Beer Chang Faces Stiff Competition Next Year

[Lite Beer]

I see him lurking, what does our own resident Light Beer have to say on this issue?

Hopefully we will have some decent beer appearing soon.

Most of the stuff here is awful.

Beer Lao

[givenall]

Finally, some GOOD NEWS! Make mine a Beer Laos, thanks, currently only available in some bars (not that I mind bars, but would like to see it in Carrefour)!

Of the current local product I find Leo and Archa drinkable, as opposed to their respective companies' flagship brands Singha and Chang which are both supremely awful. Variety is the spice of life!

PS- Bring back Mittweida!!!!!

I will not pass any vote on this till I see the beer prices go down

Edited November 12, 2009 by givenall

[Hanimal]

A Good time to introduce good old Arthur Guinness nationally in Thailand. Good for the health, or so they say.

Already available in Thailand. Try some of the Silom bars. Popular with Indians.

[kevinsan]

Miller is opening a huge brewery in central Vietnam. They bought an old milk factory a year ago.

[vicco]

Nothing like a new influx of beer to bring out all the intellectuals. No matter what you like, others will think its awful...no matter what they drink, you will think it's awful.

Never saw a discussion about beer that did not have the same format.... Question,....who really gives a shit....it's just beer....you know... water with a bit of malt and hops...and your own particular sense of taste...or lack of.........

[jackspratt]

Beer, wine and spirits

Thailand immediately reduced its previous 54% tariff on wine to 40%, and will phase the tariff to zero in 2015.

Thailand reduced the previous tariffs on beer and spirits from 60% to 30%. Tariffs will be phased to zero in 2010.

http://www.austrade.gov.au/TAFTA8311/default.aspx

So if I'm reading that tariff article correctly, all beer and spirits made in Australia are going to be sold tariff free starting Jan 1st? So in theory I could go to Villa Market and pick up a 12 pack of Tooheys New cans for 400B? (assuming they stock it)

The article also says that Australian Wine will be tariff free in 2015 and Cheese in 2020! I like this trade agreement...

I cant see imported beers from ASEAN getting any cheaper really. For instance, the 5% import duty on ASEAN drinks today shouldn't have stopped anyone as 0% is not a lot of difference. The reason ASEAN drinks don't find a market here is the excise tax (stamp duty), which would be based on CIF, the transportation cost, the fact that no one in their right mind would want to bring beer to a country just for a few expats to enjoy. If they can't get Thais to drink it today, why would there be a difference in the future? I guess Aussie beers are nice if one like frozen, tasteless beer, but it would still be a lot more expensive than in Australia due to the transportation cost and the excise tax. Also, why bring it into a market if you cant sell it to the Thais because you cant tell them it is here, cant tell them where it is, cant tell them why it is better than local beer? There are going to be a few disappointed expats when the dust settles.

As best as I can tell, there is no excise tax on imported beer - frozen, tasteless, or otherwise.

For this reason, the local brewers have a very real complaint when they are required to pay up to 60% excise on the domestic brews.

Also, you cannot compare the final price of Australian beer in Oz to Thailand. As well as excise tax and GST imposed by the federal government (at the brewery gate), the various states impose liquor licensing taxes of varying amounts at the wholesale level.

ps excise tax and stamp duty are entirely different beasts.

[jfchandler]

Ahh... the state of news reporting in Thailand...

Just got back from lunch and reading a news article in the BKK Post's business section on Thai Bev's plans to spend a lot of money on marketing to try to regain market share from Singha and Leo... Lots of quotes from Mr. Charlie... (I've always wanted to be able to say that without getting in trouble... )

And, strangely enough, the entire BKK Post article was absent any mention of the coming end of tariffs on ASEAN produced beers into Thailand. It spoke solely about all the "great" things Thai Bev is going to be doing on music and beer gardens and marketing to get their market share back up...amid a flat economy and local competition.

Chang beer sucks hairy ... and Singha isn't much better. At least Leo is passable.... Waiting soon for better days.

[wimpy]

Little Creatures from Fremantle please!

[PEP]

My message to Mr. Chang:- In typical Thai fashion if you want a greater market share just increase the price of your product. Seems (?) to work with many other services and products.

