150 Baht Atm Withdrawl Fee.. Does It Matter?

[Priceless]

[...]

Lastly, this is Thailand. The cost of their bank labor is much cheaper, so for them to charge 150 baht is an attempt to charge Western service fees for Thai labor....it will be interesting to see how the expats adapt to this? I mean the ones that continue pulling money from their Western income sources and Western based banks.

You obviously think that the ATM is just a little box with an employee sitting inside, checking your card and counting up the money Well, it's not. It is in fact a machine (Automatic Teller Machine), which has, in all probability, been imported from some Western country where it was produced by the likes of IBM or NCR. In fact, there is probably not a single second of manual labour involved in the whole transaction. On the other hand, there is a lot of technology such as computers, communications equipment, international datacomm's etc involved.

A lot (if not most) of this equipment is probably more expensive in Thailand than in the West (ever compared e.g. Internet access prices here with the West?). I would not be surprised if Thai banks actually have higher costs for this kind of transactions than Western banks do.

/ Priceless

[SurfRider]

From an example in another TV thread on this subject, SCB quoted a lower exchange rate for doing an over-the-counter transaction vs. using their ATM -- whether or not other Thai banks have the same variance in their rates is unclear -- below is an example and a summary of the pertinent issues as they currently stand:

1) If you go to SCB's ATM and use a Debit Card to withdraw 20,000 Baht from a foreign account, your account will be charged a 150 Baht fee ( US $4.25 )

2) If you go to the counter in the same bank and ask for 20,000 Baht, you'll be charged an additional US $21.65 due to the difference in the Exchange Rate between the ATM and the counter.

3) If you go to a Kasikorn or Ayudhya or GSB ATM and use the same Debit Card, there won't be ANY additional charge.

How long Kasikorn and Ayudhya will continue to NOT charge the 150 Baht fee is unknown, but there is reason to suspect that GSB will remain free of the 150 Baht charge because they don't appear to be a member of the cabal that is imposing the new fee. Additionally, GSB's ATM transaction limit is 30,000 Baht -- at Kasikorn and Ayudhya the limit is 20,000

.

[golfnut64]

Can some one clear something up for me. I went to a bank to open an account - 1st questions was do you have a work visa? So who are all these poeple that have accounts open here for when they holiday?

Which banks allow you to have an account with out a visa

thanks

Chandler, it certainly wasnt clear that you thought you people should bank else where than a bank charging the 150baht even though they werent being charged, but on principal.

who ever said US banks charge $60 for a international transfer - CBA in Australia (the allegedly small backward country) allows you to do int. transfers on your own, over the internet $20AUS.

G

[xbusman]

Have been thinking about this topic for the past few weeks as it is rather shocking to an already difficult and cumbersome financial process.

Thinking through the implications, I sort of went back to the basics.

Thailand is a third world country controlled by all sorts of vested interests running usury monopolies in one form or another. That level of control and corruption is a significant factor, some would say primary reason, in what keeps Thailand poor and undeveloped. From Customs to phone service to bankers associations to baggage scanners, its a rigged game with bizarre distortions everywhere. Good or bad, it is what it is and a primary reason that makes Thailand so Thailand. So when banks act in consortium to fix fees which is strictly illegal in most developed economies, its pretty much par for the course here.

Perhaps more importantly, we really do not know what prompted the move and what the real costs are to banks. Banking is a service no different than hair dressing or car repair. They have costs and need to make money to stay in business. I do know that banks throughout the world would prefer just not to do business in Asia or Russia. The level of theft and scams in those regions is legion. Its not easy safeguarding their trust against the hordes with computers and mal intent. Perhaps this was initiated by some obscene costs imposed on thai banks from overseas to cover the losses due to fraud. Probably something initiated this, the chance that the Thai bankers association just had a few too many beers at their annual meeting and someone came up with a nifty idea to monopolize and abuse tourists is rather slim.

In any event, its their bank and they can drive the fee the 10,000 baht if they want. They can freely form anti competitive monopolies and do whatever they want with full legal protection. Dont forget who owns the biggest banks here.....

If the price of hair cuts goes to 123,999 baht, its pretty simple, I grow some pretty long hair. For my circumstances, 150 baht is pretty steep fee to use an ATM so I will rearrange my finances to avoid that charge as much as possible. Thankfully Kasikorn is still a player and I may go visit their bank to see about transferring all my accounts to them just for the convenience (and in appreciation of) of keeping my US ATM as part of my financial tools. I, as a (hopefully) smart and rational consumer will find better and cheaper ways to obtain necessary services if it means cutting my own hair or moving cash around in my shoes. As with everything in Thailand, just give it some time, reality will eventually work out the kinks despite the puuyais best efforts.

