Which Thai Fish Varieties Are Boneless (or Easiest To Eat/de-bone)?

[newbegin4]

Hi, I would like to find a fish that is boneless (or at least is easy to de-bone).

So far, it has been trial-and-error with no luck in restaurants and buying from the supermarket.

Any suggestions? Please provide the fish name(s) as known locally in Udonthani, thanks!

[rfukata]

Udon Thani is just across the Mittaphab Lao border and is Land Locked. The only fish around there is coming from the

Mekong River and buffalo ponds such as the Catfish,Talapia and Carp. (Check the river sanitation before you eat the fish around there).

Go to the nearest Hyper-Mart such as Tesco-Lotus and check out the fish department there. You'll see a variety of fishes

which you can identify. If not, resort to the frozen fish selection; there are Red Snapper filets, Cod fillets, etc.

Good luck.

[newbegin4]

Udon Thani is just across the Mittaphab Lao border and is Land Locked. The only fish around there is coming from the

Mekong River and buffalo ponds such as the Catfish,Talapia and Carp. (Check the river sanitation before you eat the fish around there).

Go to the nearest Hyper-Mart such as Tesco-Lotus and check out the fish department there. You'll see a variety of fishes

which you can identify. If not, resort to the frozen fish selection; there are Red Snapper filets, Cod fillets, etc.

Good luck.

I've been to both Tesco-Lotus and the new Carreful supermarkets and have seen the fresh fish displays. Problem is I don't know one fish identification from another...but the frozen fish idea is a good one. I'll check to see if there are any frozen fillets (hopefully those would be already de-boned).

[Samuian]

If you can get fish Red Snapper (Plah Kapong deang), Barramundi (Plah Kapong), Black Pomfret (Plah Jaramed) Grouper, Emperor, do have very few bones - usually one major bone and a few around/in the fins!

Shark-Cutlets (Steak)

"Tuna" Steak (usually large Asian Mackerel) - NO bones

genuine Tuna-Steak

Barracuda -Steak

The fresh water fish sold fresh at Tesco and BigC as well as Macro are all Farm raised,

they are infertile and probably stuffed with Chemicals and Antibiotic, as the farmed shrimps are!

get freshly caught suplies!

[jasreeve17]

This is one of the few threads that makes me jealous of our island bretheren - my best ever fish meals were on KPG (tuna) and PhiPhi (Spanish makeral)...

Here in the city, or countryside, or anywhere with a river... the PlaChon are delicous and easy to de-bone. Makro, Tesco... they all have PlaChon, but why not find a little Issan restaurant and let them BBQ it for you?

[blue eyes]

If you can get fish Red Snapper (Plah Kapong deang), Barramundi (Plah Kapong), Black Pomfret (Plah Jaramed) Grouper, Emperor, do have very few bones - usually one major bone and a few around/in the fins!

Shark-Cutlets (Steak)

"Tuna" Steak (usually large Asian Mackerel) - NO bones

genuine Tuna-Steak

Barracuda -Steak

The fresh water fish sold fresh at Tesco and BigC as well as Macro are all Farm raised,

they are infertile and probably stuffed with Chemicals and Antibiotic, as the farmed shrimps are!

get freshly caught suplies!

Be carefull of the barracuda. I still do eat barracuda on the BBQ but I never eat one larger then three pounds.The are all meat with a very little gut sack.As to the op? I like fresh water cat fish and large talapia,or these little mud fish beacuse you eat the whole fish,bones and all.The larger one is a talapia,see the bones?

CIGUATERA or Ichthyosarcotoxin

Ray McAllister

Ciguatera is a form of fish flesh poisoning, which is exactly what ichthyosarcotoxin means! It is grossly under reported in tropical areas of the world where it is often listed as "sick to one's stomach" or "gut flu", etc. Only in the really severe cases is it likely to be recognized as a potentially dangerous form of poisoning caused by eating the flesh of a variety of tropical fish, but particularly of barracuda.

The poison is apparently produced by a variety of tiny marine organisms, dinoflagellates, which typically grow on various marine algae. These include sargassum weed, sea lettuce, Dictyota, Caulerpa, spaghetti grass, peacock algae, etc. Here the dinoflagellates thrive under warm waters, particularly in summer and fall, and produce in their tissues a poison called ciguatoxin. The algae are often preferred foods for a variety of herbivorous fish which eat, not only the algae, but the associated dinoflagellates and their toxin. The fish appear not to be affected by the toxin, although how one would tell a nauseated or diarrheic fish, I'm not sure. It accumulates in the fatty tissues of the fish and remains there until a reef predator eats the herbivore and then it concentrates in the predator's fatty tissues. For predator you should read "barracuda, grouper, amberjack, snapper, etc." If the predator eats enough herbivores who have, in turn, eaten enough algae with attached dinoflagellates, a toxic dose of ciguatoxin is available for the members of the next trophic level (the critters-mostly man-that eat the predators!)

