Is There Really A "mafia" On Samui?

[thairaid]

When the Samui cops find out the Bkk cops are coming down to bust the DVD shops, they call all the shops to warn them, then collect 10k from every one. Have also been told by a shop owner she pays a monthly fee to the cops here. Sounds pretty organised to me

Organized? That's simple graft. Look it up. This has nothing to do with organized crime mobs.

geekfreaklover:

I knew at least three people killed by the big boys.

"The big boys"? You suppose they are somehow connected when actually they are just cliques. And the killing surrounding the real estate agent or whatever; what makes you think MR BIG ordered a hit? You might as well spend your time looking for that missing Japanese WWII gold in the Philippines. Someone has a grudge and you make it out to be some conspiracy.

you do not know what you are talking about mark, appreciate your skepticism, but you have no clue here.

[sbk]

you do not know what you are talking about mark, appreciate your skepticism, but you have no clue here.

I am curious as to what makes you so well-informed. You state in previous posts that you have lived in Samui 5 years and yet you seem to be quite an expert on the place. No need to go into personal details but it does make one wonder as to why you are such an authority.

[Mark Wolfe]

thairaid:

mark, have you been to anywhere else in Thailand? if so, have you noticed how many very nice new cars there are here compared to the rest of te country? think mark, a bit, please...

We are not talking about anywhere else in Thailand. However, I seem to recall spotting a few "very nice new cars" in Bangkok. You are suggesting that the prevalence of new cars in an area is an indication of mob influence. That's certainly an interesting piece of inductive reasoning...

I think there is some confusion on your part and others regarding the difference between an organized crime syndicate and a gang (and not a street gang such as in the US).

Instead of applying ad hominem arguments, please address my previous questions. What is controlled, islandwide, by this/these syndicates and how much income is generated? You might also explain the hierarchy and how the chain of command works.

[Northbank]

For those who think there is an organized mob here, let me ask:

1. What things are controlled by the mob? Drugs? Gambling? Taxi fares? Construction contracts? Vegetable prices?

1A. Of those things controlled by the mob, how much income are we talking about?

(1. I can't see much on Samui that would be of interest to an organized mob, given that 1A, even if there were payoffs and shakedowns, the amount would not be worth the effort.)

I believe that there are "gangs" in the sense of small groups of local (men) who fancy themselves "players"; maybe they own a club or two, or come from a wealthy Samui family (sold land/have lots of coconut palms, whatever makes one wealthy here). They are self-styled tough guys who hobknob and like to be flashy. I hardly believe they are running any covert, illegal operation beyond petty theft, and certainly there aren't any gangland bosses who decide who sells tom yom or how much the laundry cost should be per kilo or who decides that so-and-so needs to eat a bullet.

There is no doubt that the term is highly over used by thais, an unassuming drunken english guy was once pointed out to me in green mango by a young thai lady and referred to as ''he mafia'' i looked at him and laughed and asked what makes you think he's mafia, she said she was out with him one night and he hit some guy over the head with a chair, i laughed again and said he's not mafia he's an idiot, of course it turned out his name was Nigel and he worked in a factory in Leeds and without a bottle of Sang Som in him he wouldn't say boo to a goose, but to her he was mafia.

Saying that there are undoubtedly wealthy groups/people on the island that are running illegal operations far beyond petty theft and they do own businesses on the island and they do have influence over the police, they do threaten people and they do hurt people to protect their interests or for gain.

If that fits in with your criteria for 'Mafia' then yes there is mafia on the island it may not resemble the Gambino family, but it's relative to where you are.

[Samuian]

you do not know what you are talking about mark, appreciate your skepticism, but you have no clue here.

I am curious as to what makes you so well-informed. You state in previous posts that you have lived in Samui 5 years and yet you seem to be quite an expert on the place. No need to go into personal details but it does make one wonder as to why you are such an authority.

Ditto!

is the last to be said.... how come you are so sure, because your husband said so?

Sorry, not meant to offend but, the money here on the island,

remember the man who was hung into the large tamarind tree at laemdin market

a few years ago?

Remember the "mysterious"" shootings around green mango and, and, and..

ever heard anyone got caught?

where do all the drugs come from which are peddled, sold and used on KPG and Samui?

Well, vegetables, if a certain... plant is considered "vegetable" and a certain ingredient in omletts -

I know, I know it used to be very ïnncent"stuff, but as of today it's not anymore....it's

way beyond... the stuff which is around nowadays... is big, big, big money and business..

