Thaksin Orders Control Of SIM Cards

[george]

PM orders control of 'sim cards'

BANGKOK: -- The government is launching a 'sim card order', especially in Thailand's southern border region, to control the current spate of insurgency in the region, according to Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

The prime minister told journalists here this afternoon that the Ministry of Information and Communications Technology (ICT) and the National Communications Commission (NTC) would jointly take care of the task.

"I've instructed the ICT Ministry and the NTC to jointly launch the 'sim card order' to control the sale of mobile phones' sim cards of all companies, particularly those sold in the country's three southern border provinces of Yala, Narathiwat and Pattani", he told the journalists after returning from Songkran celebrations with his family in Chiang Mai, his hometown, in the northern region.

"The new order, which may include the record of users' ID numbers, will help security officers to trace back for records of any mobile phones' users who may involve in the southern insurgency", he noted.

The government's new move followed frequent reports on southern insurgents' using mobile phones to detonate destructive explosives in the region.

The prime minister affirmed, however, that the government would respect the privacy of mobile phone users in general, and would seek only for specific records, if necessary, to help track down suspected insurgents.

--TNA 2005-04-16

[Erwin1011]

Ah...the old chinees syndrome: total control over the population. One notch at the time.

[penzman]

He's a big George Bush fan.

[ovenman]

The government is launching a 'sim card order', especially in Thailand's southern border region, to control the current spate of insurgency in the region, according to Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra.

The only people that this 'order' will help apprehend are the real stupid baddies who would use a phone registered in their name to blow up stuff. It would still be easy enough to obtain a prepaid SIM in Malaysia or any other country where no such registration is required. It would still be easy enough to steal a phone to obtain its SIM. It would still be easy enough to rob a phone store to obtain SIM cards. It would be easy enough to use a fake ID when purchasing a SIM card.

To me, this 'order' is akin to making people register to purchase an alarm clock because you've determined they have been used to construct time bombs. It's fine if the government wants to record an ID when users purchase a SIM card, there are other countries that do this, but it's naive to think that somehow this will reduce the usage of phone-detonated bombs.

[stumonster]

So mr 't' is saying that as of yet they have not yet tracked down all the imei numbers of phones making calls through the mobile towers in the vicinity when the remote control bombs exploded - especially the ones whose calls terminated at the instant of detonation. And these phones with the suspect imei numbers have not been triangulated , or flagged to secondhand mobileshops ( who are supposed to by law get ID numbers when accepting second hands phones for sale ) .

mate - I was of the understanding that mr't' was a technical whiz - oh how easily my illusions are shattered!!

[astral]

India has a similar ruling.

Copy of ID card or passport needed to buy a SIM, but otherwise not a big hassle.

[stumonster]

the imei number of the phone does not change when you change the sim card.

it is hardware encoded to the phone ( press *#06# and you will see the 15 digit number )

[Dah fahrang]

Another 'brilliant' idea from the PM!

Expect it to be another resounding success - just like the dropping origami birds brought about instant peace and understanding.

[DualCitizen]

Although I agree that this will not stop people from using mobile phones as remote detonators (some of the methodology was was already touched upon by ovenman), it is by no means an unreasonable request to have an ID with a SIM card purchase. If anything, I am surprised they don't already require this.

Of course now and then, criminals can be very careless/idiotic, so maybe they will catch the occasional bomber.

I don't believe that there is any country that says that their citizens have a right to utilize telecommunications in absolute anonimity (If someone out there knows otherwise, please share with the rest of us, as I would love to know). However, if the Thai government resorted to listening in on phone calls for no justifiable reason, which they probably do anyway, then that is a different matter altogether.

In other words, asking for IDs for SIMs is not an issue of invasion of privacy.

Stumonster - I am puzzled as to why you are so fixated on the imei number. If anything, the criminals would just throw away the phones after they have used them. They could even burn them, since people seem to be free to privately burn trash as they see fit. Also, there is still the issue of stolen phones, fake IDs, ect... Or is there something in your posts that I am missing?

