Abandoned

[ernest1966]

One of my wife's cousins (male) has two kids.

The girl, about 10 years old was from a gf. When she was born, there was no paperwork done for her. No birth certificate, nothing. She officially doesn't exist, doesn't live anywhere, so can't even attend school.

The boy, about 3 years old was from an official marriage. Parents bothered this time with paperwork.

The girl has lived with her grandma since she was born, she looks after her half-brother, because the new wife and the hubby up-sticks and left for BKK.

The grandmother is in her 80s, can hardly walk and the parents send max 200-300 baht a month for the upkeep of both kids. The girl is dressed in rags, can't attend school (never has) and even if she could couldn't afford the books, school uniforms etc.

The girls future is pretty bleak and I think so is her halfs brother.

My question, is this common as it seems so, there are other kids in the extended family from products of a broken home who get no contact with the parents, are dumped onto the grandparents.

And no, I am not knocking Thais, in the west you have child care, maintenance and fairly decent support network. It's just thais are poor I understand that.

[hhgz]

Let me polish my crystal ball. In your future, I see...you paying more than your fair share of the children's upbringing.

[Maizefarmer]

One of my wife's cousins (male) has two kids.

The girl, about 10 years old was from a gf. When she was born, there was no paperwork done for her. No birth certificate, nothing. She officially doesn't exist, doesn't live anywhere, so can't even attend school.

The boy, about 3 years old was from an official marriage. Parents bothered this time with paperwork.

The girl has lived with her grandma since she was born, she looks after her half-brother, because the new wife and the hubby up-sticks and left for BKK.

The grandmother is in her 80s, can hardly walk and the parents send max 200-300 baht a month for the upkeep of both kids. The girl is dressed in rags, can't attend school (never has) and even if she could couldn't afford the books, school uniforms etc.

The girls future is pretty bleak and I think so is her halfs brother.

My question, is this common as it seems so, there are other kids in the extended family from products of a broken home who get no contact with the parents, are dumped onto the grandparents.

And no, I am not knocking Thais, in the west you have child care, maintenance and fairly decent support network. It's just thais are poor I understand that.

No its not common, but she is by no means the only kid in that situation in Thailand. Many of the youngsters working in the "bright lights" businesses on Patong Beach, Pattaya and other places have kids back home been looked after by grandparents.

There are security nets and the Thai system is actually not all that bad when it gets up and running, but there are always those who fall through for some or other reason. ID is a big issue, but a formal statement from both parents is sufficient to formalise the childs identity. Till that is done, sadly the system won't kick in.

The problem is as you quite correctly note - their future is likely to be pretty bleak: the first 5 - 6 years of a kids life is the foundation on which their character/personality and future developement is built. Get it wrong and most kids carry the consequences for the rest of their lives - many of them with problems that only come home to roost and surface when they reach their 30's and 40's.

[eek]

Let me polish my crystal ball. In your future, I see...you paying more than your fair share of the children's upbringing.

..and if he has the money, why not? The choice of course is his. And..I dont mean this to come off as antagonistic, but that wasnt what the OP was asking anyway. He was asking if the scenario is common. Of which I have no idea. Maybe someone has a better idea of the statistics. But, even in other countries its often normal to have a child stay with a grandparent/relative when the parent is out working. However, in this case its very sad, and quite extreme, as the young girl isnt even registered (which is something that should be rectified). Its probably too late for her to have any kind of conventional schooling, but if she cannot read and write, do arithmetic etc..then she should have some basic schooling in these areas. What does she do everyday? Help out her grandmother with simple things or more labour intensive things? Does she have any kind of free time/play time? She is at a good age for learning some kind of skill. So, I think some kind of vocational school/schooling would be good for her.

The sum of money is very small for their upkeep, but what are the parents earning? Would the parents be better off back in their home town? Would the kids be better off with their parents? Each circumstance will be different. Some parents may not care, some may care deeply, and are just trying to work hard. In this case it sounds like they dont care as much as they should..but only from the few things you mentioned. Only those who know them well will know.

(sorry a lot of questions in there..its of course your choice if you wish to answer them. Im not judging you, or them, just would be nice if you have time/money to try give them some kind of start in life. )

[ernest1966]

I pay nothing for their upbringing, my wife and I have a child of our own. It's not my concern and none of my business to interfere, even if I wanted to I'd get told to back off.

[BigSnake]

Sad but there a many cases like this around the Kindgom, common I would say no, most cases a brother, uncle, or cousin in Thai family would take the child in and provide for the bare basic education. Maybe with a little luck a decent Thai family will step up and at least act as foster parent and help with her basic education needs.

