Okay Girls Time To Tell The Truth

[kat]

Yes, that was an excellent post from Sheryl. I think you eased a lot of our minds.

[chiangmaibruce]

If reading about another's inspirational life would be uplifting and/or comforting then by all means read about this guy - Chris O'Brien - an Australian brain surgeon whose state funeral was held yesterday. There is a lot of material on him on the web including interviews - well worth watching one of them

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,25619...?from=public_js

One practical thing to consider is to make a video/s for your child. You or others might find this morbid or uncomfortable now, but this tangible memory and the knowledge or thoughts you impart will mean A LOT to others later. It may be hard to get started on it ... maybe just start with neutral stuff, some family history, your early memories, maybe later get into some words of advice. But really, anything you say is sure to be cherished.

[blaze]

Remember this: death is a state- a state requires a subject- once you have ceased to live there is no more 'you'- there is no more subject- so "you" will never be dead. You will then, by definition- only live- ". "You' can only be alive. For ALL of us- tomorrow is a fiction- it doesn't exist- it is a conjecture- a crontrivance- you live now. THat's all that matters.

You live till the end of time- since time subjectively experienced is a creation of your own mind. You will not die. No one - and nothing- can take the present away. You have that- and in the present there is an abundance of tiny miracles just waiting to be discovered. Enjoy them- they'll keep you going a lifetime.

Where there is "I', death be not--- and where there is Death- I be not'- Epicureus. Live in the moment- and demand from your loved ones that you not be distracted from the moment. And maybe they will do the same.

[Ijustwannateach]

^Similar thoughts about death expressed in William Blake's poem/song "The Fly":

Little fly,

Thy summer’s play

My thoughtless hand

Has brushed away.

Am not I

A fly like thee?

Or art not thou

A man like me?

For I dance

And drink and sing,

Till some blind hand

Shall brush my wing.

If thought is life

And strength and breath,

And the want

Of thought is death,

Then am I

A happy fly,

If I live,

Or if I die.

[Shazza]

Hey, thanks for all these posts... my Mum has motor neuron disease and is rapidly declining - she's not here in Thailand and I am... it's hard, but at least all her kids are older than your 14 year old, her baby is 47! Leaving my kids would be really difficult for me although (and without getting into religious debate) I know I would see them again at some stage, so there is always hope there.

I have thought lately about how I would react to this kind of thing happening in my life, hopefully I would be a trooper and not get all bitter and twisted about it... hopefully I would be one of those people who others would refer to as an inspiration... who knows?

I would surround myself with colour and beauty and people and would eat loads of whatever I felt like, I would read silly books, watch lame movies, BUT would also read (or have read to me) some classics that I had missed... If I could I'd go to Scotland and Europe and oh, loads of other places, but often this is something that we need to have done earlier...oh and if at all possible, I'd like to have a cuppa tea and a chat with Johnny Depp at some stage before death - you know, just to see if he's as good looking and sexy in real life as he is in movies and magazines!!!!!

[Gaccha]

Let me offer a thought experiment to show you that you will not die just because your body dies:

Imagine that humans had invented a teleport machine between the moon and earth. You as a spacewoman engineer pop up and down to the moon via the teleportation machine. One day, while you are on the moon, you are told that it has been discovered that the teleport machine is not all it was cracked up to be. The machine actually completely destroys the person that gets into it and then creates an entirely new person with all the memories and physical features at the destination point.

Knowing this, would you use the machine to see your children back on earth (you will not of course actually see them, but an entirely different person with your memories will, you will simply cease to exist)...?

I have heard people answer both ways. It is interesting because it is a rare glimpse into our real thinking. We recognise that in some ways our memories are actually more us than our conscious selves. If you think longer, then you realise you are part of the memories your children have and will continue to have long after you drop off this mortal coil.

[Nampeung]

Sheryl - this is the sort of info I want to hear. We are on the same wave length. Some of the process you described has started to happen already and I am distancing myself from those who are still alive on this earth. I am very much in touch with the states you mentioned and the people around me are in various levels of understanding of the dying process. Most days i have roller coaster periods between serious suffering and beautiful clarifying moments where i feel totally at ease with nature and the universe. Although i panic and suffer greatly for maybe about 3 hours of every day i can honestly say that i equally have about 3 hours most days of beauty and relaxation and watching blackbirds who sing so well and seagulls teaching their young to fly. I originally studied in the Thai Theravadan Buddhist tradition (Ahjan Chah and the forest tradition of Wat Pah Nanachat) and have been lucky enough to have some of the nuns from that tradition to come to visit me here at the Hospice - so I am slowly practising meditation as I used to do 16 years ago quite successfully.

Dying can come to us all at any age... but I have to admit to feeling slightly cheated at not having the chance to see my son grow up.

Do please keep chatting everyone about your thoughts and experiences of death - it is very helpful. Regarding religion - let's not discuss each of our beliefs here please. I'd like to hear what you think of the moment of death and perhaps where you think you'll go next...

[Ijustwannateach]

Another poem by Emily Dickinson which seems to be very much in touch with some of the feelings and processes Sheryl described (and keeps the fly motif going):

I heard a Fly buzz -- when I died --

The Stillness in the Room

Was like the Stillness in the Air --

Between the Heaves of Storm --

The Eyes around -- had wrung them dry --

And Breaths were gathering firm

For that last Onset -- when the King

Be witnessed -- in the Room --

I willed my Keepsakes -- Signed away

What portion of me be

Assignable -- and then it was

There interposed a Fly --

With Blue -- uncertain stumbling Buzz --

Between the light -- and me --

And then the Windows failed -- and then

I could not see to see --

[Nampeung]

Sheryl just read your post again and it is the most wonderful post/bit of information I have ever read... really. You see because, like many others, I have never felt this feeling of near death before, I may have read your post years ago and sort of said 'oh yes I understand what she means' but it's not possible to understand unless you have worked with hundreds of dying people or indeed that you are feeling for yourself.

Thank you once again Sheryl for a fantastic description of what actually happens - one of my biggest fears, and one stemming from 'not knowing'.

Today I discussed with doctors the impossible panic moments which occur several times a day so we've added Diazapam 2mg x 3 daily to the cocktail with Morphine 3.75mls x 5 daily. Just started today and it seems to calm the panics a lot more.

Discussed with the Buddhist Theravadin Nun re medication and she said there is nothing in the teachings that say one cannot have medication when neccessaray so feel comfortable with that - I'm no hero and can stand a lot of pain but this breathing deprivation is Massive and I need medical help with it.

Huge thanks Sheryl for your last post of truth... it means something very special to me XXX

[eek]

Im glad to hear you are given medication that helps you feel comfortable Nampeung. Its early evening for you now, so hope you had a good day, and are getting ready to enjoy a nice meal. Wishing you a good evening.

[rixalex]

Im glad to hear you are given medication that helps you feel comfortable Nampeung. Its early evening for you now, so hope you had a good day, and are getting ready to enjoy a nice meal. Wishing you a good evening.

Oh?! I thought Seonai was in the UK, where it's early morning now. No?

Well either way, hope you are comfortable and having a good day.

P.S. Wonderful to read that you took so much from Sheryl's wonderful post - i think we all did.

[eek]

Doh! i read the clock as 5:43pm instead of am...so...scrap that and replace it with 'hope you had a restful night'.....!

