Sgi Buddhism, Sgi Buddhists

[Ave]

Sorry, about that, it was slightly off topic. I'll try to stick to what is more inherent to the original post.

I have casually come across this statement and although I don't know if you are a believer in something or not I thought it might be interesting to see how the brain reacts in believers and non-believers. This is the link http://www.brainmysteries.com/research/Whe...belief_meet.asp

A comparison of all religious with all nonreligious statements suggested that religious thinking is more associated with brain regions that govern emotion, self-representation and cognitive conflict in both believers and nonbelievers, while thinking about ordinary facts is more reliant upon memory retrieval networks. Activity in the brain's anterior cingulate cortex, an area associated with cognitive conflict and uncertainty, suggested that both believers and nonbelievers experienced greater uncertainty when evaluating religious statements.

Well, at least the final brain experience seems to be the same for both sides according to them. But I must admit, this reading left me a bit perplexed.

[chutai]

Is SGI Buddhism more about happiness-seeking than truth-seeking?

Does the two heve to be compartmentalised as being different aspects of the same reality?

The four paramiters or perfections:

Eternity, happiness,, true self and purity.

It's when we know the true reality of all phenomenon that we become happy. And as we learn to cast off the shallow in order to reveal the profound nature that reality do we become happier. It's a dialectical process if you like. They are both co-dependent in origination and manifestation.

He says the real purpose of religion is to bring happiness. He says his mentor said the real purpose of religion is to bring relief to the sick and poor. At no point does he say the purpose of religion or SGI buddhism is to discover anything true about reality. In fact, he assumes a great deal about reality in a matter of fact way.

You need to read and study more widely to understand that is not the case. There is much that has been written on the ultimate reality of ichinen sanzen. President Ikeda assumes only that readers of that interview will have slightly different emphasis on the nature of reality in Buddhist thought. It was not in the remit of that article to explore deeper areas of Buddhist philosophy, but to forge a greater understanding.

But we can never come to any satisfactory conclusion by trying to work things only by intellectual reasoning. Especially when to experience that reality in its totality is beyond words. Hence it's sometimes referred to as the Mystic Law for that very reason.

However:

Through chanting Nam-myoho-renge-kyo, we can manifest a state of life in which , by embodying the principle of the eternal and unchanging truth, we can live from moment to moment with the wisdom derived from this truth that functions in accordance with changing circumstances

Understand or not, the above is the important thing. To chant in order to realise a transformation of mind and more , even a transformation of life itself.

Oxford Will. You are very fortunate to have the very good friend that you do. A friend who has introduced ,and wants to share with you the manifest benefits of chanting Nam-myoho-renge-kyo. The Lotus Sutra has parables explaining just the same intent. That is, Shakyamuni Buddha's intention to lead all to the the supreme enlightenment.

“The Buddhas,the World-Honored Ones,wish to open the door of Buddha wisdom to all living beings,to allow them to attain purity*.That is why they appear in the world”

*Purity -- free from illusion. The ultimate reality.

[Brucenkhamen]

You've never heard the word *slander used in relation to a spriitual context , by which I presume that you mean Buddhist?. I realise that you've never read the Gosho (honored writings) of Nichiren, but he uses the word many times.

*To deny, oppose, disparage, or vilify the correct Buddhist teachings.

Looking at the dictionary definition I guess the word is appropriate.

I guess I just find it a turn off, I don't understand why one teacher "uses the word many times" while the rest seem unconcerned about it. I suppose is comparable the the Christian term "blasphemy" so from that point of view theistic religions use it and it's not so unreligious after all.

Do most people agree with you on this?

I don't know. I feel it's in line with the spirit of what many of my teachers teach, though I word it quite differently.