[CrossBones]

These are called "stateless persons" and have no nationality, passport, access the the 30b medical care, they cant travel around Thailand due to no ID card (police checkpoints will capture them and possibly rape them and deport them to Burma as they are not "Thai").

There are many NGOs in the north who can assist them, also give them some kind of free education. PM me if you want more advice.

In this case it seems like her family are pretty "bad people", and have done absolutely nothing for the poor girl - didnt even get her registered at birth.

These people are often fall victim to getting trafficked to other countries, usually to work as prostitutes until they are too old and then they are murdered. The reason being they have no legal rights, no protection from any country, cant defend themselves in a court of law, and generally "dont exist".

Very sad indeed.

[ernest1966]

My wife mentioned she is the same as someone from burma, said the best she can hope to do is work in a bar if she is lucky with absolutely no education thats the best she will get it seems. Once her grandma cops it i think she will be homeless.

[eek]

Can she not be legally registered now?

(Nice to read there is something out there for her, crossbones)

[cmsally]

It might be helpful if you mentioned where the children are living.

In the case of registration if they have been living in the same place since they were born it might be possible to get papers with the intervention of local govt.

Better done while the grandmother still alive.

As mentioned there are charities that can follow up on this. Sponsorship through some of the Thai charities actually costs pnly a few thousand baht a year to keep a child in school . So once in the system the help can be found.

If you were willing to disclose location it might just be possible to find someone that knows of an organisation that can help.

[CrossBones]

My wife mentioned she is the same as someone from burma, said the best she can hope to do is work in a bar if she is lucky with absolutely no education thats the best she will get it seems. Once her grandma cops it i think she will be homeless.

There are charities out there who can help her

Try http://www.depdc.org/

[astral]

The father should get the girl down to the local Amphur office and see what can be done to get her registered.

Such things are possible.

Then at least she could go to school and not be subject to arrest later in life.

[goodheartman]

My wife mentioned she is the same as someone from burma, said the best she can hope to do is work in a bar if she is lucky with absolutely no education thats the best she will get it seems. Once her grandma cops it i think she will be homeless.

she can move in with you !

[t.s]

the more you talk about the wifes family, the worse they come off.

[ernest1966]

t.s, yes it comes accross like that, but on the whole they are a fairly decent folk, but thais don't seem to want to interfere.

My wife's sister has a got money, is clever, has a car, well read, intelligent and if she wanted to she could easily get this sorted out.

At the end of the day I don't anyone wants to interfere in what happens. My wife said it won't cost more than 3k to sort out the paper work, get her registered etc, but no one wants to do it and she certainly doesn't want me to do it (no it isn't a scam).

The parents are just not interested, they haven't once come down from BKK since the birth of their son. One of my other cousins left his wife for a FOURTEEN year old girl, he's got a son of 10, which he seens occasionally. The fourteen year old g/f beat up the ex-wife and has been to court, she is now pregnant.

[girlx]

At the end of the day I don't anyone wants to interfere in what happens. My wife said it won't cost more than 3k to sort out the paper work, get her registered etc, but no one wants to do it and she certainly doesn't want me to do it (no it isn't a scam).

pretty cowardly of people around there if you ask me.

Edited April 27, 2009 by girlx

[loong]

If she has lived in the same place her whole life and the head man has known her for her whole life, with his help the child may be able to be registered. That at least is one step in the right direction.

[Ulysses G.]

My suggestion is to commit yourself to helping the kids out as much as you can.

I've always felt horrible about the way animals are treated here and in the last few years I've started raising money and providing medical care and food for them and it really feels good to help another living being improve their life. Helping a human being would feel even better. You will be happy that you decided to.

[CelticBhoy]

My suggestion is to commit yourself to helping the kids out as much as you can.

I've always felt horrible about the way animals are treated here and in the last few years I've started raising money and providing medical care and food for them and it really feels good to help another living being improve their life. Helping a human being would feel even better. You will be happy that you decided to.

I agree with this post.

Do your best to help out here.

[MSingh]

My suggestion is to commit yourself to helping the kids out as much as you can.

I've always felt horrible about the way animals are treated here and in the last few years I've started raising money and providing medical care and food for them and it really feels good to help another living being improve their life. Helping a human being would feel even better. You will be happy that you decided to.

I agree with this post.

Do your best to help out here.

