How To Save An Aspiring Bar Girl?

[think_too_mut]

Uhm sorry she dropped out of school at 14 and has no education but speaks english well? Are you a sucker? She's BEEN FALANGED already, heavily or she wouldn't speak any english at all period. She is feeding you this bullshit story about wanting to work at a gogobar because stupid dummies are supposed to instantly want to "save" her and offer to pay her to NOT work in a bar. This scam has been done a million times... how can you seriously fall for it??

Not sure where you get your info but I have a neighbor that is only 9 years old, speaks excellent englsh, and has never been out of the village.

I have heard of that too. Comes with a special milk, the more you suck on the bottle the more English ability you acquire.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

OP hasn't been back..

He got quite a few of you guys so credit where credit is due.

[BigSnake]

Save the girl?? you maybe in fact be wasting your time. Go for it anyway

[bonobo]

Uhm sorry she dropped out of school at 14 and has no education but speaks english well? Are you a sucker? She's BEEN FALANGED already, heavily or she wouldn't speak any english at all period

Not necesseraly, I've met Thai girls who dropped out of high school and were able to speak English even at a very young age. Many times they would study the language on their own, sometimes while working with foreigners (but not necesseraly sleeping with them)

OP, I wish you good luck with helping this girl. However the sad truth is that sometimes, even with all of our best intentions, there' nothing that we can do. Hope I'm wrong.

I met a 6-year-old Thai girl last night who speaks excellent English. Granted, she is going to a top school.  But kids who are exposed to a language can pick it up very quickly and very well.  I am not saying that the OP's woman did this or if she is running some sort of scam, but language ability alone is not enough to dam_n anyone.

[dave111223]

Uhm sorry she dropped out of school at 14 and has no education but speaks english well? Are you a sucker? She's BEEN FALANGED already, heavily or she wouldn't speak any english at all period. She is feeding you this bullshit story about wanting to work at a gogobar because stupid dummies are supposed to instantly want to "save" her and offer to pay her to NOT work in a bar. This scam has been done a million times... how can you seriously fall for it??

Not sure where you get your info but I have a neighbor that is only 9 years old, speaks excellent englsh, and has never been out of the village.

I agree wholeheartedly with Sabum. Thai woman with limited education speaking conversational English?? Even if she super smart and could speak some English from a government education before the age of 14. She then has somehow managed to retain the language without interaction with other English speaking people for 7 years?

Sounds like she's already been working in the bars.

Unless the OP can speak fluent Thai, and was actually speaking to the woman in Thai??

As for track61: Obviously more to this story than stated.

Maybe my kid will pop out speaking Swahili...

[think_too_mut]

Uhm sorry she dropped out of school at 14 and has no education but speaks english well? Are you a sucker? She's BEEN FALANGED already, heavily or she wouldn't speak any english at all period. She is feeding you this bullshit story about wanting to work at a gogobar because stupid dummies are supposed to instantly want to "save" her and offer to pay her to NOT work in a bar. This scam has been done a million times... how can you seriously fall for it??

Not sure where you get your info but I have a neighbor that is only 9 years old, speaks excellent englsh, and has never been out of the village.

I agree wholeheartedly with Sabum. Thai woman with limited education speaking conversational English?? Even if she super smart and could speak some English from a government education before the age of 14. She then has somehow managed to retain the language without interaction with other English speaking people for 7 years?

Just shows how wrong I have been to take my daughter (now 5) to an International school in Japan that cost 25,000US$ a year for 180 days of teaching.

She can speak English but why the cost?

I should have left her in Isaan village where English abilities roll in the streets for anyone to pick them up.

[Shotime]

It's very difficult if not impossible to "save" anyone. "Save" yourself first.

[wasabi]

It's very difficult if not impossible to "save" anyone. "Save" yourself first.

I was trying to think of some witty response that revealed my deep understanding of Thailand and human nature but you really said it all there!

[teacup]

to the OP

Well, support her for awhile so she can get off the job.

