Isaan People Killing Off Their Own Language

[isaanbrit]

My sister in law is currently pregnant with her first child and as usual every one is eager to offer advice, even those like myself who have absolutely no child raising experience.

I do have one comment though which I consider well thought out and researched. Both my wife (who agrees with me) and I keep telling her over and over again; "speak Isaan to your kids!"

Walking around town in many Issan provinces I am just shocked at the amount of people who refuse to speak their mother tongue with their children. Two parents can be happily chatting away between themselves in Isaan but when talking to turn their their kids, it must always be in Thai. (Imagine how frustrating that must be for the kids)

The reasons are obvious but sad - all about money. Where's the money? Bangkok! Thai is the language of the rich - "Isaan is for poor people" they might say. They may consider Isaan a 'stupid persons language' but I think it is way more stupid to bring children up singu-lingal when they should naturally be bilingual.

What kind of screwed up world is it when a mother feels that her own language is too "Loso"to use with her children?

I am not suggesting that Thai is not a necessary language to speak in Thailand, without it one would be screwed, but I challenge anyone to find an Isaan person who finished high school that cannot speak Thai just as well as the next person.

Thai is learnt anyway, in school, though the media, in general life, but Isaan, if not learnt from the start will never progress any further than just about understanding what Grandad says.

The only reason I can think of not to speak Isaan with one's kids is because it is lower class. The reasons to speak it are multiple: it will make them bilingual from birth, they'll be able to speak Thai anyway and most obviously, its their heritage. Considering the above I think its only an idiot who would choose not to speak their mother tongue with their children.

My wife shall certainly be speaking Isaan with our kids and we shall be proud that our kids grow up trilingual!!!

[DavidHouston]

You raise some interesting issues associated not only with ภาษาอีสาน but with many regional and local languages in the world. Even Central Thai is under a lot of pressure, mostly from English, but also from regional languages such as Chinese and Japanese. English became a dominant international language, not because of its suitability for this purpose, but by historical accident -- the first being the British Empire's ability to expand exponentially due the the new technology of sailing ships and the second being American economic ascendancy after the Second World War.

I believe that the Ministry of Education had programs to preserve regional and tribal languages found within its borders as a cultural heritage matter. But, if you now Google "อนุรักษ์ ภาษาอีสาน" you will see discussions on chat boards but I was unable to find very little of substance. Perhaps others would find more.

I would like to ask you whether there is a perhaps less obvious layer of complexity here. Even people who grow up speaking two languages or dialects, Central Thai and Isarn for example, might still retain a Northeast "accent" even when articulating the Central Thai standard languages. I suspect this is the same issue in the U.K. where someone whose native accent is a product of one of the innumerable local areas in Brittan, Ireland, Wales, or Scotland would have difficulty speaking consistent BBC English in the workplace, for example. Do employers in Central London, for example, shy away from the labor pool of the provinces or of cockney London?

I wonder if the parents who speak Central Thai to their offspring have a concern that their children will be disadvantaged in education and employment unless their accents replicate that of high class Bangkokians. I live in the Andaman South and the story is the same: educated parents who speak flawless Southern Thai will speak only Bangkok Thai with their children so as to create an aura of high class birth. As you point out, however, the problem is less acute than in the past since children can hear high-class Thai on the radio and television on a daily basis.

I wish you the best of multi-lingual luck in the raising of your children.

[wasabi]

I think learning English is probably more important than Thai and Issan.

[macduff]

My Thai wife is currently teaching our 2 year old boy Thai and lao/issan as well as English. Nowt wrong with that.Not only that i'm picking up the Thai languages as i call it.My wifes friends are mainly from north Thai here in the UK and they speak lao/issan mixed together as well as Thai.We had a get together in a Thai restaurant here in the UK with wife's from issan, and a wife from Bangkok.The issan girls were talking about the girl from Bangkok and she couldn't understand her.

[misterme]

I think learning English is probably more important than Thai and Issan.

I can't see how knowing English instead of Thai would be better for a child growing up in Thailand... unless the parents plan to send the child abroad.

Edited April 30, 2009 by misterme

[patklang]

Isaan is a big place,where is it that you live,and the thai wife refuses to teach the kid isaan language.Surely this doesnt happen all over issan as i know many many who speak isaan and thai

[macduff]

Being able to speak and read two languages or three would be an advantage i would have thought.

[meadish_sweetball]

Being able to speak and read two languages or three would be an advantage i would have thought.

It certainly doesn't hurt (although some 'experts' in the past have been silly enough to suggest it might be detrimental to children's development to be exposed to more than one language in their home).

Access to more than one language system creates a more accurate understanding of how languages work and how they can differ, which is really useful when progressing to learn yet another language.

[katana]

A little bit of info here, from this 1998 website (perhaps it's a bit out of date now?). Apparently there were Lao book burnings at one time:

The Isaan dialect comes from and is very similar to the Lao language. Lao is written using the Lao script which is distinct from Thai. Over the years the central Thai government has made a deliberate effort to unify the language of Thailand. Some Isaan people still remember government imposed book burnings to destroy Lao (and as was supposed communist) literature. One man recalls that afterwards the elders took the ashes of their ancient Lao texts and molded them with clay to make amulets to wear around their necks to remind them of their heritage. Most Isaan people today are no longer fluent readers of the Lao script.

In spite of the fact that Isaan has not been written down as a language for over forty years it still remains the mother tongue of the region and shows no sign of decreasing. First grade in school remains a traumatic time for Isaan children who are taught to read, write and speak Thai, some hearing it for the first time in their lives.

For 70% of the total population living within Isaan, Isaan is the primary heart language and Thai is the secondary language. Among the remaining 30%, other languages are primary, Isaan is secondary and Thai is third. Included in this 30% are the Khmer speakers, Chinese and Vietnamese born and raised in Thailand, and the tribal groups such as the Phu Tai and others, each with their own distinct mother tongue.

Adult literacy - 70%.

http://www.thaicov.org/thailand/isaan.html#language

Edited April 30, 2009 by katana

[Texpat]

Isaan is no more a language than TexMex spoken along the Texas border with Mexico.

It's just a mish mash of Thai and Lao. I don't see how speaking some pidgin backwater language will benefit a child in the long run.

There may be familial and cultural links that make learning it meaningful, but it certainly isn't something you'd put on a resume.

Sorta like Cajun French-English-Redneck.

[wasabi]

Isaan is no more a language than TexMex spoken along the Texas border with Mexico.

It's just a mish mash of Thai and Lao. I don't see how speaking some pidgin backwater language will benefit a child in the long run.

There may be familial and cultural links that make learning it meaningful, but it certainly isn't something you'd put on a resume.

Sorta like Cajun French-English-Redneck.

Gotta agree, I see some rural romanticism going on. A huge percentage of Thailand speaks Issan and do you see it giving them any advantages in life? The fact of the matter is that these tend to be the lowest paid members of society. However few speak English well. How could anyone doubt this is an advantage in Thailand and the world? Issan is good for gossiping and keeping secrets from Farang husbands who can speak Thai. But it's so closely related to Thai I don't see it offering any special deep cultural insight a child would be lacking by not knowing.

Edited April 30, 2009 by wasabi

[Svenn]

Isaan is no more a language than TexMex spoken along the Texas border with Mexico.

It's just a mish mash of Thai and Lao. I don't see how speaking some pidgin backwater language will benefit a child in the long run.

There may be familial and cultural links that make learning it meaningful, but it certainly isn't something you'd put on a resume.

Sorta like Cajun French-English-Redneck.

This is sort of true- Isaan is not really a language so much as it is really just plain Lao... and Lao is basically just a slack-jawed dialect of Thai (r's replaced with l's, etc). Lao was once known as Tai-Noi (little Tai). Same is true of the supposed "Isaan" alphabet- it's really just a more primitive version of Thai. Contrary to what bored unintellectual central thais will say, both Thai and Lao are intelligable to either speaker if they're attentive and curious enough. Historically, Lao people didn't really have a distinguashable identity until the 1300s. Isaan people are actually mostly Khmer or proto-Mon in ethnicity, the Lao were just one of the latest in many conquerors of the region, who imposed Laotian as the language.... the central Thais just came along and did the same thing. All of this however is not to say that there are not very important distinguishing cultural and identity features between Thai and Isaan cultures.

The thaification of Isaan is indeed repulsive, but the real enemies here in the cutural dilution are the chinese bangkok thais. kohn isaan and poor kohn thai have much in common and do not see themselves as that different- however the kohn jeen of bangkok have been shunning "tai-ness" for centuries.

[bina]

i had to steal this from 'economics.com' from the net; since i remembered my college days and endless discussions about the politics of language, mutually intelligable or unintelligable, etc

"Dialect" or "Language"

There are no universally accepted criteria for distinguishing languages from dialects, although a number of paradigms exist, which render sometimes contradictory results. The exact distinction is therefore a subjective one, dependent on the user's frame of reference.

Language varieties are often called dialects rather than languages

* solely because they are not (or not recognized as) literary languages,

* because the speakers of the given language do not have a state of their own,

* or because their language lacks prestige.

AnthropologicalAnthropology (from the Greek word ANTHROPOLOGIA consists of the study of humankind (see genus Homo . It is holistic in two senses: it is concerned with all humans at all times, and with all dimensions of humanity. Central to anthropology is the concept of linguists define dialect as the specific form of a language used by a speech community. In other words, the difference between language and dialect is the difference between the abstract or general and the concrete and particular. From this perspective, no one speaks a "language," everyone speaks a dialect of a language. Those who identify a particular dialect as the " standard" or "proper" version of a language are in fact using these terms to express a social distinction.

In groups where prestige standards play less important roles, "dialect" may simply be used to refer to subtle regional variations in linguistic practices that are considered mutually intelligible, playing an important role to place strangers, carrying the message of wherefrom a stranger originates (which quarter or district in a town, which village in a rural setting, or which province of a country); thus there are many apparent "dialects" of NavajoNavajo or Dine refers to the Navajo Nation and its people, and to the Navajo language. See also code talkers Mohave Navajo can also indicate Navajo County, Arizona Navajo, Montana Navajo, New Mexico Navajo, Oklahoma Navajo Dam, New Mexico Camp Navajo, an and ApacheApachean also known as Southern Athabaskan, refers to members of the Apachean language family (including Navajo) which is in turn a member of the larger Athabaskan family. These languages are spoken by various bands of Apache and Navajo peoples. They are, for example, geographically widespread North American indigenous languages, by which the linguist simply means that there are many subtle variations among speakers who largely understand each other and recognize that they are each speaking "the same way" in a general sense.

Modern day linguistics knows that the statusIn sociology, social status is the "standing", the honour or prestige attaching to one's position in society. In modern societies, occupation is usually thought of as the main dimension of status, but even in modern societies other memberships or affiliat of language is not solely determined by linguistic criteria, but it is also the result of a historical and political development. Romansh came to be a written language, and therefore it is recognized as a language, even though it is very close to the Lombardic alpine dialects. An opposite example is the case of the Chinese languageThe Chinese language (/, /, or ; pinyin: hany, huay, or zhongwen) is a member of the Sino-Tibetan family of languages. Although most Chinese view the many varieties of spoken Chinese as a single language, regional variations in spoken language are compara whose variations are often considered dialects and not languages despite their mutual unintelligibility because they share a common literary standard and common body of literature.

and to point out: my husband speaks korat thai issaan (thats his definition of what he speaks)... his reading and written thai were substandard; access to thai/thai and thai english and thai/isaan with all the dialects dictionaries (that i bought for him) and relying on the internet since he is far from thailand have improved his thai vocabulary by leaps and bounds, as well as his spelling and language use. he did however learn pali easily when he was a monk. he does insist that i speak thai ngen (central, regular, thai) rather then the isaan /hebrew patois that i spoke previously. although i have witnessed weird conversations where one person spoke central thai and the other spoke only issan (nong khai) thai. the central thai speaker hadnt a clue as to what the nong khai person was saying. rather amusing if it wasnt sad.

bina

israel

[robbo1]

We are living in Australia and I encourage my wife to speak her issan language to our son as often as she wants I believe bilinguill children are much more advantaged I want him when we go to thailand to understand my wifes family .

And explain anything I dont understand

[geriatrickid]

English became a dominant international language, not because of its suitability for this purpose, but by historical accident -- the first being the British Empire's ability to expand exponentially due the the new technology of sailing ships and the second being American economic ascendancy after the Second World War.

Not in 100% agreement with you there. At one time the French colonial empire was as extensive if not more extensive than the English. The Germans also had foreign colonies. German was even the 2nd most spoken language in the USA at one time. And yet English has taken over. It's because it is a forgiving language. You can make all sorts of grammatical errors, mangle the syntax and yet still be understood. French and German languages are not forgiving in that way.

Learning Thai is the way to go. Isaan dialect should be easier to pick up for a child because it is verbal. Thai requires a head start because of the reading and writing component. Think back to when you were in school how hard it was to read and write. If you want to get a government job or any of the better jobs you had better speak and write Thai properly. I see it with my Isaan friends. It's no different than the situation with marginal groups in other countries. The wealthiest subset of the Latino population in the USA are those with english language skills. In Haiti, if you want to do well, it won't be with Creole.

[KhaoNiaw]

I don't think this is anything like as widespread as the OP makes out. My daughter is now nearly 17. My wife has always spoken Thai to her when we are in the Bangkok area, our main home, and has always spoken the Isan dialect when we are at her home in Ubon. My daughter speaks both and seems to have her own formula for deciding what to use with different people at different times (always uses Lao with younger cousins whatever part of the country we're in etc.). I've only communicated with her in English since she was born so that's another first language for her. I've met a few families where the kids have been born and brought up in Bangkok and the parents only speak Thai to them. So if they visit the family in the NE they do the same, but usually the kids understand Isan. Also like my sister-in-law, where she speaks Isan to the kids but they only speak Central Thai.

In fact, the Isan dialect is now much more widely heard on TV and radio than it was when I first came to Thailand, when it was still suppressed to some degree. Also, from the Lao satellite TV stations that we can pick up, you can hear that formal spoken Lao is quite different from the Isan dialects, obvious similarities but obvious differences just like Central Thai.

Edited April 30, 2009 by KhaoNiaw

[meadish_sweetball]

Isaan is no more a language than TexMex spoken along the Texas border with Mexico.

We've had the debate about what constitutes a language before. It's more a political thing than anything else.

It's just a mish mash of Thai and Lao. I don't see how speaking some pidgin backwater language will benefit a child in the long run.

The way I see it, it's about two things, cultural identity and facilitating brain development (from having to organize two systems) and learning future languages, rather than a linear 'speaking X will get you job Y'.

There may be familial and cultural links that make learning it meaningful, but it certainly isn't something you'd put on a resume.

Sure, I agree on both counts. But just because you don't put something on a resume does not mean it was not beneficial for you to learn. And a sense of belonging to a family and group can be very powerful reasons. Language is a strong bonding marker.

The fact that a language is spoken in a relatively economically undeveloped rural area does not mean the language itself is necessarily undeveloped. It obviously won't be full of specific words pertaining to office organization or chemical compounds, but as a contrast it can have a multitude of words related to human interaction, plants, agriculture or whatever other area is important in the lives of the locals.

[isaanbrit]

Hi guys,

Thanks for all the comments, I have some responses and some extra comments;

Firstly, friends who have read the response have suggested to me that because I am not a minority it is impossible for me to understand what it is like to be one and that some Isaan people might now want their children to go through what they went through growing up. I think its certainly true that central Thai are sometimes prejudice towards Isaan people.

In response to David Houston; my hypothesis is that Bangkok Thai is different to the rest of the country as they speak their own dialect but I think that regular Thai is actually the same everywhere else from Bangkok as it has been stadardized by the media etc. When a southerner and a norherner are both speaking 'regular Thai'I think most would have problems telling them apart. Therefore, unlike UK which boats many different accents, Thailand has many different dialects or languages but not actually different accents. Central Thai all sounds the same (but "bangkok Thai" is different!)

[isaanbrit]

Isaan is no more a language than TexMex spoken along the Texas border with Mexico.

It's just a mish mash of Thai and Lao. I don't see how speaking some pidgin backwater language will benefit a child in the long run.

There may be familial and cultural links that make learning it meaningful, but it certainly isn't something you'd put on a resume.

Sorta like Cajun French-English-Redneck.

Texpat - I think being able to speak a second language is exceptionally beneficial for a child's development irrespective of whether you regard that language to be "pidgin / backwater". In Surin I have met children who speak 4 languages fluently, Thai, Laos, Khmer and Soiu (sp). You'd probably class all of these as "pidgin" but my whole point is that speaking them, even if they wont help them get a job in America, is a big advantage to their mental developemt. Speaking 4 languages fluently is cool!

[isaanbrit]

Gotta agree, I see some rural romanticism going on. A huge percentage of Thailand speaks Issan and do you see it giving them any advantages in life? The fact of the matter is that these tend to be the lowest paid members of society. However few speak English well. How could anyone doubt this is an advantage in Thailand and the world? Issan is good for gossiping and keeping secrets from Farang husbands who can speak Thai. But it's so closely related to Thai I don't see it offering any special deep cultural insight a child would be lacking by not knowing.

Wasabi - I can't believe that you consider gossiping about Ferangs to be any part important to the discussion on language development in Thai children. I don't know what percentage of Thai women have ferang husbands but I don't think its a high enough percentage to affect the argument :-)

Finally, in the far reaches of Isaan, the language is actually 99% Laos, it only becomes more Thai as you get closer to Bangkok as they have become mixed. In many places they don't claim to speak Isaan, they just call it Laos.

