Yet Another New Regulation For Retirement Visas

[annabel]

Went to renew my retirement visa with all required documents and proof of funds or so I thought . Went to get Q# and was told , sorry the Q in filled / closed for today (2.30 pm) ...come back tomorrow... BUT then the girl in charge of the Q ticket machine saw stuck in the slot of the machine the last ticket (# 430) that they were going to issue that day and said here....can go.. your lucky day ...last #.... SO happy I was till I got to the officer who was rather sullen to say the least... He shuffles through my papers then my bank account copies and bluntly throws back me back the copies of my fund accounts, 2 of them, one in a 9 month term and the other just a regular fund account. And he tells me = NOT ALLOWED...

I was a little taken back as last year that is what I provided along with my Savings account copies and bank letters. I asked why not allowed and was abruptly told= If you want to know "why" speak to my supervisor and in a very irritated way he gets up and says = follow me and brings to his supervisor's office and of course he wasn't there. He then says wait here ...When the Supervisor came I got a similar answer ... Not Allowed , New Regulation as of last year to which I said , last year I had Fund Account and no problem ...when did the new regulation come ...He repeats Last year ... Ok, well I gave up as obviously I wasn't going to get a clear answer as to WHY not allowed. The supervisor then tells me ...I told you last year that will be new regulation ....What Bull..! I never saw this guy , ever...

Anyway what do I do now ... The officer says go to the bank and move the fund accounts into your savings...and come back with new letter from the Bank ...I explain that the bigger amount is in a 9 month fixed deposit and will be a problem and may take up to a week...(didn't mention to him about the penalty for cashing it in early ).. He then says it's your money tell the bank to give it now or you will change banks and he walks away ...end of discussion ....

Anyway did all the crazy bank stuff and went back couple of days later around 12.15 and Bingo...They are closed for lunch till 1 pm and the Q is full and closed bt I decide to wait and notice on the board that they issue #'s 400 to 420 to be processed from 8.30 to 12.00 then close for 1 hour lunch and then issue #'s 421 to 440 for 1.00 to 4.00 or 4.30 ...So I decide to wait till 1.00

As soon as the girl who takes care of the Q ticket machine comes to unlock it and distribute #'s , everybody jumps up and dashes to her and her power toy (Ticket Machine) pushing and shoving to make sure they get a # before it reaches 440....Me included... hel_l I couldn't afford to waste another day and then get penalized for going over the expiry date of my visa... Strangely enough she issues # 419 to the lady in front of me and I get # 420 ...?? What happened in the morning?? 12.00 o'clock lunch time arrived and couldn't finish the last 2 #'s ??

Anyway I was called within 20 minutes and got it all done and ran out of there like a bat out of hel_l ...What a change in attitude from last year .... no smiling ...all sullen and half asleep and totally unsympathetic ... What happened to them???

[doppa]

just shows you doesn't it, how people can have varying accounts, i was there yesterday, and was in and out within 3omins, very helpful thai girl, who's english was excellent, never mind, you've only got 364 days, 12 hrs and 16mins, left before you can experience it all again.

[lothda]

I wouldn't call that a new regulation. As far as I know the money is only accepted in a normal savings account. That was the rule I learned from day one. If people have been lenient in the past it seems they now got a reminder from their superiors.

[Jingthing]

I wouldn't call that a new regulation. As far as I know the money is only accepted in a normal savings account. That was the rule I learned from day one. If people have been lenient in the past it seems they now got a reminder from their superiors.

This is an area of enforcement that varies office to office, and also changes back and forth over time. I have noticed the visa experts here usually say fund accounts are OK. I never do. I have always said, check your office!

[BigWheelMan]

What is a fund account?

[jfchandler]

I'm assuming the OP is talking about Thai bank time deposits...or fixed term accounts... similar to U.S. CDs???

[mcgriffith]

Fixed deposit accounts.

Terms generally 3, 6, 12 and 24 mo.

Although on promos can be anything- right now I have a 10 month and an 18 mo. from BAY, in addition to a 3 mo. at BBL.

I used several fixed deposit accounts at CM Imm late Sept this year for a retirement extension, with no problem.

Sorry to hear the OP had such a tough time.

[Greenside]

I'm interested to hear your story.

I had heard that this might be a problem so when I decided to go the deposit route instead of paying the UK Consulate 2000+ baht for signing a letter I took a leaflet for Kassikorn Bank's 6 month deposit account along to Immigration to check if it would be OK.