[OxfordWill]

Chutai, thanks for your reply. My purpose here is to understand my friend better so I am trying not to see what you're writing as an argument for the way things are but rather as an example of what someone with the same or similar set of beliefs to my friend thinks. In this regard I am very grateful you are sharing your beliefs with me but I wonder if I could ask you to phrase them in a way which is not dictatorial- i.e. "we believe X" not "It is the case that X." Ill understand if you dont want to but the way I am, unfortunately when I read the latter form I frequently cannot stop myself from getting down to the nitty gritty and we'll quickly lose focus and Ill learn nothing about my friend and youll hate me within a few replies.

So from what I read my friend believes that truth will lead him to happiness and that SGI Buddhism holds the secrets to the truth about the universe. SGI Buddhism, if I understand you correctly, claims to provide the tools or direct knowledge as to how to learn the profound truth of reality. Do they make this claim exclusively or do they suggest non buddhists might be able to get to the same truth in other ways?

I do not know if the comment you make about intellectual reasoning is yours alone or one SGI Buddhism teaches also? Would be good if you could clear that up. Actually thats very important viz my friend.

The next bit you mention is that SGI Buddhists believe chanting a phrase of japanese language will transform the life of the agent chanting, or perhaps lives of others, and increase the agents' wisdom in some way, perhaps with a bearing on being enlightened (which I dont know what enlightened means, at all). Can I ask you to kindly explain how the chanting works? Is it a claim about physics? About psychology? What? Thanks!

Edited October 12, 2009 by OxfordWill

[bina]

to quote my husband: you think too much....

he says farang like to make everything more complicated then things really are... not to read so much in to words, lines, sayings...

i come from a land with a zillion beliefs based on two (more or less ) religiouns with vast -and in my eyes, impossible to undestand- varying sets of belief systems, attitudes towards daily life, how to eat, how to function in any given place or situation, how to deal with life the universe and everything. i dont see that understanding their religious /psychological beliefs helps me see them in reference to me.

the best methods when u have friends with belief systems/understanding systems different than the one /s u are used to decoding in your brain is to just not discuss what hey believe/think. take a look if he is enjoying what he eats, how he dresses, if he is in a good mood this day or not... simple actions that reveal more about the person than what he says or claims he thinks.

in other words, why is it so important ot get inside his brain to see what he sees?

bina

israel

[OxfordWill]

Because I respect him.

[sabaijai]

The next bit you mention is that SGI Buddhists believe chanting a phrase of japanese language will transform the life of the agent chanting, or perhaps lives of others, and increase the agents' wisdom in some way, perhaps with a bearing on being enlightened (which I dont know what enlightened means, at all). Can I ask you to kindly explain how the chanting works? Is it a claim about physics? About psychology? What? Thanks!

OW, the following older thread goes over SGI beliefs on the efficacy of chanting the Japanese pronunciation of a Sanskrit title for the Lotus Sutra (ie Nam Myoho Renge Kyo):

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Chanting-t22...amp;hl=nichiren

Here is another thread discussing the authencity of the Lotus Sutra itself:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Lotus-Sutra-...amp;hl=nichiren

I suggest you have a look, as you may find an answer to your question there. Chutai has expressed his views and those published by SGI in both threads.

[chutai]

the following older thread goes over SGI beliefs on the efficacy of chanting the Japanese pronunciation of a Sanskrit title for the Lotus Sutra (ie Nam Myoho Renge Kyo):

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Chanting-t22...amp;hl=nichiren

Thank you. I was just beginning a search for that thread myself. Although I'd like to correct the claim that was solely an SGI perspective, but one shared by other Nichiren schools, and perhaps by others who utilise other forms of mantra as their essential practice.

Although I personally found the discussion ultimately circular, it will no doubt go some way in answering the question posed on the specific subject of chanting the daimoku.

Oxford Will. I'll get back to you on the other questions/comments raised in your Post #34

[sabaijai]

the following older thread goes over SGI beliefs on the efficacy of chanting the Japanese pronunciation of a Sanskrit title for the Lotus Sutra (ie Nam Myoho Renge Kyo):

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Chanting-t22...amp;hl=nichiren

Thank you. I was just beginning a search for that thread myself. Although I'd like to correct the claim that was solely an SGI perspective, but one shared by other Nichiren schools, and perhaps by others who utilise other forms of mantra as their essential practice.

Point taken. Hasn't SGI has split from other Nichiren schools?

[chutai]

the following older thread goes over SGI beliefs on the efficacy of chanting the Japanese pronunciation of a Sanskrit title for the Lotus Sutra (ie Nam Myoho Renge Kyo):

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Chanting-t22...amp;hl=nichiren

Thank you. I was just beginning a search for that thread myself. Although I'd like to correct the claim that was solely an SGI perspective, but one shared by other Nichiren schools, and perhaps by others who utilise other forms of mantra as their essential practice.

Point taken. Hasn't SGI has split from other Nichiren schools?

There always was different icing on the cake (doctrinal and practical differences) between the multitude of Nichiren sects -- but of course the ingredients remain the same.

But I think that you're referring to the acrimonious split with the Nichiren Shoshu priesthood in the 1991.

[chutai]

There always was different icing on the cake (doctrinal and practical differences)...

I actually meant to say the decorations on the cake ..., rather than the icing.

[bankei]

What do you think the Buddha would have thought about a religion such as Soka Gakkai?

[chutai]

What do you think the Buddha would have thought about a religion such as Soka Gakkai?

Do you mean the historic Buddha or the eternal Buddha ? If the former, then you need firstly to understand that Shakyamuni Buddha was preaching as to the understanding and people of the time. Many acknowledge that they don't know what Buddhism is. Those that do have an inkling will acknowledge its fluidity and adaption to the time, culture and circumstances in which it finds itself.

But what do you think that Buddhism as practised today thinks of Soka Gakkai ? Answering the question from within Dharma would be greatly appreciated though.

[OxfordWill]

Oxford Will. I'll get back to you on the other questions/comments raised in your Post #34

Yes please

[december52004]

Hi, I am a new Forum member and a SGI member for almost 7 years.

I can honestly say that taking faith in the Buddhism of Nichiren Daishonin through the SGI (UK in my case when I was living there) is probably the best thing that I have done in my life.

It can be at times, completely profound almost incomprehensible and at others so down to earth that in every area that it encompasses life and all of its aspects.

It is the Buddhism of daily life that even when you doubt it, it is there for you - as it is within everyone.

There is a podcast from the UK that is an excellent show for anyone familiar with Nichiren Buddhism

http://abuddhistpodcast.com/

Does anyone know of any English speaking members in the Khon Kaen / Issan region??

I would like to know if so.

Thank You,

With Kindest Regards,

Alan

[organic]

time is neither absolute nor definable

and so no period of time can be comparatively big or small...

time is intrinsically linked to matter and energy

hence albert

e=mc2

energy = mass x (speed of light)2

no one is independent

the above i.e energy (potential), mass (manifestations of physical world), time (cause&effect)

are also the components of the title of the lotus sutra

Myo (unseen potential) Ho (seen manifest) Renge (cause&effect/time)

I've been a practising SGI member for 16 years and have never come across any of that apart from the last sentence. I've never heard of renge having time as a meaning either. Anyone know where this comes from?

[Ave]

Hi, I am a new Forum member and a SGI member for almost 7 years.

I can honestly say that taking faith in the Buddhism of Nichiren Daishonin through the SGI (UK in my case when I was living there) is probably the best thing that I have done in my life.

It can be at times, completely profound almost incomprehensible and at others so down to earth that in every area that it encompasses life and all of its aspects.

It is the Buddhism of daily life that even when you doubt it, it is there for you - as it is within everyone.

There is a podcast from the UK that is an excellent show for anyone familiar with Nichiren Buddhism

http://abuddhistpodcast.com/

Does anyone know of any English speaking members in the Khon Kaen / Issan region??

I would like to know if so.

Thank You,

With Kindest Regards,

Alan

Hi Alan,

today three very curious people came to our meeting in Pattaya and as soon as we started chanting they were gone.

