Entering Thailand Twice And Volunteering Once

[OzzieBruce]

Hello all.

My wife and I live in Australia and we are planing to come to Bk on the 20th October to visit friends and leave on the 30th Oct to go the Cambodia so we can enjoy the turning of the river festival.

We then would like to return to Thailand and volunteer at a school in the Issan for about 30 days, we are doing this through www.volunthai.com. My problem is?

If I obtain a 60day visa before we leave Australia then it will expire on the 30th Oct when we leave Thailand and we would then need to apply again.

Is it possible to fly in to Thailand on our New Zealand passports and use the free 30 day tourist visa for the 10 days and then fly out on NZ passport and when we return to Thailand from Cambodia we use our Australian passports which we would have the 60day visa put in to? (is this legal?)

Can we volunteer teach in a tourist visa or do we need to apply for a Non-Immigrate O for 90 days for the teaching side of things, although this would require a letter from the school of which we do not know which one yet?

We could apply for a double entry 90day non-immigrate O visa and use the first entry as out short stay and the other upon our return, I think these cost around Aus$180.00 each so it is becoming rather expensive to volunteer just for one month.

I am not sure which way to head on this and that is why I am requesting your help. My wife and I are trying to help some Thai people learn a little more English but I don't want to breaking any Thai laws and end up teaching the in the Bangkok Hilton

Thank you for any help in advance

OzzieBruce

[Lite Beer]

To do any teaching you will need a Work Permit as far as I know. I see no mention of one on their website.

[Mario2008]

You will need a non-immigrant visa to volunteer. Why not apply for a multiple non-O at Perth.

[Lite Beer]

The website says that only a Tourist Visa is needed. I am sure that is wrong.

Do they not need a Work Permit Mario?

[lopburi3]

Volunteers should apply for a 60-day tourist visa in their own country.

That quote from there web site says it all - you will be working without a work permit.

[lopburi3]

The cost of a one-month homestay, including all food and accommodation, is $275 (add $100 for each additional month). Your donation goes directly to the administration of our project. All meals and accommodation while at your homestay are covered by your host school.

So you pay the advertiser $275 for this - the poor upcountry school has to pay for your food and lodging.

[OzzieBruce]

You will need a non-immigrant visa to volunteer. Why not apply for a multiple non-O at Perth.

that is a good Idea and I think my best option, however I live near Brisbane so I guess I apply there

Thanks

[Lite Beer]

Even with that you will still be working illegally.

[jerrylee]

The cost of a one-month homestay, including all food and accommodation, is $275 (add $100 for each additional month). Your donation goes directly to the administration of our project. All meals and accommodation while at your homestay are covered by your host school.

So you pay the advertiser $275 for this - the poor upcountry school has to pay for your food and lodging.

As of this month, all primary education in Thailand is FREE!, correct?

[Lite Beer]

The definition of work from the Dept. of Employment. http://www.doe.go.th/service3_en.aspx

1. Definition

“Alien” means a natural person who is not of Thai nationality; “ Work ” means to engage in work by exerting energy or using knowledge whether or not in consideration of wages or other benefits.

[jazzbo]

from the Volunthai(dot)com website (FAQ):

What about my visa?

Volunteers should apply for a 60-day tourist visa in their own country. If you wish to volunteer for longer than that, our friends at the Ministry of Education can help arrange a long term visa for you.

The cost of a one-month homestay, including all food and accommodation, is $275 (add $100 for each additional month).

Your donation goes directly to the administration of our project.

All meals and accommodation while at your homestay are covered by your host school.

ALSO

Any person or group who wishes to donate school supplies or cash scholarships to our target schools is welcome to contact us at: info(at)volunthai.com. Past volunteers have raised money for cash scholarships, new uniforms, and even computers for their host schools. It is easy to work with your host teacher to determine which students are most deserving of support.

Volunteers who have been accepted may pay by (PAYPAL)

Sounds like a wonderful operation for an NGO -- except nowhere on their website do they say that they are an NGO.

[stao]

Greetings To Australia,

You are getting good advice. Under NO circumstance come to Thailand and do "work" without a work Permit.

If you get busted you will be spending some time in the "monkey house" up country and then probably be fined and be "blacklisted" so...