I made it clear that it was a fixed term and they assured me that it would be no problem.

By the sound of it, it's lucky I chose not to take them at their word. It's clear that the counter staff don't know what the boys in the back are doing let alone discrepancies between one office and the next...

Sorry for your misfortune and hassle, by the way.

[annabel]

Fixed deposit accounts.

Terms generally 3, 6, 12 and 24 mo.

Although on promos can be anything- right now I have a 10 month and an 18 mo. from BAY, in addition to a 3 mo. at BBL.

I used several fixed deposit accounts at CM Imm late Sept this year for a retirement extension, with no problem.

Sorry to hear the OP had such a tough time.

Yes they did say "Saving Account" or "Fixed Deposit" Account.... but what is the diference between a "Fixed Deposit" Account and a fund account/?? I don't know cause to me sounds like pretty much the same thing

A regular fund account is where you are garantied a certain interest % and a "Term Fund Account" is where you are garantied a higher interest % but you must leave the money in the account anywhere from 3 to 24 months ...mine was 9 months and the monger the term the higher the Interest rate ...

But as I said , last year there was no issue at all using all 3 Accounts being Saving Account, Regular Fund Account and tern Deposit Fund Account and suddenly this Year FUND Accounts = not allowed ??? Problem seems to be with FUND Accounts only and I can't figure out why.. They don't want you to save money and make interest / revenue but only put in money and spend it seems to be the only reson to me for now

[ChiangMaiFun]

Fixed deposit accounts.

Terms generally 3, 6, 12 and 24 mo.

Although on promos can be anything- right now I have a 10 month and an 18 mo. from BAY, in addition to a 3 mo. at BBL.

I used several fixed deposit accounts at CM Imm late Sept this year for a retirement extension, with no problem.

Sorry to hear the OP had such a tough time.

Yes they did say "Saving Account" or "Fixed Deposit" Account.... but what is the diference between a "Fixed Deposit" Account and a fund account/?? I don't know cause to me sounds like pretty much the same thing

A regular fund account is where you are garantied a certain interest % and a "Term Fund Account" is where you are garantied a higher interest % but you must leave the money in the account anywhere from 3 to 24 months ...mine was 9 months and the monger the term the higher the Interest rate ...

But as I said , last year there was no issue at all using all 3 Accounts being Saving Account, Regular Fund Account and tern Deposit Fund Account and suddenly this Year FUND Accounts = not allowed ??? Problem seems to be with FUND Accounts only and I can't figure out why.. They don't want you to save money and make interest / revenue but only put in money and spend it seems to be the only reson to me for now

Can I clarify? sorry I'm still confused... I have 800,000 in Bank of Ayutthaya fixed savings account (2 years I think) surely this is allowed? if not (apart from the obvious why?) could I get it our earlier? what's the issue?

[hmficc]

I wouldn't call that a new regulation. As far as I know the money is only accepted in a normal savings account. That was the rule I learned from day one. If people have been lenient in the past it seems they now got a reminder from their superiors.

There was a meeting a year ago with the big. The Q. was asked and A.-NO FUND ACCOUNTS>

[gotlost]

I wouldn't call that a new regulation. As far as I know the money is only accepted in a normal savings account. That was the rule I learned from day one. If people have been lenient in the past it seems they now got a reminder from their superiors.

There was a meeting a year ago with the big. The Q. was asked and A.-NO FUND ACCOUNTS>

I asked about this in 2005 and 2006 and Immigrations said no long term account must be accessible. Sorry for those that have been caught but thats Thailand.

[jchfriis]

Fixed deposit accounts.

Terms generally 3, 6, 12 and 24 mo.

Although on promos can be anything- right now I have a 10 month and an 18 mo. from BAY, in addition to a 3 mo. at BBL.

I used several fixed deposit accounts at CM Imm late Sept this year for a retirement extension, with no problem.

Sorry to hear the OP had such a tough time.

Yes they did say "Saving Account" or "Fixed Deposit" Account.... but what is the diference between a "Fixed Deposit" Account and a fund account/?? I don't know cause to me sounds like pretty much the same thing

A regular fund account is where you are garantied a certain interest % and a "Term Fund Account" is where you are garantied a higher interest % but you must leave the money in the account anywhere from 3 to 24 months ...mine was 9 months and the monger the term the higher the Interest rate ...

