Thaksin Appointed As Adviser Of Cambodian Government

[coalminer]

ICT should block this website http://www.thailandsworld.com/index.cfm?p=277

Thailand has always been rule by Thai's. Never by Khmers.

Blocking something because you don't agree with it really is very childish and undemocratic. ( No surprise that it's on the increase.)

You're correct of course that Thailand has always been ruled by Thais. Thailand only exists since 1939. Or you could go as far back as the 14th century and you'd still be pretty much correct. Before that though, the land that Thailand now sits on was part of the Khmer Empire until that fell apart. That's why you see ruins of Khmer architecture all over the place. Where else would the stuff at Phimai in Khorat have come from, Yoshitaka? (and dozens of other sites, all the way up to Sukhothai). See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phimai_historical_park

( Obviously very little of this has anything to do with the current relationship Thailand has with Cambodia. Clearly both countries share a lot in their ancestry but each claim the lot of it as uniquely their own ancestry. Ranges all the way from temple architecture to classical dance. Imagine how much better everyone would feel if they acknowledged that they have a lot more in common than things that would drive them apart..)

Back to the 14th century and still being correct?

What about these examples:

http://siamaerospace.tripod.com/id44.htm

"From the 9th to 13th Centuries the plains area was dominated by the Khmer Kingdom of Angkor. Angkor Wat was build in this time and is located in what is now western Cambodia."

"However, in 1569 the expansionist Kingdom of Burma overran Ayudhaya and the smaller kingdom of Lan Na to the north. It installed a puppet ruler and imprisoned its heirs in Rangoon. "

"In 1760 the Burmese exasperated by Ayudhaya's successes, launched a determined and protracted war against the Kingdom of Ayudhaya. After a siege that lasted more than two years the city of Ayudhaya finally fell into Burmese hands in 1767."

http://www.jack-wallace.com/g8social_t3_03.htm

"The Thai Kings of Ayutthaya conquered not only Sukhothai, but also the areas of central Thailand formerly held by the Mon and the Khmer,"

http://workmall.com/wfb2001/thailand/thail..._the_khmer.html

"The closely related Mon and Khmer peoples entered Southeast Asia along migration routes from southern China in the ninth century B.C. The Khmer settled in the Mekong River Valley, while the Mon occupied the central plain and northern highlands of modern Thailand and large parts of Burma. Taking advantage of Funan's decline in the sixth century A.D., the Mon began to establish independent kingdoms, among them Dvaravati in the northern part of the area formerly controlled by Funan and farther north at Haripunjaya. Meanwhile the Khmer laid the foundation for their great empire of the ninth to fifteenth centuries A.D. This empire would be centered at Angkor (near modern Siem Reap) in Cambodia."

And many others, not blocked and free to read after a Google.

[bangkokumpalumpa]

I am supprised at some of the postings on this thread,

If thaksin ever does got back into power here in Thailand then there should be some worried people!!!

anyone that think Thaksin is finished and wash up should open there eyes, afterall the present govt are hel_l bent to get him. why?

money talks in Asia, and Thaksin has money and friends!!

I bet there are some worried businessmen right now in Thailand and I bet there is about to be some happy businessmen as well.

a few simple words from an advisor, like "good man" or "bad man" is the difference of making business or not, take the oil factor, so now Thaksin has a hand in that one, again!!!

to many people under estimate the man, remember there are a lot of wealthy and powerful people that do respect Thaksin, and they are about to have a very good foot in the door for business across the bourder, and others are about to get the door slamed in there faces.

the one product that makes trillions of dollars and can cause wars........OIL

maybe the present govt should chill out a we bit and try to work with the man, this could be a great advantage for them or it could be a massive dwon fall depending on how it is played.

what ever happens Thaksin is going to be around for a while yet!!

we have not heard the last of him

[bangkokumpalumpa]

I bet Chevron what to be friends with Thaksin now !!!!

[Publicus]

I am supprised at some of the postings on this thread,

If thaksin ever does got back into power here in Thailand then there should be some worried people!!!

anyone that think Thaksin is finished and wash up should open there eyes, afterall the present govt are hel_l bent to get him. why?

money talks in Asia, and Thaksin has money and friends!!