I guess if I lived in Wales I would also encourage my children to speak Welsh too. Again, no matter how unimportant the language is, speaking two languages is way more intellectual than just speaking one. :-)

Meadmash sweetball - I totally agree with everything u said :-)

Edited May 1, 2009 by isaanbrit

[Texpat]

Texpat - I think being able to speak a second language is exceptionally beneficial for a child's development irrespective of whether you regard that language to be "pidgin / backwater". In Surin I have met children who speak 4 languages fluently, Thai, Laos, Khmer and Soiu (sp). You'd probably class all of these as "pidgin" but my whole point is that speaking them, even if they wont help them get a job in America, is a big advantage to their mental developemt. Speaking 4 languages fluently is cool!

I agree speaking multiple languages is a great asset. I'm bilingual, as is my entire family. My wife is from Nong Khai and speaks Thai and Lao, and is conversant in Japanese and English. But she'll agree that Isaan isn't a language -- it's just a combination of Thai and Lao. It's fun, it's clever it's useful, but it's really nothing more than that. Thai powers want Thais to speak Thai. They demand it. Many people in Isaan have roots in Laos. Seems like a convienient compromise. I'd imagine this kind of dynamic exists wherever there are long borders between countries speaking different distinct languages.

Pidgin is a simplified language that develops as a means of communication between two or more groups that do not have a language in common.

Speaking Isaan likely won't help anyone get a job in America, but speaking Thai and Lao might.

[wasabi]

Today I was watching an Issan Karokee video with my wife. I have to admit it was more fun to watch than most Thai videos so I I should retract my statement that the usefulness is limited to gossiping. Lao/Issan is it's own language, with quirks and cultural references unique to it, but I don't think enough differences exist that it's a big deal if someone knows Thai but not Issan. I stand by my statement that if only one language was chosen it should be English. If two Thai and English. If three Eng/ Thai/ Issan. Here I'm just talking about economic advantadge.

[meadish_sweetball]

I stand by my statement that if only one language was chosen it should be English

Of course you're right from an economic, global point of view. Still, most Isaan mothers would not be able to teach their children much English.

[macduff]

My two year old son who's English/Thai is doing extremly well with his English/Thai/Issan/Lao language.I would only hope anybody on this thread who thinks it's a waste of time and of no importance in later life remembers this. If your lying in the middle of the road after a traffic accident and need help i hope and you would hope that someone can speak the native language whatever it may be as well as English to the emergency services. I would think being bi-lingual would be a great advantage to relay information whatever the cause may be under any circumstances (traffic accident just an example)

[DavidHouston]

For an "expert" opinion, see http://www.linguistlist.org/ask-ling/biling.html

[jts-khorat]

In Surin I have met children who speak 4 languages fluently, Thai, Laos, Khmer and Soiu (sp).

The language is Suay (ภาษาส่วย), a Mon-Khmer language and as such closely related to the Northern Khmer dialect spoken in Surin and other Thai provinces bordering to Cambodia (Khamen). As those two languages are in a different language family than Thai, Thai people will not be able to understand it at all; Khamen might be understood to 80% in neighboring Cambodia, Suay much less.

The Suay minority is spread over parts of Thailand, Cambodia and Laos where they were famous as elephant handlers.

A few selected words can be found here: http://www.thai-language.com/id/590087

[Johpa]

Isaan is no more a language than TexMex spoken along the Texas border with Mexico.

It's just a mish mash of Thai and Lao. I don't see how speaking some pidgin backwater language will benefit a child in the long run.

There may be familial and cultural links that make learning it meaningful, but it certainly isn't something you'd put on a resume.

Sorta like Cajun French-English-Redneck.

This is sort of true- Isaan is not really a language so much as it is really just plain Lao... and Lao is basically just a slack-jawed dialect of Thai (r's replaced with l's, etc). Lao was once known as Tai-Noi (little Tai). Same is true of the supposed "Isaan" alphabet- it's really just a more primitive version of Thai. Contrary to what bored unintellectual central thais will say, both Thai and Lao are intelligable to either speaker if they're attentive and curious enough. Historically, Lao people didn't really have a distinguashable identity until the 1300s. Isaan people are actually mostly Khmer or proto-Mon in ethnicity, the Lao were just one of the latest in many conquerors of the region, who imposed Laotian as the language.... the central Thais just came along and did the same thing. All of this however is not to say that there are not very important distinguishing cultural and identity features between Thai and Isaan cultures.