[johnbarpic]

_Ladies

_{You humble me, your words of comfort & words of advice to this truly remarkable lady, you have rallied to here at Nampeung’s request. I really don’t think us guys could be so positive with our advice as you have offered.}

_{But I would like to try to raise a little smile from Black humour. Some years ago now my mother in law was dying of cancer in a hospice in the UK she was a very positive lady and never really enjoyed tip top health. When she developed bowel cancer she never told us until she was really poorly and never complained for one minute.}

_{I went to visit soon after she was admitted to the hospice & I breezed into her room cheerily & said ‘’Hi mum how are you today’’ I’m fine but you should see some of the people in here with their deformities its enough to make you feel ill to which my father & I burst out laughing. She then she say’s I don’t know why your laughing you want to see them you would feel ill as well.}

_{She made us laugh until the end and she passed away the day after her 50th wedding anniversary, to which she told dad your not having a party without me & we didn’t we had one right there in the room.}

_{This lady also once suggested that while I was working away overseas I must remember to send my wife flowers. She said you can use Interpol they can deliver flowers anywhere. She really meant Inter-flora. ( international flower delivery)}

_{Nampeung rest well my dear. I don’t know if there is an after life but I hope there is & one day I get the chance to share your company.}

_{God Bless you all}

[submaniac]

Nampeung,

So sorry, I have been away from the board and have not read about your situation until now. I wish you and your son the best.

I know that you original asked for insight into death and the dying process. I shudder to say anything because as someone who is young and healthy, I do not feel quite right about saying things to someone in your position. It would feel like "you are young and healthy, what do you know?" However, I would like to offer the small and meager insight that I can.

My experience on the process comes from my stepfather passing away in 2007, and from talking to my mother who is an oncology (cancer) nurse, and has seen alot of death. From talking to her about it during the years, I get some impressions about the process. You mentioned that you overheard a doctor saying that someone had 48 hours to live. From my mother, she also says she knows when someone is about to pass. From what she says, it's not so much what the medical tests shows, but how the person behaves. It is as if the person's soul is preparing to leave the body. I don't know how quite to describe it as my experience comes second hand, but from her it seems that a person's demeanor changes, and it is if they have accepted it and are ready to go--like a calmness--or as Sheryl has said a 'letting go'--comes over them. And from what she says, a person has some control over the time and manner. And when I say that, I mean that if there is something important--for example a wedding anniversary, the birth of a grandchild, something--they will not leave their body until this event happens.

I do not want to get into a theological debate over the existence of God, or the working of the cosmos. But I can tell you from my personal, first hand experience from the passing of my stepfather, that he did come back to myself and my mother, to say 'goodbye'. I cannot believe that once you die, that is the end. There were so many things that happened following his death, that I knew he stopped by just to let us know that he was alright. Some people may dismiss such talk as delusional, but I know better. And I know that I did feel better knowing that he was not completely gone and was still around.

I wish I could give you more, but my little words are all I have. I wish you a calm, peaceful, and painless passing (and I don't want to say death because I know you still will be around) and I wish your son the strength to cope. God bless.

[Patsycat]

I haven't said anything on this thread, but I just saw your name roaming over "there".

My father died 6 years ago, and my mum asked us what we wanted to remind us of him, so I asked if i could have one of his sweaters. Now, my dad was 6'3 and an ex rugby player and I am 5'7 and a wee skinny binny. But I can tell you, I can still to this day smell his scent on that sweater. Which, of course i never wear!! I do have some taste in fashion. I get it out when I feel blue and need my daddy. And it gives me comfort.

So give your son something to smell or an old t shirt that he can sleep in.

About death? I can't get into all the religion things that people are babbling on about in the above posts - when it comes it comes.

[cognos]

God Bless you, and may you be comforted by the bible, and/or your family and friends, and know that many care, like me. God Bless you sister. Dean in Vancouver/Phuket

[Nip]

Hey you ladies in Thailand etc,There has been a thread running about me in another forum for a while but I'd like to broaden it out if I may because my mind is all over the place about it and I'd relly like to know your thoughts on the subject - it's not one we often discuss but it could prove useful.

In the last month or so doctors have told me I don't have long to live - please don't bother to ask why, it's an incurable disease called Bronchiectasis if anyone want to Google it.

