Laos, Hmong Refugee Crisis: Thailand’s Pm Abhisit, Anupong Should Stop Forced Returns

[churchill]

WASHINGTON & VIENTIANE, Laos - (Business Wire) As the Southeast Asia (SEA) Games open in Laos, The Honorable Howard Eugene Douglas, the former Ambassador at Large and U.S. Refugee Affairs Coordinator, has issued a statement on the Lao Hmong refugee crisis in Thailand and Laos. Douglas and the Center for Public Policy Analysis (CPPA) are urging Thailand’s Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva to seriously address this humanitarian crisis and emancipate the Lao Hmong refugees for resettlement abroad.

"Tragically, Lao Hmong political refugees who fled egregious human rights violations and religious persecution are still enduring unspeakable violence and forced repatriation from Thailand back to the Stalinist military regime in Laos that they fled," said Philip Smith, Director of the CPPA in Washington, D.C. http://centerforpublicpolicyanalysis.org

continued at http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/la...s,1080803.shtml

[Scott]

The repatriation of all potential refugees, and the Hmong certainly fall into this category, should be conducted only under the guidance of the UNHCR.

Their care and protection should be assured by the Thai gov't until a solution to their situation can be found.

[Dragonmode]

The repatriation of all potential refugees, and the Hmong certainly fall into this category, should be conducted only under the guidance of the UNHCR.

Their care and protection should be assured by the Thai gov't until a solution to their situation can be found.

Well said.

[Credo]

In spite of the political situation, Thailand has made a lot of progress in numerous areas. The treatment of migrants and refugees, isn't one of them. Generally, in the past they haven't treated them badly, they just have failed to treat them well. Starting with the Rohyingas it seems like it is getting worse.

[BSJ]

More efforts should be directed at the power brokers in Laos with the intent to settle this dispute that has it's roots back in WW2.

[Scott]

That's true and it's one of the reason that UNHCR needs to be involved. First of all, they can assist in getting those who face a well-founded fear of persecution resettled and those that must be returned to the country can be monitored and protected. It also means that aid and resettlement assistance can be given to those that are returned.

Otherwise, you have further marginalization of the Hmong and this in turn leads to less opportunities and the likelihood that political problems will be exacerbated.

[Asa]

Not all Lao displaced persons are refugees. U.S. and western countries are screening non refugees out from resettlement program, and will leave them here in Thailand. the same applies for Burmese displaced persons. Thousands of Loas Hmongs are stranded at Huai Nam Kao in Khao Kor, Petchabun with their cousin Thai Hmongs, after leaving en mass from Tham Krabok, Saraburi and Thai treats them well enough.

For Lohinga case, Royal Thai Navy treat them in the same way Royal Australian Navy would treat the Rohinga, period.

Should the west and UNHCR care to take them all out of Thailand, They will be very much welcome to the Kingdom as future American tourists.

[Credo]

Asylum seekers who are screened out and therefore denied refugee status can then be safely repatriated to their home country. If they didn't have a claim to persecution there is no reason for them to remain in Thailand. Some governments don't take too kindly to being accused by the asylum seekers of mistreatment and that is the reason that the UN involvement in the repatriation is important.

A lot of people who seek asylum are not persecuted. They are discriminated against and they aren't treated well, but they aren't persecuted.

Once they are granted refugee status then the UN is quite good about putting pressure on governments to take them for resettlement. The ones who voice the loudest complaints then get to put their money where their mouth is.

Whether other countries treat refugees poorly or not is not the question. The Australians don't have a stellar record, however, they are trying to fund refugee camps in Indonesia and a lot of the poorer countries are quite content to let them stay as long as someone is footing the bill. In the meantime, if they are screened and determined to be refugees, you can bet that a lot of pressure will be put on Burma (Myanmar) to start cleaning up its act and since the pressure comes for a lot of different angles, they sometimes do.

[BSJ]

Hi Credo, you mentioned Australia in the last post. Away from the questions "Why should we accept any illegal aliens arriving here by boat?" and "Who the he11 are they anyway???" we have infer-structure problems.

Our water resources are limited.

Our arable land is limited.

Public housing is limited.

Our social welfare system is stretched.

Jobs for unskilled labour are diminishing.

and cultural differences are starting to raise ugly and violent issues.

So there is more to the arguement than will we or won't we!

[Sweet Dreams]

Some of the Hmong ARE screened, but Thailand will not grant exit Visas.

Some of the Hmong are screened and have Resettlement Visas to Third Countries, but Thailand will not grant exit Visas

UNHCR is not officially recognised in Thailand.

This whole issue is not being handled well and is not as straightforward as saying things like ''Get the UNHCR involved'' or ''let other Governments come in and take care of the situation''!

[palusa]

Not all Lao displaced persons are refugees. U.S. and western countries are screening non refugees out from resettlement program, and will leave them here in Thailand. the same applies for Burmese displaced persons. Thousands of Loas Hmongs are stranded at Huai Nam Kao in Khao Kor, Petchabun with their cousin Thai Hmongs, after leaving en mass from Tham Krabok, Saraburi and Thai treats them well enough.

For Lohinga case, Royal Thai Navy treat them in the same way Royal Australian Navy would treat the Rohinga, period.

Should the west and UNHCR care to take them all out of Thailand, They will be very much welcome to the Kingdom as future American tourists?.

Hi ASA. mate are you for real regarding the statement "Thai treat them well"? Mate just jump in your car or on your bike and go to the main road where you stay, Mae Chan, watch the big, daily 24 hour road block there, watch as the Thai police harass, take goods from and then blackmail their REFUGEE victims into giving them any money and valuables they might have. ASA dont please qualify this procedure as treating people well because its what is known as burying your head in the sand, propoganda or simply spouting crap. Anyone reading this can see the disgusting event any day of the week held on the main highway just before Mae Chan on the Chiang Rai to Mae Sai road.

Do you honestly think the Australian navy would do as you say in treating the Rohinga the same as the unaccountable Thai navy is doing?, come on man wake up, the clue was in the wording un/accountable. Period?, yeh my freind with words like yours you must be about due that time of the month.

Many of the Thai Yai tribe have lived in Thailand for more than a thousand years, these people stand for the Thai national anthem, have the Thai flag in their homes, love the Thai king, are loyal to Thailand yet with all this they are persecuted, abused, robbed and cheated by the Thai establishment. ASA why should these guys be sent away to come, assuming the same arguement applies. to be allowed back as American tourists?, they have probably been here longer than your family and have the right, or as much right to be Thai and treated with fairness as you are. Irrespective of nationality they have the basic human right to be treated with respect, do you agree?

[speleo]

Thousands of Loas Hmongs are stranded at Huai Nam Kao in Khao Kor, Petchabun with their cousin Thai Hmongs, after leaving en mass from Tham Krabok, Saraburi and Thai treats them well enough.

These refugees crossed the border into Loei from Laos about 3 years ago - they didn't come from Tham Krabok. The Thai authorities banned the local Hmong from looking after the Lao Hmong, so the refugees ended up in temporary shelters beside the road before moving into a camp. As for the Thai treating them well enough - Medicine Sans Frontiers withdrew from working in the camp citing interference from the Thai authorities, apart from UNHCR no other NGOs are allowed in the camp and the Thai and Lao military are alledged to have forceably repatriated many, including unacccompanied children.

[hansnl]

Everywhere in the world there seem to be political refugees.

In the Netherlands, where a friend is working for the IND (Immigration and Naturalisation service) somewhere in the main office there is a steel office cupboard, filled with party stuff.

This cupboard is closed, normally, and will be opened 2-3 times a year.

Then a party is thrown, big one, for all the staff.

They have that party because they found a real political refugee.

One of his bosses last year stated, that of all the so-called political refugees, 95% was almost certainly economically motivated.

And definitely not political

Now, I just wonder, what motives the UNCHR is having.

That office really does not have a track record of non-biased exploits.

[Scott]

Let's take care not to flame other posters. It's perfectly fine to disagree with them, but don't let it get personal. It's an important subject and it involves both Thailand and a lot of our own countries. Let's not end up with the topic being closed.