I would question this "volunteer" organization why they are placing well meaning people in illegal circumstances.

[welo]

Guys,

from what I see you might be to harsh with the Volunthai project.

1. The prohibition of any kind of volunteer work for foreigners without work permit under Thai law poses a known problem to short-time volunteering.

2. The organization seems to be self funding, so obviously has to cover their expenses. Even as a non-profit organisation it is necessary and legitimate to pay a salery to an employee who coordinates the project.

Wheras I understand and encourage critisism of projects like this, I have the feeling that some of the arguments here are one-sided.

I therefore just wrote an email to the project to encourage them to respond on that thread. I am curious to hear whether they want to engage in a discussion. Maybe they could even take some advise out of it on how to handle the work permit issue.

welo

[OzzieBruce]

Thanks for your help guys

So far I have had an excellent experience with Volunthai, they had always replied to emails and kept me up to date with information about the people I will meet and where I will need to go Etc.

I also believe that they are trying there best to help the Thai people and the price they charge for their service is minimal if you compare it to other volunteering sites so I do not feel they are just there to grab money for volunteers.

My wife and I are both happy to apply for whatever visa and work permit required as we understand the need to control the type of people that enter Thailand and are trusted with their children. We both have held "Blue Cards" for many years, which is a annual police clearance check to allow you to work with children.

From what I have read so far, my understanding is that my wife and I would need to apply for a Non-Immigrate O Visa $180 for double entries and $225 for multiple entries, then is the work permit arranged after we arrive in Thailand but before we start to teach?

Regards

OzzieBruce

[jazzbo]

Guys, from what I see you might be to harsh with the Volunthai project. Fair enough. Personally, I only quoted from their own website. The 2 things that struck me is when 1) they say they say they have 'friends' at the Ministry of Education and 2) their prevalent use of the word 'donation' which indicates to me that this is an NGO when nowhere it says that it is. There is no such thing as a 'donation' to a for-profit enterprise.

And just to show I have a bit of 'been there done that' I will post a personal document from my work with a Thai NGO under Royal Patronage. The letter was written when I requested that they sponsor me for a Visa and Work Permit which would require their submitting substantial financial documents.... any inferences on that will be yours.

CFBT.pdf

[jazzbo]

BTW I am a United States Library of Congress Certified Braille Transcriber -- the only such person in Thailand.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

Do you have Australian national police clearances Ozzie or a Bluecard ? That is a requirement for any teacher of kids in Thailand. Working while being legally a tourist can bring jail time and deportation. Friends in the Ministry will not help you one iota.

[Lite Beer]

As said above it is illegal. If you are willing to take the risk it is up to you.

As for the Visa a Non Imm O Visa will give 90 days. If you wish to leave the country within those 90 days you will need a Re Entry Permit from Immigration . This would keep your permission to stay date alive. Cost 1,000 Baht.

[OzzieBruce]

As said above it is illegal. If you are willing to take the risk it is up to you.

As for the Visa a Non Imm O Visa will give 90 days. If you wish to leave the country within those 90 days you will need a Re Entry Permit from Immigration . This would keep your permission to stay date alive. Cost 1,000 Baht.

no risk because I will not be going until I am very clear that I am not breaking any laws.

If I buy the double entry visa then I do not need obtain the re entry visa, is that correct

? as I can enter the kingdom twice and not stay longer then 90 days each time

Am I correct in that understanding of it.

Cheers

[OzzieBruce]

Do you have Australian national police clearances Ozzie or a Bluecard ? That is a requirement for any teacher of kids in Thailand. Working while being legally a tourist can bring jail time and deportation. Friends in the Ministry will not help you one iota.

Yes Dr Pat, as I mentioned a few posts up that we have the Blue Card. I have a higher security clearance because I currently work in the security industry.

Cheers

[Lite Beer]

A Double Entry Non O Visa is a strange animal in that it only seems to be issued in certain Australian Consulates.

Usually it is Single or Multi entry. If you can get a double , yes that will do the job reguarding you wanting to leave and come back.

[OzzieBruce]

Thanks guys for all this great information, So now I am looking at a NON-IMMIGRANT VISA-$90 for 90days and while in Bkk I will apply for an Re entry visa Cost 1,000 Baht (A$35.00) as my time in Thailand including my visit to Cambodia would be under 90days.

