Southern Thai

[HarryHerb]

I totally love Southern Thai. It irritates me that I speak a lot of it without knowing though. It's hard when you learn a mixture of Bangkok and Southern Thai to ever be able to differentiate between the two. This might not matter to some people, but can make you appear differently when talking to Thai people from other areas. Most just think it's amusing though.

I would love to get some terms down so that I can make out when to use dteen and when to use taw - as per skylarks example! In fact I had no idea that there was another word for foot... You can see my problem.

My Thai isn't fantastic, but I would be happy to contribute where I can!

Yes, I had the same problem - if you don't have the benefit of any formal Thai teaching, it can be hard to know which words are which - until it's too late and you are faced with blank / horrified looks. I've mostly sorted that out now - thanks to a secretary who speaks only Central - although my tones occasionally go haywire when I'm tired or not concentrating and I lapse into Southern with her, which makes her laugh.

This is also one of the reasons I'm keen to start off with a list - and maybe Meadish and others could throw in some linguistic context for us.

I'll set the ball rolling with some fairly standard stuff - in transliteration, as well as (very approximative) Thai script:

เลง leng - speak, talk

แล lae - look, watch

Instead of มองไม่เห็น (mohng mai hen), southerners say แลไม่เห็น lae mai hen, or แล TV instead of ดู TV

แล้วไหม laew mai?

Instead of หรือยัง reu yang? e.g. kin khao laew mai? not kin khao reu yang?

Note also that the rising tone of ไหม is definitely a rising tone and not the high tone of central Thai.

The negative reply to this is ไม่ที่ 'mai thii' (not yet), not ยัง

พรือ preu - the closest approximation to this I can think of is อะไร 'arai'.

There are many expressions using this, not just the oft-quoted ไม่พรือ mai preu.

Examples

พรรณพรือ pan preu? ว่าพรือ waa preu? = what's up?

หาพรือ ha preu? ทำพรือ tham preu? = what can I do? (i.e. there's nothing I can do)

ทำพรือดี tham preu dii = what should I do?

ไม่พรือ mai preu = mai pen rai

The 'past' signifier ได้ 'dai' e.g ไม่ได้รู้ mai dai ruu, is pronounced 'jai', so it becomes ไม่ไจรู้ mai jai ruu.

ร่อย 'roy = ดี dii (from a-roi)

แรง raeng = จัง jang

โป poh = เพิง peung

ไส sai? = what's wrong?

เคบ kehp = รีบ riip

ยัง yang (used as a verb) = มี mee

แค kae = ใกล้ klai

ออรอ or-ror = naughty

กบ kop = กัด kat (slightly vulgar)

There are lots more... (does anyone recognise any of these?)

Re: the grunts, the standard question and answer words (along the lines of chai mai? / chai) are noh? / euh.

Example conversation:

My roti seller: Rawn raeng wan nii. Noh, Harry, noh?

Harry: Euh

So there is quite a lot of grunting, yes, but not sure if significantly more then elsewhere. The southern 'euh' is deeper and sounds more like urr, than err, if that makes sense...

I don't think southerners talk quicker, in fact I was under the impression that people from the north talk at breakneck speed - probably got to do with how much you understand. They do shorten almost every word, however, so that's maybe why you felt like you were wearing ear muffs!

[naomisri]

Okay, I can read a bit of Thai, but not much so my contributions will mainly be transliterations...

There is a vast difference between my husband "speaking South" with me and when he meets up with another native Southerner. He will slip into a totally incomprehensible (to me) dialect where words are shortened, tones are elongated and swoop up and down higher and lower than the average BKK Thai. Words merge into one instead of the average disjointed monosyllabic Thai. Despite this probably being the English equivalent of cockney or something, I love this Southern Thai the most, where tam arai? becomes tamraiuh? Ja pai talad chaweng becomes pailadweng and pai tiaw thi nai? becomes paitiawnaiuh?

Forgive me for being so low brow

I've put my comments in blue...

เลง leng - speak, talk

This one is usually only confusing when talking about "speaking South" as opposed to can speak Thai - sometimes the tones at the end of a Southern sentence will go up regardless of the correct tone of the word. Thus leng dai "speak South" gets a little confused with leng dai "can speak Thai". I have heard it shortened many times to a long leh too

แล้วไหม laew mai?