Ever tried to open a speedboat service?

Well I could go on... I understand Samui and KPG are clean as a baby's bum and

everything going on is all born from the wild imaginations of heatstruck farangs...

sure...it's not chicago style mobsters, it's different as many thing are different.... ah'well....

Edited August 14, 2009 by Samuian

[sbk]

Funny Samuian, I don't have any idea what you are accusing me of saying since my very first post in the thread was asking what his qualifications were for expertise on Samui. Suggest you re-read the entire thread and figure out who you are attacking first

[limbos]

For those who think there is an organized mob here, let me ask:

1. What things are controlled by the mob? Drugs? Gambling? Taxi fares? Construction contracts? Vegetable prices?

1A. Of those things controlled by the mob, how much income are we talking about?

(1. I can't see much on Samui that would be of interest to an organized mob, given that 1A, even if there were payoffs and shakedowns, the amount would not be worth the effort.)

I believe that there are "gangs" in the sense of small groups of local (men) who fancy themselves "players"; maybe they own a club or two, or come from a wealthy Samui family (sold land/have lots of coconut palms, whatever makes one wealthy here). They are self-styled tough guys who hobknob and like to be flashy. I hardly believe they are running any covert, illegal operation beyond petty theft, and certainly there aren't any gangland bosses who decide who sells tom yom or how much the laundry cost should be per kilo or who decides that so-and-so needs to eat a bullet.

mark, have you been to anywhere else in Thailand? if so, have you noticed how many very nice new cars there are here compared to the rest of te country? think mark, a bit, please...

The amount of Ferrari's, Lamborghini's and top of the range Mercs, Jaguars, Beemers and the occasional Rolls between Thong Lor and Suk 49 is what I call stunning. I wouldn't think each of these car owners to be a Maffia member though.

[Crow Boy]

This is a general warning

We all know the rules of this forum having carefully read and accepted them when we joined up. One of those rules can best be summed up as "play nicely" In simple terms that means no personal attacks on others will be tolerated.

crowboy'

Moderating Team

Thai Visa

[PatinBKk]

A lot of people come to Thailand and get carried away, make up stories about their previous lives etc.....everyone seems to have a Thai 'friend' who is either a 'policeman' or someone in the 'Mafia'.....it makes for an exciting life, makes people feel important and gives them adrenalin when they talk about it.......of course there is low level corruption, that is widespead throughout Thailand and is just part of life here....as far as real organised crime on Samui, forget it. The border areas North and South have organised crime profiteering from drugs, petrolium and human trafficking but Samui, a few jetski guys with a bag of weed hardly amounts to organised crime.....

[thairaid]

Funny Samuian, I don't have any idea what you are accusing me of saying since my very first post in the thread was asking what his qualifications were for expertise on Samui. Suggest you re-read the entire thread and figure out who you are attacking first

Indeed Samuian...and I think you are taking things too personally SBK

[carmine]

Ofcourse there is an element of organised crime, it's just on a small low level that befits a small island.

Northbank was correct in the way the Thais often use the term 'mafia'. They also use the term 'boxing' to discribe two people having an arguement....another example of a term used in translation but not to be taken literally.

I'm sure their are elements that control certain businesses and will not let others compete, using a 'mob style' mentality, but does'nt this happen everywhere on different levels? How much does it relly affect any of us?

I'm not saying i agree with any criminal activities, i don't, but just like in my home country, criminal activity exists, but does'nt involve me or the way i live my life

[thairaid]

A lot of people come to Thailand and get carried away, make up stories about their previous lives etc.....everyone seems to have a Thai 'friend' who is either a 'policeman' or someone in the 'Mafia'.....it makes for an exciting life, makes people feel important and gives them adrenalin when they talk about it.......of course there is low level corruption, that is widespead throughout Thailand and is just part of life here....as far as real organised crime on Samui, forget it. The border areas North and South have organised crime profiteering from drugs, petrolium and human trafficking but Samui, a few jetski guys with a bag of weed hardly amounts to organised crime.....

or sell timeshare ...all gangsters...

[thairaid]

Ofcourse there is an element of organised crime, it's just on a small low level that befits a small island.

Northbank was correct in the way the Thais often use the term 'mafia'. They also use the term 'boxing' to discribe two people having an arguement....another example of a term used in translation but not to be taken literally.

I'm sure their are elements that control certain businesses and will not let others compete, using a 'mob style' mentality, but does'nt this happen everywhere on different levels? How much does it relly affect any of us?

I'm not saying i agree with any criminal activities, i don't, but just like in my home country, criminal activity exists, but does'nt involve me or the way i live my life

wow, that is horribly ignorant and selfish...but more ignorant (it DOES affect you! more than you apparently know)

[carmine]

Ofcourse there is an element of organised crime, it's just on a small low level that befits a small island.

Northbank was correct in the way the Thais often use the term 'mafia'. They also use the term 'boxing' to discribe two people having an arguement....another example of a term used in translation but not to be taken literally.

I'm sure their are elements that control certain businesses and will not let others compete, using a 'mob style' mentality, but does'nt this happen everywhere on different levels? How much does it relly affect any of us?

I'm not saying i agree with any criminal activities, i don't, but just like in my home country, criminal activity exists, but does'nt involve me or the way i live my life

wow, that is horribly ignorant and selfish...but more ignorant (it DOES affect you! more than you apparently know)

Perhaps you might explain why?

[BigC]

I lived on the island for two years at the turn of the century. I knew at least three people killed by the big boys. I wrote a book about it. Nobody read it. Bless them.

Best not to talk or type about it. Samui in my opnion is not thailand. It is it's own country with it's own set of rules.

ya, I too know of and knew three people here that were done away with by the locals. And who does not know about a certain estate agent/developer/german/optician's wife who was gunned down two years ago in the middle of the day at the said individual's office in front of everyone?...probably by the same said individual and who also had gunned downed (though lived and still here under the patronage of the shooting range owner....mafi.....) his former estate agency partner.... ...ya, no mafia here but the timeshare salesscum

mafia. anything envloving money shootings crime basically gangs i think is mafia. then again every country different in the world. example. in england u shoot a burgler you go to jail. some states in america u get a medal for shooting a burgler in your next door neibours house.

so in thailand if u have the legal papers and u are defending your plot of land and u fire a warning shot. then i would not call that mafia. i don't really know what i am going on about. a bit of a stupid thread. yes there is mafia in samui bangkok thailand england america italy. in fact the round it up to the whole world.

[smokie36]

Ofcourse there is an element of organised crime, it's just on a small low level that befits a small island.

Northbank was correct in the way the Thais often use the term 'mafia'. They also use the term 'boxing' to discribe two people having an arguement....another example of a term used in translation but not to be taken literally.

I'm sure their are elements that control certain businesses and will not let others compete, using a 'mob style' mentality, but does'nt this happen everywhere on different levels? How much does it relly affect any of us?

I'm not saying i agree with any criminal activities, i don't, but just like in my home country, criminal activity exists, but does'nt involve me or the way i live my life

wow, that is horribly ignorant and selfish...but more ignorant (it DOES affect you! more than you apparently know)

Aside from disproportionate prices on flights and exorbitant taxi fares, and the aforementioned jetskis I don't see how this so called mafia affects ordinary people at all.

Don't see bar owners paying protection money etc..

Enlighten us please?

[Geekfreaklover]

I was sent this report a couple of years ago. Makes for interesting reading.

http://www.tinyurl.com/349wvb

The nutter that filed this report obviously thinks there's a mafia problem

Edited August 15, 2009 by Geekfreaklover

[smokie36]

I was sent this report a couple of years ago. Makes for interesting reading.

http://www.tinyurl.com/349wvb

The nutter that filed this report obviously thinks there's a mafia problem

Champagne and caviar on samui? Where do I join up?

[carmine]

I was sent this report a couple of years ago. Makes for interesting reading.

http://www.tinyurl.com/349wvb

The nutter that filed this report obviously thinks there's a mafia problem

Enough said!!!

[Geekfreaklover]

For those who think there is an organized mob here, let me ask:

1. What things are controlled by the mob? Drugs? Gambling? Taxi fares? Construction contracts? Vegetable prices?

1A. Of those things controlled by the mob, how much income are we talking about?

(1. I can't see much on Samui that would be of interest to an organized mob, given that 1A, even if there were payoffs and shakedowns, the amount would not be worth the effort.)

I believe that there are "gangs" in the sense of small groups of local (men) who fancy themselves "players"; maybe they own a club or two, or come from a wealthy Samui family (sold land/have lots of coconut palms, whatever makes one wealthy here). They are self-styled tough guys who hobknob and like to be flashy. I hardly believe they are running any covert, illegal operation beyond petty theft, and certainly there aren't any gangland bosses who decide who sells tom yom or how much the laundry cost should be per kilo or who decides that so-and-so needs to eat a bullet.