Having worked briefly in banks many decades ago, I am always a little surprised at their business model and customer relationship. They (used to) work on some pretty thin margins. Having little to no real product, they are more public relations than business. Minute changes can cause serious disruption as customers go upside down over the smallest thing (note this entire thread!). People relate to money in bizarre emotional ways. We are all besides ourselves over this charge but the price of bread has risen fifty percent in the past year. I think rice has really moved too but not a word written. Property, our homes and business, went into the stratosphere causing untold damage to the entire worlds economy but instead we generate 30 some pages on an ATM fee. For most people, money is perhaps the most serious subject of all. We might pay some over educated and under worked doctor $200 for ten minutes of conversation to tell us something we already knew (quit smoking) and never blink, but $4.2529 for an ATM transaction, NEVER! Despite the fact that the ATM machine is very expensive, filled with about 200,000 baht each (maybe more), using electricity 24/7, requiring service 24/7, paying rent to the merchant, fees to foreign banks, occasionally defrauded for untold thousands, and occasionally completely stolen. Would you take 200,000 baht of YOUR money and stick it in a machine on Sukhumvit and leave it? When I think about it that way, they are pretty darn brave for $4.2529.

By cracky, I remember the days before ATMs. Banks were open a whole 14 hours a week and you scheduled your life around the lazy bastards. Banks are by nature difficult and uncooperative. We have gotten used to a banking system in other countries where competition was allowed to flourish and they were forced to become competitive to survive. Unfortunately that deregulation allowed other evils to take root because unfortunately humans were involved. I for one will reduce my ATM usage to a minimum. Find other ways to move and keep money that reduce my costs, and perhaps move my business accounts to Kasikorn because to date they have shown some independence and customer concern.

[Priceless]

Can some one clear something up for me. I went to a bank to open an account - 1st questions was do you have a work visa? So who are all these poeple that have accounts open here for when they holiday?

Which banks allow you to have an account with out a visa

thanks

Chandler, it certainly wasnt clear that you thought you people should bank else where than a bank charging the 150baht even though they werent being charged, but on principal.

who ever said US banks charge $60 for a international transfer - CBA in Australia (the allegedly small backward country) allows you to do int. transfers on your own, over the internet $20AUS.

G

Yes, this has shocked me too. My bank in Sweden - an even smaller and more backward country - charges me $5 USD for an international transfer. I happen to know that they still make money on the transaction (one of my best friends is a senior executive at the bank). And no, they don't make their money on the currency spread, I always transfer SEK (Swedish kronor) to SCB in Thailand and let them convert. This they do at their published TT rate of exchange, with what appears to be a fee of 0.25%.

It appears that there is a cartel in force between all US banks, I guess that they somehow have to make up for all the money they've lost on there core business of lending money...

On your initial question: I think that you can find more recent information using the ThaiVisa search function, but I opened my first account here on a tourist visa back in early 2006. I had to go to a couple of branches before I found one willing to do it, though.

/ Priceless

Edited May 3, 2009 by Priceless

[Penkoprod]

Can some one clear something up for me. I went to a bank to open an account - 1st questions was do you have a work visa? So who are all these poeple that have accounts open here for when they holiday?

Which banks allow you to have an account with out a visa

thanks

A lot depends on the bank and sometimes the branch you use

Kasikorn Bank are known to be farang friendly in this matter

I opened mine there with nothing more than a passport and visa 30 day visa exemption stamp i was given on arrival

YMMV but from reports i get from ex-pats out there is that most of the banks are now operating a relaxed policy towards farangs having accounts with less than what was once asked for visa/work permit wise. Again though, this might be dependant on branch

HTH

Penkoprod

[Mali1964]

answer to the question is yes it does matter ,20 baht would have been aceptable 150 baht here is a rip off,amazing Thailand ,no wonder tourists are staying away in droves ,just another nail in the coffin by those in charge.

A little bit of perspective:

- 20 baht is what (most) Thai banks charge you for using one of their own ATMs outside of the province where your ATM card was issued.

- ~150 baht is what my home country bank will charge me for using my ATM card abroad (outside the EU). And they don't even have to operate the ATM

- ~170 baht is what my home country bank will charge me for an electronic (internet banking) transfer of any amount up to ~430,000 baht into my Thai account.