What do you all think? How/what would you feel/do if you were told this? I am the mother of a 14-year-old and still very much in control of my mind. But my body is packing up. Slowly but surely I can do less and less for myself. Now I can't wash myself, have to ask the nurse to bring me the comode to pee and poo beside the bed. I can still feed myself and type on this computer.

It's a taboo subject but I'd love it if some of you could talk about it here and just share any thoughts about living and dying.

I guess I always thought I was invincible... but not so...

I would really like to hear your thoughts on how you would feel if you couldn't walk, wash, prepare food, go outside or take proper care of your children without help

I have had a number of books published and some time ago I wrote a play that for some reason I have never offered for publication or editing so please forgive errors. Basically it deals with oppression, death and what may follow? I often joke with friends that I’m an atheist thank God. As was my father. But while he was a Jew and my mother a Catholic, on his death bed he requested that he be baptized. I guess he was covering his options. But what really struck me in his final days was not the medical care but the uplifting words of hope that the Hospital Chaplin offered. I sincerely empathize with your predicament, applaud your candor and hope that within these few lines you may find some consolation. My greatest fears have become your reality and it is easy for those who say it is something we all have to face but that does not lessen the pain and anxiety. The first extract are the words of a woman on her death bed and the second are the words spoken by the priest on her demise…

The only comfort I require is spiritual for the reality of death has spread its definitive shadow. I must now contemplate the self within me. My body is but an earthly tabernacle that will, on my demise, be dispensed with. Soon my eyes will open upon a light that has never spread upon land or sea. There is no such thing as death. Only a birth into a fuller life with nobler opportunities. I am moving towards the great adventure of the hereafter. I have no fear for the loving hearts of my forefathers await me at the gates of another unutterable mystery... I am ready to pass over with joy, wonder and excitement. I shall, in the presence of the Lord, be a child once again in a land where everything is seen at its full value. Where money counts for nothing and love for everything. The joy of heaven, is inconceivable. Just as the pleasure of a beautiful landscape is to the blind or the enjoyment of an exquisite symphony is to the deaf. As in this life, we must not blind our eyes or dull our ears. The world beyond is no unconscious sleep but a vivid and material existence. I will be more alive in heaven than I have been here on earth. I did not come into this life alone. A mother's love awaited me. Unless the good Lord's notion has changed, I can at least expect something similar in the hereafter. I must, however, hope that there shall not be greater fools in this land where neither moth nor rust corrupt than I have encountered here on earth. Lord Jesus within the flame of eternal life I willingly disgorge my earthly body as a common moth does surely become a splendid butterfly. In the solitude of space my forefathers reach out to me. They have waited for me with God's holy angels. Like the sparkle of a diamond our love has not been tarnished by the passing of time…

Priest

To die, is just to be as you were before you were born. For it was in this calm unperceiving state that you slept for thousands of years with no ambition to set out sooner. While many will mourn your passing from this world I assure you that many more will herald your arrival into the next. No pain or vile hand will disturb your gentle repose. It is spring time. What more proof is needed to affirm God's infinite goodness. It is a time when his heavenly power makes all things new. As the hopes of the earth lie in springtime, the hopes of man rest in the aspirations of his children. God has written the promise of his kingdom and resurrection in every single leaf and blade of grass. Leap into the arms of futurity. The spirit of life has fled... From the grave the voice of nature will cry. Even in your ashes, will live your wonted fire. This mortal stage did exist for your delight and amusement. Your new existence will be as steadfast as your headstone and as breathless as the grave that will accommodate you. Death has no calendar. It devours lambs as well as sheep but for you this day it does open the wondrous gateway to eternal life. Holy, Holy, Holy is the Lord of Hosts. The life of all that lives. By morning glow or evening shade I beseech you to watch over Anne. Warm her with sunshine, refresh her with cool breezes. This day she will go forth from this world in the love of the father who created her. In the mercy of Jesus Christ who died for her. In the power of the Holy Spirit who will strengthen her. At one with all the faithful, living and departed, may she rest in peace and rise in glory, where grief and misery are banished and light and joy for evermore abide. Lord, take your daughter to your bosom and let the comforting light of your divinity shine upon her for ever and ever...Amen.