[Credo]

The Thai government has a spotty record with it's treatment of asylum seekers and refugees. Most countries and the UN tread lightly because Thailand isn't a signatory to the convention on refugees. The UN lists many of them as "Persons of Concern". If the Thai government agrees, they are allowed to stay.

Countries of first asylum, such as Thailand, are where people are to be screened for possible resettlement. Most Western countries have laws and protections that make it much harder to repatriate them if they are not refugees. That is one of the reasons that many western countries will go to great extremes to keep them in the country of first asylum.

Australia in particular gets a hard time with it's rather rigid position on asylum seekers and refugees. They would not, to the best of my knowledge, either drag them out to sea or allow them to die. They would, however, go to great extents to make sure they land somewhere other than Australia.

Refugees are, for the most part, also economic refugees. Persecution usually means they have lost their land, property and other rights that would allow them to make a living. Economic migrants and refugees aren't mutually exclusive. The screening process allows Western countries (and others) to take the number of people that they can reasonably accommodate and take care of. Governments routinely give numbers to the UN as to the number of refugees they will take. This number is deducted from the overall quota of immigrants that country is allowing to come in.

Thus, if the government has decided that 50,000 aliens will be allowed to enter and 10,000 of them will be refugee, then 40,000 will be allowed through other channels, such as family reunification, special employment etc. It depends on the country.

Australia simply doesn't want to be the port of first asylum and often it isn't. They have landed elsewhere and then been 'assisted' into getting out to international waters and on their way to Australia.

[jeanpierre]

Everywhere in the world there seem to be political refugees.

In the Netherlands, where a friend is working for the IND (Immigration and Naturalisation service) somewhere in the main office there is a steel office cupboard, filled with party stuff.

This cupboard is closed, normally, and will be opened 2-3 times a year.

Then a party is thrown, big one, for all the staff.

They have that party because they found a real political refugee.

One of his bosses last year stated, that of all the so-called political refugees, 95% was almost certainly economically motivated.

And definitely not political

Now, I just wonder, what motives the UNCHR is having.

That office really does not have a track record of non-biased exploits.

shit happens some time there is a real one

[hansnl]

Everywhere in the world there seem to be political refugees.

In the Netherlands, where a friend is working for the IND (Immigration and Naturalisation service) somewhere in the main office there is a steel office cupboard, filled with party stuff.

This cupboard is closed, normally, and will be opened 2-3 times a year.

Then a party is thrown, big one, for all the staff.

They have that party because they found a real political refugee.

One of his bosses last year stated, that of all the so-called political refugees, 95% was almost certainly economically motivated.

And definitely not political

Now, I just wonder, what motives the UNCHR is having.

That office really does not have a track record of non-biased exploits.

shit happens some time there is a real one

A real shit?

[Scott]

Any further use of profanity will earn warnings.

How many times the cupboard is opened because they found a real refugee is of less importance than the fact that they do continue to find them. I can assure you that the vast majority of potential refugees do not make it to the shores of Europe or any other western countries. You are confusing people who have often transited through numerous countries (never declaring asylum) and then use it as ploy to remain in the country through endless appeals.

A few do make it and the Netherlands is to be commended for screening them in.

[Credo]

The UN is a large, bureaucratic and expensive organizations with numerous faults. In the refugee area this is also true, but unfortunately they are the only game in town that has the authority to work in many areas. Part of the test for refugee status is objective and part of it is subjective. A very large part of the process depends on credibility of the asylum seeker.

So first of all they objectively must be able to show that they come from a group that is persecuted and that as an individual (or family) you faced persecution--not discrimination; not mistreatment, but persecution. Then subjectively you need to be able to articulate this as well. Sometimes a group of people are subject to persecution, but governments may not bother with some of them.

[mizzi39]

I think that Abhisit along with ASEAN, and the UN should be forced to sit through the documentary "Hunted like Animals" if they have not already viewed it.

To repatriate the Hmong back to Laos a country that does not even recognize them does this group of people a huge disservice. Not only will they be persecuted but most likely killed.

Sorry but Laos is a backward society, way far behind Thailand when it comes to human rights violations.

[Scott]

Thanks mizzi39. It's good to have people with specific knowledge about the people and the country.