Latindancer Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 (edited) Please leave this topic in "General", rather than "Health", as it needs to be viewed by as many people as possible. I don't wish to be alarmist, but I have just been made aware of the fact that there is a serious public health threat in Thailand which some old-timers may be aware of, but many others will not. Do not eat eat raw or undercooked fish in Thailand, particularly in the North-East, as there is a serious issue with liver flukes there. If left untreated, you can develop cancer of the bile duct or liver, and even if you have been infected and treated, the risk of cancer is not lessened. And if it turns to cancer, the 5 year survival rate is 0% unless ALL tumors are cut out of bile duct and liver. The fluke is named Opisthorchis viverrini and is endemic in the North-East. In fact it is estimated that up to 50% of the population there is infected, as the people there eat raw/undercooked fish as part of their culture. As snails are also part of the life-cycle, do not eat uncooked water cress either. If you need further convincing, Google: Opisthorchis viverrini Thailand, or see http://www.stanford.edu/group/parasites/Pa...hiasis/home.htm http://www.dpd.cdc.gov/dpdx/HTML/opisthorchiasis.htm Edited June 24, 2009 by Latindancer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jellymeister Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 Please leave this topic in "General", rather than "Health", as it needs to be viewed by as many people as possible.I don't wish to be alarmist, but I have just been made aware of the fact that there is a serious public health threat in Thailand which some old-timers may be aware of, but many others will not. Do not eat eat raw or undercooked fish in Thailand, particularly in the North-East, as there is a serious issue with liver flukes there. If left untreated, you can develop cancer of the bile duct or liver, and even if you have been infected and treated, the risk of cancer is not lessened. And if it turns to cancer, the 5 year survival rate is 0% unless ALL tumors are cut out of bile duct and liver. The fluke is named Opisthorchis viverrini and is endemic in the North-East. In fact it is estimated that up to 50% of the population there is infected, as the people there eat raw/undercooked fish as part of their culture. As snails are also part of the life-cycle, do not eat uncooked water cress either. If you need further convincing, Google: Opisthorchis viverrini Thailand, or see http://www.stanford.edu/group/parasites/Pa...hiasis/home.htm http://www.dpd.cdc.gov/dpdx/HTML/opisthorchiasis.htm Always good to get helpful medical advice, but..........title of this thread should be changed to be more specific to the ailment noted, otherwise it might scare the millions of sushi lovers out there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnGotti Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 can u be more specific as to what should be avoided? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noahvail Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 Thanks for the information *and* the links - very informative. John, read the links - river fish, snails, and watercress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Osborne Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 As a big Sushi lover, my mrs is always on about this so she insists that we get frozen seafood as this kills the worms.... Actually have a big chunk of tuna that i bought in Foodland thawing out in the fridge... Having said that, I also ate raw oysters on 2 occasions yesterday around Pattaya. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanook2me Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 The title is a little misleading for me! So its safe to eat raw or undercooked fish in other countries except Thailand? I normally give seafood a miss anyway as i believe this is a very common way to catch food poisoning no matter what country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clausewitz Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 I eat at oishi and fuji every week - always sushi; not in the least bit worried about liver flukes. or h1n swine flu or whatever... Sometimes I think half the human race live in fear most of their lives? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orac Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 (edited) I hate to cast doubt on what could be a serious issue but, if the mortality rate is 100 % over 5 years as you state and 50% of the population in North-East are already infected coupled with one of the articles being from 1999-2000 then, unless there are a ridiculous number of operations being conducted up here then I would have thought it would be a lot quieter. Having said that I would appreciate a 'more reasonable' judgement from someone who is medically qualified as to the risks here. Edited June 24, 2009 by Orac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DP25 Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 Not about to stop eating sushi, or cut down on fish in general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackdanielsesq Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 I read that a similar parasite was prevalent in 50% of all rice paddy workers all over SE Asia - this particular one was the root cause of really bad health & edu issues, as it tapped energy resources immensely. It was spread primarily via human feces irrigating the paddies. Drink more very cold Chang BR>Jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timinchina Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 And also,never drink more than 2 litres of water from the Chao Praya river daily! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polecat Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 Don't eat Pop Rocks then drink Coke! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 I personally dont touch any fish out of the gulf if Thailand, due to the amount of mercury they contain, before someone starts accusing me of scaremongering, I have seen first hand the amount of mercury that comes out the ground in the Gulf of Thailand, and also proven that Hg levels in Thai nationals is quite high compared to expats living in Thailand due to the amount of fish eaten.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobsyouruncle Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 Generally river fish is not used to make sushi. Traditionally only seafoods like tuna, sea salmon, shrimp, crab, octopus etc are on the menu. What "river fish" could they use for sushi in Thailand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2oDunc Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 I personally dont touch any fish out of the gulf if Thailand, due to the amount of mercury they contain, before someone starts accusing me of scaremongering, I have seen first hand the amount of mercury that comes out the ground in the Gulf of Thailand, and also proven that Hg levels in Thai nationals is quite high compared to expats living in Thailand due to the amount of fish eaten.... Fish do not live in the ground they live in the sea and water. Maybe you can give us a link to this FACT ? Otherwise I'm sorry but you are scaremongering! As somebody who spends most days immersed in the Gulf I have to disagree! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FBN Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 I personally dont touch any fish out of the gulf if Thailand, due to the amount of mercury they contain, before someone starts accusing me of scaremongering, I have seen first hand the amount of mercury that comes out the ground in the Gulf of Thailand, and also proven that Hg levels in Thai nationals is quite high compared to expats living in Thailand due to the amount of fish eaten.... Fish do not live in the ground they live in the sea and water. Maybe you can give us a link to this FACT ? Otherwise I'm sorry but you are scaremongering! As somebody who spends most days immersed in the Gulf I have to disagree! Few remarks: This liver fluke is only carried by fresh water fish, not sea and is prevalent in SEA (also Vietnam etc) and it is a serious condition. Mercury accumulation is only relevant to (predatory) fish highest in the food chain; sharks, tuna, baracuda and even dolphin. Chula did several studies on mercury in fish around rigs in the Gulf of Thailand and did not find any local (reef) fish with elevated levels. Mercury surveillance studies on offshore workers in the Gulf of Thailand does not show that baseline mercury levels in Thai nationals are elevated irrespective of the amount of fish consumed or where they lived in Thailand. It is possible that overexposure of individuals can occur in oil and gas operations as mercury is a wellknown contaminant of crude from the whole of SEA; this is Occupational Exposure, not through diet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roamer Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 As a big Sushi lover, my mrs is always on about this so she insists that we get frozen seafood as this kills the worms....Actually have a big chunk of tuna that i bought in Foodland thawing out in the fridge... Having said that, I also ate raw oysters on 2 occasions yesterday around Pattaya. no need to freeze tuna only the farmed or river fish is subject to worm infestation. Freeze my salmon but eat my tuna as is, life without sashimi :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bina Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 part of the 'northeast-issaan- dont eat raw fish' campaign that was once around i.e. dont eat plaa raa (gouramis supposedly with 'flukes')... nothing new really... bina israel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mahtin Posted June 24, 2009 Share Posted June 24, 2009 I hope Yam Goong Dten are exempt. Otherwise I'm a goner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latindancer Posted June 25, 2009 Author Share Posted June 25, 2009 I hate to cast doubt on what could be a serious issue but, if the mortality rate is 100 % over 5 years as you state and 50% of the population in North-East are already infected coupled with one of the articles being from 1999-2000 then, unless there are a ridiculous number of operations being conducted up here then I would have thought it would be a lot quieter.Having said that I would appreciate a 'more reasonable' judgement from someone who is medically qualified as to the risks here. Orac, I didn't say this. I said that "even if you have been infected and treated, the risk of cancer is not lessened. And if it turns to cancer, the 5 year survival rate is 0% unless ALL tumors are cut out of bile duct and liver." I forget what percentage of those infected eventually get cancer. But with such a serious issue, I would think that caution would be appropriate. If you want the opinions of more qualified people, please google it and/or follow the links. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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