[Ave]

Nampueng,

all of the posts I've read so far have been, in my opinion, equally valuable because they provide a variety of opinions that, whether we agree with them or not, I'm sure we can appreciate, at least for their genuinity. On this note I'm going to send you by PM some outstanding experiences to read - I can't find the attach option here and I also want to leave you the choice of sharing them with others. They are concentrated on life rather than death despite everything, because they are based neither on doctors' predictions or a god's will, they simply concentrate on developing a strong faith in ourselves. I forwarded them to a family of (atheist) friends who found them very encouraging as one of their members was fighting against a rare syndrome. I leave you with a note about death to keep the balance. I hope you can keep sharing with us and everyone else your experience and I want to thank you for having started this thread.

In life, nothing is more certain than the fact that one will some day die. Everything else is indefinite and subject to change; death alone is a fact of eternal certainty.

And yet people try to turn away from this most certain of all things. While it may be true that, as the saying goes, 'you cannot gaze directly at the sun or at death', the lives of those who lack a sound understanding of life and death are like rootless grass. There is no question that without a perspective on death one cannot lead a stable and sure-footed life.

[kat]

Hi Nampeung:

How's the garden today? It is a bit overcast here, with a hint of brightness to come that make all the colorful leaves glow brighter against the contrast. Thinking about you.

[RueFang]

Hi Nampeung Thank you for sharing your life with us, you are an amazing, strong, beautiful woman! I wanted to share my thoughts on this topic. When I was 17 I was very depressed (what angsty teenage girl is not!!) and was close to ending my own life. One afternoon I unexplainably had an out of body experience which I can tell you instantly changed me from being suicidal to never having the thought enter my head since that moment in time. Why?? Because the second 'you' leave the body, you have absolute knowledge that your body is just the shell, the temporary housing of the 'real' you. Words obviously can't encapsulate the experience but my experience of looking down at my body from the ceiling (unfortunately I didn't fly off to far off lands!! ) I was just looking at myself from the roof!

I still remember with crystal clarity every moment of that experience because it changed my entire outlook on life. Firstly, there is absolutely no point in killing yourself (generally speaking), because it's just the shell that will die, you can not kill the true you. I obviously have no idea what happens after the body dies and where you go but I have absolute knowledge within myself that when the body dies, that is not the end of your true self. I never force my beliefs on others and I completely respect all others own views on what they believe will happen, but once you have experienced being separate (whilst fully awake!) from the body, there can be no other reality for you.

I also wanted to express my awe from reading Sheryl's post.. I watched my brother suffer through kidney cancer and passed away a few years ago, and your words were so profound and exceptionally well said. In the end the nurses in the hospice increased his morphine dosage which I believe helped him to let go of his body. Unlike you Nampeung, my brother did not accept that he was dying until about 3 days before he passed away which was such a tragedy as he had no peace and made his suffering so much worse. Your life experience, your beliefs and your mental preparation and acceptance will give you, your son and your family peace. Much love.

[quiksilva]

I just wanted to say what an incredibly touching thread, its been both an enlightenment and an inspiration.

I don't have any applicable experiences to share, only the wish that you can draw on the love of your family to find some joy and peace of mind during this time.

[donna]

reading this thread breaks my heart. knowing Nampeung personally and having shared a lot with her, it will be hard to imagine this planet without her here.

Sheryls post was one of the most compassionate and thoughtfully written posts i have seen ... ever ... on this forum.

Nampeung has put up with this disease for some years now, and I cannot say just how I would be handling the fact that my passing is just around the corner.

As I am not in her position, I can only say what I THINK I would do if I were in the same boat.

