[randyksf]

How do I get a business visa?

My Visa experience. A really good one

If you look at the visa requirements in the main pages of Thaivisa.com. It is simple I did it three weeks ago.

Here is what I did.

From the US.

I called the Honorary Thai counsel in the US. Asked them what I need.

1. A letter from your company on letter head. Stating you purpose of doing business in Thailand.  (I said to purchase Thai goods for export.)

2. I had just formed a LLc. In the state of Nevada. So I sent my cooperate charter and by laws. (Had the by laws signed by a notary public.)

3. Net worth statement.  I think they wanted to see over a million baht.

Having an LLc. when doing business anywhere it can offer you a lot of personal protecting.  When doing things corp. to corp. the most of the rules change. Oh one other little thing my airline ticket and lots of other expenses are a tax right-off.  

My company is legal and is registered with an US Federal Tax ID #. The visa process took 2 days.

I am not sure what the businesses laws are in your country are. I would do as much work to be legal here as possible.

Not sure what everyone thinks of the honorary Thai counsels? Here is the url http://www.thaiembdc.org/directry/direc_e.htm#TX_HT

I found it to be an easy process working with the honorary consulate. The cost was $125 USD or 5200 Thb.

One other warning because they are cracking down on visas. Be outside of Thailand when you get it.  

I was in the US so it was completely legal. I have heard of people using a broker. However if an emigration person really looks at the passport you will be hard pressed to explain how you got a visa from a different company while in Thailand.

[mowlem]

Selling to farangs financial plans ain't easy. It's all about relationships, and as most set up their plans BEFORE coming the market ain't big. You won't make a living in year 1.

Question. Are you qualified? or just a bullshitter selling whatever you're told.

Question. Of course people say they are successful, but how many sales staff (as a percentage) in your company have been there two years or more?

Question. Why are you taking all the risks? No WP means if they decide to invent reasons to not pay your salary, you have no comeback WHATSOEVER. You are illegal. This is regularly done to Burmese workers, who mysteriously get busted just before they paid back wages...

Join the chatroom as a guest and tell us the company. I bet it is the sort of operation that gives us farangs a bad name.

[en184]

Given all the advice I have recieved, I have decided it is not worth the risk.  The commission offered, 3% would not be sufficient to cover my living costs and my visa would probably run out before my first commission is earned.  Working on the same basis as a Burmese immigrant is not clever.  Infact I am sure certain bar girls with the same status would earn more especially if they work arround the region.

While the company is offering an honest opportunity to be an independant financial adviser, selling policies to expats in thailand, I believe the market for such life insurance policies is not that good right now.  Certainly, the industry over here in europe has been facing less premium income than before.  

Having worked in the industry, in the section paying out the commissions, I know that some IFA's do earn alot of money.  I have seen the commission being paid out from the view of the life insurance co.

It would take 2 customers / month with 50k USD in assets to earn a reasonable wage.  My guess is even this number is quite hard to achieve in a small market like BKK and the large number of brokers chasing these dollars.

Probably easier to find 2 such customers in europe?

[en184]

I am qualified.  I have an advanced degree in finance and would make a good financial planner.

I strongly believe that alot of people are not saving enough for thier retirement and for rainy days etc which come to the unprepared.

layoffs and such are on the increase.

[en184]

Anybody disagree that this is not worth the risk, and that actually living in Europe is quite comfortable really.

Why work in thailand without a work permit, and only a sales based commission, when life is actually very comfortable over here, and I can still have my holiday home in thailand and spend up to 6 weeks a year down there, enjoying the country.

[Pinkster]

Why indeed....

[Rockhard]

I've found that here in Thailand, over the years, people consistently ask questions about the country but most do not listen. It is obviously possible to "work" here in Thailand without a work permit but it's not the brightest thing to do. I have myself set-up with my company in the US and my Thai wife's company set-up here in Thailand doing the "work" for me (shipping). I've been here 7 years, know the country a bit, know the language and have a fair number of connections. It takes time to "find" the way to legally make decent money here and unless you get a legitimate job before coming here or have money to tide you over for a year or two, I wouldn't make a move here. A few years ago, ok, but not now. The government is not exactly Pro-farang right now so go ahead, take your chances if you want too but be prepared to pay the consequences which are shit.

[electro]

Hi Guys,

Ultimately it is all "Academic" !

However as somebody said already just do not get paid in Thailand !