Yep go for it, i bet it will make you feel absolutely brilliant if you helped this Girl out & you could really go to sleep at night knowing you have made a difference to someone's life & given them a chance, nothing more than that but that chance is a million times better than her not existing, as she currently does ...

Dreadful Story in my opinion & one that again shows just how cheap Life really is in a devloping Country ...

& i don't give a <deleted> if it's Thai way or Thai Culture, shame, shame, shame on those Parents, they are a disgrace to Mankind but sadly they are not alone in this abandonment of people in this Country...

[eek]

Agree with the others above about helping out, even if you just get her registered, its a step in the right direction. In all honesty does it really matter that its the families affair? None of them seem to be doing anything about it, and this is a childs life and future. Im sure the girl will be forever grateful to you in her life for that, and im sure you will feel good knowing you did such an important thing.

[TonySoprano]

And no, I am not knocking Thais, in the west you have child care, maintenance and fairly decent support network. It's just thais are poor I understand that.

plenty of Thais are both poor and send their children to school.

if this was a member of my wife's family i might consider paying for the public schooling at least, cause i mean, jeez...

[ernest1966]

I am in Chumphae, if anyone knows any contact details for NGO's who can help in this area please PM me.

[MSingh]

Agree with the others above about helping out, even if you just get her registered, its a step in the right direction. In all honesty does it really matter that its the families affair? None of them seem to be doing anything about it, and this is a childs life and future. Im sure the girl will be forever grateful to you in her life for that, and im sure you will feel good knowing you did such an important thing.

That's all you've got to do, just get her registered, making her actually exist, that's all you have to do....

This whole situation & the more i think about it is more unebelievable that her Parents haven't even got her registed, by each passing second.

[edwinclapham]

My suggestion is to commit yourself to helping the kids out as much as you can.

I've always felt horrible about the way animals are treated here and in the last few years I've started raising money and providing medical care and food for them and it really feels good to help another living being improve their life. Helping a human being would feel even better. You will be happy that you decided to.

Thank goodness there are people like you around mate, brings a smile to the heart and a tear to the eye, but for some of the posters they ought to be deeply ashamed.

[Maizefarmer]

Can she not be legally registered now?

(Nice to read there is something out there for her, crossbones)

YES - she can: and its relatively straightforward - both parents have to make a formal statement that they are the biological parents - and may call friends/relatives who recall the birth or are willing to support the statement - but dont ask me what district office or official handles the formality - I just know that it can be done like this at any time.

Anyhow - just what were the circumstances surrounding this kid's birth? - was it not in the local hospital, or failing that, did mom not go for a checkup at the local hospital after giving birth (just thinking of any old record that could be dug up to support parentage).

Regards medical treatment: my dad was a doc for the RC (Red Cross) in Thailand most of this practising life - no child needing medical treatement is denied that treament - id or no id, its a non-issue - and I think state hospital rules are similar with respect to children - they get it respective of id and/or any other circumstance.

[ernest1966]

Sorry i hope i haven't come accross as callous but i've been told by about 3 people in the family not to interfere already and that its nothing to do with me and yes it pisses me off seeing her everyday not go to school just wasting her life.

But when you keep get being told mind your own business you sorta give up. I can't exactly force the kid to come with me to the goverment offices , nor the grandmother. One of the aunties works in the local goverment offices and she's done nothing either.

[eek]

I know its easy for people to say what you should do, when they are not in your shoes. But, its obviously been on your mind, or you wouldnt have posted here. Maybe if you step in, the other family members will feel badly and try to help a little also?? I dont know of course, as i have no experience in this kind of thing. I really just wish to wish you luck and try find a way (even if its a round about way..although i dont know how..sorry )to help. Dont let the other family members apathy or telling you to keep to yourself prevent you from doing something you believe in. Can you speak any Thai? Then you can talk a little with the grandmother directly. Or is there a family member who can help and is glad to help work with you in this?

Just wish to say this is a great thread, and very informative. I hope you are able to get even more of the information you need.

[ernest1966]

I thank everyone for their useful replies. In about a month my wifes sis comes back from BKK, her command of english is better than the wifes regarding these sorts of issues, so I will wait till then and then talk to her and try and get something done.

[dogleg]

I thank everyone for their useful replies. In about a month my wifes sis comes back from BKK, her command of english is better than the wifes regarding these sorts of issues, so I will wait till then and then talk to her and try and get something done.

You would need the full story Ernest. There could be more to this than you think! Who was the "gf"? Who is this child really? I'm thinking maybe really is not Thai, maybe incest?

Very sad situation. Great if you can help. It stinks a bit to me though.