But as I said , last year there was no issue at all using all 3 Accounts being Saving Account, Regular Fund Account and tern Deposit Fund Account and suddenly this Year FUND Accounts = not allowed ??? Problem seems to be with FUND Accounts only and I can't figure out why.. They don't want you to save money and make interest / revenue but only put in money and spend it seems to be the only reson to me for now

Can I clarify? sorry I'm still confused... I have 800,000 in Bank of Ayutthaya fixed savings account (2 years I think) surely this is allowed? if not (apart from the obvious why?) could I get it our earlier? what's the issue?

I don't know anything about fund accounts, but they did accept my TIME DEPOSIT account at TMB just this week.

Chris

[Mario2008]

Immigration wants you to able to access the money. Afterall, they want you to show the money as proof that you have enough to live on. You can't live on it if you can't access it.

[gotlost]

I have always laughed at the regiment of only 400k for marriage and 800k for retirement. Guess their thanking is if your married she is wearing the other 400k and if your retired you need the 800k to party with.

[siggie2]

I have a 5 year executive bond with 2 years left,which has over 5 million bahtin offshore.There are penalties for withdrawing over a certain amount but they will not accept this.If i was struggling for money i wouldnt have a problem drawing this out,but cannot use for retirement visa.

[cloudhopper]

Last year I extended with exactly 800k in a 6 month term account and will be extending again in a couple of weeks (but now must go to MHS) and will report what happens.

AFAIK funds in a term account are always accessible - you just forfeit the interest if you withdraw prematurely.

[Sparkles]

Last year I extended with exactly 800k in a 6 month term account and will be extending again in a couple of weeks (but now must go to MHS) and will report what happens.

AFAIK funds in a term account are always accessible - you just forfeit the interest if you withdraw prematurely.

I have renewed for the last 4 years with a 12 mths fixed term account in both Bangkok and Chiang mai ,nothing was mentioned as a problem last December in CM. You are right money can be withdrawn from a fixed account,might take a few days and a million forms but you do lose your interest benefits which is hardly a big deal as they are so low.If true what a ridiclous requierement ,its still your money.I will tallk to my very helpful Bangkok Bank Manager next week and see what he has to say and report back

[gotlost]

Last year I extended with exactly 800k in a 6 month term account and will be extending again in a couple of weeks (but now must go to MHS) and will report what happens.

AFAIK funds in a term account are always accessible - you just forfeit the interest if you withdraw prematurely.

I have renewed for the last 4 years with a 12 mths fixed term account in both Bangkok and Chiang mai ,nothing was mentioned as a problem last December in CM. You are right money can be withdrawn from a fixed account,might take a few days and a million forms but you do lose your interest benefits which is hardly a big deal as they are so low.If true what a ridiclous requierement ,its still your money.I will tallk to my very helpful Bangkok Bank Manager next week and see what he has to say and report back

Bank Manager is not Immigrations.

[Sparkles]

Last year I extended with exactly 800k in a 6 month term account and will be extending again in a couple of weeks (but now must go to MHS) and will report what happens.

AFAIK funds in a term account are always accessible - you just forfeit the interest if you withdraw prematurely.

I have renewed for the last 4 years with a 12 mths fixed term account in both Bangkok and Chiang mai ,nothing was mentioned as a problem last December in CM. You are right money can be withdrawn from a fixed account,might take a few days and a million forms but you do lose your interest benefits which is hardly a big deal as they are so low.If true what a ridiclous requierement ,its still your money.I will tallk to my very helpful Bangkok Bank Manager next week and see what he has to say and report back

Bank Manager is not Immigrations.

Thanks for clearing that up. He processes many letters ,for immigration, for foreigners each week and I would think know if there have been problems recently.Allright ?

[gotlost]

Last year I extended with exactly 800k in a 6 month term account and will be extending again in a couple of weeks (but now must go to MHS) and will report what happens.

AFAIK funds in a term account are always accessible - you just forfeit the interest if you withdraw prematurely.

I have renewed for the last 4 years with a 12 mths fixed term account in both Bangkok and Chiang mai ,nothing was mentioned as a problem last December in CM. You are right money can be withdrawn from a fixed account,might take a few days and a million forms but you do lose your interest benefits which is hardly a big deal as they are so low.If true what a ridiclous requierement ,its still your money.I will tallk to my very helpful Bangkok Bank Manager next week and see what he has to say and report back

Bank Manager is not Immigrations.

Thanks for clearing that up. He processes many letters ,for immigration, for foreigners each week and I would think know if there have been problems recently.Allright ?

I know some very good Bank Managers in Chiang Mai but at the end of the day even with their contacts and insight it comes down to you and the immigration official. Bank Managers are there to protect and make money for their bank and really have very little repose with immigration.

