Tefl Masters In Chiang Mai

[kitjohnson]

Hi,

I'm an English teacher here at a university in Bangkok, and am looking to further my qualifications. I want to move to Chiang Mai. There are two options for study there: the international TEFL Masters run by Payap University, or the TEFL Masters run by CMU (taught in Thai). There is a massive difference in cost, and I don't like Payap's no students-riding-motorbike regulations ( I own two). The other difference is that studying in Thai would seriously improve my own Thai langauge skills, so I'm tempted to go for CMU.

If anyone has any experience with either of these courses, or of studying a degree program taught in Thai at CMU, I'd be super-grateful for reviews.

Oldmankit

[Scott]

Wouldn't it be hard to take a test in Thai?

[PeaceBlondie]

Wouldn't it be hard to take a test in Thai?

Especially if Thai students don't understand the test

[kitjohnson]

Wouldn't it be hard to take a test in Thai?

Good question. There's a central government exam for all undergraduate courses, but this is postgraduate, so it's really up to the faculty what test (if any) they impose. There is a 20,000 Baht 'foreigner fee' per semester, which I'm sure will encourage them to be lenient, i.e. let me use a dictionary. However I think if there was a difficult exam I'd probably fail.

I know of a Chinese guy who's studying a masters in linguistics at Chula and his Thai isn't too good. In conversation he always reverts to English, but all of the text books/written work is in English anyway, so it's actually easier than you'd think.

[BlackArtemis]

My wife, Thai national, had a lot of issues with payap.

She completed her course work in 2 years with a 3.4+ GPA and then had trouble with advisors.

One advisor jerked her around for almost 3 years while she was trying to write her thesis. This woman also lost her grant request, not once but twice. My wife had a chance at a $10,000 USD grant for her research, but "Oops" the prof "forgot" to submit it.

Daunted she took 1.5 years off before returning and was given an advisor, a wonderful guy from England. He worked with her and she completed her thesis. She was going to defend it, however she had a misscarriage and decided to defend it the following fall.

She was denied, she had to go around the whole school and gather over 6 signatures, ones from administrators not even connected to the international side of the University. Everyone said yes, but the president.

Funny thing is that there are so few people graduating from the international master's departments it would have only made the university looked better number wise.

Her mother and sister both work at the University and even the president's wife talked to him about this matter.

All in all I told her to drop it, and don't fret. Now we are int he US and she is preparing to get her MA here instead. Just to see, we asked about transfer credits. The school said we could use a third party service to evaluate her classes, but highly doubted it because in the eyes of an American University a degree from Thailand is not held in high regard.

Had we stayed in CM or Thailand, she would have transferred into CMU. But now she has a chance to get a better degree. She is only upset at the wasted time and money.

Take this as you will, but I know this is not a one time case. If you never plan on using a degree outside of Thailand, perhaps moving to BKK for a few years might be worth it. Or maybe you will have a lot more luck than my wife did at Payap. I know a few farang who studied there and made it out relatively unscathed.

[kitjohnson]

Good to hear about some peoples' experiences at Payap. I have a friend who was also dissapointed, but from an academic quality point of view.

My decision in the end is to study an online masters from one of the many respected English institutions offering them. This was I get to enjoy life in Chiang Mai whilst studying, yet also get a certificiate that will be respected throughout the world. The best of both worlds!

[jasreeve17]

Hello, I looked into MA courses in Thailand and decided it was fairly pointless (even though I'm close to the Thammasart and Chula courses which are both very good; by local standards).

Instead I'm studying a distance learning MA in England. Nottingham, Leicester and Birmingham Unis all offer good courses which have to be a better long term option than local courses. - ah, just seen your post above: great minds think alike...

Edited September 10, 2009 by jasreeve17

[femi fan]

Hello, I looked into MA courses in Thailand and decided it was fairly pointless (even though I'm close to the Thammasart and Chula courses which are both very good; by local standards).

Instead I'm studying a distance learning MA in England. Nottingham, Leicester and Birmingham Unis all offer good courses which have to be a better long term option than local courses. - ah, just seen your post above: great minds think alike...

It might be useful to remember that people doing masters' courses pick up various skills while doing so. One of them is the ability to be objective with one's observations, choices, research, debating, and writing.