This, I thought, is the ultimate proof of the power of this practice for me, the vibrations of Daimoku went right through them and shook them, just like they did to me the first time I heard Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo and rejected it for over twenty five years. As you mentioned, this practice can be difficult to understand sometimes but once we perceive its essence the sky's the limit..

Thanks for the link, nice funky start and a very stimulating speech. If we don't practice we can't grasp the real meaning of what we chant, how true.

I have not heard of a centre in Khon Kaen, as far as I know in Isarn there is one in Udon Thani and a smaller one in Korat, not sure about the latter.

Perhaps it's best to contact the centre in Lumphini where we hold the English speaking meetings. I'm going to PM you with the email address of the SGT leader based in Bangkok.

Let me know if you need the address of the centre in Udon and I'll fish it out for you.

All the best

[december52004]

Hi Ave,

received your PM thanks - and noted for the English speaking meetings in Lumphini - these are called the Rainbow Group - I know the leader of this group very well - he is a really nice guy.

I actually met a woman from Pattaya at one of the Rainbow meetings I attended last year, she was really nice as well, sorry, but I do not remember her name now!! (maybe it's even you??)

I attend meetings there about 3 times per year as it is an hour on a plane from here, or 6-7 hours on aircon bus, or 5-6 hours by car - so a bit of a trek!

I have emailed the contact in your PM and hope to hear back shortly.

I want to more with my practice and do miss the weekly meetings I used to attend in the UK a lot. that's why I am a big advocate of the Buddhist Podcast - it's like being at a meeting for me!

I even burn them to disc each month and post back to the UK to a couple of older members who do not have internet access.

Thank you for your help, hope to communicate with you again.

And great story, - I too remember the first SGI meeting I attended! I sat their bewildered, thinking - right - when are we going to meditate!

Take Care

Nam- Myoho-Renge-Kyo

With Kindest Regards

Alan

[dd369]

Hi, I am a new Forum member and a SGI member for almost 7 years.

I can honestly say that taking faith in the Buddhism of Nichiren Daishonin through the SGI (UK in my case when I was living there) is probably the best thing that I have done in my life.

It can be at times, completely profound almost incomprehensible and at others so down to earth that in every area that it encompasses life and all of its aspects.

It is the Buddhism of daily life that even when you doubt it, it is there for you - as it is within everyone.

There is a podcast from the UK that is an excellent show for anyone familiar with Nichiren Buddhism

http://abuddhistpodcast.com/

Does anyone know of any English speaking members in the Khon Kaen / Issan region??

I would like to know if so.

Thank You,

With Kindest Regards,

Alan

Hi Alan,

Are you still in Khon Kaen?

My friend would be more than happy to meet a English Speaking SGI member in Khon Kaen.

regards,

ken

[Groongthep]

"A human being is a part of a whole, called by us, the universe, a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings as something separated from the rest... a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty."

Note the word "delusion". He frequently claims I am deluded if I believe the planet and my own self to be separate, or the teapot and my own self to be separate. Is he using separate in a different way to the one in the dictionary? Do I lack the fundamental Buddhist lingo to get his point?

This is a pretty standard Buddhist view of things. Different traditions may say it quite differently or stress certain aspects more than this but this isn't unique to SGI. Camerata covers this quite well above.

I think Chutai on this board would be able to answer specific questions you may have about SGI, i haven't had any experience with them beyond heresay

"A human being is a part of a whole, called by us, the universe, a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings as something separated from the rest... a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free ourselves from this prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole of nature in its beauty."

This is a direct word-for-word quote from Albert Einstein and does not come directly from any Buddhist Sutra. I do agree with Brucenkhamen however that it is a pretty standard Buddhist view of things. Whether or not Einstein was influenced by Buddhist teaching before coming to this conclusion I don't know, but it reaffirms to me just the same that he was a brilliant thinker in more subjects than just physics and mathematics.

Edited March 19, 2011 by Groongthep