[annabel]

Fixed deposit accounts.

Terms generally 3, 6, 12 and 24 mo.

Although on promos can be anything- right now I have a 10 month and an 18 mo. from BAY, in addition to a 3 mo. at BBL.

I used several fixed deposit accounts at CM Imm late Sept this year for a retirement extension, with no problem.

Sorry to hear the OP had such a tough time.

Yes they did say "Saving Account" or "Fixed Deposit" Account.... but what is the diference between a "Fixed Deposit" Account and a fund account/?? I don't know cause to me sounds like pretty much the same thing

A regular fund account is where you are garantied a certain interest % and a "Term Fund Account" is where you are garantied a higher interest % but you must leave the money in the account anywhere from 3 to 24 months ...mine was 9 months and the monger the term the higher the Interest rate ...

But as I said , last year there was no issue at all using all 3 Accounts being Saving Account, Regular Fund Account and tern Deposit Fund Account and suddenly this Year FUND Accounts = not allowed ??? Problem seems to be with FUND Accounts only and I can't figure out why.. They don't want you to save money and make interest / revenue but only put in money and spend it seems to be the only reson to me for now

Can I clarify? sorry I'm still confused... I have 800,000 in Bank of Ayutthaya fixed savings account (2 years I think) surely this is allowed? if not (apart from the obvious why?) could I get it our earlier? what's the issue?

I'm also still confused but you should be ok as they said= "Fixed Saving account " or "Saving Account" Only.... I still don't see the difference ...if it's a fixed account whether a Savings Account or a Fund Account it's still fixed and can only be wihdrawn with a penalty on the interest.... But someone just told me that FUND ACCOUNT is not acceptable to them as FUND ACCOUNTS ARE NOT GARANTIED BY THE BANK OF THAILAND.... ok, now that would make sense ..

My other Fund account is not FIXED and money can be wthdrawn anytime with a one day notice so has nothing to do with the money being accessible or not as mentioned by Mario cause that one too they rejected.... SO it looks like it's just FUND Accounts that are not acceptable

[lopburi3]

Savings accounts and fixed deposit savings accounts are normally accepted. Fund accounts are not cash accounts and are not normally accepted. And that is what those who know the visa process tell people in the visa section.

[ChiangMaiFun]

Savings accounts and fixed deposit savings accounts are normally accepted. Fund accounts are not cash accounts and are not normally accepted. And that is what those who know the visa process tell people in the visa section.

Is is safer for me to get the money into a 'normal' savings account? and lose the interest? bearing in mind the 3 month rule?

[mcgriffith]

Yeah, lopburi3 has it right.

I think I have this nomenclature figured out.

The OP has money in a "Fund" account.

That is a mutual fund account; in US terms either a mutual fund holding equities (stocks) or fixed income investments (bonds, or preferred stocks). Or a combination of the above. In Brit terms, stocks or gilts (corporate bonds).

These type of accounts are not considered OK for the visa/extension regimen.

Fixed income accounts here are like a CD. They are a form of money market account.

I have included them in my visa extension successfully for the last few years, and am pretty sure that they still are accepted. Used them 2 months ago at CM Imm with no problem.

Accounts with a stock or bond component have never been accepted for a visa extension, as far as I know.

The issue is that most of the major Thai banks sell securities (funds) as well as savings and other money market instruments.

Sounds like the OP was sold a fund (mutual fund) account at her bank, not knowing that it would not qualify under Thai immigration law as valid monies for the retirement extension requirement.

[ChiangMaiFun]

Yeah, lopburi3 has it right.

I think I have this nomenclature figured out.

The OP has money in a "Fund" account.

That is a mutual fund account; in US terms either a mutual fund holding equities (stocks) or fixed income investments (bonds, or preferred stocks). Or a combination of the above. In Brit terms, stocks or gilts (corporate bonds).

These type of accounts are not considered OK for the visa/extension regimen.

Fixed income accounts here are like a CD. They are a form of money market account.

I have included them in my visa extension successfully for the last few years, and am pretty sure that they still are accepted. Used them 2 months ago at CM Imm with no problem.

Accounts with a stock or bond component have never been accepted for a visa extension, as far as I know.

The issue is that most of the major Thai banks sell securities (funds) as well as savings and other money market instruments.

Sounds like the OP was sold a fund (mutual fund) account at her bank, not knowing that it would not qualify under Thai immigration law as valid monies for the retirement extension requirement.

Got it... thanks - now you have explained it I would have (sort of) assumed that mixed funds would not be eligible - I count my 800k as 'dead' money in a seperate savings account - there only for visa purposes. Just part of the 'deal' of living here... I guess some cannot afford to do that and it's tougher on them trying to get the 800 together or trying to prove income etc.

[Mapguy]

Yeah, lopburi3 has it right.

I think I have this nomenclature figured out.

The OP has money in a "Fund" account.

That is a mutual fund account; in US terms either a mutual fund holding equities (stocks) or fixed income investments (bonds, or preferred stocks). Or a combination of the above. In Brit terms, stocks or gilts (corporate bonds).

These type of accounts are not considered OK for the visa/extension regimen.

Fixed income accounts here are like a CD. They are a form of money market account.

I have included them in my visa extension successfully for the last few years, and am pretty sure that they still are accepted. Used them 2 months ago at CM Imm with no problem.

Accounts with a stock or bond component have never been accepted for a visa extension, as far as I know.

The issue is that most of the major Thai banks sell securities (funds) as well as savings and other money market instruments.

Sounds like the OP was sold a fund (mutual fund) account at her bank, not knowing that it would not qualify under Thai immigration law as valid monies for the retirement extension requirement.

This is a correct understanding of the types of accounts and what is permitted by immigration. Always has been so, as I far as I know, and I have heard immigration officials confirm it from time to time.

[annabel]

Yeah, lopburi3 has it right.

I think I have this nomenclature figured out.

The OP has money in a "Fund" account.

That is a mutual fund account; in US terms either a mutual fund holding equities (stocks) or fixed income investments (bonds, or preferred stocks). Or a combination of the above. In Brit terms, stocks or gilts (corporate bonds).

These type of accounts are not considered OK for the visa/extension regimen.

Fixed income accounts here are like a CD. They are a form of money market account.

I have included them in my visa extension successfully for the last few years, and am pretty sure that they still are accepted. Used them 2 months ago at CM Imm with no problem.

Accounts with a stock or bond component have never been accepted for a visa extension, as far as I know.

The issue is that most of the major Thai banks sell securities (funds) as well as savings and other money market instruments.

Sounds like the OP was sold a fund (mutual fund) account at her bank, not knowing that it would not qualify under Thai immigration law as valid monies for the retirement extension requirement.

This is a correct understanding of the types of accounts and what is permitted by immigration. Always has been so, as I far as I know, and I have heard immigration officials confirm it from time to time.

It still baffles me because I had no problem last year getting my visa extension and showing the required 800 K using the very same Fund Account for a portion of it ... So no, It was not always like that or the officer made a mistake last year...??

[SwaziBird]

Savings accounts and fixed deposit savings accounts are normally accepted. Fund accounts are not cash accounts and are not normally accepted. And that is what those who know the visa process tell people in the visa section.

Is is safer for me to get the money into a 'normal' savings account? and lose the interest? bearing in mind the 3 month rule?

This is,really not as big an issue as we might imagine ( if the amount is moderate ).

A savings account yields a miserably small amount of interest - but is tax free.

A fixed deposit yields a marginally larger amount of interest which is still miserably small - but automatically has 15% ( when I last looked) tax deducted.

The difference between the two is miserably small - hardly worth hassling over. Do the figures for a year yourself and see what you come up with.

Enough to , perhaps , treat yourself to one decent meal and a concert !

My recommendation is to leave whatever you need for immigration purposes in a savings account. Skip the meal and concert. Have an easy time at Immigration.

Cheers.

Edited December 7, 2009 by SwaziBird

[mcgriffith]

Yeah, annabel...I think what happened is that last year they just didn't catch it (the "Funds" account, that is).

It used to be that Immigration wouldn't accept anything but simple savings accounts paying very low interest.

That was as recently as 2006, when I did my first retirement extension.

Then I believe around mid-year 2007 there was a policy change. I read about it on the Thai Visa Immigration/Visa sub-forum. Some members posted that fixed deposit accounts (like a CD; a form of money market account) were being accepted. That year I moved a goodly chunk of my 800K to a fixed deposit. And have used them successfully since then.

The deal with an account holding stocks, bonds or other securities...I don't know.

Maybe a member who uses or has used such an account to qualify for the 800K retirement extension, can enlighten us? Maybe even a brokerage account not held at a bank?

AFAIK, just a simple savings account, or a fixed deposit account at a Thai bank is the only thing they accept.