I bet there are some worried businessmen right now in Thailand and I bet there is about to be some happy businessmen as well.

a few simple words from an advisor, like "good man" or "bad man" is the difference of making business or not, take the oil factor, so now Thaksin has a hand in that one, again!!!

to many people under estimate the man, remember there are a lot of wealthy and powerful people that do respect Thaksin, and they are about to have a very good foot in the door for business across the bourder, and others are about to get the door slamed in there faces.

the one product that makes trillions of dollars and can cause wars........OIL

maybe the present govt should chill out a we bit and try to work with the man, this could be a great advantage for them or it could be a massive dwon fall depending on how it is played.

what ever happens Thaksin is going to be around for a while yet!!

we have not heard the last of him

After reading this post I know with certainly it's impossible to have any sympathy or to try to have any compassion for the tyrant Thaksin who, if he ever were to regain power and his wealth, will seek vengance, revenge and merciless payback perhaps approaching a Thai version of the policies of Pol Pot.

Thaksin is a divider, not a uniter. Thaksin is a tribalist. Thaksin were he back in power would approach Mao's so-called cultural (nazi) revolution and Pol Pot's lunatic mass murders. While one voice does not define Thaksin, Thaksin himself has done more to define himself than any of us could whether we are so foolish to like him or realistic enuff to oppose him and his elite gang and his rent a mob Reds.

[MayBeLater]

After reading this post I know with certainly it's impossible to have any sympathy or to try to have any compassion for the tyrant Thaksin who, if he ever were to regain power and his wealth, will seek vengance, revenge and merciless payback perhaps approaching a Thai version of the policies of Pol Pot.

Thaksin is a divider, not a uniter. Thaksin is a tribalist. Thaksin were he back in power would approach Mao's so-called cultural (nazi) revolution and Pol Pot's lunatic mass murders. While one voice does not define Thaksin, Thaksin himself has done more to define himself than any of us could whether we are so foolish to like him or realistic enuff to oppose him and his elite gang and his rent a mob Reds.

How silly can you get with trying to look into the future how Thaksin could/would/should react if he ever comes back to Thailand. Stating he will be like Mao and Pol Pot. Its nice that all people can write what they want, it reveals who has brains and who has not.

Recap.

- Thaksin was deposed in a coup while the majority of the populace supported him.

- Thaksin was tried for basicly abusing his powers while in office, he was convicted, and thats a good thing. Problem is that the rest of the people that matter in Thailand are as corrupt as he is. We all know why the rest are not prosecuted. Rotten corrupt judiciary on the leesh of the powers that matter.

No matter if you hate or love Thaksin you got to admit that he is singled out for threatening the powers that rule Thailand: business elite, army and the power that can not be talked about on TV (Nineteen Eigthy-Four).

Politics is much more fun if you look at it with a distance, its just a great game, don't take it serious, its so insignificant.

MBL

[walkup]

This should certainly give Thaksin more credibility in the eyes of world leaders and tarnish the claims of those simply calling him a criminal. If he were just looting the Thai coffers for his entire administration, surely the Cambodian government would not want him advising them on economic matters.

This gives some credence to the claim that the charges against him in Thailand are mainly political. I hope that they are eventually dropped and he can return to his homeland. Whether or not he should be allowed to re-enter politics is up to the Thai's, but I see no reason why he should have to live in exile.

So, suddenly the Cambodian government is angelic because it 'employs' Thaksin (or is it vice-versa)? BTW, he doesn't have to live in exile. He is a wanted criminal on the run.

[Publicus]

Politics is much more fun if you look at it with a distance, its just a great game, don't take it serious, its so insignificant.

MBL

I recommend you advise the imbalanced and obsessive compulsive Thaksin of your claim certain. He definitely could use your wise if facile counsel.

[RegularReader]

Hammered and others are correct in saying that Thais of the upper NorthEast areas of Isaan have no love for Cambodia.

In all these comments there's not much discussion that Thaksin might have shot himself in the foot by associating himself with Cambodia

While there is little love for Cambodia, I do not see this as having any material impact on the way the people in the northeast vote. Theoretically it would seem like it should, but politically I don't see it. The Red Shirt movement needs Thaksin as he is their rallying point. There isn't anything any pro Thaksin political party can promise that the Democrats can't match other than bringing Thaksin back. Hence, he serves a purpose to the Red Shirt movement and therefore, since they are the only organized group at the grass roots level in the northeast, they will explain this away. I just wait to see what BS they come up with this time.