[Hanimal]

As best as I can tell, there is no excise tax on imported beer - frozen, tasteless, or otherwise.

For this reason, the local brewers have a very real complaint when they are required to pay up to 60% excise on the domestic brews.

Also, you cannot compare the final price of Australian beer in Oz to Thailand. As well as excise tax and GST imposed by the federal government (at the brewery gate), the various states impose liquor licensing taxes of varying amounts at the wholesale level.

ps excise tax and stamp duty are entirely different beasts.

Today, all imported beers pay a duty to enter the country then pay excise tax based on CIF. Sorry, I always use the word excise tax and wasnt sure if that is called something else in other countries. Duty and excise tax are totally different and only duty affects imports but excise affects both.

[bkkjames]

Nothing like a new influx of beer to bring out all the intellectuals. No matter what you like, others will think its awful...no matter what they drink, you will think it's awful.

Never saw a discussion about beer that did not have the same format.... Question,....who really gives a shit....it's just beer....you know... water with a bit of malt and hops...and your own particular sense of taste...or lack of.........

Spoken like a true wine drinker.

[thaihome]

Thai Bev I believe has a market cap of about 300 Billion baht and more than 90 companies under the umbrella, don't think they will be going broke soon even if Beer Lao comes to town.

One of those companies is TCC, which up untill 2005 owned 25% of Beer Lao. They have since sold that to Carlsberg who now own 50%.

TH

[bkkjames]

Thai Bev I believe has a market cap of about 300 Billion baht and more than 90 companies under the umbrella, don't think they will be going broke soon even if Beer Lao comes to town.

One of those companies is TCC, which up untill 2005 owned 25% of Beer Lao. They have since sold that to Carlsberg who now own 50%.

TH

Where would we be without you TH? I bet you would do well on Jeopardy.

[NinjaGladiator]

Beer Chang is disgusting stuff, bu it has its followers. One night we spent an hour educating this scouser on the bad effect chang has on the body, with all its unregulated brewing tecniques and cheep chemicals. He stopped immediately and ordered a Leo swearing never to touch chang again, 1 wk later he was back in full swing with the chang, asked why? "it's the cheepest way to get where he wants to be" apparently he was having to drink 2x leo to have the same effect.

I think Chang draught is a very nice beer, but I still get a hang-over on it, whereas no other beer gives me hang-overs.

I do agree that we should support the thai beer market in order to support the thai people, but chang should improve the quality of its product.

[Metalgear]

Is Carlsberg made in an ASEAN country?? hmmm.

Aussie beers will qualify. will they include spirits later????

Yes. Calrsberg is from Malaysia but they were kicked out by Chang Beer many years ago after sour J/V relations. Now they are coming back but heard one of their promoters was beaten by thugs , possibly hired to put fear into competitors of Thai beer

[Grey11]

Too bad Corona isn't made in ASEAN. Be nice to see cheaper San Miguel and Beer Lao around though...

Corona, Coors, Budweiser & Miller have cornered the market on advertising in the U.S.. so their brands are stocked at all Supermarkets. Corona, like Coors tastes like water. But they are drinkable. I have drunk plenty when someone gave me one - I just wouldn't spend my money buying it myself. But, Beer Lao, Tiger & Kirin are the only decent Asian beers I have ever drunk. Singha, Leo & Chang taste like crap - very bitter. I hope the price of Heineken will go down a little. Until then I can afford to drink Tiger, which I can only find in the big Supermarkets - Big C & Tesco - where I hate to shop sending my money back to Europe.

[jeffbkk]

Beer Chang owns Beer Lao, and it was rumored to have been coming into Thailand this year, but postponed to next, and now we see the reason why.

Bintang would be a great beer to import via AFTA into Thailand as well next year, as would be Myanmar Beer, which is brewed by Singapore's Tiger in Rangoon. Angkor Beer has been "improved," and isn't too bad now as well.

Carlsberg and Guinness are both brewed in Malaysia, which should also qualify them for AFTA duty priviledges.

Tiger and San Miguel are already hear, but maybe ABC Stout and Anchor (and Anker from Indonesia) will follow?

Forget Aussie beer, as it doesn't qualify under AFTA, and I'm surprised that the separate FTA between Thailan and Australia would allow it in at reduced/nil duty.

The more you look into these various FTA's around Asia and the region, the more confused one gets. For that matter, Thailand's FTA with India should theoretically mean that Kingfisher could come in at reduced/nil duties too!

[Grey11]

Nothing like a new influx of beer to bring out all the intellectuals. No matter what you like, others will think its awful...no matter what they drink, you will think it's awful.

Never saw a discussion about beer that did not have the same format.... Question,....who really gives a shit....it's just beer....you know... water with a bit of malt and hops...and your own particular sense of taste...or lack of.........

Spoken like a true wine drinker.

REAL MEN DRINK BEER, TEQUILA, WHISKEY, ETC. SINCE THIS IS A FAMILY FORUM I WILL NOT MENTION WHAT KIND OF "MAN?" SITS AROUND SIPPING WINE.

Beer drinkers are not all uneducated idiots.

[jamora]

Is Carlsberg made in an ASEAN country?? hmmm.

Aussie beers will qualify. will they include spirits later????

Carlsberg is brewed in Malaysia, and they own 50% of Beer Lao. So there should be a good chance of getting into the Thai market, since they are expanding very aggressively in "developing countries". Saw an interview on CNN with Carlsberg CEO, Jørgen Buhl Rasmussen, announcing that they are looking to expand in the Asian region. So one can only hope!!!

Edited November 12, 2009 by jamora

[rayw]

Beer Lao at 7/11? Sweet!

Beer Lao is divine, stocked up last time I took a relative up to the Golden Triangle onto that Lao island. Had to barter as they were trying to overcharge me for a dozen bottles but got the price down though still sure it is a lot cheaper in Laos itself. Be wonderful to get it here at a nice Chang like price. I also love Chang Draft as it is so much smoother, Chang Light is much smoother too and you stay sober as I don't drink beer specifically to get drunk anyway. I also like Cheers too, and all those beers are at relatively good prices in the supermarkets, though they all have gone up so much with taxes over the past couple of years as we all have seen.

What I really really want to see is some good proper real ale like Wadwoth 6X and Old Speckled Hen but NOT at the ridiculous high prices you see here. On a pension I just cannot justify paying that much for a glass of real beer but I do miss it as lager is like maiden's water in comparison. A nice British Bitter is what I am sure many real ale lovers here would like to see at good supermarket prices. Also Newkie Brown is nice and Harvey's Sussex Bitter from the barrel served at a UK cellar temperature cool but never ice cold. Another way I save beer money is by not paying bar prices but get my beer from supermarkets and drink at home or at my friends places as they do the same too, and I prefer the homely scene anyway with a few good friends, better than those noisy money grabbing bars. Okay bars are good occasionally but just too bloody expensive, and the girls end up costing you more too if you don't watch it I am not tight but don't like throwing monetary away for nothing when there is so much other stuff I am trying to save up to buy, like a new Canon EOS7D camera to upgrade from my current 40D. There is more to life than just drinking beer nice though that is at times.

Edited November 12, 2009 by rayw

[Hanimal]

There seems to be a misunderstanding that the drop in duty is going to make beer companies want to sell in Thailand. Looking at ThaiBev's 2008 figures for beer on their website, the breakdown of the costs included in their revenue includes items like Excise tax, 53.8%, Packaging 12.8%, Raw materials 6.6% and (eliminating some of the other stuff) "Other" which includes transportation 5.3%.

Sending beer from Australia is expensive on transportation costs, though no duty paid at port of entry, but with 53.8% excise tax paid to the government prior to sales, who in their right mind would want to enter the market? Net profit margin there is given as 0.9%. Based on net sales (sales revenue minus the excise tax), that looks like a net profit margin of roughly 1.8%.

There is excise paid on imports of all alcohol; it is listed in the Excise Department's website.

[tonyboy1950]

A Good time to introduce good old Arthur Guinness nationally in Thailand. Good for the health, or so they say.

Already available in Thailand. Try some of the Silom bars. Popular with Indians.

And popular with the Irish as well, of course. Nothing in the world beats, a good fire,good company and a good pint of Guinness , on a cold winters night .

[tonyboy1950]

A Good time to introduce good old Arthur Guinness nationally in Thailand. Good for the health, or so they say.

Already available in Thailand. Try some of the Silom bars. Popular with Indians.

And popular with the Irish as well, of course. Nothing in the world beats, a good fire,good company and a good pint of Guinness , on a cold winters night .

[templedog]

In fact, Australia is NOT a member of ASEAN, but it does have observer status at most ASEAN meetings. I doubt if this would qualify it to export beer to Thailand tariff-free.

Also, I didn't see anything in the article to suggest that non-ASEAN brands would be allowed in tariff free, even if they are brewed in an ASEAN country. I am sure that the Thai beer barons will ensure that all non-ASEAN brands do not qualify for tariff-free entry, so they only have to compete with Bin Tang and Tiger beers (which of course are much better than Thai beers anyway).

Beers being from ASEAN member country's- which means from Singapore if they make any and Australia which has 2 major company's while each one has over 5-10 different beers.

and so on and on and on

He's right! Here is a list of ASEAN nations.

Brunei Darussalam

Indonesia

Cambodia

Lao PDR

Malaysia

Myanmar

Philippines

Singapore

Thailand

Viet Nam

[Jingthing]

So we aren't going to see Beer Lao in 7-11s or Tesco next year, right? Let us know WHEN this is really going to happen. What else matters. Most of us want the Beer Lao and we want it at friendly prices. How odd that is the thing that is so hard to get.

[Hanimal]

Beer Chang is disgusting stuff, bu it has its followers. One night we spent an hour educating this scouser on the bad effect chang has on the body, with all its unregulated brewing tecniques and cheep chemicals. He stopped immediately and ordered a Leo swearing never to touch chang again, 1 wk later he was back in full swing with the chang, asked why? "it's the cheepest way to get where he wants to be" apparently he was having to drink 2x leo to have the same effect.

I think Chang draught is a very nice beer, but I still get a hang-over on it, whereas no other beer gives me hang-overs.

I do agree that we should support the thai beer market in order to support the thai people, but chang should improve the quality of its product.

You just made all that up! Shame on you "Educating" indeed! "Unregulated brewing techniques"? Have you ever been to a Chang brewery? I have been to all three. Latest machinery from Denmark and Germany, the most number of German, Denmark and UK educated brewmasters of any beer company in Thailand if not Asia. A head of breweries with a PhD from Germany. Why are you making up this trash talk? Have you ever seen a chemical breakdown of the beers made in Thailand? Do you know which global beer brand imports food colouring and other chemical additives from Singapore to add to its very expensive premium beer here? The reason people get a hangover is because Chang is 6.4% alcohol and the dehydration caused by Thailand's tropical temperatures. Cheap chemicals - what a load of tosh. All the hops and malt are purchased from Germany, the UK, Australia and the USA. Chang is made with some rice (20% of the raw materials), locally purchased, but then rice is a common adjunct in both eastern and western beers too. The Chang Draught is 100% malt.

[gotlost]

It is about time that Beer Chang and mister Charoen are subjected to normal business rules. Beer Chang became this big on the expense of Singha Beer because they had an defacto Whickey monopoly and therefore any shop who needed Thai Whiskey was forced to buy Chang beer. But I suppose that is all fine when you belong to the Happy few in Thailand. I wonder if Carlsberg will make a re entry another company that got screwed by Charoen.

If my memory serves me correctly, Carlsberg is brewed in the Philippines by the guy who owns PAL, its also brewed in HK and China, not that the last two help

Carlsberg is also brewed in Lao who do think is in with Beer Lao? Good by to that shit beer Chang and but wipe Singha.

[fm2002]

Beer Lao and San Miguel (made in PI) are great, but isn't Japan an ASEAN country ? If so Sapporo and Kirin Ichiban are great beers !

[john b good]

And not before time either.

The monoplolies that Thailand exercises over pretty much everything (from outside the realm) stinks

[john b good]

It would be nice to see "Bier Hoi" available here, but then again it is not pasteurised and has to be drunk the same day that it is brewed.

Edited November 12, 2009 by john b good