I would want my family around me, and I would want to laugh with them and share fun memories of years past.

I would want to enjoy my favourite foods as often as i can (i often say that if anyone finds me dead with an ice cream spoon in my mouth and melted chocolate dribbling down my chin, they can be happy in the knowledge that i was happy at that moment).

from what i have been told, the moment of 'passing' is very peaceful and not one to be feared (although, sitting here now, it scares the crap out of me, but if i were in Nampeungs position, the feeling will probably very well be different).

I am not sure where we go after we pass on, but I DO believe in 'ghosts' (for want of a much better word). I do believe that people who have passed can pop in every now and then, even though i have never experienced it for myself.

to Nampeung, i say that you are a strong woman and i know you will fight to the end. get rid of all the bad stuff and be happy. Tell Ziyo that you love him every day, as well as your other family members. pass on all the 'life' information you can to him, and be comforted in the knowledge that so many of us love you.

[Honolulu]

Hello Nampeung

I have been a TV reader for over a year, but have never posted once. This would be my first. I am not a lady, but a 50 year old American man and was so moved and inspired by this thread that I wanted to remind you of some important facts. First, I lost both of my parents to cancer, three years apart about three years ago. I lost my younger brother when I was a teenager.I was raised Christian but, for a long time, have been Athiest. I have given the subject of death a lot of thought over the years and I would like to offer what I have learned.

First, there is absolutely no evidence that any of us goes to a seperate or differant place than any of the rest of us. Meaning that we most likely all go to the same place, wherever that is. Which means that all of the people who have gone before you (your Parents and friends) are there, waiting for you now, and that, at some point, your children will come, as you wait for them there.

Second, apparently this place that we all go to, is so wonderful, that no one ever returns. It must truly be, a better place.

So where you are going, everyone also will come someday and you sound like a very good person that I will enjoy meeting there.

So when your time comes, just remain focused on the LOVE and everything will be fine. That is where I am going and I hope to see you there.

P.S. Sheryl, thank you for the best post I have ever read.

[WaatWang]

I'd like to hear what you think of the moment of death and perhaps where you think you'll go next...

Hi Nampeung,

Many people have talked about meeting loved ones on the other side. I have done animal rescue for a long time. I am hoping that when I die, one of my horses will be there to meet me as well, and we can ride off together. I'm sure that by now she knows all the best trails there, and she can give me a tour. Plus she always liked to go faster than I had the heart for, so when I die she can take me as fast as she wants and I won't have to worry so much about falling off.

I hope you are having a good day today.

[seedy]

Good evening. I am not a lady, but thought I would post anyway.

My father died the same year my son (now 23) was born. For years before he passed, I made excuses for not travelling to see him. But I was too busy.

The line from that old song says it all ...

'And all I do, is listen to, the things I didn't say'

Tell those you love how you feel.

And most important - be at peace with yourself. Take it one day at a time, and treat every day as a gift, which it is.

I wish you all the best.

Dale

[Boo]

posts have been deleted. the thread is to give your views on death/after life etc, whatever they may be & not to debate or pick apart others beliefs. If you don't believe there is an afterlife then express that but do not do so at the expense on someone else view that there is.

[submaniac]

posts have been deleted. the thread is to give your views on death/after life etc, whatever they may be & not to debate or pick apart others beliefs. If you don't believe there is an afterlife then express that but do not do so at the expense on someone else view that there is.

I find it disturbing that anyone would come on this thread to get into am argument. Nampeung deserves better than that!!!!

[Datsun240Z]

I feel with the OP. Hope you have a happy life further.

[Boo]

Sadly in the last couple of days Nampeung/Seonai has taken a turn for the worse. The prognosis is not good & she will probably pass in the next days. Please send your thoughts, prayers, wishes, good karma, whatever it is you beleive in to her & her family.

[rixalex]

Thinking of her and hoping she's comfortable, calm and at peace....