With that in mind, perhaps you could give your reasons for why you think distance learning courses 'have to be' better than local ones. And what do you mean by local? And how do you know those three univerisities offer 'good' courses? And on what criteria did you decide a course in thailand would be 'fairly pointless'?

I'm not being facetious asking these questions because if you write like this on your course you're going to have a lot of problems!

Several people i know of who have done distance MA courses in TESOL (or related degrees) or who know people who have done such courses feel they lost out to a degree from total lack of classroom interaction and contact. Whle distance courses do have benefits, it's useful for anybody considering them to look at the possible disadvantages too. Often the distance courses are logistically and financially better, but it's inherently difficult for them to match a classroom-based degree in terms of content and effective learning.

[jasreeve17]

Hello, I looked into MA courses in Thailand and decided it was fairly pointless (even though I'm close to the Thammasart and Chula courses which are both very good; by local standards).

Instead I'm studying a distance learning MA in England. Nottingham, Leicester and Birmingham Unis all offer good courses which have to be a better long term option than local courses. - ah, just seen your post above: great minds think alike...

It might be useful to remember that people doing masters' courses pick up various skills while doing so. One of them is the ability to be objective with one's observations, choices, research, debating, and writing.

With that in mind, perhaps you could give your reasons for why you think distance learning courses 'have to be' better than local ones. And what do you mean by local? And how do you know those three univerisities offer 'good' courses? And on what criteria did you decide a course in thailand would be 'fairly pointless'?

I'm not being facetious asking these questions because if you write like this on your course you're going to have a lot of problems!

Several people i know of who have done distance MA courses in TESOL (or related degrees) or who know people who have done such courses feel they lost out to a degree from total lack of classroom interaction and contact. Whle distance courses do have benefits, it's useful for anybody considering them to look at the possible disadvantages too. Often the distance courses are logistically and financially better, but it's inherently difficult for them to match a classroom-based degree in terms of content and effective learning.

Yes you are; facetious and rude.

The answers are obvious:

UK MA courses are accepted worldwide - Thai courses are not. In fact, UK courses are more widely accepted in Thai unis than local courses are, as I found out when I discussed my options with several head of departments.

Researching the staff who teach the courses and the world ranking of these unis tells you alot too...

The entrace criterea is much higher in the UK courses, thus the material covered is at a higher and more interesting level. I could go on for a long time with more reasons...

Don't bother answering if you're just going to be rude.

[kitjohnson]

I'm not being facetious asking these questions because if you write like this on your course you're going to have a lot of problems!

I think you are judging his post too severely: he is not writing his thesis, just expressing his opinions on a forum. We all learn on our TEFL (or whatever) courses that it is crucial to be clear about who the target audience is when teaching or evaluating writing.

It is not good to write-off an institution or course just because it's offered in Thailand, and it's also not good to assume a course will be good just because it's from a well-recognised university. However, balancing the options, I do believe that a distance course would be time and money well-spent, and probably carries more clout long term (both within and outside Thailand). I currently teach in a university and most of the Ajarn Thai here got their post-graduate education abroad. Regarding actual learning, I am sure there are several advantages and disadvantages of learning by distance.

I'd be really grateful if people would let me the result of your research and experience. I've started my own researches, and some institutions are being fussy about which country I'm actually studying in. If I study in the UK, it will cost this, but if I study outside, it will cost more. Funny, it being a distance course.

What are your conclusions regarding the universities you named, with reference to both cost and quality (as much as it can be judged without actually studying somewhere). The Applied Linguistics / TEFL masters at Nottingham is going to cost 6,300 pounds, and they said that scholarships are not available for distance courses. 6,300 pounds is a lot of Baht!

With respect to all posters,

Kit

[jasreeve17]

The Applied Linguistics / TEFL masters at Nottingham is going to cost 6,300 pounds, and they said that scholarships are not available for distance courses. 6,300 pounds is a lot of Baht!

This is the very course I'm enrolled for (January): It has an interesting balance of subjects, excellent credentials for the instructors, offers solid support for students and the faculty has a high reputation. At 10,000 baht per month over two and a half years, I can afford it, just, and consider the money well spent.