Instead of หรือยัง reu yang? e.g. kin khao laew mai? not kin khao reu yang?

Note also that the rising tone of ไหม is definitely a rising tone and not the high tone of central Thai.

The negative reply to this is ไม่ที่ 'mai thii' (not yet), not ยัง

This answer to this question most often in my house includes a dai, as in tam laew mai? - m'dai tam thii. The mai is never a full mai, always a shortened ma, and quite often the dai is shortened too making it m'd'tam thii!

พรือ preu - the closest approximation to this I can think of is อะไร 'arai'.

There are many expressions using this, not just the oft-quoted ไม่พรือ mai preu.

Examples

พรรณพรือ pan preu? ว่าพรือ waa preu? = what's up?

หาพรือ ha preu? ทำพรือ tham preu? = what can I do? (i.e. there's nothing I can do)

ทำพรือดี tham preu dii = what should I do?

ไม่พรือ mai preu = mai pen rai

Preu is one of my favourite words, my husband uses it almost exclusively with his son/his staff and it took me a long time to work out that the word was preu, not preu-uh, which is obviously making it into a question. I have often heard mai mee arai as an answer to preu.

The 'past' signifier ได้ 'dai' e.g ไม่ได้รู้ mai dai ruu, is pronounced 'jai', so it becomes ไม่ไจรู้ mai jai ruu.

Funny I haven't picked up on this one at all. Have to listen out for it!

ร่อย 'roy = ดี dii (from a-roi)

แรง raeng = จัง jang

โป poh = เพิง peung

ไส sai? = what's wrong?

เคบ kehp = รีบ riip

ยัง yang (used as a verb) = มี mee

แค kae = ใกล้ klai

ออรอ or-ror = naughty

กบ kop = กัด kat (slightly vulgar)

Can you put definitions in for these?

Re: the grunts, the standard question and answer words (along the lines of chai mai? / chai) are noh? / euh.

I get nuh? rather than noh? I also get yuh, meh? But I'm not totally unconvinced that that isn't based on yeah from English as in yeah, mai?

I personally think that Southern Thai is spoken much slower than other forms of Thai, but it is the shortening of words that makes it a lot harder to follow. For example mahk is shortened to ma, like - chawb is pronouned with a rising tone thus chawb ma.

The difficulty can be that the words are shortened, but end up being the same length or longer as the vowel sound is elongated....

Okay now I'll get my thinking cap on and contribute some of my own.

[meadish_sweetball]

This one is usually only confusing when talking about "speaking South" as opposed to can speak Thai - sometimes the tones at the end of a Southern sentence will go up regardless of the correct tone of the word. Thus leng dai "speak South" gets a little confused with leng dai "can speak Thai". I have heard it shortened many times to a long leh too

Is the word meaning 'Thai' as pronounced in Southern Thai really just a difference in tone from the word meaning 'South', or is it possible you missed that the initial consonant sound is also different?

In Standard Thai, this is how they are written and pronounced:

ไทย thai [MidShort]

ใต้ taai [FallingLong]

Note that 'th' here is an English 't' as in 'tie', and 't' is a hard, unaspirated 't' as in 'sty'.

[sbk]

OK, just noticed a revival here (internet connection was quite dodgy yesterday).

Naomisri, just say lang pasa dai, and people will understand that you are saying, "I can speak southern language".

ออรอ or-ror = naughty

I was under the impression this meant silly rather than naughty. Naughty is yung with a high tone.

Here we say jep pheung for bad stomach (instead of thong sie) jep hua for headache, jep teen etc etc.

Its funny that some of the differences that I pointed out you said were just different pronunciations of the same word, I think that it appears that way to us but to non-Southerners it is viewed as a different word altogether. Meht and meet for knife, say Meht to a Bangkok person and they won't understand you at all. Seems many are unable to make the shift that it is just a different pronunciation of the same word.

Min and men (smells bad) etc etc. We don't see much of a difference at all, but the majority of Thais I have met it is a major difference!