There is no doubt that the term is highly over used by thais, an unassuming drunken english guy was once pointed out to me in green mango by a young thai lady and referred to as ''he mafia'' i looked at him and laughed and asked what makes you think he's mafia, she said she was out with him one night and he hit some guy over the head with a chair, i laughed again and said he's not mafia he's an idiot, of course it turned out his name was Nigel and he worked in a factory in Leeds and without a bottle of Sang Som in him he wouldn't say boo to a goose, but to her he was mafia.

Saying that there are undoubtedly wealthy groups/people on the island that are running illegal operations far beyond petty theft and they do own businesses on the island and they do have influence over the police, they do threaten people and they do hurt people to protect their interests or for gain.

If that fits in with your criteria for 'Mafia' then yes there is mafia on the island it may not resemble the Gambino family, but it's relative to where you are.

You sure she wasn't trying to say "he my friend"

[Mark Wolfe]

Submitting a document to the authorities subtitled: Cigars, Caviar, Champagne, Cocaine & cun_t sort of shoots the whole thing in the foot.

However....

Bandidos members arrested for Samui land deals

Three members of the Bandidos, an international motorcycle gang, were arrested yesterday on charges relating to illegal land sales on Koh Samui, police said.

A team of 100 officers raided 10 locations on the resort island early in the morning, arresting two alleged gang members and a Thai official suspected of being an accomplice in the illegal land sales. A third foreign national sought by police later turned himself in.

...DSI spokesman Colonel Piyawat Kingket said the Bandidos gang brought more than Bt3 billion into Thailand and laundered it in Koh Samui through several tourist businesses.

DSI chief General Sombat Amornviwat said his department had received a complaint from British national Neil [only name given in the article] that the gang had threatened to kill him until he turned over his business last December. (Pattaya Daily News says: The remaining forces were sent to search various business places that were run by their gang, including the "Ussy Pub" which was run by the Gang Leader. He had obtained this pub from Mr. Niel Pattrick William, a British national after the gang had blackmailed it from him.)

During a six-month investigation, police found that the foreign suspects were members of the Bandidos gang and had a network that extended to Bangkok, Pattaya and Phuket. They trafficked drugs in Thailand and laundered money here, Sombat said. They also engaged in illegal land deals in which they bribed land officials and used forged Sor Khor 1 documents to claim ownership of land they later sold to other foreign nationals.

-- The Nation (July 19, 2006)

There is a "Samui Comedy Festival"? Is that a joke?

[churchill]

Before you post photos of accused people perhaps you should update yourself as to the result of the court case and if they were guilty or NOT .

[Mark Wolfe]

Why? I didn't say anything about guilt or innocence. Perhaps you might contact The Nation and the Pattaya Daily News and tell them to delete their news stories for the past. Or maybe ask Google, Yahoo and all the rest of the search engines to block that URL. I don't understand your point; however, if you wish to update, please do.

[churchill]

Police corruption - http://kohphangannews.org/modules.php?op=m...r=0&thold=0

[thairaid]

Before you post photos of accused people perhaps you should update yourself as to the result of the court case and if they were guilty or NOT .

emm...perhaps you should...they were NOT found NOT guilty...just released...that is NOT the same as being found not guilty, in fact BIG difference, particularly here.

[churchill]

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Crispin-Free...&hl=crispin

[thairaid]

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Crispin-Free...&hl=crispin

ya so? that does NOT= "innocent"...just like I said, so please explain your point. He was released, nothing more, nothing less, there was no finding by anyone that he was not guilty. He may have been and he many not have been.

[Mark Wolfe]

Alleged corruption by a single biased individual.

This has little if anything to do with the subject of organized crime on Samui (if it exists at all).

[churchill]

I would say there is no more a Mafia in Samui than in the rest of Thailand - but There are several powerful families that can get things done and undone !

[norwayeagle]

Let me say "it" like this when it comes 2 OPs question .Mafia (cosa nostra italia) is everywhere but bcus so many have been taken and the pressure on them is BIG.it is almost impossible 2 get them these days.there r chains as loong as never been b4.They just have to do it like that.Not so much money bcuse every1 in the "chaingang" get a fee.Cosa nostra still make money,and have small "faraway part" in allmost everything that's giving Money (illegally) .People in this kind of business mostly!!, dont know who is the number 1 chain in their "business".This sounds reasonable,Doesn't it?N dont ask me how i know.