[stumonster]

Stumonster - I am puzzled as to why you are so fixated on the imei number.  If anything, the criminals would just throw away the phones after they have used them.  They could even burn them, since people seem to be free to privately burn trash as they see fit.  Also, there is still the issue of stolen phones, fake IDs, ect...  Or is there something in your posts that I am missing?

yes - unless they immediately got rid of(destroyed) the phone it could be used to get a location and/or identifying information.

[Golf]

As many pointed out, it's a wireless thing. You cannot control it, particulatlly with this method. I'd like Mr. Toxin to think and think hard on how to put an end to this crisis. Stop playing round and deal with the situation head on.

FYI: In Koran, it said that 1000 birds are in the sky. They have come to destroy the holy city and its people. The birds are considered evils to the Moslims. And Thai government just dropped them...

Golf

[george]

Update:

New mobile phone regulations to curb southern violence

BANGKOK: -- Thailand’s National Security Council (NSC) is working on guidelines to regulate the sale of mobile phone cards, known as 'SIM cards' to help reduce the violence in the country’s deep South, according to Deputy Prime Minister and Interior Minister Pol. Gen. Chidchai Vanasatidya.

The move comes after a recent spate of bomb blasts in the country's southern border provinces, where attackers used mobile phones to trigger explosive devices.

Pre-paid vouchers for mobile phone can be bought at any convenience store throughout Thailand.

Government officials are considering making it

compulsory to show an ID card or passport to purchase a SIM card in the future.

“Any measure to regulate mobile phones must strike the right balance between individual rights and security concerns,” Prime Minister Thaksin

Shinawatra said here Monday morning.

Any rule which is introduced to control the sale of mobile phones and SIM cards must cover the whole country, and not just the three southern border provinces of Yala, Narathiwat and Pattani, Mr. Thaksin told journalists after chairing a meeting of security agencies.

The prime minister’s family owns the country’s biggest mobile phone service provider--AIS.

The NSC is working on a set of guidelines to be

submitted to the prime minister for approval, Pol. Gen. Chidchai told journalists on Monday.

Requiring ID cards and passports is only one of several measures under consideration to prevent insurgents using mobile phones to trigger bomb

blasts, he said.

Meanwhile, an expert questioned the effectiveness of relying on regulating the sale of mobile phone vouchers to deal with the insurgents.

Instead, the government should focus on improving its intelligence in order to prevent future insurgents' attacks, he said.

The only technical option available to the government to stop bomb attacks is to disable signal transmissions in the whole area,

according to the IT security expert, Prinya Hom-anek.

This, of course, would affect all members of the public, he added.

Expensive equipment is needed to selectively disable specific phone numbers, he said.

Therefore, the most effective solution is detailed intelligence and warning systems, he said

--TNA 2005-04-19

[chuchok]

You can actually buy Prepaid SIM cards from Asian countries that "roam"....so if you were really serious,wouldn't you do something like that?

[Nam Kao]

>>>>FYI: In Koran, it said that 1000 birds are in the sky. They have come to destroy the holy city and its people.

Golf, yes the Kookran is correct, except these birds will be US fighters/bombers/missiles.

-nam

[Golf]

>>>>FYI: In Koran, it said that 1000 birds are in the sky. They have come to destroy the holy city and its people.

  Golf, yes the Kookran is correct, except these birds will be US fighters/bombers/missiles.

-nam

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Absolutely! We're living in a very disturbing period when the olny world super power can invade any countries with or without reasons.

Golf

[george]

IDs to be mandatory for SIM cards

Bid to end bombings triggered by mobiles

BANGKOK: -- The government will make it mandatory for people to produce either national ID cards or passports when buying SIM cards for prepaid mobile phones in its latest effort to nail separatist bombers in the South.

In addition, all existing 21.5 million prepaid Thai and foreign mobile phone system users in Thailand will have to report their citizenship identification or passport numbers to their respective phone operators within six months.

Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra said the Information Communication Technology Ministry (ICT) had consulted with the National Telecommunications Commission (NTC) on tightening regulations on SIM cards in prepaid mobile phones that were often used by insurgents to remotely detonate bombs.