- 0 baht is what my Thai bank charges me for any ATM withdrawal of up to 20,000 baht as long as I'm within my home province.

If you're on a two week holiday here, I think you can probably afford the 150 baht fee. Several friends of mine, who regularly holiday in Thailand, have set up local accounts here and transfer money before they leave for their holidays. If you live here, all it takes is a little bit of planning.

I agree with the basic premise that everything should be free. Unfortunately banks, just like lunches, are not

/ Priceless

170 baht is what my home country bank will charge me for an electronic (internet banking) transfer of any amount up to ~430,000 baht into my Thai account.

Priceless who is this bank that charge 170 baht (£3.30) to do online transfers i know Halifax is £9.50.

Do you care to share their name thanks,thats if your UK of course.

[Priceless]

answer to the question is yes it does matter ,20 baht would have been aceptable 150 baht here is a rip off,amazing Thailand ,no wonder tourists are staying away in droves ,just another nail in the coffin by those in charge.

A little bit of perspective:

- 20 baht is what (most) Thai banks charge you for using one of their own ATMs outside of the province where your ATM card was issued.

- ~150 baht is what my home country bank will charge me for using my ATM card abroad (outside the EU). And they don't even have to operate the ATM

- ~170 baht is what my home country bank will charge me for an electronic (internet banking) transfer of any amount up to ~430,000 baht into my Thai account.

- 0 baht is what my Thai bank charges me for any ATM withdrawal of up to 20,000 baht as long as I'm within my home province.

If you're on a two week holiday here, I think you can probably afford the 150 baht fee. Several friends of mine, who regularly holiday in Thailand, have set up local accounts here and transfer money before they leave for their holidays. If you live here, all it takes is a little bit of planning.

I agree with the basic premise that everything should be free. Unfortunately banks, just like lunches, are not

/ Priceless

170 baht is what my home country bank will charge me for an electronic (internet banking) transfer of any amount up to ~430,000 baht into my Thai account.

Priceless who is this bank that charge 170 baht (£3.30) to do online transfers i know Halifax is £9.50.

Do you care to share their name thanks,thats if your UK of course.

Really sorry to have to disappoint you It's a Swedish bank, Svenska Handelsbanken (SHB). On a side note: I used to have to transfer "manually", i.e. go to the branch office and fill in and sign a form. In those days the fee was 150 SEK. Some 3-4 years ago they opened for int'l transfers via their internet bank. Since this was an automatic transaction (with me doing all the manual work ) they lowered the fee to 40 SEK! That's the kind of bank that you stay with

/ Priceless

[Mali1964]

answer to the question is yes it does matter ,20 baht would have been aceptable 150 baht here is a rip off,amazing Thailand ,no wonder tourists are staying away in droves ,just another nail in the coffin by those in charge.

A little bit of perspective:

- 20 baht is what (most) Thai banks charge you for using one of their own ATMs outside of the province where your ATM card was issued.

- ~150 baht is what my home country bank will charge me for using my ATM card abroad (outside the EU). And they don't even have to operate the ATM

- ~170 baht is what my home country bank will charge me for an electronic (internet banking) transfer of any amount up to ~430,000 baht into my Thai account.

- 0 baht is what my Thai bank charges me for any ATM withdrawal of up to 20,000 baht as long as I'm within my home province.

If you're on a two week holiday here, I think you can probably afford the 150 baht fee. Several friends of mine, who regularly holiday in Thailand, have set up local accounts here and transfer money before they leave for their holidays. If you live here, all it takes is a little bit of planning.

I agree with the basic premise that everything should be free. Unfortunately banks, just like lunches, are not

/ Priceless

170 baht is what my home country bank will charge me for an electronic (internet banking) transfer of any amount up to ~430,000 baht into my Thai account.

Priceless who is this bank that charge 170 baht (£3.30) to do online transfers i know Halifax is £9.50.

Do you care to share their name thanks,thats if your UK of course.

Really sorry to have to disappoint you It's a Swedish bank, Svenska Handelsbanken (SHB). On a side note: I used to have to transfer "manually", i.e. go to the branch office and fill in and sign a form. In those days the fee was 150 SEK. Some 3-4 years ago they opened for int'l transfers via their internet bank. Since this was an automatic transaction (with me doing all the manual work ) they lowered the fee to 40 SEK! That's the kind of bank that you stay with

/ Priceless

Wish the greedy English banks would take note but they have those debt's to pay back of course

That's great Priceless its how Banks should reward their customers when doing the donkey work ourselves.