I teach on two MA courses (one of them is MA TESOL at a high level Thai uni) and a PhD course here, and whilst I try my best for the students I know I'm miles below international standards (though I'm decent by local standards...) - hence why I'm investing my hard earned money on upping my skillset and qualifications (my education is in electronic engineering not TESOL). Much as many Thai teachers do an excellent job given the limitations of the Thai education sector, there really is no comparison with top UK unis...

[femi fan]

Hello, I looked into MA courses in Thailand and decided it was fairly pointless (even though I'm close to the Thammasart and Chula courses which are both very good; by local standards).

Instead I'm studying a distance learning MA in England. Nottingham, Leicester and Birmingham Unis all offer good courses which have to be a better long term option than local courses. - ah, just seen your post above: great minds think alike...

It might be useful to remember that people doing masters' courses pick up various skills while doing so. One of them is the ability to be objective with one's observations, choices, research, debating, and writing.

With that in mind, perhaps you could give your reasons for why you think distance learning courses 'have to be' better than local ones. And what do you mean by local? And how do you know those three univerisities offer 'good' courses? And on what criteria did you decide a course in thailand would be 'fairly pointless'?

I'm not being facetious asking these questions because if you write like this on your course you're going to have a lot of problems!

Several people i know of who have done distance MA courses in TESOL (or related degrees) or who know people who have done such courses feel they lost out to a degree from total lack of classroom interaction and contact. Whle distance courses do have benefits, it's useful for anybody considering them to look at the possible disadvantages too. Often the distance courses are logistically and financially better, but it's inherently difficult for them to match a classroom-based degree in terms of content and effective learning.

Yes you are; facetious and rude.

The answers are obvious:

UK MA courses are accepted worldwide - Thai courses are not. In fact, UK courses are more widely accepted in Thai unis than local courses are, as I found out when I discussed my options with several head of departments.

Researching the staff who teach the courses and the world ranking of these unis tells you alot too...

The entrace criterea is much higher in the UK courses, thus the material covered is at a higher and more interesting level. I could go on for a long time with more reasons...

Don't bother answering if you're just going to be rude.

No, the answers are not obvious. You would be correct that UK courses are accepted worldwide, but how you have managed to declare that thai courses are not, and so emphatically, is interesting. Perhaps you could explain how this is the case. There is no official international body that recognises or does not recognise this or that MA. It is entirely up to potential employers as to the merits they afford any particular MA based on the country it was taken in.

The entrance criteria for UK courses is NOT necessarily much higher at all.

Who is compiling this world ranking, and on what basis do they have authority to decide? And, it takes a department in a university quite some time to establish its reputation, and not much time at all to lose it.

Nearly everything you write is the result of your subjective views and personal experience. There is little that is valid to it objectively with regard to the thai context. Hence a lot of it is just plain wrong.

[Scott]

Let's keep the debate civil and on track.

Let's also try and keep from broad, unsubstantiated claims.

Let's try and answer questions posed.

Most of all, let's not flame other members, otherwise I have the awful choice of hitting the 'delete' button or the 'close the thread' button.

[jasreeve17]

Femi Fan, you use a lot of words to say nothing. You're another of these folk that love to argue... The way you pretend to be so reasoned yet say such unreasonable things is pretty funny.

I was going to reply point by point, but you'll just shift your focus and start arguing about something else... I'll do my studies in the UK, you stick to your Thai universities - good luck. I'm happy with me decission.

[femi fan]

Yeah, whatever mate, it's fine by me.

I would say though that 'arguing' and debating are somewhat key components of decent education, and skills that are necessary particularly in a post-graduate degree.

So yes, i'm another of these folks who like to 'argue'. That's how we move forward in life i thought. How could i find out i'm wrong if i'm never willing to argue about things?

[Loaded]

IMO a MA TEFL from a UK university will be more useful and more widely recognised around the world than a MA TEFL from a Thai university such as Payap. There could be many advantages for completing in Thailand including cost but if recognition is a factor accreditation has to be considered.

[kitjohnson]

I've getting stuck into researching masters courses (by distance learning), and there's a lot on offer. So far the Nottingham course sticks out as the most flexible and interesting.

I came across the Times Higher Education world university rankings. Whatever you think about such lists, Thailand did appear in the top 200. Chula, of course, at number 166.

http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/hybr...sp?typeCode=243