I am not talking about the Red Shirt leaders, I am talking about the normal ordinary Thai people in that part of Isaan. Your point about the Red Shirts needing him is valid, but not all Isaan people are "red". Further, I am saying, a lot of their love for Thaksin has to do with the money, not the man. And this could be seen as a "sell out".

[brahmburgers]

Let Thaksin shoot himself in the foot once again.

Abhisit is playing his cards well, and getting a boost in public confidence. Peua Thai heavies have seen the latest two polls showing Abhisit is gaining in popularity, and they're doing what any Thai politicians would do in such a predicatment; disdaining the poll results.

But they and the remnants of the Reds are quaking, as yet more bricks fall from their paper mache wall which tries to appear solid (as if backed by many Thais) but is as solid as wet rice falling from a blimp.

[caf]

Still waiting to hear Red leaders separate themsleves from Thaksin. Who among the Reds is saying anything negative about this deal between Thaksin and Hun Sen? Or about Thaksin the economic advisor to the Cambodian government? About Thaksin possibly relocating to Cambodia?

Reds don't seem concerned. Red forumists instead are trying to misdirect the focus to Abhisit, pursuing their old saw that Mark is in over his head again. Abhisit is playing this one by the book, pursuing the established diplomatic options and actions.

Meanwhile Thaksin the Cambodian is almost forgotten.

Thaksin the Cambodian!! Your anti-thaksin emotions are clouding your normally thoughtful points

Actually he is Thai and has some powerful Thai friends. You don't want to admit that do you?

It would be helpful if you could advise us of the benefits to Thailand of Thaksin being an adviser (economics) to the government of Cambodia, thereby becoming an official of the government of Cambodia. I share the view of the government of Thailand that it's not a good idea and I thus far support the Thai government's response.

Kindly advise..........what are the benefits to Thailand of Thaksin becoming an official of the government of Cambodia?

One forumist said Thaksin needs an income, which could be understandable but, then again.........

No benefits at all. His is a tactical move. But your response did not answer my point. Admit he has powerful friends here. That is what is worrying some of the elite.

[Old Man River]

Hammered and others are correct in saying that Thais of the upper NorthEast areas of Isaan have no love for Cambodia.

In all these comments there's not much discussion that Thaksin might have shot himself in the foot by associating himself with Cambodia

While there is little love for Cambodia, I do not see this as having any material impact on the way the people in the northeast vote. Theoretically it would seem like it should, but politically I don't see it. The Red Shirt movement needs Thaksin as he is their rallying point. There isn't anything any pro Thaksin political party can promise that the Democrats can't match other than bringing Thaksin back. Hence, he serves a purpose to the Red Shirt movement and therefore, since they are the only organized group at the grass roots level in the northeast, they will explain this away. I just wait to see what BS they come up with this time.

I am not talking about the Red Shirt leaders, I am talking about the normal ordinary Thai people in that part of Isaan. Your point about the Red Shirts needing him is valid, but not all Isaan people are "red". Further, I am saying, a lot of their love for Thaksin has to do with the money, not the man. And this could be seen as a "sell out".

I understood your comment, but we just don't agree. I think the main point of our disagreement is that you think people in the northeast will independently change the way they vote because of this while I think a change could only come via an organized, unified group leading them to change their vote. I see no attempt right now by the Dem's to communicate with the northeast voters at the grass roots level, but I do see the Red Shirt movement already doing damage control at the grass roots level.

Hence, this will blow over with no material impact on Thaksin's popularity upcountry. Perhaps the odd vote here and there, but it will take more than this to change the northeast's strangle hold on elections.

[caf]

There is a similarity with the current Honduran Coup where the elected government leader camped out in the neighboring country for a while. Coups historically get very little international respect.

The difference is that th eHonduran governmenmt are recognized by zero countries even less than the breakaway Georgian states while both th eThai coup government and all of the ones including Abhisit's during the tenure of this parliament have been internationally recognized. The leader of the Honduran government has and still is widely welcomed whilst Thaksin has had more difficulty in this way. The questions may be posited of why is this true? Some coups are more readily accepted than others and some leaders are more readily abandoned than others it seems

The OAS (to include the United States) believes Zelaya's challenge to the Supreme Court's constitutional ruling could and should have been handled better and differently than it was, and that the Honduran government has set a bad precedent in its approach to dealing with Zelaya's open defiance of the Supreme Court's constitutional ruling against his unconstitutional plan to re-elect himself.

Consequently, Zelaya is welcome among OAS member states. Post coup Thaksin is welcome in one Asean member state, Cambodia, even though it's been reported Thaksin has slipped into a few other Asean states but has had to scamper out once spotted.

Perhaps Thaksin should gather all his gang abroad to set up a Thai Government in Exile. I'd bet one rogue country would recognize it. It would get all of those nasty people out of Thailand too.

Who exactly do you mean by his gang? You may be getting on dangerous ground, Publicus.

[Old Man River]

Still waiting to hear Red leaders separate themsleves from Thaksin. Who among the Reds is saying anything negative about this deal between Thaksin and Hun Sen? Or about Thaksin the economic advisor to the Cambodian government? About Thaksin possibly relocating to Cambodia?

Reds don't seem concerned. Red forumists instead are trying to misdirect the focus to Abhisit, pursuing their old saw that Mark is in over his head again. Abhisit is playing this one by the book, pursuing the established diplomatic options and actions.

Meanwhile Thaksin the Cambodian is almost forgotten.

Thaksin the Cambodian!! Your anti-thaksin emotions are clouding your normally thoughtful points

Actually he is Thai and has some powerful Thai friends. You don't want to admit that do you?

It would be helpful if you could advise us of the benefits to Thailand of Thaksin being an adviser (economics) to the government of Cambodia, thereby becoming an official of the government of Cambodia. I share the view of the government of Thailand that it's not a good idea and I thus far support the Thai government's response.

Kindly advise..........what are the benefits to Thailand of Thaksin becoming an official of the government of Cambodia?

One forumist said Thaksin needs an income, which could be understandable but, then again.........

No benefits at all. His is a tactical move. But your response did not answer my point. Admit he has powerful friends here. That is what is worrying some of the elite.

While I want to stay out of your arguement of who has friends where, out of curiousity, please explain your comment that this is a tactical move. Normally, tactical moves aren't made without clearly defined benefits in sight. What is the clearly defined benefit in sight?

[caf]

Still waiting to hear Red leaders separate themsleves from Thaksin. Who among the Reds is saying anything negative about this deal between Thaksin and Hun Sen? Or about Thaksin the economic advisor to the Cambodian government? About Thaksin possibly relocating to Cambodia?

Reds don't seem concerned. Red forumists instead are trying to misdirect the focus to Abhisit, pursuing their old saw that Mark is in over his head again. Abhisit is playing this one by the book, pursuing the established diplomatic options and actions.

Meanwhile Thaksin the Cambodian is almost forgotten.

Thaksin the Cambodian!! Your anti-thaksin emotions are clouding your normally thoughtful points

Actually he is Thai and has some powerful Thai friends. You don't want to admit that do you?

Powerful Thai friends? Agreed. Should anyone around here expect to meet any of Thaksin's powerful Thai friends anytime soon?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Meanwhile Red forumists continue to try to misdirect the thread topic away from Thaksin by attacking the Nation, PAD, the coup, Abhisit, Kasit, other forumists, Sondhi, the Democrat Party, the Election Commission, the judiciary, the powers that be, nosey farang etc etc.

The fact remains Thaksin is an official of the government of Cambodia. Tell us how that benefits Thailand, thank you.

I am not a red forumist. I do not like Thaksin. My point is he has powerful friends ( not rich family as one poster said, not gangsters, not the mob....). Also he has not formally accepted the appointment as I understand it and I think it is only a tactical move anyway. Certainly no benefit to Cambodia

Seems to be rather a lot of shooting from the hip on this thread now. Relax a bit and think things through. There is sa lot of positioing going on.

[caf]

Thaksin the Cambodian!! Your anti-thaksin emotions are clouding your normally thoughtful points

Actually he is Thai and has some powerful Thai friends. You don't want to admit that do you?

It would be helpful if you could advise us of the benefits to Thailand of Thaksin being an adviser (economics) to the government of Cambodia, thereby becoming an official of the government of Cambodia. I share the view of the government of Thailand that it's not a good idea and I thus far support the Thai government's response.

Kindly advise..........what are the benefits to Thailand of Thaksin becoming an official of the government of Cambodia?

One forumist said Thaksin needs an income, which could be understandable but, then again.........

No benefits at all. His is a tactical move. But your response did not answer my point. Admit he has powerful friends here. That is what is worrying some of the elite.

While I want to stay out of your arguement of who has friends where, out of curiousity, please explain your comment that this is a tactical move. Normally, tactical moves aren't made without clearly defined benefits in sight. What is the clearly defined benefit in sight?

You are right, it is wise to stay out of the argument. Publicus avoided the point. He shows that he knows enough about Thai politics to understand the recent positioning but he chooses to slant his posts as purely anti-thaksin. He ignores other points. But he is astute enough to be aware of them.

Taksin is just ruffling feathers and he knows he can do that with impunity.

What was the old Max Bygraves number " You need friends"

[RegularReader]

Hammered and others are correct in saying that Thais of the upper NorthEast areas of Isaan have no love for Cambodia.

In all these comments there's not much discussion that Thaksin might have shot himself in the foot by associating himself with Cambodia

While there is little love for Cambodia, I do not see this as having any material impact on the way the people in the northeast vote. Theoretically it would seem like it should, but politically I don't see it. The Red Shirt movement needs Thaksin as he is their rallying point. There isn't anything any pro Thaksin political party can promise that the Democrats can't match other than bringing Thaksin back. Hence, he serves a purpose to the Red Shirt movement and therefore, since they are the only organized group at the grass roots level in the northeast, they will explain this away. I just wait to see what BS they come up with this time.

I am not talking about the Red Shirt leaders, I am talking about the normal ordinary Thai people in that part of Isaan. Your point about the Red Shirts needing him is valid, but not all Isaan people are "red". Further, I am saying, a lot of their love for Thaksin has to do with the money, not the man. And this could be seen as a "sell out".

I understood your comment, but we just don't agree. I think the main point of our disagreement is that you think people in the northeast will independently change the way they vote because of this while I think a change could only come via an organized, unified group leading them to change their vote. I see no attempt right now by the Dem's to communicate with the northeast voters at the grass roots level, but I do see the Red Shirt movement already doing damage control at the grass roots level.

Hence, this will blow over with no material impact on Thaksin's popularity upcountry. Perhaps the odd vote here and there, but it will take more than this to change the northeast's strangle hold on elections.

You are a step ahead of the debate. I agree it will require an organized push to take advantage of this situation, but the conditions are set, to make a move against Thaksin. Whether or not the Dems/BJP can take advantage of it will become apparent in the next few days.

In any case, I stick by my point that Thaksin is wrong if he thinks the loyalty to him is about anything more than money. Isaan people are not stupid - they've had to live this way for a long long time.

[mca]

Err.... "You Need Hands" caf mate.

[rixalex]

While I want to stay out of your arguement of who has friends where, out of curiousity, please explain your comment that this is a tactical move. Normally, tactical moves aren't made without clearly defined benefits in sight. What is the clearly defined benefit in sight?

You are right, it is wise to stay out of the argument. Publicus avoided the point. He shows that he knows enough about Thai politics to understand the recent positioning but he chooses to slant his posts as purely anti-thaksin. He ignores other points. But he is astute enough to be aware of them.

Taksin is just ruffling feathers and he knows he can do that with impunity.

What was the old Max Bygraves number " You need friends"

Just to get this clear, you are saying that the clearly defined benefit in sight is ruffling feathers?

Black Songkran wasn't sufficient a ruffle?

Edited November 8, 2009 by rixalex

[rixalex]

I most certainly take every opportunity to point out current corruption --- as far too many posters here write trite and ill founded views with the pretence that all corruption is Thaksin only.

"with the pretence that all corruption is Thaksin only. " ???

The only pretence is the pretence in your head that just because people mention Thaksin's corrupt ways, that means they also think that Thaksin is the only corrupt one. He's not. I've already stated that.

Weirdly you seem to feel that acknowledging existing current corruption somehow diminishes that of Thaksin ...

Please quote where i have denied existing current corruption. I don't. It exists.

You are simply making stuff up now.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

The benefit is that Thaksin stays in the news, and at the top of the headlines. To be honest I don't think he anticipated the governments overreaction, but he does know that Abhisit is prone to make mistakes when poked a bit. One of those guys in government is clearly going to blow a fuse and throw his toys out of the pram, exposing their insecurity.

I think Thaksin's short term strategy is to stay in a position where people talk about him, and listen to what he has to say. He's better able to do that from Cambodia, which after all is right around the corner. Then the current government act like they're stung by a wasp every time Thaksin does anything.

Anyway, I don't think there's more to it than that Thaksin wants to stay influential, never mind that he's not physically in Thailand; he needs to do that in order to re-construct the 'rural alliance' that worked so well for him in the TRT days.

Personally, I would hope that people in favor of empowering the poor in Thailand would move beyond his figure and come up with a person with less baggage who's far less easily dismissed.

Edited November 8, 2009 by WinnieTheKhwai

[rixalex]

TV pictures taken a few seconds ago at one of my neighbors house.

Look at top right text.

Big failure of a newbie with 5 posts .....

First of all coalminer you accuse dataserver of being a big failure for correctly pointing out that your neighbours were not wacthing ASTV. The big failure was yours and yet you seem unable to muster an apology.

Newbie, you seem to be a previous member of ThaiVisa.

For what reason was your membership annihilated and did you need to comeback under your present alias?

I remember to have read that a banned member of ThaiVisa is forbidden to come back under another alias ...

(Hope that mod's don't read this ...)

What's more you now you accuse him of being a banned member. I assume you have some evidence for this?

[Livinginexile]

He's getting closer..

The expat community is becoming very nervous

[WinnieTheKhwai]

The expat community is becoming very nervous

I don't think there is such a thing as an expat community that agrees on anything.

( Well, other than the price of beer and ATM withdrawals. )

For me, it's not so much that I would like to see Thaksin back, but rather a return to a more democratic system with less influence (or better yet, no influence at all) from the army and so on.

Part of national reconciliation means that you have to accept that there is a sizable contingent of people who will feel left out and disenfranchised when they're artificially blocked(*) from voting for the person they want. You simply cannot harp on about national unity (like Abhisit likes to do like a broken record) while clearly not respecting people with a different opinion from your own.

(* Artificially blocked: includes military coups, rewriting the constitution to favor the elite, removing elected governments repeatedly over things as trivial as the PM being on a TV cooking program until finally ending up with a favored clique in government.. Even if you don't agree with this then at least accept that TRT/Thaksin's electorate sees it that way. [Cue: someone stating they're all uneducated lower-caste hicks who's opinions don't matter and can't be trusted with democracy.])

If Abhisit were truly a leader (Ok, I know) then he would have the political courage to work out a deal that respects all parts of the country and all classes of its population. By not doing so he de-facto solidifies the status quo, a status that really doesn't do anything to improve things for the poorer regions and classes, or even Thailand as a whole for that matter.

I also suspect some expats to actively don't WANT Thailand to progress, because they like the added financial power they wield while Thailand's economy goes down the drain (or, doesn't grow), and they too appreciate the source of cheap.. erm, 'labor'. So pretty much the same selfish and exploitive interests as the Bangkok PAD/Democrat elite.

Edited November 8, 2009 by WinnieTheKhwai

[hammered]

Right now Thaksin with assistance of his proixy Chavalit is walking all over what the military hold dear: Cosy up to a tradional enemy, talk about autonomy down south, imply negotiations will not be done on the hard Thai negotiating line, imply we are certain in a few years hence things will be our way, act like Thaksin will be back linked into all the ohters. Working oin the fears of the enemy can be succesful in a negotiation if indeed one is going on and we shouldnt forget the asset seizure decisonm is imminent. Anyone who thinks that is not part of the context is delusional.

As to powerful friends well Im sure all are aware of this and it will be interesting to see on what side these things fall but a reading of history from a bunch of decades ago reveals intially it may actually be that the power resides in others than powerful friends at least for a while. I doubt this one is certain

Of course the whole scenartio does not address the issue that there is no set of ruyles all agree to and there probably wont be unbless forced on both sides (and who does the forcing?). It also deosnt address that both sides have done their best to indoctrinate people to there way of thinking. Neither side cares about debate but rather pure indoctrination. Mind you in power games among powerful elite people such is often the case.

Abhisit has failed some would say not tried to reconcile people but then again ditto in Somchai, Samak, and Thaksin and anyone who thinks Chavalit would even try ios either delusional or doesnt know anything about Thai politics. There is no real desire toi reconcile just to win. The word reconcile is defined by both sides to mean what they want.

[Siripon]

Yinglak( Thaksin's sister) was on TV this morning saying Thaksin would make clearer his role regarding Cambodia on Tuesday.

Working out how to limit the damage no doubt.

I still believe he'll not set foot in Cambodia, too much of a coward.

[otherstuff1957]

^ He's probably realized that it would be a bad strategic move. While there might be short term benefits and the people in Issan might be excited and encouraged by his proximity, a lot of the Red voters in the central plains are probably shifting political allegiance as we speak. If he loses them, the current incarnation of TRT may not even be the biggest minority party in the next election.

He might issue an official refusal of the offer or he might make a confusing, ambiguous statement that people can interpret however they like and that he can spin one way or the other as things play out.

[ballpoint]

... but he does know that Abhisit is prone to make mistakes when poked a bit...

Any facts to support this statement? You admit to knowing the thoughts of Thaksin, how often do you speak to him? I’d say that Abhisit was poked about as far as possible over Songkhran, and made the right decision, making your hero look like a clueless whiner on international television to boot. In fact, I’d go as far to say the opposite, and will supply evidence to back it up as well. In 2006, Thaksin seemed desperate to get more support so he sold off AIS to show he was serious about not mixing business with politics. All well and good, but he couldn’t resist the chance to make as much out of the deal as possible, first by using complex share transfers within his family, during which time the shares increased in value by huge amounts, secondly by exploiting a loophole and not paying a sataeng in tax on the deal, and thirdly by changing the law, enabling him to sell to the investment arm of a competing country. In the face of mounting public anger he stubbornly hung on to his position, and refused to defuse it by donating a portion to charity, or some other act of goodwill. He was poked, he made a huge mistake. No doubt the pedantic “he was never convicted of any crimes following this”, by those very same posters who claim to clamour for democracy. Let me ask you, was it ethical? How would a normal MP, let alone the PM, of a truly democratic country have been dealt with if found doing the same? Another example? His interview on CNN over Songkhran, he was poked by Jim Clancy and blundered on, reading his prepared script about how he hoped things would have panned out – big mistake. And now this. The smart thing to do would have been to graciously thank Hun Sen for the offer, but decline it. Instead he saw the chance to try and further divide Thailand, and indeed, may even have been one of the architects of the offer, accepted it and is now dithering about what to do. Big mistake.

[rixalex]

The smart thing to do would have been to graciously thank Hun Sen for the offer, but decline it. Instead he saw the chance to try and further divide Thailand,

Yes, i think the thought of dividing Thailand further and creating tension must have been a big part of the attraction. Another factor is his ego. He needs to feel important and he needs to feel wanted. That made it an offer he couldn't resist. Having accepted however, it has now dawned on him that it might lose him some support in Thailand.

As we speak, i have no doubt that somewhere out there in the desert our square-faced little friend has his best men frantically trying to cook up the best way to back out of all this and come out smelling of roses.

[ballpoint]

...For me, it's not so much that I would like to see Thaksin back, but rather a return to a more democratic system with less influence (or better yet, no influence at all) from the army and so on.

I’d argue that it’s impossible to go back to a “more” democratic system, partly because Thailand has never had a true democratic system, and partly because one man making all the decisions, including literally life and death ones, is not a democracy, no matter how many people voted for him. All those arguing that one person one vote is the sole cornerstone of a democracy are sadly mistaken. A true democracy also consists of a system of checks and balances, an independent judiciary, who no person is above, the ability of any party to freely campaign anywhere, without fear of violence or murder, and the respect for the people by those they voted for. Thailand has never had these last four, unless you count the military removing a corrupt government as a check and balance? In which case, I’ll accept that on the day of the coup, Thailand was more democratic than it was previously, because a corrupt government was removed. Despite all the spins to the contrary posted here, the coup was, on the whole, popular. There was no organised protest under a charismatic leader, ala 1992, immediately following it. That came later, initially as a violent counter to the PAD, and then as a more organised “bring back Thaksin” movement. Going off topic here I know, but it’s fundamental to the root of this thread and many others.

You simply cannot harp on about national unity (like Abhisit likes to do like a broken record) while clearly not respecting people with a different opinion from your own.

Quite right, and we've all seen how the red leadership, including Thaksin, "respects" the opposing side. Indeed, I doubt very much that Thaksin respects his own side, seeing them as revolution fodder. In the interests of balance, I'd also put Sondhi in the same boat. As we’re often told by both sides, the majority of shirt wearers of both colours are common folk. The single largest division between them at the moment is the fate of Thaksin. It is folly to spout that he is the only way to reconcile them. He is not the cure, he is the disease. How can the rehabilitation of the one man responsible for the division be reconciliation? It’s not, it’s a poke in the eye to the yellows and a win to the reds, (still referring to the common supporters, I couldn't care less if the leaders on both sides had their eyes poked out), and will not solve anything. I’d go so far as to say that Thaksin is not as important as he, and his supporters here, make him out to be, and would be quickly forgotten by the rank and file of both sides should they develop their own true grassroots leaders. Unfortunately, those leaders who could not be corrupted would probably end up missing and / or dead. I don’t have the answers, but I do know Thaksin is not one of them. All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is the silence of a few good men, a species that sadly appears to be extinct in Thai politics. I do believe, however, that Abhisit is a better man morally than Thaksin, Chavalit, Chalerm, Samak, Jatuporn, Newin, Suthep, Sondhi, and all the others currently standing on the stage. I may be grossly mistaken in this, and if so I would freely admit it, but only time will tell. And, until we get the benefit of hindsight, no amount of poisoned foresighting by Thaksin and his goons will change that opinion.

[Samuian]

... but he does know that Abhisit is prone to make mistakes when poked a bit...

Any facts to support this statement? You admit to knowing the thoughts of Thaksin, how often do you speak to him? I’d say that Abhisit was poked about as far as possible over Songkhran, and made the right decision, making your hero look like a clueless whiner on international television to boot. In fact, I’d go as far to say the opposite, and will supply evidence to back it up as well. In 2006, Thaksin seemed desperate to get more support so he sold off AIS to show he was serious about not mixing business with politics. All well and good, but he couldn’t resist the chance to make as much out of the deal as possible, first by using complex share transfers within his family, during which time the shares increased in value by huge amounts, secondly by exploiting a loophole and not paying a sataeng in tax on the deal, and thirdly by changing the law, enabling him to sell to the investment arm of a competing country. In the face of mounting public anger he stubbornly hung on to his position, and refused to defuse it by donating a portion to charity, or some other act of goodwill. He was poked, he made a huge mistake. No doubt the pedantic “he was never convicted of any crimes following this”, by those very same posters who claim to clamour for democracy. Let me ask you, was it ethical? How would a normal MP, let alone the PM, of a truly democratic country have been dealt with if found doing the same? Another example? His interview on CNN over Songkhran, he was poked by Jim Clancy and blundered on, reading his prepared script about how he hoped things would have panned out – big mistake. And now this. The smart thing to do would have been to graciously thank Hun Sen for the offer, but decline it. Instead he saw the chance to try and further divide Thailand, and indeed, may even have been one of the architects of the offer, accepted it and is now dithering about what to do. Big mistake.

"he smart thing to do would have been to graciously thank Hun Sen for the offer, but decline it. Instead he saw the chance to try and further divide Thailand, and indeed, may even have been one of the architects of the offer, accepted it and is now dithering about what to do. Big mistake."

Agreed, he is making one after the other because he believes himself he is free of faults, trying every possible u-turn, to turn his fortune, miserable failure, it's NOT one second about his "beloved country" only about his ceased power, influence and of course his "live savings"!

And using the expression "life savings" for 2.2 Billion is just another smack in the face of the havenot's he claimed to bring out of poverty, in this he has reached Mastership but he never had the genuine intention to do so - just using it as the bait and it worked well, for sometime....

Now Abhjisit calling on him to take the countries interests first, before his own, was a good move, pointing in the right direction!