[colino]

Too me yes it does matter

150 Baht fee Thai end GBP 1.50 that end.

The Baht down to 50 everything costs a third more

True dumping BBC E

Uk air taxes.

More nails in the coffin for Uk people here in Thailand.

Colino

[katana]

As we begin another week with the big three

STILL NOT CHARGING 150 THB ATM FEE

Government Savings Bank Government Savings Bank

Kasikorn BankKasikorn Bank

Bank of Ayudhya Bank of Ayudhya

Useful info, thanks for posting. Let's hope it lasts.

Edited May 3, 2009 by katana

[sheff_mick]

Bangkok Post, Published: 4/05/2009 at 12:00 AM

BANKING

Banks asked to cut foreigners' ATM fees

By: SOMRUEDI BANCHONGDUANG

The Thai Bankers' Association will ask local banks to cut fee charges for foreign cardholders using local ATMs, according to association secretary-general Twatchai Yongkittikul.

He said the TBA would hold talks among its members about current fees.

But he cautioned that any cuts would likely be marginal, as most of the fees represented charges imposed for international network access and simply passed on to end-users.

Since mid-April, foreign cardholders withdrawing funds from local ATMs have been charged 150 baht per transaction.

Dr Twatchai said the fee largely came from new transaction charges imposed by international service providers MasterCard Worldwide and Visa Worldwide to cover interchange network costs.

Local banks, which had previously absorbed the expenses, are now looking to pass on their own operating expenses to customers, arguing that the fees charged in Thailand are in line with expenses charged for cross-border ATM transactions in other countries.

Dr Twatchai acknowledged that a number of foreign tourists and expatriates had complained about the added fees.

Shortened version re. Thai Visa obligations

Ref url for the complete article is....

http://www.bangkokpost.com/business/econom...igners-atm-fees

Edited May 4, 2009 by sheff_mick

[Penkoprod]

This part of the article would indicate where the problem lies, tbh.

At a minimum, he said, local banks should communicate better with customers about the expenses banks incur for processing international transactions.

Its this lack of communication that gets most peoples hackles rising, and NOT the fee itself perhaps?????

Penkoprod

[ronaldjp]

Doesn't anyone here get the point??? Its not the THB 150 charge that really matters and especially if you ARE savvy and just withdraw large sums from time to time and go to the next machine and deposit in your local bank account, if you have an account here, or in your wallet if you don't....it's the fact that the banks are so blazon about showing the charge on the ATM slip! I agree that banks are entitled to a small charge... as the overseas banks take hidden charges constantly on these transactions and never show it , why don't the banks here just incorporate it in the exchange rate and there never would have been a complaint because the charge is, in the sum total of things, so small.BUT WHY ON EARTH the Thai Bankers Association could not have made a sliding scale of charges that would not penalise the withdrawers of small amounts , is beyond me, . Just another example about decisions being made which primarily concern tourists without ADVISE FROM THE TOURIST authority or some other panel of foreign experts.

[goodpoint]

There is no notifacation the charge will be applied. In other countries there is. This is deceptive.

The service was never free. Never. The home bank levies the charge at around 4%. On a 5000 baht withdrawal, this lifts the total charge to 7%.

Visa levies the charge on the merchant. If merchant levies a charge it notifies customer in advance.

I have to be suspect that the initial views expressed above reflect the baking industry. But then again recent bank management illustraes how much harm banks are capable of inflicting on themselves and others..

Edited May 4, 2009 by goodpoint

[goodpoint]

Giving it more thought a 150 B charge on a 20,000 withdrawal is less than one percent. Not serious. But notification is important, a key issue, as it can deter some customers from withdrawing small amounts - because they don't like carrying lots of cash with them.

Edited May 4, 2009 by goodpoint

[Soutpeel]

The service was never free. Never. The home bank levies the charge at around 4%. On a 5000 baht withdrawal, this lifts the total charge to 7%.

Not all home banks....

[Rinrada]

Just got the official starting prices from the Nationwide about thir new charges

Nationwide VISA Debit Cards

Ref :From 1st June 2009 we will start to pass on the VISA Charge fee and will be included in your £ statements

At the moment this is 0,84% but from 1st July 2009 it will increase to 1 %.