The problem is that… her support networks are probably mostly working girls. So you need to help her find a new social life / new networking circle, and new aspirations in life

If she's a gold digger, too bad, move on.

Good luck.

[Marksamui]

To the OP:

The girl is 21 and speaks good english and has little education = She HAS worked in a bar before

The mother has her 21 yr old daughter and now another baby? = This is the girls baby not the mothers, the mother looks after it for her.

She does not want to go to the bar = She wants you to give her money

For me (you can call me cynical if you wish) but this is as straight a forward scam as they come, should be pretty obvious what is going on here. Look I am not cold hearted and I fell sorry for the girl, but don't get caught up it this mess. It is a con and you are the mark that is falling for it by the sound of it. Walk away otherwise you will regret it!

Edited March 27, 2009 by Marksamui

[britmaveric]

At the end of the day not your business - don't get involved.

[think_too_mut]

The girl is 21 and speaks good english and has little education = She HAS worked in a bar before

The mother has her 21 yr old daughter and now another baby? = This is the girls baby not the mothers, the mother looks after it for her.

She does not want to go to the bar = She wants you to give her money

The girl must be enjoying her game with someone who does not even question along above 3 lines.

[Tod Daniels]

Believe me an entry level "real" job at 6000 a month is nothing to sneeze at for a person with as marginal an education as the girl in your story. Don't confuse how little that money is worth wherever you came from with the value of it here in this pissant country.

I have found; first world values concerning finances have little or no place in a developing third world country. There are MANY entire families living without difficulty on that amount.

While your story is anecdotally amusing; it is one which has been beaten to death on this and other forums. Sadly you can't "save" anyone, they have to save themselves. That she has stellar engrish skills, and that the monther has a young baby (highly suspect), I think she's already in the P4P business, but hey, you're the one wearing rose colored glasses not me.

Given the incredibly tight, (yet often completely blind) devotion I have seen thais give their parents (even ones less redeeming than the two in your story), I doubt you'll EVER be able to convince her to take 'gainful' employment over the perceived big money' a "time share" or "rent-to-own" girl might make.

Please be aware; right now is the lowest season some girls I know in the industry have ever experienced in many years. They are making LESS than the 6000 baht take home in salary after their deductions to their original 14,000 baht a month for missing quotas on bar-fines and lady-drinks. Many have taken time off, went back up country to Nakhon Nowhere to live with their families, as it is just not as viable a business as it was several years ago. ..

Good luck, my advice is run away without looking back.

This story has the makings of a slow motion train wreck with the O/P the engineer. ..

[Marksamui]

The girl is 21 and speaks good english and has little education = She HAS worked in a bar before

The mother has her 21 yr old daughter and now another baby? = This is the girls baby not the mothers, the mother looks after it for her.

She does not want to go to the bar = She wants you to give her money

The girl must be enjoying her game with someone who does not even question along above 3 lines.

Honestly and I doubt he will admit it, but I would bet that the OP is already handing some cash over!

This is an open and shut con, plain and simple.

[keestha]

Doing a normal job, she would probably earn more than in a bar during the low season. OP, just gain the confidence of a girl doing this type of work, and ask her how much money she and her friends really make. You'll find out they are living hand to mouth.

[Maizefarmer]

well, I expect there will be plenty of flippant, facetious, sanctimonious replies to this but here we go.

I know a young lady who is NOT a bar girl. She is from a slum in Lad Prao, her stepfather is a drunk, her mother has a two year old baby as well as this daughter who is 21. Her name is "J".

J's mother wants her to go work in a go go bar to support the family. The mother does not work and has J wrapped around her little finger. The stepfather is violent and abusive.

The go go bar is attractive for J because....

1. She thinks she can help her mother/baby sister.

2. She can live by herself away from the abusive (physically, he has threatened sexually before too) stepfather.

3. She is from a slum and likes the idea of having money and the power and perceived worth that that brings.

4. She thinks she can find a farang "boyfriend" at the bars (she hates Thai guys)

J is uneducated and left school at 14. It is true she will make money and help her family. However, she has no other idea of what to do and seems to me to be unduly controlled by her mother and, understandably, greedy for money beyong the poverty she has grown up with.

Please help me.....does she have any options bearing in mind she needs to get away from the stepfather and help her (blo#dy selfish) mother and she has no education so will only be able to get a crappy 6000 bhat a month job. She speaks good English, is pretty but other than that has no other "qualifications".

Thanks for any caring and positive ideas. I am not expecting much. I want to talk her out of the go go bar but.......I cannot find anything better.

Your intention is honourable - but sadly, I fear you are beating a broken drum

The reality of the situation is that in many cases the lesser of the evil opputunities open to folk in such situations are that barwork becomes their best option - saving her may be letting her go work in a bar.

That, in my humble opinion has never been the problem in its self: its how the individual deals with the situation. The problems start when bar work becomes alcohol consumption (in large quantities), then soft drug abuse, then narcotic abuse .... and so the "problems" build upon each other over time.

I know a few bar girls - professionals: its a Disney ride, you pay for the fun, have a good time and then turn your back and walk away. Thats the way they work - they don't get involved in any of the emotional bull shit, they don't ask for money to be sent, they don't letter write - they do the nights work and thats it - its over the next day. End of subject - no exceptions.

Their attitude to it is no different to any other job - just that its a job in which the line between personal and professional life has to be drawn a lot more strictly than folk in conventional professions/job would draw the line between the 2.

If she has the character and personality to discipline herself to do that (and most can't .......), then chances are she can keep her head on and make a success of it, save money, get the things she wants, get herself and her family out of the cycle of poverty and make a success of her life.

So, what are the chnaces you think she can go about it like that?

Where do most of them come unstuck?

They lack experiance on how to handle financial affairs - no matter what they have, it becomes money in one hand and out the next - all because they know how easy it is to get more. After a few years on the game, they look back at the lost oppurtunity. In other words: for the long run they are actually little better off than they were when they started out.

... and before someone cites an example otherwise, yes - I know, but for the overwhelming majority come their 30's and 40's the oppurtunity has passed them by ...

And that all said, at the end of the day no-one saves you - you get given oppurtunities to save yourself, but its only you who can do it.

Edited March 27, 2009 by Maizefarmer

[MrHammer]

The young child and the english sounds suspectible, now the others pointed out!

I don't really meet a lot of slum dwellers so I am not sure whats up and down here.

Why is it, that so many of these people have no qualms about lying and scamming? I know that people like this ends up miserable, they start to believe their own lies, they forget how to trust people, they turn on their friends and family, they have to drink or use drugs to cover up their dark heart.

I truly feel sorry for such pitiful existence. In the end you get whats coming to you. If you are a buddhist perhaps you will be reborn 500 times as cripple - who knows?

[TAWP]

Why not let her work in a go-go bar?

As you said, it would allow her to move out of an abusive environment, have more money, be independent and still be able to support the family (and younger sibling).

Good for her.

[MrHammer]

Why not let her work in a go-go bar?

As you said, it would allow her to move out of an abusive environment, have more money, be independent and still be able to support the family (and younger sibling).

Good for her.

She probably did already, thats were she learned to lie so easily.

Bar girls ar 90% fuc_ked up emotionally and morally. Specially those that have to deal with the brits and german package tourists.

[TAWP]

Bar girls ar 90% fuc_ked up emotionally and morally. Specially those that have to deal with the brits and german package tourists.

Actually, i would have to disagree with that statement.

But I have noticed that many westerners with Victorian values have a really hard time grasping the fact that not all of them are...and assume they have to be perhaps even to begin with to be in the trade.

[Sabum]

Uhm sorry she dropped out of school at 14 and has no education but speaks english well? Are you a sucker? She's BEEN FALANGED already, heavily or she wouldn't speak any english at all period. She is feeding you this bullshit story about wanting to work at a gogobar because stupid dummies are supposed to instantly want to "save" her and offer to pay her to NOT work in a bar. This scam has been done a million times... how can you seriously fall for it??

