What Can I Do In Lamai With 3 Million Thai B

[samuiDarbs]

hello every 1

iam a regular visitor to Thailand samui /pattaya /rayong samet you get the idea

been about 12 times and have finally sorted my affairs out in the uk so I will be able to pack up and move to samui

next June/ July 2006 . I will have a bit of money to rent a small bungalow house for about 8000 a month

I will have roughly 3 million bhat in total that's cutting all ties and burning a few bridges in the uk

so don't no how long this money will last out there, i dont plan on going back with my tail between my legs to quickley

what do I do if iam planning on staying long term .Rent then build a cheap place or what ?.I work from home allot on my website which hopefully I can spend more time on out there so might be able to live off that but if i cant what should /could i invest in ?

also visa runs is there a way round them after you've been there a while ?also Bank accounts ?

iam popping back over on the 20th of July for a week or so just to chat to people and have a little look around lamai

iam looking around lamai as its cheaper than chaweng .and my money might go abit further

my money wont last for ever any advice would be greatly appreciated

SamuiDarbs

[Khun Jean]

Hi,

The biggest problem is your Visa/workpermit situation.

When you not qualify for a "marriage' or 'retirement' visa your only option is the tourist visa. I hope you enjoy the 12+ hour trip to Ranong every month. Flying is also a possibility but that will be too costly.

The visa run will cost you about 1500 baht.

The 3 Million baht is approx 40.000 pounds. If you put it in the bank in UK you can get 2000 pounds interest a year approx 140.000 p/year = 11500 baht per month on a savings account.

You can find a place to stay starting from 2000 baht a month. A telephone line will cost you 4000 baht for installing and if you use adsl the total bill will be around 1500 baht a month.

Electricity when not using an aircondition is roughly 1000 baht.

Water is another 100 baht. Your minimum costs here are

2000+1500+1000+100 = 4600 baht a month. This is without any luxery.

When you only use the interest from the bank you have 7000 baht a month for the rest. You can eat good for around 150 baht a day. the other 2500 is for all other things.

When your website start to make money you can supplement this. In my opinion you need at least 30.000 baht a month when your single to be comfortable.

To get to that level your website needs to make at least 18500 baht or 270 pounds a month.

I would strongly advice you to NOT invest the money here. You have very little options with your visa situation. It means you need to find someone you trust 100% before you part with your money. Focus on making money in the UK/world with your website.

For me that is my source of income, and i know a few more people who do the same so it can be done.

If you are stubborn and want to invest it anyway DON'T invest it into a bar. If someone wants you to invest in their bar that should be a big red flag. Nobody who's bar is making money will do it and the ones that don't make money and ask for a financial injection so it can be better are more in need of a good manager.

Investing in land is difficult, you can not own land here and setting up a company is too costly and cumbersome. If you had a lot more money it would be ok to do, but for 3 million baht you can not really buy a piece of land that will make you a profit soon. You can buy a house and rent it. But it will give you about the same return as putting it in a savings account in the UK, which is ofcourse a lot better because you still have money available. Reselling houses is very difficult, almost everybody is building their own and there are already many properties for rent.

I do know how you can make around 30.000 baht a month with an investment of 3.000.000 baht but it will be in Bangkok not in Samui. It is a relatively safe way and it will be your property 100%. PM me if you are interested, i am doing the same thing so i can give you a few tips.

You write Lamai is cheaper than Chaweng. That is true but there are nicer places on Samui that are a lot cheaper than Lamai. And certainly until you make enough money with the website it is a good idea to stay as far away from places where money is very easily spend. Places like Lipa noi, Thongkrut, Hua Thanon and many others are nice, quiet and cheap. Living in those places will enable you to live here and get a good feeling of the place, it really is very very different than spending a holiday here.

It is good that you made the decision to move to Thailand, a better life is waiting for you. But don't come running here, do it a little slower and with enough preparation. That way you won't have to go back ever.

Good luck.

[Ajarn]

Nice to see some true level-headed advice here.

3 mill doesn't go so far here really, unless you truly do it on the cheap, as mentioned. But that takes a lot of the fun out of being here if you have to live like that for too long, in my view. As you summarized, this can be a good life here if you come prepared a bit... It's worked well for me, anyway.

[Major Major]

excellent stuff Jean, best post I have ever seen on this forum

[LaoPo]

I do know how you can make around 30.000 baht a month with an investment of 3.000.000 baht but it will be in Bangkok not in Samui. It is a relatively safe way and it will be your property 100%. PM me if you are interested, i am doing the same thing so i can give you a few tips.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I would be interested in your suggestion.

However, wouldn't it be a lot safer to invest this kind of money in 'your/anyones' homecountry, since there are some quite safe real estate funds with the same or close % of profitability?

LaoPo

[samuiDarbs]

thnks Khun Jean

that was great advice and has made things seem allot easier to understand

also now I no I don't have to invest and I could probably stay in Thailand/ samui for allot longer than 4 or 5 years as I was expecting

I will keep working on my move and my website and let you no how I get on

thanks again for the free advice

good luck to you

[ParrotHead]

3 mil? well, you can use 2 mill of that and put it in an unusable account and get a work permit in exchange.(after all the red tape BS). Then you can actually make money in Samui! (or loose it all on a poorly conceived business). You can also make money flying under the radar, but that is something i know NOTHING about, so don't ask.

I too, am sick of my yearly 6 month money drain, only to sulk back to the States to suffer away from my lady to earn that severely devalued US dollar for 6 months so I can return. At least you guys from Europe and England, etc are riding high on a great exchange rate.

[Malice in Wonderland]

Quote (khun Jean) - " Investing in land is difficult,you cannot own land here and setting up a company is too costly and cumbersome"

I had a new Thai company(my second) formed in 20 days for 3.75 rai I purchased this month in Ban Taling Ngam - cost of company formation 14,000 baht, estimated cost of transferring deeds to new company and all associated paperwork approx 15,000 baht. It CAN be done but you need to seek good advice and do your homework;I've lived in Lamai for 2 + 1/2 years and watched land go from 300,000 per rai to over a million and with the advent of direct flights from HK and nerves about the Andaman Coast it's only going one way....

There is still land out there at 800,000 -1,500,000 million per rai if you know where to look (with chanote title before you all start telling me it's farmland...) and I took the plunge for that very reason,It won't be available forever and at least I have a foot on the ladder whilst still within my budget. If you can,snap up a rai now and then go away and earn the cash to do something with it in the future.I have many customers on their 3rd or 4th visit to Samui who kept telling themselves they would buy land,only to return next time to find the price had doubled....

p.s I'm a bar owner not a real estate agent or developer....(and don't buy a bar!!)

[Khun Jean]

I agree that land is a good investment. However if you have 3Mb and have to live of it, it is not a good idea. If you have money that is not needed for living it is a totally different story.

I know ban talign nam. My estimates is you will have to wait a long time before the land is significantly higher in price. I am betting on Lipa Noi.

I can be completely wrong too. But that is the risk you take when you invest. Many people are not able to run a bar. The proof are all the bars that are empty and for sale. If you DO know how to run a bar it can be a lucrative business.

BTW Starting a business for the sole purpose of owning land is not allowed. It will be seen as circumventing the 'foreigner can not own land' law. You will have to 'fake' doing real business and have transactions. You need an accountant/bookkeeper for the administration and tax. You need a lawyer that is capable of seting up the company in the right way.

I think that is cumbersome.

[Khun Larry]

I will have roughly 3 million bhat in total that's cutting all ties and burning a few bridges in the  uk

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Although 3 million may sound like a lot, it is certainly not enough to burn any bridges to the West.

Possibly 2 - 3 years of modest, easy living then you're empty.

I recommend you quickly double (or even triple) your money in the Thai stock market then consider your additional options.

If you can quadruple your money first all the better.

Edited April 26, 2005 by Khun Larry

[Malice in Wonderland]

"Invest in land,they don't make it anymore...."

[ThaiPauly]

Hey Malice, you could spend 2m of that on the Community Magazine, I am sure they would sell it for about that price. then you could revamp it.

just my 2 satangs worth

TP.

[Khun Larry]

p.s I'm a bar owner not a real estate agent or developer....(and don't buy a bar!!)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Don't buy land either. Don't even consider it.

You want land, buy some in a country that lets you buy land. A no brainer.

[skipdivils]

p.s I'm a bar owner not a real estate agent or developer....(and don't buy a bar!!)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Don't buy land either. Don't even consider it.

You want land, buy some in a country that lets you buy land. A no brainer.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Or pay a good lawyer 20,000 - 30,000 to setup a company properly that then buys and owns the land. Don't listen to Khun Larry.

And MaliceinWonderland, I am heading to Lamai in a month to close my recent land deal. Me and a buddy are grabbing 6 rai. I totally agree with your train of thought. Would love to have a beer and chat more when I visit in late June. What bar do you own? I'll pop by and have see you. Would love to hear more about your ideas for the land thing.

[Khun Jean]

The whole company route is not a 100% insurance the land is yours. For starters you have 39% or 49% of the shares if it is a real working and profitable company. If it is for the purpose of owning land and you do not have invoices, customers, profit etc.. like any normal company you will be investigated. True it is not really enforced that much but what if that changes say ... next year. Crackdown on foreign owned land. Not hard to imagine that it can happen.

Only at that moment you will know if your company was setup correctly or not.

The same with the 30+30 year leases. You will know in 30 years. And guess what you'll loose.

The company route is good IF you have a REAL company that makes PROFIT and pays TAX. If anything misses you are in for a surprise.

Don't believe me, well good luck. I hope you did not believe your laywer and checked things for yourself. If you did, everything is ok because you went in with all the knowledge you needed and assessed the risks.

[Khun Larry]

p.s I'm a bar owner not a real estate agent or developer....(and don't buy a bar!!)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Don't buy land either. Don't even consider it.

You want land, buy some in a country that lets you buy land. A no brainer.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Or pay a good lawyer 20,000 - 30,000 to setup a company properly that then buys and owns the land. Don't listen to Khun Larry.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Or pay a good lawyer 20,000 - 30,000 ...bla bla bla .... Impossible for the average Joe. Fantasy land.

A no brainer.

[simey]

Impossible for the ordinary Joe? If you invest 3 mill in land then the cost of the lawyer at 30,000 is a paltry 1% of that. Think thats a lot? How much do you have to pay an estate agent in the UK to sell your house, how much do you have to pay a solicitor to handle your purchase of a house. More than that. And it's not as if this way of doing things is unusual, there are a lot of people buying land and property under the same setup so you are not alone.

[Khun Jean]

And it's not as if this way of doing things is unusual, there are a lot of people buying land and property under the same setup so you are not alone.

You're right. Most of them are screwed collectively.

It seems people put up with everything just to be able to stay in Thailand. It is a nice country but you have to be able to pull out when things start to get worse. It is a developing country after all. With all the turmoil that comes with it. It seems pretty stable right now, but in 10 years? Nobody knows.

Always have an exit strategy.

Many people buy land and they do it with questionable constructions. People who want to retire are made to believe they actually own the place. They will find out later if that was really true. Buy something and keep it in the family. If you have a Thai spouse it is possible, otherwise forget it.

I have some money invested here and hope it will give a good return, but i can walk away from it tomorrow.

If it is your live savings that you are putting in land or business you are taking an awful risk.

Am i being pessimistic, no realistic is the better word .

[OlRedEyes]

It has always fascinated me how many farangs who invest here, oftentimes most of their money, never bother to first investigate the political and economic direction/prospects of Thailand. When I chat to them, they show a total lack of interest or knowledge of the macro issues which will, in the end, affect them. It's not really investing... more like gambling

[simey]

Anything you do with your money is gambling, even keeping it under your mattress in cash has a risk of devaluation, and the effect of inflation.

I bought my house on Samui five years ago, it did not use up all of my cash and so I also bought some mutual funds. At least the house retained it's value, the funds (despite being 'safe') have managed to lose over 33% of their value to date. Had I have invested the money for the house in the funds then as you say I would have been screwed.

I agree you need to understand the area you are investing in, but if you think that a hous e in Thailand is vastly more risky that the Enron shares that looked so good a while ago, or that company pension that the MD has been siphoning off all these years, then I would disagree.

Are you pessimistic? Sounds like it to me, at least the 'collectively screwed' people seem to be having a good time rather than living in a place they dislike with a suitcase packed for the emergency exit...

[Khun Larry]

Impossible for the ordinary Joe? If you invest 3 mill in land then the cost of the lawyer at 30,000 is a paltry 1% of that. Think thats a lot? How much do you have to pay an estate agent in the UK to sell your house, how much do you have to pay a solicitor to handle your purchase of a house. More than that. And it's not as if this way of doing things is unusual, there are a lot of people buying land and property under the same setup so you are not alone.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

One mans no brainer is another mans lifetime challenge.

Chookdee

[bkkmadness]

Surely one day they will decide that these farang that have set up companys just to own land (which is illegal I think?) are in the wrong and take back all that land, with a "thanks very much, we have your cash and land now, bye bye, we let you break the rules for a while but now it's all nicely developed we think its time to have it all back"

That not seem a big risk for all these people with fake companys who have invested loads in land here?

It is illegal to do it that way isn't it?

[bkkmadness]

It has always fascinated me how many farangs who invest here, oftentimes most of their money, never bother to first investigate the political and economic direction/prospects of Thailand. When I chat to them, they show a total lack of interest or knowledge of the macro issues which will, in the end, affect them. It's not really investing... more like gambling 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

An excellent point, just a few slight changes that will occur soon, and the whole government could change in a swift miltary coup. Lets see how many farangs can hold onto their dodgely bought land then.

Laws for farangs in this country can change instantly.

[Khun Larry]

Surely one day they will decide that these farang that have set up companys just to own land (which is illegal I think?) are in the wrong and take back all that land, with a "thanks very much, we have your cash and land now, bye bye, we let you break the rules for a while but now it's all nicely developed we think its time to have it all back"

That not seem a big risk for all these people with fake companys who have invested loads in land here?

It is illegal to do it that way isn't it?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You have hit the nail on the head

It is no different then the fake visa stamps which were promoted so openly but then declared in violation of some long existing law.

But if they want to piss their money away.....

Scam is the best description of investing in Thailand.

Why would anyone be interested in investing in a scam? I have no idea, but many do like this type of "investment".

[bkkmadness]

You know my brother was thinking of investing (and still is) quite an amount of money into some land on Koh Phang Nan though one of these off the shelf companies. He was telling me with his overall 12 weeks experience here that it would be "ok coz they have companies that set up the company for you and it's all legit" and I had to explain this to him.

Fact is of course the companies that make money from selling the land will tell you this coz they make cash out of it. Very similar to the visa situation before which Khun Larry mentions lots of things that are in violation of the law are professed to be perfectly legal at the time, until the government decides thats its time to reinforce that law, which in the case of land ownership would be extremely profitable for them.

What would it take? A quick audit of the company, find out it's not legit, reclaim the land, fine the farang for a few more bucks, then give them a swift boot out of the country on a 'person non grata' visa with the farang being able to make no legal comeback because they were in in fact breaking the land ownership laws of the country.

Risky to set up one of those dodgy companies IMO especially when talking about investing life savings which many people do.

Edited May 2, 2005 by bkkmadness

[simey]

Whats illegal about a Thai company, majority thai owned, making money, paying taxes. It was frowned upon to have a company that did not trade or pay taxes as the inital situation was, but now the company will rent the house, make the money, and pay taxes.

A comparison the illegal visa stamps is apples and oranges, although if it suits your mindset I'm sure the relationship is there, somewhere.

But it's your money and your choice. As for the change of government that was not likely given the outcome of the recent election, a military coup would not be likely in a monarchy where the royal family is adored as much as it is here.

Is there nothign that can cheer you guys up a little? I mean, there is looking on the black side but I can't help feeling you are in the wrong country with such a pessimistic outlook on life. Tell you what, if all these bad things happen I'll personally apologise to you. If they don't, and I make money frm my fake company and bad investment, well I'll send you a postcard!

[bkkmadness]

Simey, of course, its your choice and good luck to you, I personally dont care if you make a load of money or lose it, I dont know you from Adam. Not being pessamistic, just a realist as I would when concerning money in any country. If your overly optimistic this is definately the wrong country for investors and it's easy to have clouded judgement.

The illegal thai companys I was reffering to are the ones that are just set up with land purchase in mind, but do not trade as a company.

A change of government can happen in this country easily, The King though adored is not going to stay with Thailand for ever and who knows what the future holds, and without talking to much about it here as it's against forum rules the adoration for the Royal Family may be an important factor that causes such change. It's not as if it's a country that hasn't had rapid changes of government and coups before in recent history.

[simey]

Maybe thats the difference between me and the investors. I bought my land and built my house as I loved living in Thailand. I have a job that allows me to take 6 months off, and spending it on a little warm island with my freinds is all I looked for. It would be nice if the house made money but that was never the intention - I wanted to be able to forget the rat race and cold weather for a while and lose the stress. In that respect I am not so desperate for a return.

People looking for a quick buck with no local knowledge should take your advice, that is true of any investment.

If I ever meet you in a bar on Samui we'll discuss it in a more civilised way, over a beer!

[naka]

Earn your money in a country where you can make the most.

Spend your money in a country you like, and where it goes furthest.

Easy !

Trying to earn decent money in a low cost country is a nightmare

cos the locals will always be prepared to work for less than you.

[Mini_me]

hello every 1

iam a regular visitor to Thailand samui /pattaya /rayong samet you get the idea

been about 12 times and have finally sorted my affairs out in the uk so I will be able to pack up and move to samui

next June/ July 2006 . I will have a bit of money  to rent a small bungalow house for about 8000 a month

I will have roughly 3 million bhat in total that's cutting all ties and burning a few bridges in the  uk

so don't no how long this money will last out there, i dont plan on going back with my tail between my legs to quickley

what do I do if iam planning on staying  long term .Rent then build a cheap place or what ?.I  work from home allot on my website which hopefully I can spend more time on out there so might be able to live off that but if i cant what should /could i invest in ?

also visa runs is there a way round them after you've been there a while ?also Bank accounts ?

iam popping back over on the 20th of July for a week or so just to chat to people and have a little look around lamai

iam looking around lamai as its cheaper than chaweng .and my money might go abit further

my money wont last for ever any advice would be greatly appreciated

SamuiDarbs

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>