The measures were agreed on at a meeting yesterday hosted by the ICT. Joining the session were national security agencies, the Royal Thai Police Office, the NTC, TOT Corporation, CAT Telecom, Thai Mobile, the Telecommunications Association of Thailand, True Corporation and all private mobile phone operators.

Previously, prepaid phone users were not asked for their ID when they wanted SIM cards. They simply visited the nearest convenience store to buy one, no questions asked. Easy availability has seen SIM cards fall into the wrong hands. Separatist militants have bought SIM cards for phones used to set off bombs.

The government warned that phone services would be cancelled if users failed to meet the SIM card registration deadline.

The government decided on the ID measures so authorities could easily trace SIM card users. Current users will need to contact their network operators to provide ID information.

Mr Thaksin cautioned, however, that traceability must not undermine SIM card sales and customer privacy.

``For example, customers only have to produce the 13-digit serial number on their cards and nothing else. The data will be called up by computer to let the authorities know who bought the SIM card,'' he said.

Mr Thaksin said the government needed to locate bombers swiftly. He made it clear the regulation would serve only security purposes.

Kanawat Wasingsungworn, assistant to the ICT minister, said the SIM card database was designed to counter terrorism in the South. The government would seek cooperation from mobile phone service providers to institute the mandatory registration. Companies might consider airtime giveaways as an incentive.

Mr Kanawat said checking foreign-origin SIM cards brought into the country would not be difficult as roaming numbers could track masterminds in the event of separatist attacks.

TOT and CAT engineers would assist in background checks.

CAT Telecom said operators would like a law enacted to allow the deactivation of customers' mobile phones without infringing upon consumer rights.

The prime minister said the controls would apply nationwide rather than in specific locations to prevent potential saboteurs from buying cards elsewhere to launch attacks in separatist hotspots.

Deputy Prime Minister Chidchai Wannasathit said the regulation would be proposed in writing for Mr Thaksin to look at before it went into effect.

In practice, he said, SIM card buyers would most likely have to produce at least a photocopy of their national ID card for proper registration.

Submission of citizenship information would complement measures already in place to cut off phone signals at bomb sites to prevent secondary blasts.

Pol Gen Chidchai said the regulation would be one of many being drawn up to end the cycle of violence in the deep South. ``There will also be technical measures. This is only one piece of the puzzle,'' he said.

DTAC chief executive Vichai Bencha-rongkul said registration may inconvenience subscribers but his company was ready to cooperate. There would be no limit on how many SIM cards customers could buy.

Bangkok Senator Seri Suwannapanont was sceptical the controls would put an end to bomb attacks since copies of ID cards could be easily forged.

--Bangkok Post 2005-04-19

[ovenman]

Bangkok Senator Seri Suwannapanont was sceptical the controls would put an end to bomb attacks since copies of ID cards could be easily forged.

Ahhh... the lone voice of reason an a deep sea of b.s. Sorry, but for any number of reasons that have been already outlined in this thread, this measure won't do dick to make the South any more secure, but everybody gets to shuffle a lot of paper and feel like they are doing something about the problem.

I don't have any qualms amout complying with this measure. I had to produce the same paperwork (i.e. a copy of my passport) when purchasing SIMs in Italy, India and Singapore. Even in those countries though, I really think this is more of a bureaucratic paper shuffle than anything else.

It'll undoubtedly be a lot of fun collecting the required paperwork from all of the prepaid SIM users extant in Thailand but India managed to do the same after instituting a similar policy. I suppose that it will get done here as well.

Edited April 19, 2005 by ovenman

[Maejo Man]

Just when you thought you had seen everything that the Head waiter had in his little box, he comes up with a completely unworkable gem like this, and floors us once again. Still it's going to provide plenty of employment for somebody....but..... who is going to foot the wages bill?

[Orion76]

Now watch cellphone robbery sharply increase in the South.

[astral]

Does this mean the requirement, for farangs who want to own a phone to have a work permit, has been rescinded??