Now along comes a recreational or commercial fisherman and the predator ends up on someone's table. Again, depending upon the parts of the fish eaten and the amount eaten, ciguatera may manifest itself in a variety of ways.

While eating the same fish at the same table, a few folks will not be affected at all. A further few will report stomach problems and pass it off as "bad fish", while the unlucky ones will have severe stomach distress, and a variety of neurological symptoms such as aching joints, metallic or peppery taste, dryness in the mouth and throat, skin itches, dizziness and nausea and, very diagnostic, reversal of hot and cold sensation. It is reported that an ice cube touched to the tongue feels hot. Few will test a hot poker touched to the tongue, but I suppose it would feel cold. Apparently a few deaths have been reported by Dr. Jack Randall, mostly from eating significant amounts of large barracuda.

In Bermuda, there was a Warrant Officer at Kindley Air Force Base who liked to fish. He brought home a large barracuda one day and the family had this fine eating fish for supper. Then the symptoms started. Most of those listed above were present in the next few days. However, the symptoms persisted for weeks and eventually he and his family were sent back to the States on a medical transfer. I am told that 2 years later he still got dizzy when he stood up at his desk. This points up one of the other serious aspects of ciguatera. It apparently dissolves in fatty tissue in your body and is released over time as you metabolize this tissue, and the symptoms can persist for weeks to years. Yet some people seem not to be significantly affected.

There are no easy ways to tell if a particular fish is ciguatoxic. Many "old wives tales" exist but none are any good. DeSylva and Poli list a series of these tales and tell you THEY DO NOT WORK!

Silver does not discolor on contact with a ciguatoxic fish.

Flies are supposed to avoid landing on and eating toxic fish.

Ants wont feed on toxic fish.

Such a fish is "sick" and will not fight well when hooked.

Teeth of a toxic barracuda are dark in color and a safe barracuda has white teeth.

ALL FALSE!

I believe that the best way to tell is to fillet your fish, mark the packages with a death's head and feed the carcass to the neighbor's (dare I say it) cat! Watch the cat eat it! In a moment I'll tell you why this is important! If the cat eats a reasonable portion and is still OK the next day, scratch out the skull and eat the fish. While not foolproof, this appears to be an acceptable procedure for all but the neighbor and the neighbor's cat!

Recently a test for ciguatoxin in fish was reported. I understand it costs about $5.00 per fish, but with fish selling for $5/lb, ten lbs of fillets would be worth the price. The other preventative measure to insure that you don't get ciguatera is to eat only small marine carnivores. Many people say to eat fish weighing less that 10 lbs. Many years ago, one of the experts in the investigation of ciguatera (Mark Poli) told me on the telephone that he preferred 5 lbs and under. Yet even that is not totally dependable for Dr. Don DeSylva, of Miami's Rosensteil School of Marine and Atmospheric Sciences, reported several 4 lb barracuda which poisoned the consumers. Do not buy large, thick fillets which probably came from a large fish. Small snapper, grunts, etc are common and very tasty. Eat them.

The Atlantic Ocean occurrances are especially concentrated where medical services report possible poisoning, where large populations are concentrated and where folks eat a lot of fish. This means Florida, the Bahamas and Caribbean nations. Most of the English language literature naturally lists Florida and Bahamas occurrances.

Some authorities recommend injections of mannitol as soon as possible after symptoms occur. For more information on this I refer you to Dr. Donald De Sylva, Prof. of Marine Science, Rosensteil School, 4800 Rickenbacker Causeway, Miami 33149 (305) 350-7334.

There is another type of poisoning, called scombroid poisoning, which occurs if one eats a scombroid fish, particularly the mackerals and tunas, after they have been left in the sun and not iced. Some chemical in the outer flesh changes as the fish dries out and causes, in humans, very rapid pulse rates and severe reddening of the skin. It is very scary and couse conceivably cause death in a weak person. It is very different in symptoms and cause from ciguatera.