I'm afraid I don't know anything about Southern Thai outside the islands since I have only ever lived here. But, I don't imagine it is majorly different from the mainland, just a few words here and there.

[HarryHerb]

ออรอ or-ror = naughty

I was under the impression this meant silly rather than naughty. Naughty is yung with a high tone.

Yes, you're right. I think cheeky / silly / playing up would be a better translation. It's mostly said to kids, as far as I can see.

Here we say jep pheung for bad stomach (instead of thong sie) jep hua for headache, jep teen etc etc.

'jep pung' is a great southern cover-all expression. Can mean you've got the runs (thong sia), stomach cramps (puat thong), even gone into labour (jeb thong khlod look)! I was out fishing one day when one of my friends got a call to say his wife was 'jep pung'. It took me ages to realise why they were all so excited.

Its funny that some of the differences that I pointed out you said were just different pronunciations of the same word, I think that it appears that way to us but to non-Southerners it is viewed as a different word altogether. [...] We don't see much of a difference at all, but the majority of Thais I have met it is a major difference!

Yes, I suppose you're right. Same as a strong Scottish rendering of an English phrase would probably sound impenetrable to a foreigner - or even to some southern English jessies. This is especially true, as Naomisri points out, there's usually an added 'uh' or 'oh' on the end of everything.

As there's no written southern vocabulary, though, I think it would be hard to prove that 'meet' and 'meht' for example are actually different words - and I suspect most southerners when asked to write down 'meht', would write the Central Thai 'meet'.

Naomisri, here's what I wrote with meanings (transliterated), plus some more I thought of:

'roy (from a-roi) - good, cool, fun (general approving word)

raeng - very, really, a lot

poh - just, as in 'poh dteun' - I just woke up

sai? - what's wrong? (usually said, like you say: 'sai-uh?', or 'sai lao')

kehp - be in a hurry, rush

yang (used as a verb) - to have

kae - near

or-ror - silly, cheeky

kop = bite (slightly vulgar)

yaa suup - tobacco, also used for normal cigarettes

tee kia yaa - ashtray

cham - plate, bowl

ka-lui - a lot, many

ka-lui mot - really a lot

nam chuup - nam prik

nawng bao / pi bao - younger / older brother

luuk bao - son

bo dek - boyfriend / girlfriend (used with teenagers)

nuan - soft, melted

tawn chao - used to mean 'tomorrow'

ki klan - lazy, don't feel like doing anything

They're a bit random, sorry. But I'd be interested to see if these are also 'island south' words (I'm on the mainland).

Some southern words have even made it up to the big smoke e.g. 'saeng' (bored, sick and tired)

By the way, Naomisri, I suspect you don't really 'leng dtai' anyway - you should tell people you 'leng thong daeng' - a lovely expression meaning 'to speak bronze' or 'copper', basically an alloy of Central and South.

[naomisri]

Yeah, it's not the Thai and the Dtai (South) that are getting mixed up Meadish, it's the Dtai (South) and the dai (can) - you speak south, vs. can you speak? They don't always add the Thai after the speak. A lot of Southern speakers seem to disregard the tone of the last word in favour of a really high falling tone. Thus the confusion...

I'm learning a lot here, keep it up.

One I hear a lot is hup'du, instead of pit bradu. Scuse the t'literation, totally going by sounds here. Maybe someone can provide the correct spelling?

Jep is definitely used for everything at my house too.

I find quite often Southern speakers will suddenly loose their ability to pronounce the S sound too and will substitute sh Then it's back to speaking to a non-Southerner and the S sounds suddenly reappears. Don't know if this is unique to Surat/Nakhon.

Most of the Southern words I know are the only words I know so it's going to take me a while to identify them...!

Maybe we could do a group of words at a time i.e body parts/foods/household items....?

Or are you more interested in the structure of the Southern dialects?

[sabaijai]

I totally love Southern Thai. It irritates me that I speak a lot of it without knowing though. It's hard when you learn a mixture of Bangkok and Southern Thai to ever be able to differentiate between the two. This might not matter to some people, but can make you appear differently when talking to Thai people from other areas. Most just think it's amusing though.

I would love to get some terms down so that I can make out when to use dteen and when to use taw - as per skylarks example! In fact I had no idea that there was another word for foot... You can see my problem.

My Thai isn't fantastic, but I would be happy to contribute where I can!

Yes, I had the same problem - if you don't have the benefit of any formal Thai teaching, it can be hard to know which words are which - until it's too late and you are faced with blank / horrified looks. I've mostly sorted that out now - thanks to a secretary who speaks only Central - although my tones occasionally go haywire when I'm tired or not concentrating and I lapse into Southern with her, which makes her laugh.

This is also one of the reasons I'm keen to start off with a list - and maybe Meadish and others could throw in some linguistic context for us.

I'll set the ball rolling with some fairly standard stuff - in transliteration, as well as (very approximative) Thai script:

เลง leng - speak, talk

แล lae - look, watch

Instead of มองไม่เห็น (mohng mai hen), southerners say แลไม่เห็น lae mai hen, or แล TV instead of ดู TV

แล้วไหม laew mai?

Instead of หรือยัง reu yang? e.g. kin khao laew mai? not kin khao reu yang?

Note also that the rising tone of ไหม is definitely a rising tone and not the high tone of central Thai.

The negative reply to this is ไม่ที่ 'mai thii' (not yet), not ยัง

พรือ preu - the closest approximation to this I can think of is อะไร 'arai'.

There are many expressions using this, not just the oft-quoted ไม่พรือ mai preu.

Examples

พรรณพรือ pan preu? ว่าพรือ waa preu? = what's up?

หาพรือ ha preu? ทำพรือ tham preu? = what can I do? (i.e. there's nothing I can do)

ทำพรือดี tham preu dii = what should I do?

ไม่พรือ mai preu = mai pen rai

The 'past' signifier ได้ 'dai' e.g ไม่ได้รู้ mai dai ruu, is pronounced 'jai', so it becomes ไม่ไจรู้ mai jai ruu.

ร่อย 'roy = ดี dii (from a-roi)

แรง raeng = จัง jang

โป poh = เพิง peung

ไส sai? = what's wrong?

เคบ kehp = รีบ riip

ยัง yang (used as a verb) = มี mee

แค kae = ใกล้ klai

ออรอ or-ror = naughty

กบ kop = กัด kat (slightly vulgar)

There are lots more... (does anyone recognise any of these?)

Re: the grunts, the standard question and answer words (along the lines of chai mai? / chai) are noh? / euh.

Example conversation:

My roti seller: Rawn raeng wan nii. Noh, Harry, noh?

Harry: Euh

So there is quite a lot of grunting, yes, but not sure if significantly more then elsewhere. The southern 'euh' is deeper and sounds more like urr, than err, if that makes sense...

I don't think southerners talk quicker, in fact I was under the impression that people from the north talk at breakneck speed - probably got to do with how much you understand. They do shorten almost every word, however, so that's maybe why you felt like you were wearing ear muffs!

Thanks for the use of Thai characters. It really helps me envision what the word sounds like. When someone write /p/ in Roman for a Thai word, for example, one never knows whether they mean ป or พ or when they write /a/, is it เ , แ , า , or ะ

[HarryHerb]

Sorry for short pause .

Maybe we could do a group of words at a time i.e body parts/foods/household items....?

Or are you more interested in the structure of the Southern dialects?

I think doing groups of words would be interesting and more productive, because then we could compare mainland and island words and see if there was any difference, or if this pan-Southern dialect really does exist.

Regarding "structure", I am always interested in reading tidbits of etymology and linguistics, but personally I am absolutely clueless in this case, so would have nothing to contribute on either subject - however, if someone else can enlighten us, that would be great.

So, go ahead, choose your topic area!

[naomisri]

Okay, we'll start with vehicles seeing as that's a group I have been talking about recently.

I've put the tones in by sound - I'm sure you can correct a few. Same official spellings as Central Thai so they're just estimates...! Can't really transliterate the long/ short tones.

HT = High

LT = Low

MT = Medium

FT = Falling

RT = Rising

Motorbike = Rot (MT) Kreung (RT)

Car = Rot (MT) Yon (HT)

Bicycle = Rot (MT) Thep (high FT)

Bus = Rot (MT) Budt (LT)

Plane = Reua (RT) Bin (HT)

Ferry = Reua (RT) Feh-ree (LT-HT)

Boat (small) = Reua (RT)

Lorry (6 wheeler) = Rot (MT) Hok (LT) Lor (RT)

Motorbike with side attachment = Rot (MT) Sam (RT) Lor (RT)

Theep (HT) Rot Thep (ride your bike)

Cab (HT) Rot Yon/Reua (drive your car/boat)

Kee (LT) Rot Kreung (drive your motorbike)

Can't think of any more, but maybe you can.

These are Mainland Suratthani pronounciations

[Richard W]

For an overview, there's a summary of the Thai dialects available in Thai. You may have to tell your browser it's in a Thai encoding - the pages don't seem to tbe tagged. Apart from the spoken samples at the main page, I'm not sure that it adds anything to Marvin Brown's magnum opus.

[sbk]

Here is a funny story but you'd have to understand Southern Thai to get it, I think.

My mother-in-law had a very vivid dream about my husband and his grandfather who passed away about 13 years ago. (her father-in-law) Anyway, she had to tell us all about it so that we could find a significant (read: winning) lottery number in the dream.

My father-in-law says, "how about si-hok-hok" (466)? And when she asks why he answers "kii-hok"

I thought it quite funny.

[HarryHerb]

Okay, we'll start with vehicles seeing as that's a group I have been talking about recently.

I've put the tones in by sound - I'm sure you can correct a few. Same official spellings as Central Thai so they're just estimates...! Can't really transliterate the long/ short tones.

HT = High

LT = Low

MT = Medium

FT = Falling

RT = Rising

Motorbike = Rot (MT) Kreung (RT)

Car = Rot (MT) Yon (HT)

Bicycle = Rot (MT) Thep (high FT)

Bus = Rot (MT) Budt (LT)

Plane = Reua (RT) Bin (HT)

Ferry = Reua (RT) Feh-ree (LT-HT)

Boat (small) = Reua (RT)

Lorry (6 wheeler) = Rot (MT) Hok (LT) Lor (RT)

Motorbike with side attachment = Rot (MT) Sam (RT) Lor (RT)

Theep (HT) Rot Thep (ride your bike)

Cab (HT) Rot Yon/Reua (drive your car/boat)

Kee (LT) Rot Kreung (drive your motorbike)

Can't think of any more, but maybe you can.

These are Mainland Suratthani pronounciations

I think apart from 'rot kreuang' - which they also use in the north - and 'reua bin', as you say these are just different pronounciations of Central Thai words, which is also what I think Richard W was trying to point out with his link (although I have no idea what all the tables mean). The Marvin Brown book you mention is out of print, by the way Richard W - is it worth tracking down for a non-linguist?

Does anyone know if you can post sound files on TV? Maybe this is the way to go...

To add to the transport list: (สแลง?) sa-leng, one of those old style bicycles. You can also say วิ่งเรือ 'wing reua' to drive a boat. And have you ever heard the word 'dohn' (โดน?) used for street / road?

[naomisri]

Different pronounciations of central words may sound more or less the same to us English speakers (and certainly transliterate as the same), but saying them to someone who speaks a different dialect you might as well be using a whole different set of letters. I don't know whether there are rules about tones changing or whether words have just evolved to have different tones in the South. As I have learnt Southern Thai as opposed to central Thai I have no idea which tones are "correct" unless I read them (which I'm still a beginner at!).

I've definitely heard wing reua before, but I'm not sure about dohn - I will ask the husband...

So does your local Thai use the same tonal pronounciation of these words as the Suratthani mainland?

[HarryHerb]

I'm not saying central and southern words sound the same - they clearly don't - but I'm not sure what actually constitutes a 'dialect' and what can be described as merely a different accent.

For example, the words 'Do I have to?' in English could be pronounced 'Dee ah haffty' by someone from Northern Ireland, or 'Doo oy av too' by someone from South-West England, but for me the actual words being spoken are the same, regardless of who understands whom. It's only their accents that are different. You could use a whole different set of letters to write down what they said (as I just did), but the speakers themselves wouldn't.

This is why I'm interested in sound or video files, because you would really get a sense of the language (with all its various grunts!), as well as being fun for our fellow central / northern Thai members to try and decipher what the hel is being said.

The tones you wrote sound pretty similar to what I'm hearing (over on the west coast) and actually whenever I go over to Surat / Samui, it does sound fairly similar - although not identical.

[Johpa]

I'm not saying central and southern words sound the same - they clearly don't - but I'm not sure what actually constitutes a 'dialect' and what can be described as merely a different accent.

For example, the words 'Do I have to?' in English could be pronounced 'Dee ah haffty' by someone from Northern Ireland, or 'Doo oy av too' by someone from South-West England, but for me the actual words being spoken are the same, regardless of who understands whom. It's only their accents that are different. You could use a whole different set of letters to write down what they said (as I just did), but the speakers themselves wouldn't.

It is pretty well accepted by linguists that Central Thai, Northern Thai (Kham Muang), and Southern Thai are closely related yet distinct languages of the Tai language family arising from specific historical migrations of Tai people into the region. Certainly many of the words differ in rather simple phonological ways and are easily parsed by those from other regions. But the cumulative affect is to make conversations in one region unintelligible to speakers from another region. This may get lost in the larger cities where the local language, probably from the domination of Central Thai in the media, begins to assimilate towards Central Thai. I can only speak specifically about Northern Thai.

The Kham Muang spoken in the rural villages in Chiang Mai that has been little impacted by the media is not readily understood by Bangkok residents and is now seen even by many Chiang Mai City residents as a rustic hillbilly dialect. My son, having learned his Kham Muang from rural cousins and rural friends causes jaws to drop in the markets in the city as he speaks a deep rural Kham Muang that is not expected from a luuk krung.. And the northern rural folks, from my limited experience when I brought family down south on a vacation, could not make heads or tails of Southern Thai, even after over one week of exposure.

Now compare this to my experience with some contrasting English dialects. Perhaps the single most contrasting dialect to my Ahmerican English is the English spoken in Edinburgh. The first time I met such a Scotsman I did not understand nary a single word. But after 3 days I was able to tune into the dialect and understand everything apart from the local slang.

Somwhat aside, what is common is for the speakers of the minority languages to learn the local majority “official” language. Thus speakers of Southern Thai, Lao, or Kham Muang, for the most part, are fairly fluent in Central Thai. On a more local level, the older minority people up north, such as my father-in-law tend to be conversant in Kham Muang but not in Central Thai, a language he does not really understand. And I know areas up in the Chiang Mai and Chiang Rai hills where it is only in the past 20 years, with the introduction of roads and electricity, that Kham Muang has replaced Lahu as the lingua franca. Central Thai is now taught even in the remote village schools. Given what has happened to smaller minority languages in Europe, I am surprised that the minority Tai languages are still holding out.

Of course the debate as to where on the continuum a language spoken in a given region is a dialect or a distinct language will never cease. Those in the governing cities will, for mostly political reasons with little linguistic reasoning, describe all other related languages spoken in the realm as dialects. So Isaan is somewhat derogatorily described as a dialect by the Bangkok elite while at the same time Lao is seen as a “language.” This just goes to prove the old adage that a language is a dialect with an army behind it.

[sbk]

Back to lessons:

Doua chao: means tomorrow morning but applies to the entire day

Do reu: day after tomorrow

Dae wa: yesterday

Dae sur: day before yesterday

Sory, no tones or thai script, my Thai is strictly learned by listening so altho my tones are correct I'd have to really sit there and say it over and over to pinpoint what the tone actually is.

[logbags]

"Dtor chaaw" means tommorow morning.

'thaang pay" is used instead of "thaang mot" meaning "all of it"

"laeng" is use instead of "phuut" so you "laeng Dtai" or speak the southern language.

"jang hoo" is often used instead of "jang leey" for "very much" like "aroi jang hoo" very delicious.

"yaang raeng" or "very strong" is often added on the end of a sentence "jeb yaang raeng" hurt a lot. Some people just say "raeng" like something expensive is "phaeng raeng"

"kheey" is used instead of "jim" for pussy or vagina.

"phii baaw" is big brother.

"waa phruea" is used like "what did you say?"

"dtai hong" is like "die you bastard" and is like cursing somebody to have an accident.

"dtop dtai" is like "I'll knock your block off."

"dtop salop salai" is as above "like I'll knock you out"

Old people in the south used to call Phuket "thung khaa" due to a long grass that grew there.

I hope you understand my phonetics. LOL Southerners tend to shorten everything like aussies. Dtalart or market is shortened to "lart" in the south.

There are many words the southerners use everyday that are unique to them.

[h90]

lol....

pai---thep

(bai nai---krung thep)

or my wife calling me: rang bah....farang bah.

in my office account nakhon si thamarat, my wife the same. her sister also, motorbike guy is from Patalung. When they speak all the others are running :-)

This kind of started in the Ladies Forum, but do any of you language experts feel like writing down some southern Thai? I'm trying like **** to pick it up, but I learn a lot faster when I see it writen down.

[logbags]

in my office account nakhon si thamarat, my wife the same. her sister also, motorbike guy is from Patalung. When they speak all the others are running :-)

Ask her what "hoi khlaeng" means

She will call you "ert" LOL [/b]

Then ask her what "ert" means

[h90]

what I got back: "that is language absolut low, can use in patpong only, answer was "get mum woador"

so not really a good idea

in my office account nakhon si thamarat, my wife the same. her sister also, motorbike guy is from Patalung. When they speak all the others are running :-)

Ask her what "hoi khlaeng" means

She will call you "ert" LOL [/b]

Then ask her what "ert" means

[sabaijai]

"dtop salop salai" is as above "like I'll knock you out"

that's central thai too isn't it? though with southern tones applied it would be southern ...

Without any tones shown here it's hard to get the real southern thai flavour. I dined with a friend from Hat Yai last night and she was speaking the Yai dialect with another Thai, and it reminded me how much the tone sequences make southern Thai, well, southern Thai.

[logbags]

As a non native Thai speaker I struggle like most. My understanding of tones is hopeless, I just understand what is said in the context.

Whether is dog or horse bites you is usually understood as dogs tend to bite more than horses and you tend to ride a horse and not a dog.

I actually live with 3 southerners and have a girlfriend in Nakhon Sri where I go a lot. I don't have that much trouble if a Thai speaks to me clearly. Thai men in the south tend to mumble and speak really fast so they can be very hard to understand.

A friend from Nakhon told me he went to Koh Samui 20 years ago and people greeted him with "khreng Sakrai" like Sawadee. He said he has never heard it again since. I have never heard it.

Every area in the South has its little quirky words that are unique to the area. "Dtop Salop Salai" I heard in phuket 20 years ago at bars. It probably originates elsewhere as local phuket people tend to be very polite.

I used to live with a crazy guy from Koh Samui 18 years ago who was Samui born and bred. He was a soldier on the Thai/Khmen border and was quite barking mad. I used to laugh as he had 100 rai of beach front land on Koh Phangan and he used to ask me what it was worth.

He had been offshore for years and thought it was only worth a few hundred thousand baht. LOL.

I am getting too lazy to study Thai anymore.

[fluxweed]

As a non native Thai speaker I struggle like most. My understanding of tones is hopeless, I just understand what is said in the context.

Whether is dog or horse bites you is usually understood as dogs tend to bite more than horses and you tend to ride a horse and not a dog.

And the tones are different in different dialects too. It's hard to explain but the word with High falling tone for example 'ห้า' (5) the tone sounds different in northern Thai.

I don't know much about Southern so I'm curious to know how that sounds.

It is interesting to know that there is some word usage that is the similar in Northen and Southern Thai that the Central people would not have a clue what we talk about. This is from real experience in a conversation between 3 people, each from the North, Central and South.

Edited March 8, 2006 by fluxweed

[HarryHerb]

Back to lessons:

Doua chao: means tomorrow morning but applies to the entire day

Do reu: day after tomorrow

Dae wa: yesterday

Dae sur: day before yesterday

Sory, no tones or thai script, my Thai is strictly learned by listening so altho my tones are correct I'd have to really sit there and say it over and over to pinpoint what the tone actually is.