Not sure where you get your info but I have a neighbor that is only 9 years old, speaks excellent englsh, and has never been out of the village.

I have heard of that too. Comes with a special milk, the more you suck on the bottle the more English ability you acquire.

Seriously, Why would someone try to propagate the lie that you can know english WELL through osmosis? Self study? RIIIIIGHT. You guys are NOT helping this dude, he's being totally scammed and you'd do best to help him see that. I've heard the exact same story a thousand times, it's ALWAYS a scam, they have a flucking handbook on what to say to stupid falangs to get money. The FIRST thing is = I DONT WANT TO WORK IN A BAR or I HAVE NO MONEY SO HAVE TO WORK IN A BAR. Im ashamed I missed the whole mother has a new child thing... lol obviously actually the girls baby... I must be slipping.

[runner]

wait, let me guess. you're thinking about keeping her out of bar, soo you give her money every month + truck + sin sot + + +.

if you're a newb, I'd seriously consider reading up on Thai women. might save you a little bit of money.

[bkkjames]

am i wrong in assuming its not th aspiring ones that need help - its the ones who have achieved legend status?

[track61]

"Not sure where you get your info but I have a neighbor that is only 9 years old, speaks excellent englsh, and has never been out of the village"

"As for track61: Obviously more to this story than stated"

There's more. Her aunt is married to a Brit and there is a retired military guy (Thai) living down the road that had some sort laison job with the US Air Force for years. She is like their joint venture I guess. Whatever, it is working because she practices on me. I was just pointing out that language skills are not necessarily the only legitimate benchmark.

I agree that this story is BS, either on the part of the OP (2500-3000 Baht "crappy entry level job" is much more believable), or the girl. If she doesn't want to work the bars she doesn't have to. As I alluded, my 19 yo sister-in-law has worked 12-16 hrs/day in a large seafood restaurant (with only 2 days off/month) for 21/2 years and only makes 3500B(maybe another 1000 in tips), must pay the owner 1000B/mo for a room and still sends her mother 500-1000B/mo. Much, much harder than shuffling around the pole. Bar girls may be disadvantaged but I have never seen one led away at gun point. I have to ask, exactly what is the OP trying to save her from? I don't see it as the worse way to make a pretty good living. I realize they must go with X number of guys a month but they can somewhat pick and choose. I have seen them turn down drunks and/or A-holes lots of times. If they wanted to, many could probably retire wealthy after 5-10 years. Dumb choices are not mandatory.

If you ain't trolling you are being taken for a ride,

[h90]

speaking english, short education=working in the go go bar already.

[wasabi]

Personally given the array of employment options for an uneducated Issan girl I think working in a bar has to be given consideration. The problem however is that any oppurtunity to earn decent money, bar or otherwise will be met by greedy friends and relatives that have no conception of financial planning or investment. The vast majority of bar girls will end up just as broke as when they started. Just because they are making good wages doesn't suddenly confer an ability to manage wealth. If someone really wanted to help bar girls they'd teach them to open a bank account and not tell anyone about it.

Edited March 27, 2009 by wasabi

[ray23]

Anyone sitting out to teach a bar girl about life is in for an education

[Heng]

Aren't discussions involving coal miners against the forum rules? You know how sensitive people are about coal mining.

[TAWP]

Personally given the array of employment options for an uneducated Issan girl I think working in a bar has to be given consideration. The problem however is that any oppurtunity to earn decent money, bar or otherwise will be met by greedy friends and relatives that have no conception of financial planning or investment. The vast majority of bar girls will end up just as broke as when they started. Just because they are making good wages doesn't suddenly confer an ability to manage wealth. If someone really wanted to help bar girls they'd teach them to open a bank account and not tell anyone about it.

Exactly, and done.

[jfchandler]

You forgot to mention apart from the relatives involved, about (speaking in general) the working lady then turning over much/most of her illicit earning to the (visible or behind the scenes) Thai BF so he can booze and lout about all day and night...