Now I just need Volunthai to arrange a letter from the school for me to pass on to the Embassy, when try to work out the W/P stuff.

I never thought that volunteering for one month in the Issan could be so complicated, but from what I read on this forum it is no surprise.

I think I would only do this once and next time look at volunteering in Cambodia

When I first arrive in bkk on a Non-Immigrant visa am I meant to be working for the school then as we plan to visit some friends then leave and then return 3 weeks later to do the volunteer work? So I guess the school would be writing in their letter that they expect me to start on a particular date and gaining the visa for one month before that is not going to happen.

I am still better to arrive in BKK on the 30 day tourist visa, visit my friends for 10 days, then leave for Cambodia, while in Cambodia can we then apply for the NON-IMMIGRANT VISA-$90 for 90days, do our month of volunteering when just leave.

Just trying to keep it all legal

Thanks for all your help

Ozzie Bruce

[OzzieBruce]

Just in closing, can anybody tell me how long it can take to get a work permit if we arrive in Bangkok on the Non- Immigrant O - roughly how long would it be before we could start volunteering?

Thank You

OzzieBruce

[Mario2008]

Just in closing, can anybody tell me how long it can take to get a work permit if we arrive in Bangkok on the Non- Immigrant O - roughly how long would it be before we could start volunteering?

Thank You

OzzieBruce

The WP is applied at the local labour office where you are going to work.

make sure the organisation will help you with the WP first. The process is fairly simple, but I would advise you to bring your degree along, and only takes 1 or 2 days. The big question will be if the school and the organisation will help you, as it will mean they will have to do it for all volunteers. They may not like that.

[Lite Beer]

A Re Entry Permit does not add days to your stay. The permission to stay would still be valid for a total of 90 days from your first entry whether you were in Thailand or not.

You may have a problem if you decide to come without a Visa and get a 30 day stamp. The airline can refuse you entry to the flight if you do not have an air ticket leaving Thailand within those 30 days.

This is because if you were refused entry the airline would be fined and also be responsible for taking you back.

I bet you wish you never started this

[OzzieBruce]

A Re Entry Permit does not add days to your stay. The permission to stay would still be valid for a total of 90 days from your first entry whether you were in Thailand or not.

You may have a problem if you decide to come without a Visa and get a 30 day stamp. The airline can refuse you entry to the flight if you do not have an air ticket leaving Thailand within those 30 days.

This is because if you were refused entry the airline would be fined and also be responsible for taking you back.

I bet you wish you never started this

It is getting that way, I do have a flight booked out of Bkk for the first visit, but yes you are right, I am wondering if I really would like to freely give of myself and be meet with so many walls. I am waiting for a reply to my email to Volunthia to see what assistance they offer.

I will post the result here.

Cheers

[thaiphoon]

I bet you wish you never started this

LB: Ah, the British sense of humour shining through . I actually feel sorry for this guy. He wants to come here to help Thai kids as part of his vacation and meets a mountain of visa and work permit issues that he had not expected and which we know about, but unfortunately the school involved seems somewhat uninformed on these matters to the extent that potentially its volunteers could end up in clink.

[StatlerandWaldorf]

The definition of work from the Dept. of Employment. http://www.doe.go.th/service3_en.aspx

1. Definition

"Alien" means a natural person who is not of Thai nationality; " Work " means to engage in work by exerting energy or using knowledge whether or not in consideration of wages or other benefits.

If that is the definition of work then I can conclude that any local guy who has ever done any 'work' for me has technically not been working as they certainly have not exerted any energy . Does smoking cigarettes and throwing the butts in my garden then falling asleep in my sala count as work?

[thaiphoon]

Does smoking cigarettes and throwing the butts in my garden then falling asleep in my sala count as work?

Oh for sure ... its called working on the sleep

[Lite Beer]

. I actually feel sorry for this guy. He wants to come here to help Thai kids as part of his vacation and meets a mountain of visa and work permit issues that he had not expected and which we know about, but unfortunately the school involved seems somewhat uninformed on these matters to the extent that potentially its volunteers could end up in clink.

Yes. So do I. Full marks to him for sticking with us . I think that I would have told Me to get lost long ago.

Good luck to him and his Wife.