[george]

Update:

Interior minister stresses need to regulate SIM cards sale

BANGKOK: -- The government needs to regulate the sale of SIM cards for prepaid cell phones to help reduce the violence in the country’s southern border provinces, the Deputy prime Minister and Interior Minister Police General Chidchai Vanasatidya told journalists on Tuesday

The practice is common in developed countries, he said. The minister also urged the public to cooperate with the planned measures.

The minister was responding to criticism that the proposed regulation would violate peoples’ rights.

Illegal SIM cards smuggled into Thailand from foreign countries also needed to be controlled, he said.

''We need to address the illegal use of SIM cards from Malaysia in our southern border provinces. However, I cannot reveal how we will do it,'' he said.

Violent unrest has plagued Thailand’s three southern-most provinces near the Malaysian border since early last year.

Suspected insurgents have been using mobile phones to trigger bombs blasts.

The new regulation will require anyone purchasing a SIM card to show their identity cards or passport.

''It is not only to prevent violence in southern border provinces but it is time for our country to regulate the SIM cards sale as a matter of national security,'' said Pol. Gen. Chidchai.

The police are constantly concerned that criminals are also using prepaid cell phones, he said.

--TNA 2005-04-19

[ovenman]

Illegal SIM cards smuggled into Thailand from foreign countries also needed to be controlled, he said.

''We need to address the illegal use of SIM cards from Malaysia in our southern border provinces. However, I cannot reveal how we will do it,'' he said.

These little gems intrigue me. Illegal in what sense? What are they planning to do, ban the roaming use of cell phones from Malaysia because obviously anybody from Malaysia that is trying to use their phone while in Thailand is a terrorist?

[bkk_mike]

Does this mean the requirement, for farangs who want to own a phone to have a work permit, has been rescinded??

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Farangs can have a phone without a work permit, so long as you just get a pay as you go phone sim. (i.e. one2call)

You only need a work permit to get a subscription service. (i.e. monthly bills sent to your house...)

Admittedly, I can see how it can work for people getting new SIM cards. But for people with existing SIMs - are they going to disable your phone because they don't have your ID? If so, when?

[Jack Jones]

So I have a 121 card. What do I have to do to not lose my number. I'm currently in the UK but will be in Thailand next month.

[ovenman]

But for people with existing SIMs - are they going to disable your phone because they don't have your ID? If so, when?

That's exactly what they did in India a couple years back. I don't recollect what the time frame was that phone users had to get into compliance.

[ovenman]

So I have a 121 card. What do I have to do to not lose my number. I'm currently in the UK but will be in Thailand next month.

There has been no compliance date announced yet as far as I know. I wouldn't worry about it if you'll be in Thailand next month. A ton of paperwork will need to get shuffled to get every prepaid user registered. The initial registration period will in no way be over in a month's time.

[Sunny Valentine]

Sidenote: Amazing, that a retirment Visa (which is issued on mandatory transfer of about 10 times the average yearly Thai wages from abroad) is not sufficient for getting a postpaid phone. A foreign VISA Gold card is not sufficient either.

But my wife (jobless at the time of the transaction, which was before we registered our marriage) got a post-paid contract without problems, for me, under her name.

TIT

Sunny

[opalhort]

So I have a 121 card. What do I have to do to not lose my number. I'm currently in the UK but will be in Thailand next month.

There has been no compliance date announced yet as far as I know. I wouldn't worry about it if you'll be in Thailand next month. A ton of paperwork will need to get shuffled to get every prepaid user registered. The initial registration period will in no way be over in a month's time.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The original article mentions:

"In addition, all existing 21.5 million prepaid Thai and foreign mobile phone system users in Thailand will have to report their citizenship identification or passport numbers to their respective phone operators within six months."

opalhort

[ovenman]

There has been no compliance date announced yet as far as I know.

The original article mentions:

"In addition, all existing 21.5 million prepaid Thai and foreign mobile phone system users in Thailand will have to report their citizenship identification or passport numbers to their respective phone operators within six months."

The OvenMan stands corrected!

[rocky]

In addition, all existing 21.5 million prepaid Thai and foreign mobile phone system users in Thailand will have to report their citizenship identification or passport numbers to their respective phone operators within six months.

maybe we are getting a time frame of six months