This only applies OUTSIDE Visa Europe (so still OK on booze runs to Calais)

For info on countries affected ...have a look...

www.nationwide.co.uk/foreigntransactions

in future others may incur....30 days notice etc....so its official..

...

We have been using these cards for FREE transfers for wot about 20 years so a bit sad but MPR.....

now at the Bank of Mae-On will just need to.....

[goodpoint]

The service was never free. Never. The home bank levies the charge at around 4%. On a 5000 baht withdrawal, this lifts the total charge to 7%.

Not all home banks....

The ‘home bank’ fee is /was always in the spread. The buy/Sell, the baht/Yen etc. It is usually a staggering 3-6 % (staggeriing because in the electronic transaction age this is 99% clear profit to home bank + presumably a nice fee to the offshore bank - Thai banks already receiving.

[Chaimai]

Just got the official starting prices from the Nationwide about thir new charges

Nationwide VISA Debit Cards

Ref :From 1st June 2009 we will start to pass on the VISA Charge fee and will be included in your £ statements

At the moment this is 0,84% but from 1st July 2009 it will increase to 1 %.

This only applies OUTSIDE Visa Europe (so still OK on booze runs to Calais)

For info on countries affected ...have a look...

www.nationwide.co.uk/foreigntransactions

in future others may incur....30 days notice etc....so its official..

...

We have been using these cards for FREE transfers for wot about 20 years so a bit sad but MPR.....

now at the Bank of Mae-On will just need to.....

Welcome Rin - better late than never

[vagabond48]

I have been out of the country for nearly 2 months and I'm returning soon.

I find that Siam City Bank, most of the time, has the best ATM rate according to this website so can someone tell me if they are charging this 150b fee?

[Chaimai]

I have been out of the country for nearly 2 months and I'm returning soon.

I find that Siam City Bank, most of the time, has the best ATM rate according to this website so can someone tell me if they are charging this 150b fee?

Yes they are.

[JimGant]

I find that Siam City Bank, most of the time, has the best ATM rate according to this website

That website gives bank-established rates, which are good for in-bank money exchanges, or electronic fund and wire transactions. Not (normally) for ATM transactions.

SCiB's ATM rates are established by the networks (Visa's Plus and MC's Cirrus, being the prime ones). This is true for most Thai banks. However, Bank of Ayudhya (BofAy) now has ATM machines that use exchange rates set by BofAy -- using the dynamic currency conversion concept. See This Thread

[barryofthailand]

There is no notifacation the charge will be applied. In other countries there is. This is deceptive.

The service was never free. Never. The home bank levies the charge at around 4%. On a 5000 baht withdrawal, this lifts the total charge to 7%.

Visa levies the charge on the merchant. If merchant levies a charge it notifies customer in advance.

I have to be suspect that the initial views expressed above reflect the baking industry. But then again recent bank management illustraes how much harm banks are capable of inflicting on themselves and others..

Your way wrong. I bank with a credit union in the States, and the only charge that I am charged is a 1.5% conversion fee levied by Visa, and my credit union rebates that back to me. So the 150 Baht charge is a big deal when you can only withdraw 20,000 Baht at a time, so two withdrawals a month times 150 baht would be 3,600 Baht per yr. Thank goodness for the Banks that are not charging in Thailand.

Barry

[golfnut64]

K bank now charge the 150 fee

is there one left that doesnt?

[jfchandler]

Government Savings Bank (the pink colored one) appears to still be ATM fee-free.

They have a regular branch on Suk Road near the Emporium Shopping Center, an ATM in the Asoke-Sukhumvit BTS/MRT complex, and another branch (regional office) up on Phahon Yothin Road.

Anyone else spotted other GSB ATM locations around BKK?

[barryofthailand]

When did you try Kasikorn Thai last and was charged the 150 baht fee?

Barry

[ilgitano]

When did you try Kasikorn Thai last and was charged the 150 baht fee?

Barry

Yesterday (sat 15th may) no fee from kasikornbank at Chiang mai airport plaza. Today the exact same machine now wants 150 baht fee.

Bank of Ayudhya (yellow ATM) still not charging the fee as of today (sunday 16th may)

Edited May 16, 2009 by ilgitano

[jfchandler]

Ilgitano...I believe you'll find that "yesterday" in Thailand was Friday (not Saturday), the 15th...

And today is Saturday (not Sunday), the 16th...

unless you've created your own international date line....

[pattaya_girl]

When did you try Kasikorn Thai last and was charged the 150 baht fee?

Barry

Is the Kasikorn Bank now charging ???