It's taken me a while to check these out (sorry!), as some I had never heard, but the west coast versions of these seem to be (same-same but) different:

Hua chao - tomorrow morning - dtawn chao applies to whole day (equivalent to 'phrung nii')

Wan seu - day after tomorrow

Raek waa - yesterday

day before yesterday - could only find the central '2 wan thii laew' (pronounced in southern tones)

Could just be a difference of transliteration, of course...

Tones is a tough one - especially because the Thai script I have learnt does not correspond with the sounds I hear every day. I can pronounce the words well enough (I have also learned by listening) but would be hard pushed to tell you exactly what tone it was, especially as most words seem to have some sort of embellishment at the end 'oh!', 'ey', 'uh' etc. that adds a rising / falling tone to words that in themselves are flat.

In fact I find the whole voice of southern people different, much less high-pitched and nasal than central / north, so it would be hard to emulate even if you had the tones written down.

[sbk]

Thung pay is a good one, I didn't know until recently (last year!) that in central it was Thung moht.

dai hong is one I would avoid if I were you

what about jip hai louey? It is a slang term (not polite) for very or really (ie kee neeo jip hai louey--really really stingy--or rather really f@cking stingy) Anyone know if this is southern or not?

[logbags]

"Chip haay" or "ship hai" can be used in many ways.

It can be used like "goddamn" on the end of a sentence if you are pissed off. The dictionary says it means extremely, really or too bad which I feel is not totally correct.

It is used when talking about going broke or hoping someone else goes bankrupt. "Chiip haay" or "ay shiip haay" = "######ing broke" It can be used like a curse like "Dtai Hong"

There was a guy in Bangkok 20 years ago called "Chiip haay Charlie"

He worked at the U.S embassy and would order a beer by saying.

"aaw beer singh khuat lek yen yen shiip hai" in a loud U.S accent.

He was saying "give me a goddamn cold beer" Most people thought he was a <deleted>.

It is a very rough and rude word. Like "yet may" it can be used by men when speaking to mates.

I hear many Thai men using "yet may" exactly like farangs use "mother######er"

You don't obviously use it in polite company. It is not a south word in origin I am told.

I remember a friend called a motorbike taxi driver a "######ing reptile" or "ay here" and he was nearly murdered That is one best left in the vault.

[sbk]

Yeah, I had never heard Ai Heah before either (I'm american, I pronounce my final r ). When I asked my husband what it meant, he said its a monitor lizard. I couldnt' see the point but he said it is a really dire insult in Thai and a surefire way to get your butt kicked.

I don't really know too many of those words, thank goodness. My husband and his family don't really swear much. But, I do hear alot from the local boat guys hanging around. Still never heard Ai Heah before tho.

[HarryHerb]

Let's keep it clean, eh?

Thang pey (ทั้งเป้)

according to my Krabi friends is totally Surat Thani style. They mostly use the central ทั้งหมอด (thang mot - mot is pronounced much flatter than in Central Thai where you sort of round your mouth on the 'o' sound), but say their parents and other old folk still use the old-style thang pey

They also say you pronounce พรือ preu kind of like พรุว pru-ee, is that correct?!

[logbags]

"Waa Pun Phruu" some people say. I would think it is correct it comes from around Surat. It is certainly used in Nakhon Sri as well.

'Waa Phrua" is another way you hear it. It comes out a number of ways.

I agree words like "ay here" or "ay haa" are best left unsaid. However they are worth knowing in case people use them to speak about you

"phuak ay here" can be used to describe various groups of reptiles. I heard a good sledge by a katoey recently that is a bit too tasty for a public forum.

[g00dgirl]

I would like to know what "ert" means actually ..

Apart from that I heard that in Southern Thai

ab - to take a drug

lao - the same as eeg - again

mueng - you

what I got back: "that is language absolut low, can use in patpong only, answer was "get mum woador"

so not really a good idea

in my office account nakhon si thamarat, my wife the same. her sister also, motorbike guy is from Patalung. When they speak all the others are running :-)

Ask her what "hoi khlaeng" means

She will call you "ert" LOL [/b]

Then ask her what "ert" means