Lastly en184 , I have to say that you should understand something regarding the 'Non Immigrant B' Visa , this allows somebody to stay in Thailand for 90 days not 30 days as a Tourist Visa allows !

To amke a "Moot Point" anyone working or attempting to do any work on a "Tourist Visa" should first visit the Immigration Dept in Bangkok , walk behind the Building and take a look at the Immigration Jail !!!!!

Best of Luck for the "Dummies" :cool:

[Guest IT Manager]

In case you would establish a company yourself and subcontract work from the company where you actually work, you still wouldnt be given a work permit because of the screening that takes place before a work permit application is approved.

And that gem of disinformation originated where? A work permit application is based on several things, as Sunbelt will tell you, but none of them appear in your list. Talk to people who do the companies and permits.

If it's your company, you are assessed, not the prospective employer.

[keestha]

But IT.....you have to see what I said in the context of preceding posts in this thread. Do you really think somebody working in a boiler room where foreigners without a work permit are telemarketing, could get a work permit by establishing his own company which subcontracts work from the boiler room?  A "company office' which consists of a backroom with a telephone and a list of prospects which have to be called to make a sales pitch wouldnt look too convincing to labour department officials when they drop by to do their inspection, I am afraid.

[en184]

The company im question was barclayspencer.  They appear to be a very reputable company.  

Almost wish I hadn't turned them down.  

Anybody heard of them?

[Digger]

The company im question was barclayspencer.  They appear to be a very reputable company.  

Almost wish I hadn't turned them down.  

Anybody heard of them?

BarclaySpencer are well known here for harrassing expats with selling financial plans.      

Not a flame but I for one would never trust anyone to give me good advice if their whole operation operates on the fringes of legality.    I get many phone calls from guys like these trying to sell pensions etc etc and I tell them all to p**s of unless they can show me their work permit and taxes paid for the last 3 years in the country where they are based.  So far nobody has ever made it to an appointment... I wonder why?

[Butterfly]

The company im question was barclayspencer.  They appear to be a very reputable company.  

Almost wish I hadn't turned them down.  

Anybody heard of them?

Why did you ? there were no risk at all.

All the other guys are afraid of their own shaddow.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Wherever did you get that insane idea Butterfly.  If posting grossly irresponsible advice was  a capital crime, you'd be on death row.

[Butterfly]

Wherever did you get that insane idea Butterfly.  If posting grossly irresponsible advice was  a capital crime, you'd be on death row.

Come on, what are the risks if he does this ? there is no way they can catch him if he is discrete and not bragging about it in the bars. I am only mentioning the risk here, not wether it is legal or not. This is a different issue.

[taxexile]

Come on, what are the risks if he does this ? there is no way they can catch him

and people wonder why there is a crackdown.

[en184]

The only real risks, butterfly, is tha i don't make as much money on a commission based system as having a regular job.

And, it would cost me money in accomodation and flights.  

I thought about it.  To make alot of money, you gotta be good every month and make the sales.  During the first few months, you might not make any sales.

SO, you got lost earnings and you gotta support yourself.  And, I would not be ble to live cheaply in Bangkok.;  There is too much temptation.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Hey Tax....are the loonies in charge of the asylum ? I wonder where they pluck these ideas from. And, as you say, they wonder why there is a crackdown, and why farangs are being targeted by the Government.    

[base1]

The company im question was barclayspencer.  They appear to be a very reputable company.  

Almost wish I hadn't turned them down.  

Anybody heard of them?

BarclaySpencer are well known here for harrassing expats with selling financial plans.      

...too true Digger!  what an annoying bunch of amateur mobile phone book "leads" list grabbers they are. duh! 

[Butterfly]

The only real risks, butterfly, is tha i don't make as much money on a commission based system as having a regular job.

And, it would cost me money in accomodation and flights.  

I thought about it.  To make alot of money, you gotta be good every month and make the sales.  During the first few months, you might not make any sales.

SO, you got lost earnings and you gotta support yourself.  And, I would not be ble to live cheaply in Bangkok.;  There is too much temptation.

Oh, I totally agree with you. The financial risk is pretty high in these type of jobs. The few people I did see succeed were making good money, but I don't know how many have failed. Probably more than a few.

[Mr Average]

re: work permits

Doubtless all you oh-so-terribly knowledgeable experts out there are aware already of the very large number of English teachers who've been working here for years without work permits.

Perhaps you'd be kind enough to pool your immense wisdom and reveal to me the staggeringly high percentage of those who were deported last year.