The thaification of Isaan is indeed repulsive, but the real enemies here in the cutural dilution are the chinese bangkok thais. kohn isaan and poor kohn thai have much in common and do not see themselves as that different- however the kohn jeen of bangkok have been shunning "tai-ness" for centuries.

Well now the degradation of the other forums has reached the language forum. I am amazed at the ignorance on display here.

First, Lao is a very distinct language within the Tai language group. It is not some form of Creole such as Tex-Mex where two very distantly related languages intersect. Isaan is, for all intents and purposes, Lao. One might call it a dialect of Lao, but it is not a "slack-jawed" dialect of Central Thai. That position is just plain ignorance. I have heard Shan, another language in the Tai language family be commonly referred to as Tai-Yai, but I do not commonly hear Lao referred to as Tai-Noi.

Both the Thai alphabet and the Lao alphabet are historically derived from the Khmer script and thus from the South Asian scripts. The Lao script is no more a primitive version of Thai script that is Lao a lazy form of Central Thai. You might as well as argue that the Roman alphabet is a primitive version of classic Greek script.

Standard Lao or Isaan is not necessarily mutually comprehensible to a Central Thai speaker. The languages are closely related, and a Central Thai speaker from Bangkok can often pick up the topic of conversation of a Lao speaker, but not always the comment being made upon the topic. Most Lao and Isaan folks can understand Central Thai due to its pervasiveness in the regional media. This is similar to the situation in Iberia where the Portuguese speakers usually understand Spanish, as it too dominates the media on that peninsula, but Spaniards tend not to understand Portuguese. But unless a Central Thai speaker has been exposed to Lao, either in the home, school, or in the media, mutual intelligibility is limited.

The Lao and Isaan cultures represent the migration of both Tai people and Tai culture southwards into Southeast Asia. Clearly there has been significant genetic mixing between these Tai migrations into the region and the earlier Mon-Khmer migrations, as well as with other groups, some of whom are now lost to history. But the genetic pool in Isaan has not been ethnically Khmer or "proto-Mon" for generations, and much of that genetic pool has never been such. Just more nonsense.

Look, the languages of the politically weaker people in and around Thailand have been on the wane for the same reasons the languages of the politically weaker people of Europe have lost their languages. One no longer meets many speakers of Breton in France, or Westphalian in Germany, nor speakers of Cornish in England, nor speakers of Sogdian anywhere on the planet. People want to identify with the elites. They will shift their languages towards the language of the elite, in this case Central Thai. They will slowly shift their ethnic identity towards the elites, towards those in political power. And history has shown that people will even shift their religious beliefs to those of the elites. How else can you explain the recent success of the death cult of Jesus around the globe, or the earlier conversion of Hindu Indonesia to Islam?

The elites will facilitate these shifts by denigrating the indigenous languages by using all the propaganda tools of the State, even influencing visitors to believe the nonsense that these other languages are to be viewed as somehow inferior. Ah, but there is always good political reason not to incorporate basic linguistics into the educational curriculum. Keep the masses ignorant and keep your power.

[misterme]

I stand by my statement that if only one language was chosen it should be English. If two Thai and English.

I, too, stand by my statement that if they are to live in Thailand, Thai if only 1 language, Eng as a 2nd.

Knowing only English in Thailand is a big liability and would seem to me to be a bad choice. The only practical use to your theory would be if living abroad.

[waikhru]

my daughter is 5 and speaks lao and thai fluently.

when she speaks thai you would not know she was from issan, when she speaks lao you would not know she speaks thai.

speaks both perfectly.

for some reason however she speaks lao all day in the village,as does everyone, but when she plays with her dolls she speaks thai.

copying tv i think.

[Rikker]

Johpa, thanks for your post. I had given up on this thread. Comments like those you responded to are the kind of intellectually destitute, willful ignorance that keep me from participating most anywhere else on ThaiVisa.

Everyone interested in this topic would be wise to read and RE-read Johpa's post just now. It demonstrates an understanding of the basic principles at work here.

And the commenters Johpa was responding to would do well to acquire some actual knowledge on the topic. These type of comments are ignorant of even the most basic principles of how the languages of Southeast Asia (or any languages for that matter) have come about, and how they interact with and relate to one another. Pick up a book guys.

[Edit: I also want to thank those others -- including the usual helpful contributors -- who have injected some value into this thread. Maybe I'm too sensitive to the prevailing ignorance on sociolinguistic issues in Thailand, which is often true of both Thais and foreigners. Thanks.]