Now two anecdotes about ciguatera incidents (or non-incidents as the case may be.) While in Micronesia during Operation Stellaroid Control, looking for evidance of the Crown of Thorns Starfish depradations on the coral reefs of Truk, the Trukese native assisting us caught a doctorfish or tang on hook and line. He started to fillet it and give us all pieces as sashimi (raw fish). Dr. Bob Jones knocked it out of his hands telling him "Don't eat that. It is probably ciguatoxic." Tawn Paul, the native, said "no problem here, we eat these all the time!" Bob had just done his doctoral dissertation at the University of Hawaii on the association between the doctorfish of the same species and ciguatera. We tentatively ate a little raw doctorfish and had no ill effects but Dr. Jones would not touch it!

The last story is perhaps amusing now, but it was not at the time it happened. The Kindley Air Force Base Fishing Club held a large tournament offshore Bermuda and afterwards all met at one of the officer's house for a fish cookout. Late that night the last guest left and the lady of the house told her husband that she could not face all these fishy dishes in the morning so they set about cleaning up and putting dishes thru several fillings of the dishwasher. Early in the process she found a plate of uneaten barracuda and told her husband she'd put it out for the cat. She called the cat and left it eating the barracuda. When, much later, she went out to get the last plate, she found the dead cat next to the plate and she panicked. She called Colonel Frese, Kindley's head of the KAFB Hospital, who had been at the banquet, told him about the cat and asked what to do? Colonel Frese told her to organize a telephone network and get everyone who had been at the party to the hospital to have their stomachs pumped!

In the very wee hours of the morning, as she and her husband came back from the hospital, the neighbor's wife came over and told her "Honey, I did not want to spoil your party last night, but at 2AM when I drove my husband to the Base to fly a WB-50, I ran over your cat. Rather than spoil your evening I laid her at the door and figured to tell you this morning." The fish wife grabbed her by the throat and told her that, on the pain of sudden death, mention this to no one on the base. She said "Because of your kindness we pumped the stomachs of 40 couples and there are 80 unhappy officers and their wives who would get violent if they knew." I was told the story as the wife in question was leaving for the States and I think this is the first time a very good story has leaked out. So watch the cat eat the fish and keep track of it afterward so it doesn't get hit by a car!

By the way, I acknowledge the assistance now and in the past, of Dr. De Sylva, Dr. Mark Poli and Dr. Dan Baden, all of the Rosensteil School, who have given me papers, telephone interviews, etc.

Ray McAllister

All information and images are property of UnderSea Adventurers © 2000

[blue eyes]

Thought you may like a look at the little guys before they get cooked.We make this little trap right in to the mud on the rice /water side of the paddy.They just jump right in every night and a meal is made.

[sbk]

Gosh, I guess I'd better watch out now. I've been eating fresh caught barracuda for 20 years and had no side effects whatsoever. My time must be up.

[crazykopite]

Hi I buy fillets of TABTIM it is a white fish very tasty and you can purchase ready filleted in Tesco 2 nice fillets cost me about 70 baht and 6 years on I have yet to have had a bone in it.

[meatboy]

there is pangasius,sold as dory fillets,farmed at aprox.135bht kilo.pacific sold at 285kilo.the pacific i prefere the farmed has a muddy taste,i have only seen the pacific dory at home fresh,then there is also indian one eye halibut i have tasted one about 16oz.and it was quite nice but if you can get the fillets which are cut from a large fish i have been told you wont find better.i got some shark coming this weekend never tried it anybody know what its like.

[ozzydom]

Macro in Udon Thani usually have skate and stingray which are boneless you can either buy them whole or just the wings,they are easy to skin and make fine eating,I cut them into cubes and batter them,called fish cocktails in Oz.

Large Tilapia (1kg and up ) make fine boneless fillets and easy to skin ,very fine textured fish.

CP outlets have skinless boned fillet of Pacific Dory which isnt Dory but still good eating.

And as a last resort ,never turn your nose up at Birdseye Fish fingers from Tops Supermarket, goes well with mashed taters and a couple of eggs .

[ozzydom]

If you are a regular fish eater,a good idea is to buy yourself a good 8 inch blade boning knife and a cutting board.

If you Google "How to fillet and skin fish" you will find numerous pictorial and video instructions on the subject.Being able to do this chore yourself will save you a good deal of cash and give you a wider choice .

Buying whole fish allows you to ensure that the fish is fresh,(clear dark eyes ,dark gills clean smell).

[meatboy]

tried shark fillet same size of a dory fillet[mekon cat fish] coated with batter not to bad,better than farmed fish,oh for some haddock,kippers and plaice come on mackro,i see you took my advice and imported some cider so why not good tasteing fish.:jap: